Yata Mirror Grossly Underated- HardCounter to Dust Release

[Waltz]

Actually there are more astral attacks. Example Gedo mazo dragon should fall under this. [

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Another is Gentoshin no Jutsu
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Those two techniques fall under astral. Lol even says art of astral projection. That is the english translation

Shiki fujin is astral, forgot about that jutsu , as whatever the death god is, doesn't exist in the PHYSICAL realm.. just like totsuka and yata mirror, they are spiritual things..

Does astral also include Fūinjutsu: Shiki Fūjin? I think it does.

Q.Q lmao, Forgot about all these things

Blaze, Strcit and Owarij You guys just had to crash my party didn't you?
A question though, is Sasuke's susano'o arrow listed as an Astral attack? (A scan would be nice also)

 

[Forget Me Not]

A question though, would Sasuke's susano'o arrow be an Astral attack?

Possibly so. I think it is categorized under that in the databook.

I don't doubt it could negate the Susano'o arrow if it negated Kirin.

 

[Waltz]

Possibly so. I think it is categorized under that in the databook.

I don't doubt it could negate the Susano'o arrow if it negated Kirin.

-Edit-
It negated the Arrow:

Spoiler

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Ok to the rest.

 

[Forget Me Not]

Itachi isn't invincible and I wont doubt that yata mirror has weak points, I even said in the op that that invincible hype is definitely a hyperbole.. I personally believe the shield is an automatic defence for incoming attacks... though there is 0 proof on both sides of the argument, i'll attempt to reread the databook scans and look for some

Exactly my point. I too believe this. Yata Mirror should extend automatically at incoming attacks since they are adjacent to Itachi (which doesn't mean Yata is weak as 9/10 attacks in the series are of this nature). But attacks that are not linear...I don't think Yata could counter those (i.e. if someone like Minato could teleport directly behind the Yata/Susano'o and hit him).

There are seldom characters that could counter Yata, but the counters I stated seem feasible enough. I also believe Chibaku Tensei could defeat Susano'o/Yata. Why? Because it's a gravitational pull; it isn't an astral or elemental attack. There is nothing that can defy gravity. Itachi's Susano'o along with himself and company were going to even be subdued by the tech, but luckily Itachi was ingenious enough to formulate a plan just in the brink of time.

 

[seanmansam]

It is just an exaggeration!!! Jeez...

 

[edo tensai wilmaso]

honestly kishi just pulled that out of his rabbit a$$ .....he is secretly in love with itachi.... we will never see those items again.

 

[Forget Me Not]

I think we're overstating the value of Yata Mirror a bit. Yata clearly has susceptibilities, that much has been proven.

I don't think Yata Mirror solely is what made Itachi deemed invincible. It's the combination of Yata Mirror AND Totsuka Blade is what is so deadly.

There's no doubt in my mind that Itachi could be damaged if he just mounted Yata Mirror and not the Blade as well. It would only be a matter of time. But with Totsuka he can be on the offense and defense at the same time.

Yata Mirror or Totsuka Blade by themselves are not nearly indestructible. It is the duo of the both that make Itachi so unique.

 

[Waltz]

I think we're overstating the value of Yata Mirror a bit. Yata clearly has susceptibilities, that much has been proven.

I don't think Yata Mirror solely is what made Itachi deemed invincible. It's the combination of Yata Mirror AND Totsuka Blade is what is so deadly.

There's no doubt in my mind that Itachi could be damaged if he just mounted Yata Mirror and not the Blade as well. It would only be a matter of time. But with Totsuka he can be on the offense and defense at the same time.

Yata Mirror or Totsuka Blade by themselves are not nearly indestructible. It is the duo of the both that make Itachi so unique.

Agreed. So far several highly possible counters have been illustrated, Yata Has weak spots and as you said is over estimated.

In your previous post referring to Chibaku tensei were you saying that it counters Yata on a whole? (i disagree too) or solely that it counters yata ability to react to incoming attacks?

 

[Forget Me Not]

Agreed. So far several highly possible counters have been illustrated, Yata Has weak spots and as you said is over estimated.

In your previous post referring to Chibaku tensei were you saying that it counters Yata on a whole? (i disagree too) or solely that it counters yata ability to react to incoming attacks?

In my previous post I meant that it could counter Yata Mirror and Itachi altogether. Why? Because it isn't an elemental or astral attack - it has no notion of physicality. Nothing can escape gravity. It could probably hold its ground for a short time span, but it would ultimately be subdued.

