What power would you rather have?

[To Whatever]

It's the opposite. RSM can be used by anyone who knows Sage Mode and has Rikodou's chakra. Sasuke can learn Sage Mode and combine it with his Six Paths chakra to attain RSM if he wants, though it will be weaker than Naruto's RSM. And you'll have the Six Paths chakra if you have the Rinnegan, which means if you have Rinnegan, you can get RSM as well.

But an RSM user cannot get the Rinnegan in anyway aside from stealing/taking from someone else.

RSM is a gift the databook states that. What RSM are you talking about as Naruto's version includes the bijuu and his modes.

And yeah, a RSM user stealing Rinnegan is easy as pie.

 

[Chaosmark101]

What is Rikodou Sage Mode? It is basically the heightened state of Sage Mode, which is attained by utilizing Rikodou Senjutsu chakra i.e. combining natural energy (Senjutsu) with Rikodou chakra to create Rikodou Senjutsu. Being in that state is referred to as "Six Paths Sage Mode" or "Rikodou Sage Mode".

You don't have a solid understanding of what Rikudo Sage Mode is, so let's learn about here.

Spoiler

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"Ninjutsu, Senjutsu - Six Paths Sage Mode
No rank, no range, offensive, defensive, supplementary
Users: Naruto Uzumaki

⬅ The floating ability used by the Sage of Six Paths is also almost mastered unconsciously by this technique's user.

From the ancestor of shinobi, a divine state is gifted, touching the principles of all creation, commanding all things in nature

The qualities for obtaining this technique are strict studying and using a small gist in chakra kneading sensibility. An iron faith to face any hardship and the guts to never give up. Furthermore, the returning incarnation and fate's guidance ― only those who hold those are granted the Sage of Six Paths' powers. Those who activate the technique come to understand the flow of all life, gain a deep insight at the world's origins and are able to apply it on interacting allies without changing the way of things. This technique isn't something shinobi are chosen to experience. It is a technique that chooses shinobi.

➡ Kicking the "Truth-Seeking Ball"! Exceeding the Kurama Mode, a feat accomplished by a huge chakra.

⬅The reaction speed is not less than equal to Madara, who had turned into the Ten-Tails' jinchuriki. The sensing ability has also risen!!


Translated by Seelentau

Six Paths Sage Mode Can only be obtained by those who've have received The Yang portion of the sage of six paths chakra, or from the juubi, to be more precise Six Paths ten tails coffin seal.

And as I've stated before user's of Rikudo senjutsu do not require gathering of NE. As they already possess Senjutsu just entering the mode. As seen in the manga. [

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],[

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]

So, all you need to attain RSM is use Sage Mode by utilizing Rikodou chakra, which Sasuke has. There is nothing more to RSM than that. So Sasuke can attain RSM, although it will be weaker.

Your 25% right here. Rikudo sage mode is used by the users rikudo chakra, or in Naruto's case. The Yang half he received from the sage, but It can only be used by a person who has that half. Which is why another person such as Sasuke who also received chakra from the sage cannot awaken Six Paths Sage mode. Rinnegan was for Sauce & RSM was for Noodles.

In case you don't know, RSM looks like this:

Spoiler

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All other modes Naruto used subsequent to this are RSM+.

Irrelevant as

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is portrayed as

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.
As stated in the manga.

@bold The only difference will be that the user's Rikodou chakra will be mixed with natural energy, and that will create Rikodou Senjutsu (not just Senjutsu) because the chakra is Rikodou chakra, so the user attains Rikodou Sage Mode.

Addressed above. Rikudo senjutsu =/= Rikudo chakra + Senjutsu.

Also, you said that that Sasuke will just attain SM. Sasuke's Six Paths Yin chakra is equivalent to Senjutsu chakra by default, so obviously combining THAT with natural energy will result in something greater i.e. RSM.

They are equivalent in that both are halves, & Rikudo's chakra yes. But both serve completely different functions. Naruto's buffs him via RSM, Sasuke's buffs him via Rinnegan.

Plus, Sasuke can attain SM just by his own regular chakra. Are you trying to assert that he'll attain the same thing if he uses Rikodou chakra instead of his regular chakra? Won't Rikodou chakra make any difference?

Classic SM's like toad & snake etc would be easily obtainable for Sasuke now. But just because he has Rikudo's chakra now doesn't mean it mixing with NE = The senjutsu from a RSM user.

@underlined Rikodou Senjutsu can be attained by any Rikodou chakra. It will be at its strongest form when combined with Six Paths Yang chakra, but that doesn't mean no other type of Rikodou chakra can attain RSM.

Absolutely need Rikudo's yang half, being a JJ, or have been birthed by Kaguya. Those were the only methods shown in the manga.

BTW, RSM users NEED to gather natural energy. Senjutsu doesn't work without that.

Rikudo senjutsu =/= Standard/conventional senjutsu. It isn't subject to the same requirements.

 

[Sage konohamaru]

Rsm because am not evil

 

[The Demon Hawk]

RSM is a gift the databook states that. What RSM are you talking about as Naruto's version includes the bijuu and his modes.

Regardless of whether Naruto's version is a gift or not, RSM CAN be attained by combining Six Paths chakra with natural energy, albeit it will be weaker compared to Naruto's gift Yang RSM.

And yeah, a RSM user stealing Rinnegan is easy as pie.

Keep dreaming... BTW, this is a poor way of attaining another power. Acquiring it yourself is the real deal.

You don't have a solid understanding of what Rikudo Sage Mode is, so let's learn about here.

Spoiler

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"Ninjutsu, Senjutsu - Six Paths Sage Mode
No rank, no range, offensive, defensive, supplementary
Users: Naruto Uzumaki

⬅ The floating ability used by the Sage of Six Paths is also almost mastered unconsciously by this technique's user.

