Kakuzu vs Tsunade

[TheEvilOne]

Not his character, but you seem to underrate his abilities.

]"Every Kage/Sannin/High Jounin can defeat him". I won't take you literally on that since High Jounin's aren't enough to defeat him, but the fact remains about you underrating him in a way.

High jounins- Guy and Kakashi, no on else

He can take Mei, the 3rd Kazekage, Gai, Kakashi, 2nd Mizukage Sasori, Deidara, Konan, the 4th Kazekage, Gaara, Yagura and most Jinchuurikis, and a few others i can't remember.

Wow, he can take KAKASHI? GUY? 2nd MIZUKAGE? DEIDARA? SASORI? YAGURA? GAARA? This shinobies would literally STOMP him. That's the most biased opinion I ever heard.

If you actually analyze his abilities you'll notice that. He hasn't shown his full power in a 1 vs 1 because he's never been granted one. Battles including him are designed to stack the odds against him.

e.g. Naruto, Kakashi, Ino, Chouji and Yamato vs Kakuzu
Chouji, Darui, Tenten (with a treasured tool), Ino and a few others fought him in the war.

They are WEAK shinobies. The only threats to him were Kakashi and Naruto. And Naruto fodderized him with one attack. Kakashi can defeat him too. 5 Kamui, 5 hearts.


In a 1 vs 1, his hearts are almost impossible to take down. How can they be taken out whilst he's supporting them at the very same time ? His Doton Domu makes him immune to physical attacks e.g. All Taijutsu and Kenjutsu users

Ther keyword is ALMOST. Most of the Kage level shinobies have attack that can take them down.


This adds:
The 7 Ninja Swordsmen
Hanzo (Possibly)
Mifune
Darui
Tsunade

From this list he can't defeat Tsunade and Hanzo ( well posibly )

and any close combat fighter to the list of people he can beat.

I always thought you are reasonable, but now? Meh, I think I misjudged you.

 

[Negative Knight]

I always thought you are reasonable, but now? Meh, I think I misjudged you.

Choose any of those shinobi I listed, i'll either link you to a debate I've had concerning them or detail why exactly they lose to Kakuzu. 5 Kamui = 5 Hearts ? In the time he uses one Kamui, he'll be bombarded by all the other hearts and killed himself. Suicde isn't considered a win.

Gai ? Deidara ? Sasori ? and the 2nd Mizu would all stomp Kakuzu ? Its clear you don't want to be convinced and won't be. Stomp means low to no difficulty. Its clear you don't understand Kakuzu's abilities in the slightest.

 

[TheEvilOne]

Choose any of those shinobi I listed, i'll either link you to a debate I've had concerning them or detail why exactly they lose to Kakuzu. 5 Kamui = 5 Hearts ? In the time he uses one Kamui, he'll be bombarded by all the other hearts and killed himself. Suicde isn't considered a win.

Gai ? Deidara ? Sasori ? and the 2nd Mizu would all stomp Kakuzu ? Its clear you don't want to be convinced and won't be. Stomp means low to no difficulty. Its clear you don't understand Kakuzu's abilities in the slightest.

Okey, try to convince how the hell can Kakuzu beat those guys.
btw, Kakashi now can use more then 4 Kamui, without help.

 

[Zexion~]

^ thats if he doesnt use anything else that takes up chakra ... which he would have to to beat kakuzu

 

[Negative Knight]

Okey, try to convince how the hell can Kakuzu beat those guys.
btw, Kakashi now can use more then 4 Kamui, without help.

Assuming Kakashi uses Kamui right off the bat...

Kamui is a last resort not a game opener. By the time Kakashi realizes he needs it, he'll have no time to activate it without being killed by Kakuzu's aerial masks.

Pick any one of them, i don't have time to explain each and everyone.

 

[TheEvilOne]

Assuming Kakashi uses Kamui right off the bat...

