Eh, actually you got a point about Luffy there. He just recently got rescued by Jimbei and then runs off on his own in BM's territory without thinking. Yeah, I thought he would act different after being sent off by Kuma and Ace's death but guess not :/
Zoro's character has definitely gone through a lot of growth.. good posts ToshiZO!
This made me think about the other SH's.. and while, yes, their character growth has been significant as well.. idk if any have had more growth than Zoro's character.
I said he showed character development, moreso than pretty much any other strawhat. Lmfao you guys somehow think being interesting = character development.
Yeah amazing growth. He spoke his mind on 2 occasions.
As for the sacrificing the dream for Luffy's dream. Robin, Nami and Sanji did that too. So Zoro can just get in line.
You can't be serious if you think he had more growth than most Strawhats. Aside from Brook, Franky and Chopper who also basically didn't get any love. Zoro is probably in the bottom 4.
Yeah amazing growth. He spoke his mind on 2 occasions.
As for the sacrificing the dream for Luffy's dream. Robin, Nami and Sanji did that too. So Zoro can just get in line.
You can't be serious if you think he had more growth than most Strawhats. Aside from Brook, Franky and Chopper who also basically didn't get any love. Zoro is probably in the bottom 4.
Because Sanji, Nami, and the rest of the SHs directly told Luffy they were going to kill Luffy if he gets in the way of their goal right? Don't lump them together oversimplifying the whole situation.
Also there is the fact that he is much more serious and involved with Luffy and the moves the Strawhats make. The other SHs haven't changed much when it comes to their stance among their directions. Usopp will give you that I'm shit scare of entering vibe, Nami will give you something similar to what she would have said in chapter 100, go look at how Zoro handles going from island to island from back then and compare it to how he is constantly thinking ahead in the New World.
Zoro is much more invested, it is a noticeable change from pre timeskip.
Not really going to take your opinion seriously here when you clearly were having trouble distinguishing interesting character to character development, trying to say Zoro is a boring character like that means anything in this debate.
Also you speak as though Zoro needs to speak his mind on more than 2 occasions to show his growth? What, is that how we measure things? Even 1 occasion is enough to dive deep into the mentality of a character, that's just being shallow counting moments.
Only other SH I can see with more development here is Robin like Beezy said.
Yeah amazing growth. He spoke his mind on 2 occasions.
As for the sacrificing the dream for Luffy's dream. Robin, Nami and Sanji did that too. So Zoro can just get in line.
You can't be serious if you think he had more growth than most Strawhats. Aside from Brook, Franky and Chopper who also basically didn't get any love. Zoro is probably in the bottom 4.
That's the point you don't get. It's not about having it. It's about developing it. Zoro neither has it nor did he ever developed it.
Lets say a character gets a sad flashback. He goes through all these character defining moments, but then as soon as the next island comes up we hit the reset button and its as if none of that just happened.
Then that is an example of a lack of character development despite getting more insight on the character and having these moments.
Also there is the fact that he is much more serious and involved with Luffy and the moves the Strawhats make. The other SHs haven't changed much when it comes to their stance among their directions. Usopp will give you that I'm shit scare of entering vibe, Nami will give you something similar to what she would have said in chapter 100, go look at how Zoro handles going from island to island from back then and compare it to how he is constantly thinking ahead in the New World.
You're biased and focusing everything on Zoro without taking the others in account.
You can easily make (better) lists that show growth for most SH's. Everybody knows that, even you. Keeping up this argument is just lying to yourself.
Gee I'm so happy that in 20 years of One Piece Zoro showed some growth since he said he would kill Luffy in chapter 8 if he would come in between him and his dream.
I didn't say he had none, I said he had very little.
You're biased and focusing everything on Zoro without taking the others in account.
You can easily make (better) lists that show growth for most SH's. Everybody knows that, even you. Keeping up this argument is just lying to yourself.
Gee I'm so happy that in 20 years of One Piece Zoro showed some growth since he said he would kill Luffy in chapter 8 if he would come in between him and his dream.
I didn't say he had none, I said he had very little.
Ah I see the problem here. You are confusing a character being fleshed out with character development.