From the ancestor of shinobi, a divine state is gifted, touching the principles of all creation, commanding all things in nature

The qualities for obtaining this technique are strict studying and using a small gist in chakra kneading sensibility. An iron faith to face any hardship and the guts to never give up. Furthermore, the returning incarnation and fate's guidance ― only those who hold those are granted the Sage of Six Paths' powers. Those who activate the technique come to understand the flow of all life, gain a deep insight at the world's origins and are able to apply it on interacting allies without changing the way of things. This technique isn't something shinobi are chosen to experience. It is a technique that chooses shinobi.

➡ Kicking the "Truth-Seeking Ball"! Exceeding the Kurama Mode, a feat accomplished by a huge chakra.

⬅The reaction speed is not less than equal to Madara, who had turned into the Ten-Tails' jinchuriki. The sensing ability has also risen!!


Translated by Seelentau

Okay. Though it doesn't establish anything.

There are a lot of things in this post that I can't reply to right now because you haven't given any solid explanation or evidence for me to counter them properly. So my current reply is basically a means to extract full information. I'll address everything fittingly in my next reply after you rightly answer this particular one.

Six Paths Sage Mode Can only be obtained by those who've have received The Yang portion of the sage of six paths chakra,

Where is it stated that only those who have the Yang portion of Six Paths chakra can attain Six Paths Sage Mode? (Remember I'm not talking about Naruto's specific Yang derived RSM, of course that is exclusive to Naruto's Yang half and completely different. I'm just talking about ordinary RSM attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE).

or from the juubi, to be more precise Six Paths ten tails coffin seal.

That I'm aware of.

And as I've stated before user's of Rikudo senjutsu do not require gathering of NE. As they already possess Senjutsu just entering the mode. As seen in the manga. [

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],[

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]

Again, there is no proof that RSM does not require gathering NE. Don't use Juubi Jins as examples, they're a slightly different case. Provide the proof.

Your 25% right here. Rikudo sage mode is used by the users rikudo chakra, or in Naruto's case. The Yang half he received from the sage, but It can only be used by a person who has that half.

Proof again? (Remember I'm not talking about Naruto's unique RSM rooted from the Yang half, I'm just talking about any RSM attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE).

Which is why another person such as Sasuke who also received chakra from the sage cannot awaken Six Paths Sage mode.

Combining Six Paths chakra with NE WILL grant Sasuke Six Paths Sage Mode regardless of anything. Yes, it won't be in the same league as the Naruto's "RSM gift" which he received due to Six Paths YANG chakra, and it would principally be a completely different type of power as opposed to Naruto's Yang half rooted RSM. But it will technically still be "Six Paths Sage Mode", because what else are you going to call a mode attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE? (which Sasuke CAN attain)

Rinnegan was for Sauce & RSM was for Noodles.

Do not misinterpret and force the correspondence. Sasuke has more flexibility with the powers he has.

Irrelevant as

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is portrayed as

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.
As stated in the manga.

I still don't see how that makes what I said irrelevant.

Addressed above. Rikudo senjutsu =/= Rikudo chakra + Senjutsu.

Naruto's specific Rikodou Senjutsu may not be equal to Rikodou chakra + NE (although you didn't provide any evidence for this, I need the proof to accept it), and yes its completely exclusive to the Yang half with different principles and power. But Rikodou Senjutsu CAN be attained by Rikodou chakra + NE regardless of what Naruto's RSM is and however it works, that doesn't matter. Nobody is saying that it will be the exact same Six Paths Sage Mode as Naruto or that it will be on the same level, but it WILL definitely be Six Paths Sage Mode.

They are equivalent in that both are halves, & Rikudo's chakra yes. But both serve completely different functions. Naruto's buffs him via RSM, Sasuke's buffs him via Rinnegan.

That's true. Naruto naturally gained RSM ability due to Six Paths Yang chakra and Sasuke gains Rinnegan due to Six Paths Yin chakra.

But on top of that, Sasuke can attain RSM (not the same type or power RSM as Naruto, but what he will attain will still be called RSM) by combining his Six Paths chakra with NE.

Classic SM's like toad & snake etc would be easily obtainable for Sasuke now.

Yes, and those are by relying on his regular chakra. Combining NE with Six Paths chakra will automatically result in Six Paths Sage Mode. That Six Paths Sage Mode won't be the same thing or the same power level as Naruto's though, it will be eminently different and a lot weaker.

But just because he has Rikudo's chakra now doesn't mean it mixing with NE = The senjutsu from a RSM user.

I never said it will be equal to Senjutsu from an RSM user. Of course it'll be inferior, and it won't even be the same thing. But it will still be RSM (called "RSM"). Agreed or not?

Absolutely need Rikudo's yang half, being a JJ, or have been birthed by Kaguya. Those were the only methods shown in the manga.

2nd and 3rd, I'm okay with. 1st, I need proof. (Remember, I'm not saying Sasuke will attain the same level of Six Paths Sage Mode as Naruto. I'm only saying that he will attain Six Paths Sage Mode).

Rikudo senjutsu =/= Standard/conventional senjutsu. It isn't subject to the same requirements.

In power? Yes. In mechanism? I need proof.

 

[To Whatever]

Regardless of whether Naruto's version is a gift or not, RSM CAN be attained by combining Six Paths chakra with natural energy, albeit it will be weaker compared to Naruto's gift Yang RSM.



Keep dreaming... BTW, this is a poor way of attaining another power. Acquiring it yourself is the real deal.



Okay. Though it doesn't establish anything.

There are a lot of things in this post that I can't reply to right now because you haven't given any solid explanation or evidence for me to counter them properly. So my current reply is basically a means to extract full information. I'll address everything fittingly in my next reply after you rightly answer this particular one.



Where is it stated that only those who have the Yang portion of Six Paths chakra can attain Six Paths Sage Mode? (Remember I'm not talking about Naruto's specific Yang derived RSM, of course that is exclusive to Naruto's Yang half and completely different. I'm just talking about ordinary RSM attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE).



That I'm aware of.



Again, there is no proof that RSM does not require gathering NE. Don't use Juubi Jins as examples, they're a slightly different case. Provide the proof.