Kamui is a last resort not a game opener. By the time Kakashi realizes he needs it, he'll have no time to activate it without being killed by Kakuzu's aerial masks.

Pick any one of them, i don't have time to explain each and everyone.

Lets see, Gaara. Kakuzu can't even touch him.

 

[Negative Knight]

Lets see, Gaara. Kakuzu can't even touch him.

Thanks, I don't have to write anything out.

Read the whole argument between myself and Genii.

Here's the link -

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[TheEvilOne]

Thanks, I don't have to write anything out.

Read the whole argument between myself and Genii.

Here's the link -

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Thx, I'll read it. But it would be easier if you copy and paste your opinion.

 

[Negative Knight]

Thx, I'll read it. But it would be easier if you copy and paste your opinion.

Nah, that would be unfair on Genii. You'll see a one-sided debate for Kakuzu, but this debate shows its a fair match up between the two.

 

[TheEvilOne]

Nah, that would be unfair on Genii. You'll see a one-sided debate for Kakuzu, but this debate shows its a fair match up between the two.

As I see the last reply is Genii's. So you couldn't counter his further arguments? ^

 

[Negative Knight]

As I see the last reply is Genii's. So you couldn't counter his further arguments? ^

Nah, notice the time he posted it. It was during my exam period (Whole month of January Exams) and so I never got round to it. Genii is no longer active on NB, but you reminding me of this debate actually makes me want to reply. It was a fun debate since we had to come up with new counters every post or so xd

 

[Zexion~]

As I see the last reply is Genii's. So you couldn't counter his further arguments? ^

:sy: ......................................

 

[Izuna Kakashi Senju]

Kakuzu mid-high diff.

 

[TheEvilOne]

:sy: ......................................

What do you want to say?

 

[Zexion~]

just because someone gets the last post doesnt mean the win the debate

 

[Tartarus]

just because someone gets the last post doesnt mean the win the debate

eggs-actly U_U

 

[Negative Knight]

eggs-actly U_U

That reminds me, i should counter your argument soon. Will do in a little while

 

[Tartarus]

That reminds me, i should counter your argument soon. Will do in a little while

Eggcellent, why do I keep egg puns xd I won't be able to respond probably til later tonight since I'm heading to work. I get the feeling we're gonna be stuck in a deadlock til I get bored since both fighters are stamina tanks.

 

[shelke]

Tsunade loses this, in my opinion, but mid-high difference.

Tsunade summons Katsuya who can handle extremely high level damage. She can make it split and carry one with her to replenish her damages. Wind release pressure damage won't do much to Tsunade as she seems to heal at an accelerated rate. His intelligent hard work would be resisted by Tsunade's immortality technique as she took on Madara's Katon attack and healed afterwards. This doesn't seem comparable, but it she won't be able to stand and heal is the mask uses it repeatedly.

False darkness seems to be the actual problem here, as the spear-like release can cover multiple enemies - meaning, the mask can spew out multiple spears - but as proven in Sasuke's case, who literally tanked Darui's Raiton attack, Tsunade can counter this with her own lightening release, but I hardly doubt that the attack that can obliterate and spear through rocks would be completely countered by her. It will most certainly damage her and leave her immobile for a while.

If she tries to get near, Grudge fear and drive all his threads - ahem testicles - into her and would try and retract her organs there and then. Once the threads penetrate, she can't heal herself as the penetration has already happened. If he uses earth spear, then Tsunade might be able to damage it to an extent if she uses chakra control as well, but I hardly doubt Kakuzu will let her because of his speed advantage. Not only that, Kakuzu's physical power is also increased, which would make him fight on even grounds with Tsunade.

His summon can be busied with masks and Katon, wind, and Raiton attacks. Once she is immobile, due to shock from a Raiton attack or Earth Spear, he can simply extract her organs. Katsuya will be rendered useless after Tsunade is done.

