Why Madara HASN'T confirmed Izuna's death

[Edge]

Izuna is dead. Madara is pretty much saying that what he got from his brothers death is hatred. Which means his brother death is fueling his motivation to complete the moons eye plan for his solution to world peace.

Not true. In that scene, Madara is debating with Tsunade in that the only thing that is passed on after death from generation to generation is power. Tsunade argues that this isn't true and that love and the famous Will of Fire are passed on. Madara retorts that all they inherited was hatred.

Nothing there states that Izuna's death was Madara's motivation.

Nice try.

 

[6PathsofKami]

Not true. In that scene, Madara is debating with Tsunade in that the only thing that is passed on after death from generation to generation is power. Tsunade argues that this isn't true and that love and the famous Will of Fire are passed on. Madara retorts that all they inherited was hatred.

Nothing there states that Izuna's death was Madara's motivation.

Nice try.

Yeah thats what I got from that too and it wouldnt make sense if he is planning the moons eye plan because of his bros death coz he is partly to blame for taking his eyes.

 

[onimusha madara]

i +rep you but my input is this i man who was once equal to madara they were literal both badass to the max now ik that madara isnt a complete **** he even said that to a man he hated and respected the 1st that he would have taught him how to revive himself so to his own bro who gave him his eyes his fleash and blood wouldn't he have some sort of an idea on maybe i want my brother back maybe i will make a plan maybe i feel a bit bad for my bro giving his eyes so yeah maybe ill teach him for this badass susanoo power just saying he could be good guy madara i mean he did say he would bring back the first for a good challenge ya know guys

 

[KidGamer65]

Nice theory +rep

 

[Artaya]

Anyone could still be alive even if they've died; it seems like this comes up all the time in the series. I mean, Orochimaru just sprouted from a couple tattoo's after being dead for ages. And on that note; do you think that he could have been pulled out of the curse mark that way if he hadn't died? Like, could there have been two Orochimaru's?

Also, did Madara have Rinnegan before he died? I thought his power got juiced by the Edo by Kabuto? Am I wrong?

 

[jaykuhz]

I like this thread better than any Obito thread on the Internet. Good job dude +rep

Edit: I know this isn't a Tobi ID thread, but you know...still good evidence I guess, you know?

 

[Edge]

I like this thread better than any Obito thread on the Internet. Good job dude +rep

Edit: I know this isn't a Tobi ID thread, but you know...still good evidence I guess, you know?

Thanks a lot dude And yeah I guess, but Izuna could be aaaaaaaaanybody

 

[Prime Rib]

of course izuna isnt dead

 

[Edge]

of course izuna isnt dead

I think so too, people can also believe he's dead but all I want is for people to to stop quoting Madara as saying he' dead for sure in that particular instance.

It's still open ended.

 

[〜Angel Reborn〜]

First off, THIS IS NOT a Tobi thread. Tobi could be the man in the moon for all I care, I just wanted to get this out after hearing it tossed around so many times.


Now to the point, a lot of people insist that Izuna must be dead because Madara "confirmed" it.

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This one panel here ^

"After my brother died, he only left me his eyes and their power."

"AFTER my brother died..."

I've looked up several translations as well as the actual Raws for the chapter for those who want to put forth the translation argument. It's virtually the same both ways.

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Madara as speaking as if Izuna's death is in the past. It's a tricky way to word it, but basically Madara is confirming his death, but at the same time leaving his actual current status ambiguous. Basically we know Izuna DIED (in the past), but he may not actually be DEAD.

Who else fits this description? Who else has DIED but is not currently DEAD?


-Kakashi

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-Shizune

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-Fukasaku

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-Madara

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All of these folks have died. Are they currently dead? No.
Thus, you can insert any of the above mentioned into Madara's sentence form.

Ex. "After Kakashi died, he imparted a final gift of bravery and heroism towards Chouji by saving his life from Pain's missiles."

See? Just because they died in the past, doesn't mean they are dead in the present.

*Also, pretty much everyone who was ever Edo Tenseid (although now technically dead) had DIED before they were revived. When they were fighting they had DIED but were not DEAD (revived).

Now what sort of incredible magical force could possibly revive someone? Theoretically Madara would have been the one to revive Izuna. How can this be?

Which magical set of eyes does Madara have?

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What can the Rinnegan do?

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Does Madara know how to revive people using the Rinne Tensei?

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There you go.

Furthermore, some argue that if Izuna was indeed alive, then Madara would've just said it plain and simple. I mean, why not?
However, Madara wouldn't say "My brother's still alive." because it would ruin whatever plans Kishi has for Izuna to reappear. Even if Madara had bothered to say his brother was still alive or something along those lines, the DIALOGUE WOULD STILL SOUND THE SAME.

Ex.1 "After my brother died, all he left me where his eyes and their power, but he's still alive."

Ex.2 "My brother is still alive, but after he died all he left me were his eyes and their power."

So to summarize, Madara hasn't really confirmed anything other than Izuna DIED (in the past) but he never said that he's actually DEAD. He may yet still be alive for whatever reasons .

You can choose whether or not to believe Izuna is still alive, but don't say that Madara has confirmed anything when he technically hasn't. Death doesn't really have much of an impact in this manga as you may have realized. Thanks for reading

Hmmm Very posible man - and it makes sense that the eye he currently has works well with him as of an other uchiha - must be the eye of Obito...