Proof again? (Remember I'm not talking about Naruto's unique RSM rooted from the Yang half, I'm just talking about any RSM attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE).



Combining Six Paths chakra with NE WILL grant Sasuke Six Paths Sage Mode regardless of anything. Yes, it won't be in the same league as the Naruto's "RSM gift" which he received due to Six Paths YANG chakra, and it would principally be a completely different type of power as opposed to Naruto's Yang half rooted RSM. But it will technically still be "Six Paths Sage Mode", because what else are you going to call a mode attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE? (which Sasuke CAN attain)



Do not misinterpret and force the correspondence. Sasuke has more flexibility with the powers he has.



I still don't see how that makes what I said irrelevant.



Naruto's specific Rikodou Senjutsu may not be equal to Rikodou chakra + NE (although you didn't provide any evidence for this, I need the proof to accept it), and yes its completely exclusive to the Yang half with different principles and power. But Rikodou Senjutsu CAN be attained by Rikodou chakra + NE regardless of what Naruto's RSM is and however it works, that doesn't matter. Nobody is saying that it will be the exact same Six Paths Sage Mode as Naruto or that it will be on the same level, but it WILL definitely be Six Paths Sage Mode.



That's true. Naruto naturally gained RSM ability due to Six Paths Yang chakra and Sasuke gains Rinnegan due to Six Paths Yin chakra.

But on top of that, Sasuke can attain RSM (not the same type or power RSM as Naruto, but what he will attain will still be called RSM) by combining his Six Paths chakra with NE.



Yes, and those are by relying on his regular chakra. Combining NE with Six Paths chakra will automatically result in Six Paths Sage Mode. That Six Paths Sage Mode won't be the same thing or the same power level as Naruto's though, it will be eminently different and a lot weaker.



I never said it will be equal to Senjutsu from an RSM user. Of course it'll be inferior, and it won't even be the same thing. But it will still be RSM (called "RSM"). Agreed or not?



2nd and 3rd, I'm okay with. 1st, I need proof. (Remember, I'm not saying Sasuke will attain the same level of Six Paths Sage Mode as Naruto. I'm only saying that he will attain Six Paths Sage Mode).



In power? Yes. In mechanism? I need proof.

So what version of RSM are u talking about? Naruto's version is superior for obvious reasons and the real deal my ass, i'm stealing rinnegan easy af with RSM.

 

[Chaosmark101]

There are a lot of things in this post that I can't reply to right now because you haven't given any solid explanation or evidence for me to counter them properly. So my current reply is basically a means to extract full information. I'll address everything fittingly in my next reply after you rightly answer this particular one.

I'll take that as a concession then.

Where is it stated that only those who have the Yang portion of Six Paths chakra can attain Six Paths Sage Mode? (Remember I'm not talking about Naruto's specific Yang derived RSM, of course that is exclusive to Naruto's Yang half and completely different. I'm just talking about ordinary RSM attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE).

No RSM user has ever been shown doing the bold. Or any character for the matter. Not the sage, not madara, obito etc

That I'm aware of.

are you sure? Seems like you aren't.

Again, there is no proof that RSM does not require gathering NE. Don't use Juubi Jins as examples, they're a slightly different case. Provide the proof.

This

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you blatantly ignored.

Proof again? (Remember I'm not talking about Naruto's unique RSM rooted from the Yang half, I'm just talking about any RSM attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE).

Addressed above

Combining Six Paths chakra with NE WILL grant Sasuke Six Paths Sage Mode regardless of anything. Yes, it won't be in the same league as the Naruto's "RSM gift" which he received due to Six Paths YANG chakra, and it would principally be a completely different type of power as opposed to Naruto's Yang half rooted RSM. But it will technically still be "Six Paths Sage Mode", because what else are you going to call a mode attained by combining Six Paths chakra with NE? (which Sasuke CAN attain)

Sage Mode? Sasukes Rikudo chakra melded with his Becoming his. Learn the distinction! The only possible way for him to gain RSM would be becoming a JJ.
Now if You can provide proof that he can do that that'd be swell :lol

Do not misinterpret and force the correspondence. Sasuke has more flexibility with the powers he has.

Really because both powers granted to them are equally limitless as the other.

I still don't see how that makes what I said irrelevant.

Because whether or not Naruto has his chakra cloak up or not it's still RSM.

Naruto's specific Rikodou Senjutsu may not be equal to Rikodou chakra + NE (although you didn't provide any evidence for this, I need the proof to accept it), and yes its completely exclusive to the Yang half with different principles and power. But Rikodou Senjutsu CAN be attained by Rikodou chakra + NE regardless of what Naruto's RSM is and however it works, that doesn't matter. Nobody is saying that it will be the exact same Six Paths Sage Mode as Naruto or that it will be on the same level, but it WILL definitely be Six Paths Sage Mode.

Addressed above, bring me proof which you haven't done at all that states He'll have RSM or a form similar.

That's true. Naruto naturally gained RSM ability due to Six Paths Yang chakra and Sasuke gains Rinnegan due to Six Paths Yin chakra.

nothing to say here.

But on top of that, Sasuke can attain RSM (not the same type or power RSM as Naruto, but what he will attain will still be called RSM) by combining his Six Paths chakra with NE.

Proof? The manga has never shown this
despite Madara having absorbed senjutsu from Hashirama
whilist having rikudo chakra as you keep saying.
He didn't have RSM.

Yes, and those are by relying on his regular chakra. Combining NE with Six Paths chakra will automatically result in Six Paths Sage Mode. That Six Paths Sage Mode won't be the same thing or the same power level as Naruto's though, it will be eminently different and a lot weaker.

Again he'll be in Sage Mode not Six Paths Sage mode.

I never said it will be equal to Senjutsu from an RSM user. Of course it'll be inferior, and it won't even be the same thing. But it will still be RSM (called "RSM"). Agreed or not?

