[Theory] Why Rinnegan has no Genjutsu.

[Senju Bean]

It's because it came from the fruit, not the God tree itself. The fruit is a genetic offshoot of the original God tree. That is why Hagaromo obtained the Rinnegan and not the Juubi eye.


The difference between the Juubi eye and the Rinnegan is that the Juubi eye is predominately Yin while the Rinnegan is a perfect mix of Yin/Yang. The Juubi itself is 50/50 but concentrated in different areas. The Juubi's body is Yang and the Juubi's eye is Yin. That is why the body can use Mouton and the Eye can cast Infinite Tsukuyomi. The Rinnegan can neither use Genjutsu nor Mokuton because it is essentially a chemical product of the two powers.

How did the Sharingan gain genjutsu? Well, the Sage sired the elder son after becoming the Juubi Jin. He gained the tree's special Yin powers, which are known for making genjutsu. Now, the son may have inherited the power of eyes, but that's very vague. He may have inherited powerful eyes but it could be powered by anything. It was powered by the Yin from the Shinju. That is why the Sharingan has Genjutsu and the Rinnegan doesn't.


Yin + Yang unfused= powerful genjutsu and powerful body seperately (e.g Obito, Danzo, Shinju etc0

Yin+Yang fused together= something new entirely

Yin+Yang fused+ Genetics for Powerful Eyes= Rinnegan => no (or weak) genjutsu since Yin & Yang together doesn't make genjutsu.

Yin+Genetics for Powerful Eyes= Sharingan => can use powerful genjutsu.

 

[thegame]

Rofl... It seems like you have misunderstood what a genjutsu is. Having rinnengan or sharingan have nothing to do with genjutsu. Any shinobi can learn to use genjutsu in some manner, but members of the Uchiha clan have proved a greater affinity for this due to many factors. Of course the sharingan helps a lot, as you can see the flow of chakra, which makes it easier to form genjutsu, but all in all it has nothing to do with it, and we have seen several shinobi using different types of genjutsu.

Any shinobi have both yin and yang chakra, but the ratios may differ greatly. That is the entire essence of chakra molding and being able to form genjutsu for instance. Perhaps Lee could be mentioned as one, who hasn't both, although I am not too sure about that.

Genjutsu is just a genre of jutsu akin to ninjutsu. It just involves chakra manipulation a different and often more difficult manner.

 

[dark legion]

isn't this a Genjutsu ::

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Or this moment :

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[Senju Bean]

Rofl... It seems like you have misunderstood what a genjutsu is. Having rinnengan or sharingan have nothing to do with genjutsu. Any shinobi can learn to use genjutsu in some manner, but members of the Uchiha clan have proved a greater affinity for this due to many factors. Of course the sharingan helps a lot, as you can see the flow of chakra, which makes it easier to form genjutsu, but all in all it has nothing to do with it, and we have seen several shinobi using different types of genjutsu.

Any shinobi have both yin and yang chakra, but the ratios may differ greatly. That is the entire essence of chakra molding and being able to form genjutsu for instance. Perhaps Lee could be mentioned as one, who hasn't both, although I am not too sure about that.

Genjutsu is just a genre of jutsu akin to ninjutsu. It just involves chakra manipulation a different and often more difficult manner.

Of course but the Rinnegan has no special unique genjutsu techs like the Sharingan has

 

[Senju Bean]

isn't this a Genjutsu ::

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Or this moment :

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That is not genjutsu. that is chakra disruption

 

[thegame]

Of course but the Rinnegan has no special unique genjutsu techs like the Sharingan has

Unique? You mean MS abilities?

But Pain's human path did use genjutsu as I recall. He used that jutsu to go inside someones mind and extract information. That is a genjutsu. The only difference on that genjutsu and those used by uchiha (for same purpose), is that Pain's killed the victim instantly afterwards.

But we also saw, that there was several mind barriers inside the lower level shinobi of the rain village, which Pain had placed there. When Jiraya captured that dude he tickled with a feather, his mind was investigated by people of the Yamanaka clan and they encoutered such mind barriers, which is obviously a form of barrier genjutsu.

 

[Senju Bean]

Unique? You mean MS abilities?

But Pain's human path did use genjutsu as I recall. He used that jutsu to go inside someones mind and extract information. That is a genjutsu. The only difference on that genjutsu and those used by uchiha (for same purpose), is that Pain's killed the victim instantly afterwards.

But we also saw, that there was several mind barriers inside the lower level shinobi of the rain village, which Pain had placed there. When Jiraya captured that dude he tickled with a feather, his mind was investigated by people of the Yamanaka clan and they encoutered such mind barriers, which is obviously a form of barrier genjutsu.

How is that genjutsu. I'm thinking long range influence of the mind.