You can make the argument Zoro isn't as fleshed out as the other Strawhats. You can't however make an argument for Zoro's character development which is something completely different.
You can have the most stale character which you hardly know anything of, and he can get more development than the most multidimensional character. Lmfao I think most people have the same issue between differentiating the two.
Zoro is in fact along with Robin the Strawhat with the most character development.
I agree with Toshizo on this. The Strawhats are actually quite stagnant as characters. Fleshing out backstory is great and all, but it doesn't necessarily equate to progression of a characters personality, its just groundwork. Sanji is just now after all this time getting some groundwork and frankly, his character hasn't truly progressed one ounce. If anything, he regressed this arc by quite a bit. Sure he was put under some impossible situations, but his loyalty should always have been with his crew. Also wano, is zoro's arc, so lets expect some progression there.
Not fair zeff was being targeted too tbh idk why sanji is getting so much shit.
Had zoro brook anyone else been in a situation where something you cared about were to be blown up (in zoro case it would be the white sword only diffferences is that sanji hands would blow up) all of the people that you care about basically has a hit out on them
Not to mention the threat of a yonko trying to kill off your crew all for you. I mean no one could have gotten out of his situation
However zoro vs sanji in terms of character development imma def give it to sanji
For multiple reasons 1
We just had a year of sanji where we seen multiple shades of his characters and how much he cares for everyone to throw his life away
Two while I admit zoro has become more serious his character is still stagnant... the whole badass thing is getting played out I feel like zoro will become so much more I am just waiting for ODA to do so
Aside from honor, passion and love for his captain we haven't seen much of zoro's personality
Ida puts him inn situations where he doesn't have to try or be challenged which is why we can't see more of his personality
Character development is usually shown (in stories like this) when you lose or your in situation where I can't control it (because it's relatable and that's why the audience eats it up)
People's favorite moment with zoro (myself included) is thewhole kuma situation and that was because he couldn't be badass there he just had to take it until he could not no more.
Eventually we will get more moments like that but until then I do agree zoro's character developement is not as fleshed out as a lot of youare trying to make it seem anyone can find chapters proving that the straw hats have made luffy listen to them or having serious moments they all have them. However with this whole thing with sanji it is showing multitude of different types of feelings which gives us more insight on how his character reacts to things how his mind set works etc. his plan tech would not have failed however big mom and his family are just that much of *******s who only care about themselves.
Not fair zeff was being targeted too tbh idk why sanji is getting so much shit.
Had zoro brook anyone else been in a situation where something you cared about were to be blown up (in zoro case it would be the white sword only diffferences is that sanji hands would blow up) all of the people that you care about basically has a hit out on them
Not to mention the threat of a yonko trying to kill off your crew all for you. I mean no one could have gotten out of his situation
However zoro vs sanji in terms of character development imma def give it to sanji
For multiple reasons 1
We just had a year of sanji where we seen multiple shades of his characters and how much he cares for everyone to throw his life away
Two while I admit zoro has become more serious his character is still stagnant... the whole badass thing is getting played out I feel like zoro will become so much more I am just waiting for ODA to do so
Aside from honor, passion and love for his captain we haven't seen much of zoro's personality
Ida puts him inn situations where he doesn't have to try or be challenged which is why we can't see more of his personality
Character development is usually shown (in stories like this) when you lose or your in situation where I can't control it (because it's relatable and that's why the audience eats it up)
People's favorite moment with zoro (myself included) is thewhole kuma situation and that was because he couldn't be badass there he just had to take it until he could not no more.
Eventually we will get more moments like that but until then I do agree zoro's character developement is not as fleshed out as a lot of youare trying to make it seem anyone can find chapters proving that the straw hats have made luffy listen to them or having serious moments they all have them. However with this whole thing with sanji it is showing multitude of different types of feelings which gives us more insight on how his character reacts to things how his mind set works etc. his plan tech would not have failed however big mom and his family are just that much of *******s who only care about themselves.
i liked the idea.
I hope oda shows a scene where Law and Zoro were attacked by another calamity and Zoro most probably got captured saving Robin or any other SH.
Lets say a character gets a sad flashback. He goes through all these character defining moments, but then as soon as the next island comes up we hit the reset button and its as if none of that just happened.