I agree with the Bold. Just because He has rikudo chakra, and he learns SM. It doesn't mean he'll be a RSM user, not a chance unless he actually obtains that form.

2nd and 3rd, I'm okay with. 1st, I need proof. (Remember, I'm not saying Sasuke will attain the same level of Six Paths Sage Mode as Naruto. I'm only saying that he will attain Six Paths Sage Mode).

Evidence for #1[

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] the sage gave him half his chakra and he awakened RSM.

In power? Yes. In mechanism? I need proof.

Rikudo senjutsu definitely is not equal to regular senjutsu what is this garbage

 

[The Demon Hawk]

I'll take that as a concession then.

Okay, whatever.

No RSM user has ever been shown doing the bold. Or any character for the matter. Not the sage, not madara, obito etc

You didn't understand anything. I suggest you read the post completely before forming replies. BTW, let me clear stuff up by simplifying the terminologies, so you understand better.

There are two types of RSM we're talking about that I've clearly emphasized about in my previous post (in case you didn't know that):
1. The specific dedicated RSM power e.g Naruto's Yang RSM and Juubi's RSM.
2. Sage Mode empowered by Rikodou chakra = RSM

The former is Naruto's, the latter is what Sasuke can achieve. Understand something?

are you sure? Seems like you aren't.

Yeah, I am.

This

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you blatantly ignored.

I'm not adamant about objecting to it, but this doesn't prove anything.

Addressed above

Alright, though it wasn't very convincing.

Sage Mode?

Sage Mode empowered by Rikodou chakra is not simply Sage Mode. It will be in a different league compared to Sage Mode. If you want to call it Sage Mode, add some distinction in the name to distinguish it from regular Sage Mode.

Sasukes Rikudo chakra melded with his Becoming his. Learn the distinction!

Not relevant.

The only possible way for him to gain RSM would be becoming a JJ.

The only possible way for him to gain THAT RSM would be becoming JJ or acquiring Six Paths Yang chakra. And that's a different power which I didn't even talk about. You're the one to bring it in anyway.

I was referring to Sage Mode empowered by Rikodou chakra and terming it as "Rikodou Sage Mode". I made the distinction between the two with so much emphasis in the last post that if you understood it you wouldn't have replied back in disagreement.

Now if You can provide proof that he can do that that'd be swell :lol

With the argument I'm making, I don't need to provide any proof. You're the one who has the burden of proof.

Really because both powers granted to them are equally limitless as the other.

I disagree. Sasuke has much more potential. And I'm serious, not fanboying here.

Because whether or not Naruto has his chakra cloak up or not it's still RSM.

I never said otherwise.

Addressed above, bring me proof which you haven't done at all that states He'll have RSM or a form similar.

#logic (Read below)

Proof? The manga has never shown this

The manga doesn't need to show this.

Sage Mode can be attained by combining chakra with NE. But if that chakra is Six Paths chakra, then Six Paths Sage Mode will be attained, because it will be in a whole new league compared to regular Sage Mode due to Six Paths chakra. It will technically be CALLED Six Paths Sage Mode, but it won't be the same Six Paths Sage Mode that Naruto or Juubi Jins have. How much more times do I have to assert this?

despite Madara having absorbed senjutsu from Hashirama
whilist having rikudo chakra as you keep saying.
He didn't have RSM.

Madara absorbed Hashirama's Senjutsu chakra.

Again he'll be in Sage Mode not Six Paths Sage mode.

Regular Sage Mode =/= Sage Mode empowered by Rikodou chakra (Six Paths Sage Mode) =/= Yang or Juubi Six Paths Sage Mode.

@blue Sasuke's viable Sage Mode.
@red Naruto's Six Paths Sage Mode.

Agreed?

I agree with the Bold. Just because He has rikudo chakra, and he learns SM. It doesn't mean he'll be a RSM user, not a chance unless he actually obtains that form.

Exactly. Naruto's Yang RSM and Juubi derived RSM are completely different powers. Sasuke cannot attain that.

What Sasuke will attain is technically Sage Mode but it is a distinct and exponentially more powerful version of Sage Mode due to Six Paths chakra. So as a distinction, we can call it Sage Mode empowered by Six Paths chakra, which when written in concise form, will read Six Paths Sage Mode. So logically, it is called RSM, though technically it isn't the same RSM we've seen Naruto and Juubi Jins using.

Side note: Actually, RSM is a wrong term for Naruto's Yang Mode. It should have been called "Rikodou Mode" or something like that. But since Kishi chooses to call it that, who are we to alter it? So in turn, we've to change the name of Sasuke's viable Sage Mode from Six Paths Sage Mode, which BTW sounds more logical on Sasuke's mode than Naruto's, to something else.

Evidence for #1[

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] the sage gave him half his chakra and he awakened RSM.

If you're talking about the actual RSM, then okay. I thought you had a more broader perspective and included Sasuke's as well, and I also thought that you were trying to imply that Sasuke couldn't achieve Sage Mode w/Rikodou chakra without having the Yang half.

Rikudo senjutsu definitely is not equal to regular senjutsu what is this garbage

Of course, that's pretty much what I said.

You didn't even understand what I was asking. I agreed that it is different in power, but in mechanism, I needed proof (whether Naruto needs to gather natural energy or not), and you haven't provided any proof yet. The scan you showed above proves nothing.

 

[The Demon Hawk]

So what version of RSM are u talking about? Naruto's version is superior for obvious reasons and the real deal my ass, i'm stealing rinnegan easy af with RSM.

There are two RSMs:
1. The exclusive and dedicated RSM (granted by Rikodou's Yang chakra or Juubi)
2. Rikodou chakra + Sage Mode = RSM

The first one is Naruto's RSM. The second is the RSM which Sasuke can possibly achieve. They both are different types of powers and they're also distant in their power level.

And "Rinnegan stealing" is bulls***. Enough with that.

 

[Chaosmark101]

You didn't understand anything. I suggest you read the post completely before forming replies. BTW, let me clear stuff up by simplifying the terminologies, so you understand better.