 

[Draxus]

How is that genjutsu. I'm thinking long range influence of the mind.

You can't just change the definition of genjutsu to fit your theory. Genjustsu by definition is using your chakra to effect your opponent's chakra network. This can cause illusions, sleep, paralysis, or even allow you to control their body. It has nothing to do w/ range, and doesn't specifically target the mind.

So chakra rods can be used to cause a type of genjutsu.

 

[Senju Bean]

You can't just change the definition of genjutsu to fit your theory. Genjustsu by definition is using your chakra to effect your opponent's chakra network. This can cause illusions, sleep, paralysis, or even allow you to control their body. It has nothing to do w/ range, and doesn't specifically target the mind.

Ok but that's nitpicking. The reason the Rinnegan doesn't have OP genjutsu techs( Tsukuyomi, Kotoamatsukami, Infinite Tsukuyomi, Genjutsu at a distance) is simply because it's ratio of Yin to Yang is just too low.

Of course Rinnegan can use some Genjutsu, It has Yin after all. The Rinnegan just can't use any of the one shotters Genjutsu that I have mentioned.

 

[thegame]

How is that genjutsu. I'm thinking long range influence of the mind.

Well, I am not gonna look for the page in the manga, where genjutsu is explained, but the wiki is good at it:

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Genjutsu is simply defined as manipulation of the flow of chakra in the brain. In other words anything non-physical (and non-spiritual) created using chakra. I am unaware about the Yamanaka clan's mind jutsu's, if they are actually genjutsu. It's a bit difficult with those clan techniques, as some of them do have physical effects. My point is, a jutsu can be both ninjutsu and genjutsu, when it has physical effects. For instance Tsukuyomi is classified as a Ninjutsu in the databook, but it is referred to as a genjutsu.. It's all very confusing, but I am certain we would all call it a genjutsu.

The mind talking jutsu would IMO also be a genjutsu, because you create sound in the brain of the "victim". Other people around him will not be able to hear it unless the user wants to let them. So the sound is just an illusion in ones mind created by manipulating the flow of chakra to the brain. That is the definition of a genjutsu.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Stupidity Par Excellence:

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[kotoamatsukami]

You can't just change the definition of genjutsu to fit your theory. Genjustsu by definition is using your chakra to effect your opponent's chakra network. This can cause illusions, sleep, paralysis, or even allow you to control their body. It has nothing to do w/ range, and doesn't specifically target the mind.

So chakra rods can be used to cause a type of genjutsu.

Um no rods can not be used as genjutsu.

 

[thegame]

Stupidity Par Excellence:

Spoiler

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Well hello sir,

certainly mature of you, giving negative rep with the response "nope".
How should I act in response to that? Find one of your many theories (which is now utterly wrong), which you spent days or even weeks in replying "thanks", "maybe", or "okay" to every person, that wrote in the thread, for then to ignore major questions proposed by people, that actually took time reading your theory?

Stupid is the one who neglects other possibilities unless something is completely clarified. Luckily Naruto is a novel, and as such it may be interpretted in many ways. A theory can only be validated by questioning it, and that may involve considering every possibility.

Stupid is the one, who does not realise, his own stupidity, and I certainly realise my own stupidity, when it's that obvious. You however, did not realise the stupidity of this pathetic attempt to offend me.

And oh the irony, when you were mad at people posting non-topic in your threads

 

[kisamexRocks]

There might be genjutsu with Rinnegan but it's truly OP if Kishi wont bring it in. Having Rinnegan or Sharingan or Byakugon doesn't mean you can do genjutsu, remember Kuneai(Spelling) the leaf girl ninja that was bangin with Asuma, she used genjutsu on itachi and she doesn't have special eyes.Even I think Tayuya used sound as a genjutsu. And the frogs that fought with jiraiya against pain used sound to create a genjutsu.

Black rods just disrupt chakra and try to control you. But it's not genjutsu.

 

[altaire uchiha]

Well hello sir,

certainly mature of you, giving negative rep with the response "nope".
How should I act in response to that? Find one of your many theories (which is now utterly wrong), which you spent days or even weeks in replying "thanks", "maybe", or "okay" to every person, that wrote in the thread, for then to ignore major questions proposed by people, that actually took time reading your theory?

Stupid is the one who neglects other possibilities unless something is completely clarified. Luckily Naruto is a novel, and as such it may be interpretted in many ways. A theory can only be validated by questioning it, and that may involve considering every possibility.

Stupid is the one, who does not realise, his own stupidity, and I certainly realise my own stupidity, when it's that obvious. You however, did not realise the stupidity of this pathetic attempt to offend me.