Except that this mentality has been a consistent character trait of Sanji throughout the entire manga up until this point.
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Traits can make for both positive and negative moments. It's all about how they're curbed in relation to the situation at hand, now what they are in and of themselves. As seen in Sanji's selfless actions in Skypiea and Thriller Bark. Or regarding Zoro's pride, how stern he was about not letting Usopp back into the crew without an apology in the Post-Enies Lobby arc. Oda tried to do the same with Sanji's chivalry, but that's just Oda advocating a stupid, obsolete cultural mindset that should not be portrayed in a positive light. But Oda's not changing at this point, so it's not worth making a note of it.
The entire point of Sanji's character development in the Baratie arc was to learn that he it is worthwhile to risk your life to pursue your dream and that you shouldn't disparage yourself with irrational, nonexistent obligations/debts to your loved ones. And he came out wanting to become a pirate that can search for All-Blue. He grew. But that didn't get rid of his trait of reckless selflessness completely, and it wasn't supposed to. The same applies to Zoro's pride and Usopp's cowardice. These are cornerstones of their characterizations that give them their identities in the first place. Just because they get character development on those fronts to make those traits not go overboard does not mean that they will or should be completely erased. That is both unrealistic and detrimental to why they're individuals. People don't just get over an insecurity they have after overcoming just once in a more minor situation before encountering a newer and more intimidating/traumatic experience. That's just silly and ignorant. Just because Usopp built up the nerve to fight against Kuro in Syrup Village doesn't mean he's going to be fearless during Arlong Park and Alabasta. That's preposterous. There are flaws in all of us that take as long as years to confront/fully come to terms with in a variety of applications. And that's what makes them all the more compelling to get engrossed in through a fictional lens meant to reference and inspire people in real life. Otherwise, characters are just fully developed in their first arc or even arc. Which, needless, is pretty freaking boring and redundant to have a story based around unless it's a series based around the supporting cast's growth in response to the protagonist's attributes like One-Punch Man. If we're going to play this game, then I might as well falsely state that Luffy saving Robin at the end of Alabasta makes her character development in Water 7/Enies Lobby of building up her will to live and have faith in others superfluous.
Also, each trial that pushes a character to get internal development can be similar and different simultaneously. In the Baratie, Sanji didn't have to deal with his father figure's life, his new true family, and his own hands that he holds pride in being used as extortion stakes from a family that always belittled him as being a worthless failure who is blasphemous towards their expectations for royal, biologically-enhanced, apathetic progenies. The message is similar to the Baratie's, but not in a way that makes this arc redundant. It's meant to provide continuity to Sanji's struggles as a character. Pushing him into new stakes, circumstances, and nuanced meaning with a consistent general topic. Oda's not pretending that Sanji's development during the Baratie arc didn't happen. He's doing this BECAUSE IT HAPPENED. All Sanji had to build up the will for in the Baratie arc was being able to risk his debt and something tangible like the ship to fight. In Totland, he actually has other people's lives on the line based on every choice he makes. People who are family to him. He can't just decide to fight through the odds like Luffy, whose logic in this arc is also stubbornly flawed. Because beating up the bad guy in charge like usual can't work here. Sanji's stakes this time are the people who mean dearest to him as a testament to how far he has come in appreciating the Straw Hats as well as himself. This is meant to test what Sanji has learned and struggled with to see if those lessons can extend to situations as tense as Totland's, and thus reveal and even deeper and inspiring conviction behind such ideals. Which is why we can still find superhero stories entertaining even though they continually redecorate the same overall moral of not killing and building up valor. Sanji needs to learn he needs to trust his friends in being to help him besides just fighting and that subjugating yourself with whatever rules your captors make is not a reliable strategy, because you all you have is their word.
So before you post pages from the source material like that, make sure you try to get the full content of that scene/arc into view. Like posting the page right before it:
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Zoro's character development theme is pride. Usopp's character development theme is cowardice. Sanji's character development theme is selflessness. That's all there is to it, and doesn't mean they should all be one-in-done cases than properly fleshed out and explored in all sorts of awe-inspiringly engrossing dynamics to make some awesome stories to read. Not that the story can't ever focus on other aspects of their multi-dimensional characters, because thing should be switched up to not make things monotonous, of course.