For starters I'm gonna go ahead and ask that you read my entire post at least once before jumping in. As you requested of me.

There are two types of RSM we're talking about that I've clearly emphasized about in my previous post (in case you didn't know that):
1. The specific dedicated RSM power e.g Naruto's Yang RSM and Juubi's RSM.
2. Sage Mode empowered by Rikodou chakra = RSM

But the problem with this is that just having rikudo chakra buffs a person. Even Naruto & Sasuke in base are buffed because of their rikudo chakra running through them.

So saying "Sasuke in sage mode should have a Rikudo sage mode because of Rikudo chakra" Would be like me referring to Naruto and Sasuke in base as "Rikudo base mode" :lol

The former is Naruto's, the latter is what Sasuke can achieve. Understand something?

The latter isn't the actual RSM. Thus it wouldn't get it's name.

I'm not adamant about objecting to it, but this doesn't prove anything.

Yes it does. If Naruto is shown fighting Sasuke and has no time to gather natural energy but enters RSM, then it obviously means he doesn't need to gather natural energy anymore. Unless he's trying to buff one of his attacks like in canon. Don't deny this man.

Alright, though it wasn't very convincing.

Come on man it's so simple. If DMS Kakashi were to have gained SM out of nowhere. Would the product be called RSM? No, he'd just be in Sage mode with a rikudo susanoo & DMS.

Sage Mode empowered by Rikodou chakra is not simply Sage Mode. It will be in a different league compared to Sage Mode. If you want to call it Sage Mode, add some distinction in the name to distinguish it from regular Sage Mode.

If you want me to acknowledge it'll be strong. Well of course, no SM isn't strong but again RSM >SM

Not relevant.

Definitely is. It was given to him, & his chakra, Susanoo, abilities wouldn't be the same without it.

The only possible way for him to gain THAT RSM would be becoming JJ or acquiring Six Paths Yang chakra. And that's a different power which I didn't even talk about. You're the one to bring it in anyway.

Smh. If you know why do you keep asserting that it should have RSM's name?

I was referring to Sage Mode empowered by Rikodou chakra and terming it as "Rikodou Sage Mode". I made the distinction between the two with so much emphasis in the last post that if you understood it you wouldn't have replied back in disagreement.

I replied back because you can't go around coining things that have a name already with a new name. Much like "Ultimate Susano'o" I mean what the hell is that :lol
If Sasuke lacks the requirements for RSM, but learns SM. The he'd get SM. If he had the requirements for RSM, these he'd have RSM. End of story.

With the argument I'm making, I don't need to provide any proof. You're the one who has the burden of proof.

Your argument is completely baseless. You haven't brought 1 scan from the manga or Databook backing up your assumptions. They will forever be assumptions if you lack proof.

I disagree. Sasuke has much more potential. And I'm serious, not fanboying here.

I guess you know more then Kishi does about his manga, when both characters at the end of the war had all elements, and the means to create any jutsu they desire. (For the most part)

I never said otherwise.

Earlier you were trying to tell me that any version of RSM with the chakra cloak was "RSM +" Yet it is, & they are RSM. Don't deny this.

#logic (Read below)

The manga doesn't need to show this.

Sage Mode can be attained by combining chakra with NE. But if that chakra is Six Paths chakra, then Six Paths Sage Mode will be attained, because it will be in a whole new league compared to regular Sage Mode due to Six Paths chakra. It will technically be CALLED Six Paths Sage Mode, but it won't be the same Six Paths Sage Mode that Naruto or Juubi Jins have. How much more times do I have to assert this?

Addressed above. Will Sage Mode be empowered yes it will. But you can't grant it that name because only JJ's Naruto, and Kaguya's kids have shown it.

Madara absorbed Hashirama's Senjutsu chakra.

Yet he still had Rikudo chakra, which should have given him "Six Paths Sage mode" right?
#logic

Regular Sage Mode =/= Sage Mode empowered by Rikodou chakra (Sage Mode) =/= Yang or Juubi Six Paths Sage Mode.

@blue Sasuke's viable Sage Mode.
@red Naruto's Six Paths Sage Mode.

Agreed?

Fixed, & Man why can't you read? I said it was viable on post #42, but again unless he shows the actual RSM, It'll just be sage mode.

Exactly. Naruto's Yang RSM and Juubi derived RSM are completely different powers. Sasuke cannot attain that.

Thank you for agreeing. That was all I wanted to hear :lol

What Sasuke will attain is technically Sage Mode but it is a distinct and exponentially more powerful version of Sage Mode due to Six Paths chakra. So as a distinction, we can call it Sage Mode empowered by Six Paths chakra, which when written in concise form, will read Six Paths Sage Mode. So logically, it is called RSM, though technically it isn't the same RSM we've seen Naruto and Juubi Jins using.

@Bold,underline :lol :lol :lol
Anyways that's pretty much all I needed to hear. You agree that'd it just be sage mode. Regardless of his Rikudo chakra. Though calling it Six Paths Sage mode is fanfic man I'm sorry.

Side note: Actually, RSM is a wrong term for Naruto's Yang Mode. It should have been called "Rikodou Mode" or something like that. But since Kishi chooses to call it that, who are we to alter it? So in turn, we've to change the name of Sasuke's viable Sage Mode from Six Paths Sage Mode, which BTW sounds more logical on Sasuke's mode than Naruto's, to something else.

:lol some people already call his RSM that, & some people were calling Naruto's KCM "Rikudo Mode" because of the horns back in the day :lol. Regardless it's called Rikudo Sage Mode, because that's what the Manga & Databook called. Also it performs like a much improved SM, so that's what it is.

If you're talking about the actual RSM, then okay. I thought you had a more broader perspective and included Sasuke's as well, and I also thought that you were trying to imply that Sasuke couldn't achieve Sage Mode w/Rikodou chakra without having the Yang half.