 

[Negative Knight]

I'm such a nerd, this is actually getting fun xd
-For your first point, Tsunade had already been fighting for a few hours against Madara, so her chakra was starting to run out, I still haven't even broke out katsuya support for an argument. Katsuya serves as another line of recovery if she gets in a pinch. Essentially Tsunade has both her own massive chakra and Katsuya healing her as support.
-The next point I'd like to address that while Kakuzu's attacks are destructive, they aren't killing jutsu even on non-tanking characters, nor unavoidable.

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Although overwhelming, Kakashi managed to survive Kakuzu's pressure damage without the aid of any healing, and several chunin were able to avoid searing migraine. Now
Tsunade may be no speed demon but she's faster than those chunin and an expert at evasion since she's a seasoned medic. She won't be getting pelting by every little hit, but she does have the recovery to take it fairly well, she'll probably be able to use that as surprise factor.
-On the last part, in theory it's possible for her to greatly increase her speed, as Sakura only has a 3 in strength but gains superhuman strength once she applies chakra control. In theory it could work the same way for speed, but this is still just theory. My other response to the speed will be used with Hidan as an example when it come to speed:
Hidan(only a 3.5) was able to skillfully outmaneuver Asuma(4.5) despite having a lower speed and fight evenly with Kakashi(4.5)

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Fighting for hours has no toll on her regeneration since her cells continue to split as normal. Imo, i don' think Byagkou even has a time limit. When she isn't being attacked her cells divide as normal since too much cell division would give her cancer or cause other grievous effects on her body. It seems as if her cell division is only accelerated once she's hit by a mortally wounding attack e.g. Madara's Katon. Considering that, its a pretty miniscule feat of having it active for however long she did.

Anyway discount fatigue as a problem for Tsunade, she's an absolute stamina tank (in terms of chakra reserves) possessing even enough to heal an entire village. But her vast chakra reserves play no part in fatal attacks.

Being struck by Madara's Katon instantly took her to her absolute limit, leaving her on death's door moments afterwards. Whilst not as powerful, Kakuzu's Fire mask would produce the same effect (granted not as severe as instant death), his Lightning mask would electrocute/paralyze her whilst the Wind Mask would serve to slice into her to deal severe damage.

Granted none of this would kill Tsunade but it would leave her severely damaged and with wounds that can't be healed. Realizing this, Kakuzu would inevitably undertake a different tactic to put her down once and for all. Fusing his Fire, Wind and possibly even Lightning masks together, he could create a creature even more fearsome than the plain Fire and Wind combination. The reason they didn't all fuse in his fight against Kakashi was he had to absorb the lightning heart once he lost his original heart.

Can you possibly imagine Tsunade tanking a combination even deadlier than Kakuzu's Katon/Fuuton combo ?

Something which fuses this:

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With this

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This is proves to be far more than enough to kill Tsunade. The simple Katon/Fuuton combo would take two uses at most, but Kakuzu's Katon/Fuuton/Raiton attack would end her with a single hit.

Tsunade's fighting style is naturally slow, Hidan's speed in Kenjutsu combos was what overwhelmed Asuma/Kakashi who were only armed with Kunai, putting them at a serious disadvantage against a weapon intensive user such as him.

Otherwise, Hidan's sluggishness was glaringly obvious. Tsunade's lack luster speed (even with a chakra control boost) is still a far cry from Kakuzu's agility and speed in Taijutsu. His ability to encompass threads into his ordinary Taijutsu would overwhelm Tsunade completely. His threads themselves were even

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fully without much effort. Tearing into Tsunade's body even once would give him sufficient time to extract her heart and leave her with no means of regeneration. Since its a viable tactic usually used by Kakuzu, I see this happening when she's restrained/wounded. Furthermore, it would become an even more likely occurrence once Kakuzu realizes that much like him, she can't be killed by normal means.

No heart = No oxygen fueling her brain = No cellular regeneration = Good Game.