Another reason why I'm lead to believe this is that Itachi used his Susano'o against Chibaku Tensei before. He stated the only way to counter Chibaku Tensei in that instance is to overwhelm it. If Yata Mirror was truly the panacea, why didn't he use it? He could have told Naruto and Bee to merely hide by his Yata Mirror if it could counter Chibaku Tensei's gravitational pull. The only conclusion is that Yata Mirror was not a feasible counter to Chibaku Tensei so he henceforth hypothesized a different strategy.

 

[Forget Me Not]

-Edit-
It negated the Arrow:

Spoiler

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Ok to the rest.

What I mean is that Yata definitely can counter the Susano arrow if it countered a far more destructive technique like Kirin.

 

[Aominecchi]

Nice info bro

 

[Owarij]

@ForgetMeNot

Yeah,
Zetsu basically saw Susanno, a full susanno.. which is ALREADY an incredibly tough defence to break...I can list the few jutsu that would be able to penetrate a Full susanno's defence right now....
ontop of that already tough defence he had Yata mirror for protection AND totsuka sword for offence... To him It seemed perfect

Maybe in the right hands it is, But Itachi does have stamina problems, so even with all of those toys, he wouldn't be able to use it long in a fight

 

[mcmousy]

What would happen if you attacked the strongest shield (Yata) with the strongest blade (Totsuka)?

Imagine the Unstoppable movement and the immovable object. And there is your answer

 

[Niwdog]

Itachi does not need to activate Susano'o to use the Totsuka Blade and Yata Mirror since they are items that are separate to Susanoo and can be used independent of them, or else Oro wouldn't have been after the blade and the mirror. This means that Itachi doesn't have to exhaust tonnes of chakra to use them. His invincibility still maintains without the use of his chakra. And if what this thread's OP claims is true and Yata Mirror can extend around Itachi, then Itachi's a lot more powerful and effective a shinobi than I already thought he was, and that sounds like such a backwards thing to say on this forum considering how overhyped Itachi is on it.

Another important thing, does Yata Mirror count as ninjutsu?

You know what, I'm actually going to plus rep. I was sceptical before I read the OP but I'm convinced. There was very clearly laid out and compelling evidence.

 

[Nupp]

I think if Black Zetsu who is supposed to be the embodiment of Madara called Itachi invincible with the Yata mirror then I would not take it lightly......

I think the fact the shield can change shape means it may be able to form a 360 defense, however as even Itachi says everything has a weakness I bet the Yata mirror is no exception.

 

[binderr]

We all know of the two legendary spiritual weapons that caused Black zetsu to consider Itachi an Invincible force...

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Hyperbole? Yes, But there is truth to his words...First one must understand what a Spirtual weapon is... Answer? Noone knows.. according to zetsu it's a supernatural item.... Databook implies noone really know how or when exactly they appeared.. but the legends have been passed down for years

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What should be noted is that is has NO true phyiscal form, meaning these weapons have no true shape, and could essentially become what shape or size the user wishes... They way we see them now is at a size fit for susanno, but when these weapons were found by Itachi, they wouldn't have been large, they could have been anything, maybe even the normal size of a katana and shield..

If you don't believe what i'm saying, Of course , I have proof , often overlooked

Spoiler

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Here you see how yatta mirror is, a flat shield, a bit bigger than Itachi, but still smaller than susanno itself..


Sasuke then throws explosive kunai to cause and explosion

Spoiler

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You can no see the shield has grown, as the head of susanno is no longer higher in the air

specifically talking about this

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You also should note the sfx showing the mirror was shrinking after the attack..


Next feat of this? pretty obvious

Spoiler

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If you don't see it

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You clearly see it extended again, covering more in the back of itachi, which is not how it originally looked, considering its flat


Now I want you to pay CLOSE attention , to the last two pictures I posted, and realize that for this attack, Yata mirror has changed size and shape, and is now fully covering Susanno....

This means that no matter WHAT attack comes at Itachi, Yata mirror can Change not only its ELEMENTS, but its ATTRIBUTES , to deflect it.....

The databook even says this

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Note that it changes its attributes and properties..


You should also be aware that yata mirror doesn't simply "block' all attacks.. It REFLECTS.. All attacks.. as stated like 500 times in the manga and databook..





MUU - Onooki

People, alot of people , have been putting Muu over Itachi simply because Jinton is a "360" thing.... they claim, that yata mirror and its frontward defence would not at all protect Itachi from the molecule disintegration..
Bullocks..