The only real gripe I have about Sanji's character arc in Totland is Oda making Sani give a whole "I betrayed you/I don't care about you" monologue to Luffy and Nami similar to what Nami and Robin did. I expect more creativity from Oda and Sanji should know that wouldn't work. However, going as far as physically beating up Luffy, which neither of those girls did, helps make up for that. And he only succumbed to his state of despair after trying to act rebellious to the Vinsmokes and ending up seeing Cosette get beaten up. So he had a front row seat of seeing how any hasty actions could get other hurt. Oh, and the Vinsmokes themselves are two-dimensional and don't add anything to Sanji's internal struggles flashback-wise, but that's a whole other subject lol.
- Having a sad backstory =/= character development
- Being a multidimensional character =/= character development.
Actually, there's a difference between these terms. It's understandably not noticeable to some people until it's broken down for them. See, character change/development is meant to define the specific moments where characters surpass their internal inhibitions and finally acknowledge why they were were wrong or flawed in their mindset. Character growth goes for moments that take place AFTER instances of change/development, and are meant to showcase how much a character has come in their journey to reference past experiences where they first became enlightened and stronger inside/out.
To give an example, Zoro losing Mihawk in the Baratie arc to learn just how much of a small fry he was compared to the big leagues. Therefore promising Luffy that he will never lose again and tying into his dedication towards helping Luffy become the Pirate King. That's character CHANGE/DEVELOPMENT. In contrast, Zoro being willing to sacrifice his life and pride to Kuma and Mihawk respectively were signs of character GROWTH. Showing how much Zoro's grown to care about his crewmates. In that moment, Zoro didn't hesitate in the slightest in making his decision. There was no struggle or need to change there, because he already underwent said changes over the course of the story to those specific points in time. What Sanji's going through now in Totland is very much character development as it's pushing his ideals, personality quirks, and bonds to the brink as he constantly hesitates and gets his morale broken down.
Lets say a character gets a sad flashback. He goes through all these character defining moments, but then as soon as the next island comes up we hit the reset button and its as if none of that just happened.
I can understand how that's disappointing for some, but One Piece as a series isn't meant to heavily focus on the Straw Hats themselves all of the time. If anything, most of the arcs are about seeing how the casts of the islands themselves develop in response to the Straw Hats. The development for the Straw Hats themselves are sparsely spread out, and in a way that's more meaningful special for when they do get intimate focus. A character getting character development does not mean that their traits linked to their past struggles suddenly get completely erased, or that their issues are completely solved to never become relevant again. Like I said before, that would actually be bad characterization and take away from what makes them unique characters. They just shouldn't make the exact same mistakes in similar circumstances again and come to terms with themselves more.
Then that is an example of a lack of character development despite getting more insight on the character and having these moments.
Usopp shows regression at times (Dressrosa). Luffy is a pretty stagnant character tbh. You would think he would change after Ace's death, but he acts almost identical to how he was pre timeskip.
The Dressrosa incident for Usopp was a bit messy, but people have come up with decent excuses for it. Such as forgetting Robin in that moment, which in turn may erase a bunch of pivotal moments in how he's stepped up his courage like burning the flag at Enies Lobby and sniping Spandam to save Robin. Also, it was the first time that Usopp had to protect the lives of people who weren't close friends, but random individuals who held Usopp up to a high pedestal because of believing his lies. So it was also a test of Usopp living up to other peoples' expectations. I would preferred a different execution to that scene so that explanations like these could be highlighted, but Dressrosa as a whole is what it is and hopefully Wano Country will not be a repeat.