Only that he can't achieve the RSM shown in the manga without it's requirements.

Of course, that's pretty much what I said.

You didn't even understand what I was asking. I agreed that it is different in power, but in mechanism, I needed proof (whether Naruto needs to gather natural energy or not), and you haven't provided any proof yet. The scan you showed above proves nothing.

& Addressed above. Looks like we're done here :lol

 

[The Demon Hawk]

For starters I'm gonna go ahead and ask that you read my entire post at least once before jumping in. As you requested of me.

I did. (Though you didn't answer)

But the problem with this is that just having rikudo chakra buffs a person. Even Naruto & Sasuke in base are buffed because of their rikudo chakra running through them.

So saying "Sasuke in sage mode should have a Rikudo sage mode because of Rikudo chakra" Would be like me referring to Naruto and Sasuke in base as "Rikudo base mode" :lol

Yeah, this is kinda funny, and actually legit if put into perspective. I agree. Instead of calling it "a different RSM", we should call it "Rikodou powered SM" for the sake of simplicity, sensibility and differentiation.

The latter isn't the actual RSM. Thus it wouldn't get it's name.

@underlined I'm well aware of that.

I already told you the reason to get its name. Though I avert my naming scheme based on the 2nd quote.

Yes it does. If Naruto is shown fighting Sasuke and has no time to gather natural energy but enters RSM, then it obviously means he doesn't need to gather natural energy anymore. Unless he's trying to buff one of his attacks like in canon. Don't deny this man.

I'm not insistent on denying it. But what proves that this wasn't a quick as instant gathering of natural energy? And that this mode is stored within Naruto?

Come on man it's so simple. If DMS Kakashi were to have gained SM out of nowhere. Would the product be called RSM? No, he'd just be in Sage mode with a rikudo susanoo & DMS.

Addressed above.

If you want me to acknowledge it'll be strong. Well of course, no SM isn't strong but again RSM >SM

Yes, RSM > Rikodou chakra powered SM > SM.

But SM Sasuke > RSM Naruto.

Definitely is. It was given to him, & his chakra, Susanoo, abilities wouldn't be the same without it.

In a perspective, yes (after reference to the 2nd quote).

Smh. If you know why do you keep asserting that it should have RSM's name?

I was referring to the name "RSM" with a different context. That's why.

I replied back because you can't go around coining things that have a name already with a new name. Much like "Ultimate Susano'o" I mean what the hell is that :lol

I said "you wouldn't have replied back in disagreement", because the context is important which you got (I suppose). And no, they don't already have a name. "Ultimate Susanoo" was also an addressing name because calling it "BijuuPS" was stupid since Sasuke could create it without bijuus' chakra.

If Sasuke lacks the requirements for RSM, but learns SM. The he'd get SM. If he had the requirements for RSM, these he'd have RSM. End of story.

You sure have a hard time understanding the difference between giving it a reference name and calling it the same ability.

Addressed above however.

Your argument is completely baseless. You haven't brought 1 scan from the manga or Databook backing up your assumptions. They will forever be assumptions if you lack proof.

It isn't baseless. It is completely backed up by proof. Learn the difference between manga or databook proof and logical proof. I already explained why I didn't need to provide any manga proof, and the logical proof was self-explanatory which I provided anyway.

I guess you know more then Kishi does about his manga, when both characters at the end of the war had all elements, and the means to create any jutsu they desire. (For the most part)

Everything is not related to jutsu. I was referring to power and abilities. For example, Naruto can't do much to expand his power by relying on himself, whereas Sasuke can learn Sage Mode to add physical attributes and ninjutsu power to his already RSM rivaling physical attributes and ninjutsu power making them even stronger.

Earlier you were trying to tell me that any version of RSM with the chakra cloak was "RSM +" Yet it is, & they are RSM. Don't deny this.

I'm not denying this. I said the exact same thing.

- You said "Because whether or not Naruto has his chakra cloak up or not it's still RSM"
- I said "I never said otherwise" because I already said the same thing before that whether or not Naruto has his chakra cloak it still will be RSM.

Go back and read the post again.

Addressed above. Will Sage Mode be empowered yes it will. But you can't grant it that name because only JJ's Naruto, and Kaguya's kids have shown it.

Addressed above.

Yet he still had Rikudo chakra, which should have given him "Six Paths Sage mode" right?
#logic

No, it shouldn't have given him that. He only absorbed Hashirama's senjutsu chakra, not Sage Mode.

Fixed, & Man why can't you read? I said it was viable on post #42, but again unless he shows the actual RSM, It'll just be sage mode.

Where did you derive the irrelevant conclusion about "not being able to read"? I was solely referring to the naming, nothing else, which is solved now. You sure have difficulty in understanding the difference.

Thank you for agreeing. That was all I wanted to hear :lol

I never disagreed in the first place. I've agreed all along. LOL

@Bold,underline :lol :lol :lol
Anyways that's pretty much all I needed to hear.

It's kind of funny that you heard it just now when I've been saying the same thing all along contextually.

You agree that'd it just be sage mode. Regardless of his Rikudo chakra.

Yes. I only called it "Six Paths Sage Mode" for differentiating it with regular Sage Mode because it was in a completely different league. Though I've averted that argument now.

Though calling it Six Paths Sage mode is fanfic man I'm sorry.

Although you're right within your standpoint, your lack of understanding about my point is simply and overwhelmingly disappointing.

Calling it "Six Paths Sage Mode" is unreasonable, but it is NOT fanfic, because I'm not referring to THAT power. WTH?

:lol some people already call his RSM that, & some people were calling Naruto's KCM "Rikudo Mode" because of the horns back in the day :lol. Regardless it's called Rikudo Sage Mode, because that's what the Manga & Databook called. Also it performs like a much improved SM, so that's what it is.

Yeah...

Only that he can't achieve the RSM shown in the manga without it's requirements.

Said that countless times already and with significant emphasis.

& Addressed above. Looks like we're done here :lol

I guess...