And oh the irony, when you were mad at people posting non-topic in your threads

Dont encourage him by acknowledging his idiocy. Its all people like him have, its why they do things like that, theyre so attention starved in real life they try to live off of negative attention on a message board.

 

[flyboyissac]

I like ur theory's keep it up

 

[Draxus]

Ok but that's nitpicking. The reason the Rinnegan doesn't have OP genjutsu techs( Tsukuyomi, Kotoamatsukami, Infinite Tsukuyomi, Genjutsu at a distance) is simply because it's ratio of Yin to Yang is just too low.

Of course Rinnegan can use some Genjutsu, It has Yin after all. The Rinnegan just can't use any of the one shotters Genjutsu that I have mentioned.

Well see now you're moving the goal post. If you don't want your theory nitpicked then don't post it. Generally people like me, enjoy reading theories and poking holes.

You can call it nitpicking if you want to, but it's pretty clear to me the reason is that rinnegan doesn't need an OP genjutsu and has nothing at all to do with yin or yang chakra. Sharingan are watered down Rinnegan, sure they are weaker over-all but have evolved to excel in other areas.

Ultimately my point was you have to consider the actual definition of genjutsu in a theory like this, because you are basically saying it's not possible for rinnegan user to use KA or Tsuki. Kinda silly when you think about how rinnegan has the ability to control life and death.

Um no rods can not be used as genjutsu.

Do charka rods not allow the user to manipulate their victims chakra with their own?

Well, I am not gonna look for the page in the manga, where genjutsu is explained, but the wiki is good at it:

You must be registered for see links

Genjutsu is simply defined as manipulation of the flow of chakra in the brain. In other words anything non-physical (and non-spiritual) created using chakra. I am unaware about the Yamanaka clan's mind jutsu's, if they are actually genjutsu. It's a bit difficult with those clan techniques, as some of them do have physical effects. My point is, a jutsu can be both ninjutsu and genjutsu, when it has physical effects. For instance Tsukuyomi is classified as a Ninjutsu in the databook, but it is referred to as a genjutsu.. It's all very confusing, but I am certain we would all call it a genjutsu.

All genjutsu technically fall under the classification of ninjutsu, since you have to mold chakra to perform it. Hope that clears thing up for you.

 

[Senju Bean]

Well see now you're moving the goal post. If you don't want your theory nitpicked then don't post it. Generally people like me, enjoy reading theories and poking holes.

You can call it nitpicking if you want to, but it's pretty clear to me the reason is that rinnegan doesn't need an OP genjutsu and has nothing at all to do with yin or yang chakra. Sharingan are watered down Rinnegan, sure they are weaker over-all but have evolved to excel in other areas.

Ultimately my point was you have to consider the actual definition of genjutsu in a theory like this, because you are basically saying it's not possible for rinnegan user to use KA or Tsuki. Kinda silly when you think about how rinnegan has the ability to control life and death.

Sharingan is not watered down Rinnegan because it's of completely different composition. Rinnegan is a fused balanced of Yin and Yang while the Sharingan is Yin. That is why the techniques shown are completely different. It's a different eye. Now MS is just watered down EMS, that works but EMS is not watered down Rinnegan.

Rinnegan can control life for death because it has access to reality warping powers via Inyouton. But because Rinnegan uses an equal amount of Yang when ever it uses Yin, it's not going to come out with a very powerful genjutsu like Tsukyomi or Koto. Tsukyomi and Koto are heavily composed of mostly Yin, if not all.

 

[Draxus]

Sharingan is not watered down Rinnegan because it's of completely different composition. Rinnegan is a fused balanced of Yin and Yang while the Sharingan is Yin. That is why the techniques shown are completely different. It's a different eye. Now MS is just watered down EMS, that works but EMS is not watered down Rinnegan.

Rinnegan can control life for death because it has access to reality warping powers via Inyouton. But because Rinnegan uses an equal amount of Yang when ever it uses Yin, it's not going to come out with a very powerful genjutsu like Tsukyomi or Koto. Tsukyomi and Koto are heavily composed of mostly Yin, if not all.

If it wasn't a watered down version, then Sharingans couldn't become Rinnegans, but they can, just like MS becomes EMS.

So you're saying it's NOT POSSIBLE for Rinnegan to use an ability that's mostly yin or yang chakra? Does this mean a being of mostly yang chakra won't be able to preform powerful genjutsu too?

 

[Senju Bean]

So you're saying it's NOT POSSIBLE for Rinnegan to use an ability that's mostly yin or yang chakra?

Precisely, because the Rinnegan uses both at once.

Now, thats not saying that a Rinnegan user can't use a powerful genjutsu. They can, but not directly through the eyes. Maybe through sound or hand seals, like Infinite Darkness by Hashirama or Tayuya's flute.