I've seen that type of complaint aimed towards Luffy, but it's because of his flawed, yet insightfully simple personality that makes him an entertaining protagonist. Having him become more serious and worldly would be boring, and would actually go against how he was able to inspire so many people up until now in the series despite his palpable stupidity and rashness. And that was also not the point of Ace's death, which was supposed to convince Luffy that he wasn't strong enough for the New World, that he can't just wing everything and expect to save everybody at his current level, and to deal with grief while realizing the worth of his crew. He saved and motivated all of them, and they in turn indirectly saved and motivated him. Which is why they trained, so as to catch up with the rest of the series' powerful factions and characters. He doesn't need to become Zoro or Law or anything, that would be a big turn-off. They needed to build-up the strength to not have to be forced to run away like they did in Sabaody Archipelago. That's pretty much it. And we see that when he tangos with Fujitora in Dressrosa and says that now he doesn't and shouldn't have to run away like he did pre-timeskip.
Zoro went from putting his goal > Luffy.
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To putting Luffy's life > his goal.
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To throwing his pride away (and he is extremely prideful) bowing down to his end goal for Luffy, and train for Luffy rather than just the WSS.
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Zoro is also much more serious than he was pre timeskip, he went from a nonchalant person to keeping Luffy in check.
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He cares a lot for the moves the strawhats make, before he used to allow Luffy to make decisions on a whim, sleeping 99% of the time, but the New World and his changed role in the strawhats demand him to do this, in his mind atleast.
Those are all pretty damn great moments that help give subtle, yet profound moments of character growth for Zoro. If only other Straw Hats displayed moments like those as well.
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Oh, if only.
In other words he is much more serious now than ever.
And blander. Which is certainly a great testament to Mihawk's character, or lack of it for better wording.
Zoro completely molded from simply a strong fighter in the strawhats to Luffy's right hand man (VC mentality). He showed some of the most growth among the SHs. Whether people like his pre ts laid back character over the current more serious character is a complaint of personality preference not character development.
It is an issue with personality preference (not that it makes such a complaint any less valid).
Additionally, I argue that Jimbei makes for more of a Vice Captain than Zoro (not that I don't see where you're coming from). Zoro makes for more of a charismatic front-lining soldier than really being suited to the assortment of responsibilities a First Mate has to deal with.
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You need to be proficient in a social environment with other competent people is to humbly listen and think objectively. It's never about being right for the sake of being right, but helping everybody gain more insight into how the series ticks to accurately acknowledge both its flaws and attributes. I'll always respect someone who's willing to admit when they're wrong more than always happening to be right on the first go. That shows you value the truth more than superficial complacency.
That's just my advice I've come to learn from all of the years of foruming. Not that you asked about it, but I like to reassure people about that since it's easy to forget.
No he has plenty of development....if strength defined character development, Kaido would be top 3 in character development but he clearly lacks that so don't confuse the idea of zoro not having a solid development because some people like to fap to him and thinking he is the strongest and how he is undefeatable....also Sanji just became one of the developed characters in One Piece there is not much Oda can go in-depth on now....it seems you lack understanding of what character development is....
Not that this statement isn't unfounded, but I think it's incorrect to apply it all so broadly.
You don't see Robin suddenly becoming withdrawn and mysterious after Enies Lobby. She became more intertwined into the crew's wackiness.
Except that this mentality has been a consistent character trait of Sanji throughout the entire manga up until this point.
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Traits can make for both positive and negative moments. It's all about how they're curbed in relation to the situation at hand, now what they are in and of themselves. As seen in Sanji's selfless actions in Skypiea and Thriller Bark. Or regarding Zoro's pride, how stern he was about not letting Usopp back into the crew without an apology in the Post-Enies Lobby arc. Oda tried to do the same with Sanji's chivalry, but that's just Oda advocating a stupid, obsolete cultural mindset that should not be portrayed in a positive light. But Oda's not changing at this point, so it's not worth making a note of it.