 

[Chaosmark101]

I did. (Though you didn't answer)

Didn't answer where? Didn't know it had to be expressed, thought we both were just gonna read it thoroughly first. I have been reading it first btw.

Yeah, this is kinda funny, and actually legit if put into perspective. I agree. Instead of calling it "a different RSM", we should call it "Rikodou powered SM" for the sake of simplicity, sensibility and differentiation.

Rikudo enhanced would sound better imo, but yeah sure you can call it that.

I'm not insistent on denying it. But what proves that this wasn't a quick as instant gathering of natural energy? And that this mode is stored within Naruto?

Naruto wasn't shown sitting still to gather NE, there also wasn't any emphasis showing Naruto gather NE when he and every other normal sage mode user (besides Kabuto) is shown out of the fight gathering NE. Usually with their hands clasped together but not always. Also yes it comes from within.

Yes, RSM > Rikodou chakra powered SM > SM.

But SM Sasuke > RSM Naruto.

There's only so Senjutsu chakra a SM Rinnegan Sasuke could produce, & Natural energy he can gather.
As Naruto has the superior mode & more chakra he should always be able to equal sasukes SM boost just by absorbing a large amount of NE again as seen at VOTE 2

I said "you wouldn't have replied back in disagreement", because the context is important which you got (I suppose). And no, they don't already have a name. "Ultimate Susanoo" was also an addressing name because calling it "BijuuPS" was stupid since Sasuke could create it without bijuus' chakra.

when did Sasuke recreate his Bijuu PS without the Bijuu's? I've read Gaiden, seen Boruto in theatres, & never saw him use it again. Gonna need a scan my man. Ive only seen him use PS again after.

It isn't baseless. It is completely backed up by proof. Learn the difference between manga or databook proof and logical proof. I already explained why I didn't need to provide any manga proof, and the logical proof was self-explanatory which I provided anyway.

Real proof > Logical & hypothetical proof man
You know that, and know you didn't provide proof.

Everything is not related to jutsu. I was referring to power and abilities. For example, Naruto can't do much to expand his power by relying on himself, whereas Sasuke can learn Sage Mode to add physical attributes and ninjutsu power to his already RSM rivaling physical attributes and ninjutsu power making them even stronger.

Naruto already has pretty much everything besides doujutsu, again SM on Sasuke will be pretty negligible.

I'm not denying this. I said the exact same thing.

- You said "Because whether or not Naruto has his chakra cloak up or not it's still RSM"
- I said "I never said otherwise" because I already said the same thing before that whether or not Naruto has his chakra cloak it still will be RSM.

Pretty sure in the context of your post you were trying to assert RSM as the one with no cloak up, but whatever.

No, it shouldn't have given him that. He only absorbed Hashirama's senjutsu chakra, not Sage Mode.

Madara had Hashirama's SM. His SM markings appeared on his Hashirama manboob face. Which is why the base refers to that specific madara as Sage Madara or SM Madara.

Where did you derive the irrelevant conclusion about "not being able to read"? I was solely referring to the naming, nothing else, which is solved now. You sure have difficulty in understanding the different.

Since I agreed I won't be a ****, let you call it SM rikudo powered and what not, we can skip this.

Although you're right within your standpoint, your lack of understanding about my point is simply and overwhelmingly disappointing.

Lol guess that's about it, there wasn't much to cover really

 

[To Whatever]

There are two RSMs:
1. The exclusive and dedicated RSM (granted by Rikodou's Yang chakra or Juubi)
2. Rikodou chakra + Sage Mode = RSM

The first one is Naruto's RSM. The second is the RSM which Sasuke can possibly achieve. They both are different types of powers and they're also distant in their power level.

And "Rinnegan stealing" is bulls***. Enough with that.

How is it bs? Are you saying a RSM user isn't capable of stealing rinnegan? That in itself is bs.

RSM has bijuu chakra man and makes you connected to them. It's part of how Naruto got TSB and a new mode.

 

[Warlocks]

lol guys why are feeding The Demon Hawk trolls he has to be 6 yrs 0ld can't reason with him

 

[The Demon Hawk]

How is it bs? Are you saying a RSM user isn't capable of stealing rinnegan? That in itself is bs.

The question about stealing in itself is total crap. You can't just go and steal something away from a same caliber shinobi. That's ridiculous.

RSM has bijuu chakra man and makes you connected to them. It's part of how Naruto got TSB and a new mode.

Yes, Naruto's RSM is an exclusive power that belong only to him due to having Six Paths Yang chakra. Sasuke can't have the same.

I'll edit this post with a reply later bro

Did you forget about this? Or you're just busy temporarily?

 

[Chaosmark101]

The question about stealing in itself is total crap. You can't just go and steal something away from a same caliber shinobi. That's ridiculous.



Yes, Naruto's RSM is an exclusive power that belong only to him due to having Six Paths Yang chakra. Sasuke can't have the same.



Did you forget about this? Or you're just busy temporarily?

No I haven't forgotten. Wasn't really sure I should be reviving this thread to converse on a subject when we both are on the same page. Regardless Yeah I'll reply right now.

Post is up there ^ btw

 

[KesOnFire]

Rinnegan baby lol

 

[The Demon Hawk]

No I haven't forgotten. Wasn't really sure I should be reviving this thread to converse on a subject when we both are on the same page. Regardless Yeah I'll reply right now.

Post is up there ^ btw

I understand. And indeed, we're both on the same page on the main topic of our argument. But that argument cultivated some side topics, which we're still not settled on. I was actually awaiting your response on those aspects, not the ones that have been resolved.

Didn't answer where? Didn't know it had to be expressed, thought we both were just gonna read it thoroughly first. I have been reading it first btw.

It should be expressed if specifically asked. But that doesn't matter now anyway, right?

Rikudo enhanced would sound better imo, but yeah sure you can call it that.

Done.