 

[hunk143]

Yes Madara know how to revive people using the Rinne Tensei... Thats why he said he wanted Nagato to revive him.
And i too somewhat believe that Izuna might be Tobi but i'll wait for Kishi to Troll.

 

[supino]

hasn't Nagato already explained that in order for the rinne tensei to work not much time after a person has died must pass?

Spoiler

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it doesn't make sense since otherwise Nagato could had revived Yahiko. he had his very well preserved body, all he had to do was use rinne tensei and ta da! no reason for Pain to exist.

Madara awoke the rinnegan after his battle with Hashirama and shortly before he died, that's most likely decades after Izuna died. Whatever way Madara has found to use the rinne tensei on himself involves probably keeping a part of himself/ his chakra alive for long enough so that the new rinnegan user would learn and perform the technique. and that's what he meant when he spoke of revealing to Hashirama the way to come back from the dead, the way he found to die but still preserve a part of himself 'alive'.

 

[natssuu]

Indeed, if Madara said that his brother is dead then it would be different story. Tobi = Izuna is still strong theory.

 

[Frikid]

this thread is more like counters for people who say izuna is dead so he can't be tobi xd

but since it ain't related to tobi or who is tobi ... it can't be closed, clever ...

 

[Edge]

hasn't Nagato already explained that in order for the rinne tensei to work not much time after a person has died must pass?

Spoiler

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it doesn't make sense since otherwise Nagato could had revived Yahiko. he had his very well preserved body, all he had to do was use rinne tensei and ta da! no reason for Pain to exist.

Madara awoke the rinnegan after his battle with Hashirama and shortly before he died, that's most likely decades after Izuna died. Whatever way Madara has found to use the rinne tensei on himself involves probably keeping a part of himself/ his chakra alive for long enough so that the new rinnegan user would learn and perform the technique. and that's what he meant when he spoke of revealing to Hashirama the way to come back from the dead, the way he found to die but still preserve a part of himself 'alive'.

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Madara obviously had a plan for revival; and it wasn't through Edo Tensei (his surprise at learning that's how he was summoned). He was expecting Nagato to revive him hence the "That brat Nagato finally managed to grow". He wasn't planning on reviving himself. Also, by your argument, how could Madara have been revived if he theoretically died when Nagato was a child? (since he knew Nagato when he was a "brat") . That's quite a long time.

Nowhere is is stated that Madara needs to keep a part of himself alive, until we know more about the Rinne Tensei tech, I wouldn't believe that Nagato knew everything about how it worked or even began to use it to it's full potential. After all, these are the SO6 paths eyes...

this thread is more like counters for people who say izuna is dead so he can't be tobi xd

but since it ain't related to tobi or who is tobi ... it can't be closed, clever ...

I have no idea what you're talking about >.>

 

[Timiursa]

Absolutely possible, man, good job.

And it's interesting how the only people who disagree with this simply keep posting that page and yell "Bad translation" xD

 

[Minator93]

Nice. I never thought of it this way. +rep

 

[Edge]

Nice. I never thought of it this way. +rep

Glad I made you think differently xd

 

[KevinPJH]

+Rep.

IF this is how it went down in the Manga, i would be very happy.

 

[supino]

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Madara obviously had a plan for revival; and it wasn't through Edo Tensei (his surprise at learning that's how he was summoned). He was expecting Nagato to revive him hence the "That brat Nagato finally managed to grow". He wasn't planning on reviving himself. Also, by your argument, how could Madara have been revived if he theoretically died when Nagato was a child? (since he knew Nagato when he was a "brat") . That's quite a long time.

Nowhere is is stated that Madara needs to keep a part of himself alive, until we know more about the Rinne Tensei tech, I wouldn't believe that Nagato knew everything about how it worked or even began to use it to it's full potential. After all, these are the SO6 paths eyes...

My theory is that Madara had a plan to preserve a part of him or a substantial part of his chakra to this world. and of course it's not stated nowhere, because it is a theory like many other things are. this entire thread is based upon a theory actually.

I think it was pretty clear when I wrote that if Nagato could had used rinne tensei in any other way he could had easily revived Yahiko, anyone could disagree with the idea of Nagato reviving his best friend while knowing rinne tensei or explain why when he found out how to use the rinne tensei not even once he considered sacrificing some of his chakra to perform the jutsu, after all for Nagato bringing back just one person wouldn't be impossible, he died only after he invaded and demolished Konoha, fought a long battle against Naruto AND brought back an entire village. furthermore, it appears that Konan knows what rinne tensei is and how it can tire Nagato which makes me think they had used or attempted to use it before.

Spoiler

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then again there is my favourite argument, quite the opposite of what you stated, that Nagato didn't know much about the jutsu.... yet another theory. which brings us to, as you said: we don't know much about that technique. fair enough, but we do not know much about other techniques as well and yet we can observe the results and consequences. and from what is shown in the manga, so far, it seems that there is a time limit after which, is very much likely, that rinne tensei cannot bring back people.

(and what do you mean the eyes of so6p? those are Madara's? or you mean it like, the same as those of the so6p?)