The entire point of Sanji's character development in the Baratie arc was to learn that he it is worthwhile to risk your life to pursue your dream and that you shouldn't disparage yourself with irrational, nonexistent obligations/debts to your loved ones. And he came out wanting to become a pirate that can search for All-Blue. He grew. But that didn't get rid of his trait of reckless selflessness completely, and it wasn't supposed to. The same applies to Zoro's pride and Usopp's cowardice. These are cornerstones of their characterizations that give them their identities in the first place. Just because they get character development on those fronts to make those traits not go overboard does not mean that they will or should be completely erased. That is both unrealistic and detrimental to why they're individuals. People don't just get over an insecurity they have after overcoming just once in a more minor situation before encountering a newer and more intimidating/traumatic experience. That's just silly and ignorant. Just because Usopp built up the nerve to fight against Kuro in Syrup Village doesn't mean he's going to be fearless during Arlong Park and Alabasta. That's preposterous. There are flaws in all of us that take as long as years to confront/fully come to terms with in a variety of applications. And that's what makes them all the more compelling to get engrossed in through a fictional lens meant to reference and inspire people in real life. Otherwise, characters are just fully developed in their first arc or even arc. Which, needless, is pretty freaking boring and redundant to have a story based around unless it's a series based around the supporting cast's growth in response to the protagonist's attributes like One-Punch Man. If we're going to play this game, then I might as well falsely state that Luffy saving Robin at the end of Alabasta makes her character development in Water 7/Enies Lobby of building up her will to live and have faith in others superfluous.
Also, each trial that pushes a character to get internal development can be similar and different simultaneously. In the Baratie, Sanji didn't have to deal with his father figure's life, his new true family, and his own hands that he holds pride in being used as extortion stakes from a family that always belittled him as being a worthless failure who is blasphemous towards their expectations for royal, biologically-enhanced, apathetic progenies. The message is similar to the Baratie's, but not in a way that makes this arc redundant. It's meant to provide continuity to Sanji's struggles as a character. Pushing him into new stakes, circumstances, and nuanced meaning with a consistent general topic. Oda's not pretending that Sanji's development during the Baratie arc didn't happen. He's doing this BECAUSE IT HAPPENED. All Sanji had to build up the will for in the Baratie arc was being able to risk his debt and something tangible like the ship to fight. In Totland, he actually has other people's lives on the line based on every choice he makes. People who are family to him. He can't just decide to fight through the odds like Luffy, whose logic in this arc is also stubbornly flawed. Because beating up the bad guy in charge like usual can't work here. Sanji's stakes this time are the people who mean dearest to him as a testament to how far he has come in appreciating the Straw Hats as well as himself. This is meant to test what Sanji has learned and struggled with to see if those lessons can extend to situations as tense as Totland's, and thus reveal and even deeper and inspiring conviction behind such ideals. Which is why we can still find superhero stories entertaining even though they continually redecorate the same overall moral of not killing and building up valor. Sanji needs to learn he needs to trust his friends in being to help him besides just fighting and that subjugating yourself with whatever rules your captors make is not a reliable strategy, because you all you have is their word.
So before you post pages from the source material like that, make sure you try to get the full content of that scene/arc into view. Like posting the page right before it:
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Zoro's character development theme is pride. Usopp's character development theme is cowardice. Sanji's character development theme is selflessness. That's all there is to it, and doesn't mean they should all be one-in-done cases than properly fleshed out and explored in all sorts of awe-inspiringly engrossing dynamics to make some awesome stories to read. Not that the story can't ever focus on other aspects of their multi-dimensional characters, because thing should be switched up to not make things monotonous, of course.
The only real gripe I have about Sanji's character arc in Totland is Oda making Sani give a whole "I betrayed you/I don't care about you" monologue to Luffy and Nami similar to what Nami and Robin did. I expect more creativity from Oda and Sanji should know that wouldn't work. However, going as far as physically beating up Luffy, which neither of those girls did, helps make up for that. And he only succumbed to his state of despair after trying to act rebellious to the Vinsmokes and ending up seeing Cosette get beaten up. So he had a front row seat of seeing how any hasty actions could get other hurt. Oh, and the Vinsmokes themselves are two-dimensional and don't add anything to Sanji's internal struggles flashback-wise, but that's a whole other subject lol.
These are both true.
Actually, there's a difference between these terms. It's understandably not noticeable to some people until it's broken down for them. See, character change/development is meant to define the specific moments where characters surpass their internal inhibitions and finally acknowledge why they were were wrong or flawed in their mindset. Character growth goes for moments that take place AFTER instances of change/development, and are meant to showcase how much a character has come in their journey to reference past experiences where they first became enlightened and stronger inside/out.