As Ive shown before, ANY incoming attack, would be countered by the mirror and reflected... even if yata mirror has to stretch in a 360 manner to do so , similar to what happened here

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This isnt solely for Jinton....Any incoming taijutsu attack will be countered... yata mirror repelled Sasuke's and his kusunagi thrust....
People claim that A would be able to go behind yata mirror and attack.. Once again, this isn't a legendary spirtual item for crap and giggles..Like gaara's sand, the yata mirror protects the user from ANY attack



But how far can yata mirror really go?
Its not exactly clear, the databook mostly speaks of its impervious fortitude when pitted against jutsu

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Material

Astral

Physical

and Ninjutsu

What I want you to focus on is the two bolded

as·tral
/ˈastrəl/
Adjective
Of or relating to a supposed nonphysical realm of existence in which the physical human body is said to have a counterpart.
​

what? : o, Databook implies that Yata mirror would even defend against non physical dimension related attacks? Attacks like Long ranged Kamui?

....That my friends is up to you to see and consider

Grossly underated spiritual items

EDIT
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i

Another thing everyone should note is the sheer speed that the shape manipulation happens... The mirror moves from its small state to incredibly large withing milliseconds of the attack actually hitting

Inb4 Bogard, minator94

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Soloking solos

yeah. I pitted Itachis susanoo against Madaras PS once: everyobdy said PS was best but I still think Itachis susanoo is best

 

[Niwdog]

In my previous post I meant that it could counter Yata Mirror and Itachi altogether. Why? Because it isn't an elemental or astral attack - it has no notion of physicality. Nothing can escape gravity. It could probably hold its ground for a short time span, but it would ultimately be subdued.

Another reason why I'm lead to believe this is that Itachi used his Susano'o against Chibaku Tensei before. He stated the only way to counter Chibaku Tensei in that instance is to overwhelm it. If Yata Mirror was truly the panacea, why didn't he use it? He could have told Naruto and Bee to merely hide by his Yata Mirror if it could counter Chibaku Tensei's gravitational pull. The only conclusion is that Yata Mirror was not a feasible counter to Chibaku Tensei so he henceforth hypothesized a different strategy.

Whilst I agree that Yata Mirror is not sufficient for countering or eliminating Chibaku Tensei, I don't think that was the reason Itachi didn't try to counter it with Yata Mirror and have Naruto and Bee hide with him behind it to survive it. Let's say that Yata Mirror could was a feasible defence against Chibaku Tensei, it would have been fruitless for Naruto, Bee and Itachi to merely endure the attack and protect themselves because that would not really have progressed any further with defeating Nagato since that would prevent Naruto, Bee and to an extent Itachi's mobility, who would have to remain constantly behind the Yata Mirror whilst fighting Nagato. Itachi tends to make moves that attempt to end battles as soon as possible and eliminating Chibaku Tensei was a better move in that respect than providing a counter that would only defend him, Naruto and Bee against it.

 

[PureSkillz]

Yata can't defend against Kaumi.. Kaumi warps you into another
dimension.

Unless the Kaumi user tried to rip the Yata Mirror in half, then I have no doubts
that it would resist being destroyed. But you can't prove that Itachi's Susanoo
wouldn't be able to be warped.

Also, that didn't look like the bomb-kunai/explosion was reflected in your scan, it looked like it was blocked.

 

[Forget Me Not]

Itachi does not need to activate Susano'o to use the Totsuka Blade and Yata Mirror since they are items that are separate to Susanoo and can be used independent of them, or else Oro wouldn't have been after the blade and the mirror. This means that Itachi doesn't have to exhaust tonnes of chakra to use them. His invincibility still maintains without the use of his chakra. And if what this thread's OP claims is true and Yata Mirror can extend around Itachi, then Itachi's a lot more powerful and effective a shinobi than I already thought he was, and that sounds like such a backwards thing to say on this forum considering how overhyped Itachi is on it.

Another important thing, does Yata Mirror count as ninjutsu?

No, he obviously doesn't need Susano to use the items. But that is besides the point. The reason why Black Zetsu exclaimed that Itachi is invincible is because of the combination of Susano + Yata Mirror + Totsuka Blade. Not just because Itachi possesses them. He didn't state that the items are invincible.

We also don't know how much chakra wielding these items exhaust without a medium like Susano'o. The event of Itachi using these items without Susano was never introduced, so the point you're trying to make is more or less non-sequitur.

Yata Mirror is also not ninjutsu; it's a spiritual weapon.

 

[Forget Me Not]

yeah. I pitted Itachis susanoo against Madaras PS once: everyobdy said PS was best but I still think Itachis susanoo is best

Are you saying Itachi's Susano is superior to Madara's PS? Because if so please re-think your stance. Or better yet re-read this thread.

Those items are far from invincible. Itachi is also far from invincible.