Naruto wasn't shown sitting still to gather NE, there also wasn't any emphasis showing Naruto gather NE when he and every other normal sage mode user (besides Kabuto) is shown out of the fight gathering NE. Usually with their hands clasped together but not always. Also yes it comes from within.

If the gathering of NE is really quick (close to being instant), then Naruto doesn't need to "sit still" to gather NE. Hashirama could gather NE extremely fast while standing in midst of battle (just like Naruto), so Naruto who is a Rikodou powered individual with a much superior form of SM can undoubtedly do the same and much faster (close to instant). So that is reasonable. And the "emphasis" point is addressed within BTW.

All in all, it still poses the same question. What proves that this mode is stored within Naruto and not a quick as instant gathering of natural energy? The cloak is from the 9 bijuus' chakra (as I've addressed below) and that is stored within Naruto, so that is understandable. But RSM itself is stored within Naruto, that requires proof.

There's only so Senjutsu chakra a SM Rinnegan Sasuke could produce, & Natural energy he can gather.

Didn't get what you're saying.

As Naruto has the superior mode & more chakra he should always be able to equal sasukes SM boost just by absorbing a large amount of NE again as seen at VOTE 2

Naruto gathered all available NE at VOTE, so he isn't going any further than that. Plus, Sasuke can already equal RSM Naruto in all aspects currently. So surely, his SM will provide a significant boost that will surpass RSM Naruto.

when did Sasuke recreate his Bijuu PS without the Bijuu's? I've read Gaiden, seen Boruto in theatres, & never saw him use it again. Gonna need a scan my man. Ive only seen him use PS again after.

He didn't recreate it. But he can, logically. I assume you've read my argument with KG regarding this on the other thread (since you disliked my posts), so you must have the idea about my standpoint. And if you didn't read those posts, I can separately discuss it.

Real proof > Logical & hypothetical proof man

True. But in case real proof doesn't exist, logical and factual derivations as proof are sufficient. You can't just turn them down without a counter proof.

You know that, and know you didn't provide proof.

My argument is that Sasuke can potentially gather NE to enter SM w/Rikodou chakra. What proof do you need for that?

Naruto already has pretty much everything besides doujutsu, again SM on Sasuke will be pretty negligible.

Why will it be negligible? Sasuke is already on par with RSM Naruto in almost all aspects. SM boost will be significant and will undoubtedly put Sasuke above any form of Naruto.

Pretty sure in the context of your post you were trying to assert RSM as the one with no cloak up, but whatever.

You're right, I did say that. But I didn't say only that was RSM.

I said both modes i.e. the one with plus eyes only AND the one with cloak and Godoudamas are both RSM, the only difference is that the former is pure RSM (strictly Hagoromo's Yang Senjutsu chakra) whereas the latter is RSM + 9 bijuus chakra.

Madara had Hashirama's SM. His SM markings appeared on his Hashirama manboob face. Which is why the base refers to that specific madara as Sage Madara or SM Madara.

Let's address the initiating factor of this argument. Regardless of what Madara absorbed, the point is that Madara could not/did not get SM enhanced with Rikodou chakra. Because for that, he has to absorb NE and combine it with his Rikodou chakra, which he didn't do because you can't absorb the ability to gather NE. Whether Madara had Hashirama's Senjutsu chakra or Hashirama's SM, it is still Hashirama's only, not his own. So the point about Rikodou chakra is invalid.

Since I agreed I won't be a ****, let you call it SM rikudo powered and what not, we can skip this.

LOL. Okay, dude...

Lol guess that's about it, there wasn't much to cover really

About the main argument, you're right we're done. But the argument of side topics still pertains. If you don't want to flood this thread with it, we can discuss each topic individually through PM, if you're fine by that.

 

[The Demon Hawk]

Rinnegan baby lol

Are you sure?

 

[The Amazing Kaguya]

Rikudo Sage Mode

A Single Rinnegan does not interest me.

 

[Tarinth]

Really? According to what you're trying to imply, it's dead wrong. Actually, there is a power gap between Rinnegan and RSM. But Rinnegan is on the dominant side, not RSM. Here's how:

Six Paths chakra (comes with the Rinnegan) grants Sasuke speed equal to RSM+BM Naruto i.e. superior to RSM only Naruto, strength slightly less than RSM+BM Naruto i.e. roughly equal to RSM only Naruto (both of which are shown in the movie), and jutsu power equal to RSM Naruto (as they have a similarly powerful chakra). So that alone puts Rinnegan Sasuke on par with RSM Naruto (excluding EMS and BM powers).

And that is without the usage of Rinnegan's large and versatile set of extremely powerful techniques in addition to that which makes Rinnegan superior to RSM without a doubt. Though it won't add much from a power standpoint since RSM will still be able to match those to some extent, it will still grant immense versatility.

Plus, with Rinnegan w/Six Paths chakra, you can learn Sage Mode and attain a weak form of RSM, but you can't do the opposite with RSM.

I've shown you their standings. You can take you pick now.

This is completely fallacious. Rinnegan doesn't come with Six Paths chakra, or at the very least, anywhere near as much
as that which Sasuke beheld. Sasuke unlocked his rinnegan from getting chakra from the Sage, but the common Rinnegan
is formed from Ashura chakra + Indra chakra. This only provided a little Hagoromo chakra to the likes of Madara.
The original awakener of the rinnegan, Madara, with no other enhancements like the Juubi or SM, cannot even begin
to compare with a RSM user (think Juubi Jin Madara, RSM Naruto, and Juubito, except the juubi jins don't even use any
eye techniques). Yeah, Madara would get wrecked. Sasuke was a special case that had half of Hagoromo's chakra, which
isn't typically the case.

A normal person, like Nagato, if given the rinnegan, becomes incredibly OP, but with RSM, would become instantly top-tier.
Rinnegan Nagato gets destroyed by RSM Nagato.
Unless this question gets changed into which would you rather get, assuming Rinnegan also has a complimentary huge amount
of Six Paths chakra added with it, which is not generally the case, then RSM is the clear answer.