To give an example, Zoro losing Mihawk in the Baratie arc to learn just how much of a small fry he was compared to the big leagues. Therefore promising Luffy that he will never lose again and tying into his dedication towards helping Luffy become the Pirate King. That's character CHANGE/DEVELOPMENT. In contrast, Zoro being willing to sacrifice his life and pride to Kuma and Mihawk respectively were signs of character GROWTH. Showing how much Zoro's grown to care about his crewmates. In that moment, Zoro didn't hesitate in the slightest in making his decision. There was no struggle or need to change there, because he already underwent said changes over the course of the story to those specific points in time. What Sanji's going through now in Totland is very much character development as it's pushing his ideals, personality quirks, and bonds to the brink as he constantly hesitates and gets his morale broken down.
I can understand how that's disappointing for some, but One Piece as a series isn't meant to heavily focus on the Straw Hats themselves all of the time. If anything, most of the arcs are about seeing how the casts of the islands themselves develop in response to the Straw Hats. The development for the Straw Hats themselves are sparsely spread out, and in a way that's more meaningful special for when they do get intimate focus. A character getting character development does not mean that their traits linked to their past struggles suddenly get completely erased, or that their issues are completely solved to never become relevant again. Like I said before, that would actually be bad characterization and take away from what makes them unique characters. They just shouldn't make the exact same mistakes in similar circumstances again and come to terms with themselves more.
The Dressrosa incident for Usopp was a bit messy, but people have come up with decent excuses for it. Such as forgetting Robin in that moment, which in turn may erase a bunch of pivotal moments in how he's stepped up his courage like burning the flag at Enies Lobby and sniping Spandam to save Robin. Also, it was the first time that Usopp had to protect the lives of people who weren't close friends, but random individuals who held Usopp up to a high pedestal because of believing his lies. So it was also a test of Usopp living up to other peoples' expectations. I would preferred a different execution to that scene so that explanations like these could be highlighted, but Dressrosa as a whole is what it is and hopefully Wano Country will not be a repeat.
I've seen that type of complaint aimed towards Luffy, but it's because of his flawed, yet insightfully simple personality that makes him an entertaining protagonist. Having him become more serious and worldly would be boring, and would actually go against how he was able to inspire so many people up until now in the series despite his palpable stupidity and rashness. And that was also not the point of Ace's death, which was supposed to convince Luffy that he wasn't strong enough for the New World, that he can't just wing everything and expect to save everybody at his current level, and to deal with grief while realizing the worth of his crew. He saved and motivated all of them, and they in turn indirectly saved and motivated him. Which is why they trained, so as to catch up with the rest of the series' powerful factions and characters. He doesn't need to become Zoro or Law or anything, that would be a big turn-off. They needed to build-up the strength to not have to be forced to run away like they did in Sabaody Archipelago. That's pretty much it. And we see that when he tangos with Fujitora in Dressrosa and says that now he doesn't and shouldn't have to run away like he did pre-timeskip.
Those are all pretty damn great moments that help give subtle, yet profound moments of character growth for Zoro. If only other Straw Hats displayed moments like those as well.
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Oh, if only.
And blander. Which is certainly a great testament to Mihawk's character, or lack of it for better wording.
It is an issue with personality preference (not that it makes such a complaint any less valid).
Additionally, I argue that Jimbei makes for more of a Vice Captain than Zoro (not that I don't see where you're coming from). Zoro makes for more of a charismatic front-lining soldier than really being suited to the assortment of responsibilities a First Mate has to deal with.
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You need to be proficient in a social environment with other competent people is to humbly listen and think objectively. It's never about being right for the sake of being right, but helping everybody gain more insight into how the series ticks to accurately acknowledge both its flaws and attributes. I'll always respect someone who's willing to admit when they're wrong more than always happening to be right on the first go. That shows you value the truth more than superficial complacency.
That's just my advice I've come to learn from all of the years of foruming. Not that you asked about it, but I like to reassure people about that since it's easy to forget.
Being one-dimentional, Not having depth to the character, and Lack of development make Zoros character uninteresting. And the same shit makes Luffy interesting. #NB Logic :yeah:
Being one-dimentional, Not having depth to the character, and Lack of development make Zoros character uninteresting. And the same shit makes Luffy interesting. #NB Logic :yeah:
