[VS] Tsunade vs Ay

[Lord Tywin]

Did King Hashirama say that Tsunade's reaction speed is on par with Minato and KCM Naruto?

He said that Minato's reaction speed is ordinary.

 

[HiddenSound]

He said that Minato's reaction speed is ordinary.

Lol that's incredible

 

[Lord Tywin]

Lol that's incredible

Many incredible bullshit you can find in this thread alone.

 

[Tazzilla88]

So taking speed as the issue, how many ninja do you think can react to Ay?

 

[Icelerate]

He said that Minato's reaction speed is ordinary.

I'm guessing he thinks Tsunade's reaction speed is extraordinary while Minato's is just ordinary

 

[Icelerate]

We have no idea how effective that'd be against Ay's top speed punch. Pretty sure people have used chakra to plant their feet on the ground yet ended up losing their balance somehow....though even if this worked, he would hit her, and stop since she won't budge, so he wouldn't get knocked off.

The bold is vague and can only be explained with scans. If this worked, he'd land on top of Katsuyu which gives Tsunade the opportunity to launch a counterattack. Regardless, I can see your point with the chakra buildup in feet method not working due to the momentum behind Ay's punches. Do bare in mind that Tsunade has a lot of chakra and precise chakra control which lets her jump extremely high and use CES so I'm pretty sure her ability to stick onto surfaces is much much higher than ordinary shinobi that you are probably referring to. Bare in mind it was Sakura to master this ability before Naruto and Sasuke despite being vastly inferior to them in pretty much every single way other than chakra control. Not to mention there aren't only the two options of Tsunade getting sent flying and Tsunade not budging. A third option is that Ay's punch is strong enough to send her sliding a few metres but still on Katsuyu. The lethal medical ninjutsu strategy via remote healing technique still works even if I choose to take the middle ground. There is also the fact that Ay's punch won't be as strong if he doesn't have a solid foothold.

He wasn't suffering from any backlash. He isn't Itachi. He was perfectly fine apart from his Susanoo draining his energy. The only time he feels backlash from using Amaterasu is when he uses it with a V2 Susanoo or higher. If he suffered backlash you would've seen it like you saw it with Itachi. Your comparison with Itachi is also flawed beyond belief considering Itachi had suffered backlash from Tsukuyomi being broken and spamming Amaterasu while he had a disease. Sasuke only had a Ribcage up for less than a minute before that. And it was one small flame. Itachi used two giant flames. Sasuke has no disease, so taking backlash from techs and giving them to Sasuke makes no sense, especially since Sasuke didn't exert as much stamina and chakra as Itachi.

So no. Sasuke's was no different. His overall speed is already on another level to hers w/o Sharingan, let alone MS Sasuke. The gap in speed is large as hell, and the gap in reaction speed is even larger.

Whatever I was going overboard here.

Intel on speed doesn't mean anything significant. At the end of the day, either you can or can't react. Getting used to it helps, but intel isn't going to change anything. Deidara leaped out of the way against Sasuke who is nowhere near Ay's level of speed so that doesn't even matter. Hell, he's not even as fast as V1 Ay's Shunshin in Base.

Well based on your examples, I can agree that Tsunade won't get used to Ay's level of speed anytime soon.

That just means he'll come back down if he doesn't land when he should. He'll still accelerate as normal.

Running downhill or on a level surface is much easier than running up hill. Your acceleration will be less because of the influence of gravity but since Ay exerts many Gs, I guess you can argue its negligible.

Except there's no way to quantify how fast it was moving, and given that things hit by Ay haven't shown to move at extremely high speeds, especially speeds near Ay's own speed, we can forget about that. Lol @ the Sakura example considering Kaguya was moving nowhere near top speed. It seemed like she stopped when she saw Sakura coming too, but I could be wrong about that though.

I agree, his punches don't possess the same level of momentum as his own body. Since that is Sakura and we are discussing Tsunade, I'll let this one slide but once my Sakura speed analysis comes out, you're going to have to try better than that.

I can agree with your first point.

What first point of mine?

Since when does flicking a Kunai in the air require the same speed a punch does? Striking speed is just that, striking speed. Tsunade being able to punch faster than Minato doesn't mean that she'll be able to punch faster than he can flick his Kunai into the air. Two different movements.

Whether or not this is true doesn't matter because we all know Tsunade's reaction speed pales in comparison to Minato so we can drop this argument.

 

[Lord Tywin]

I'm guessing he thinks Tsunade's reaction speed is extraordinary while Minato's is just ordinary

He did say that Tsunade can punch her the way Minato can teleport. Not sure if that counts as reaction.

 

[Hiraishin Stage 3]

Actually it was all of their jobs to counter it.

No it was not, It was Mei's job to do it, others can't do it

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Tsunade pulled through because the fire was small but it still burned her badly and she fainted once the byakugou ran out.

Otherwise she too relied on Mei to counter the fire.

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Yet somehow you created a fanfic that Tsunade has greater speed/reactions from this, when he wasn't competing with Tsunade on who acts first.

 

[Null Man]

Tsunade blitzes U_U

 

[RedRobin]

No it was not, It was Mei's job to do it, others can't do it

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Tsunade pulled through because the fire was small but it still burned her badly and she fainted once the byakugou ran out.

Otherwise she too relied on Mei to counter the fire.

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Yet somehow you created a fanfic that Tsunade has greater speed/reactions from this, when he wasn't competing with Tsunade on who acts first.

Gaara's sand and Onoki's earth wall could have countered, Ay could have moved out of the way yet Tsunade was the fastest one to react and counter. You don't see it that way because it's Tsunade.

 

[Hiraishin Stage 3]

Gaara's sand and Onoki's earth wall could have countered, Ay could have moved out of the way yet Tsunade was the fastest one to react and counter. You don't see it that way because it's Tsunade.

Oonoki was out of chakra, I said this already.

Why should Ay move out of the way? Mei was preparing her jutsu and madara's attack was still far away. Tsunade just jumped in rashly.

Raikage's reflexes have been specifically said and shown to be way above any other human, no matter what "feat" you can pull out for tsunade its futile.

 

[Xlad]

wow. tsunade waz first to block fir, whih means bee must be faster thn naruto cause he saved him first from ei. conlclusion: all them are slower than tobi=madara

 

[Null Man]

wow. tsunade waz first to block fir, whih means bee must be faster thn naruto cause he saved him first from ei. conlclusion: all them are slower than tobi=madara

But Base Bee is faster than KCM Naruto.

 

[KidGamer65]

The bold is vague and can only be explained with scans. If this worked, he'd land on top of Katsuyu which gives Tsunade the opportunity to launch a counterattack. Regardless, I can see your point with the chakra buildup in feet method not working due to the momentum behind Ay's punches. Do bare in mind that Tsunade has a lot of chakra and precise chakra control which lets her jump extremely high and use CES so I'm pretty sure her ability to stick onto surfaces is much much higher than ordinary shinobi that you are probably referring to. Bare in mind it was Sakura to master this ability before Naruto and Sasuke despite being vastly inferior to them in pretty much every single way other than chakra control. Not to mention there aren't only the two options of Tsunade getting sent flying and Tsunade not budging. A third option is that Ay's punch is strong enough to send her sliding a few metres but still on Katsuyu. The lethal medical ninjutsu strategy via remote healing technique still works even if I choose to take the middle ground. There is also the fact that Ay's punch won't be as strong if he doesn't have a solid foothold.

I know. That's why I need to find scans for it so I'll try and do that, if not I'll probably give you this point, and the bold is iffy. Naruto and Sasuke couldn't even do it correctly, that's why they kept falling. Once you master it, I'm pretty sure that you don't stick any better than you do someone else who has already mastered it. Then there's the fact that chakra reserves have never been implied to be a factor.

She won't be able to counter attack. Because she is being held in her position, she'll take Ay's punch and take even more damage than she would had the punch hit her and knocked her back. While she recoils from that, he can take the opportunity to Shunshin away. It all depends on Katsuyu being able to suck Ay in before he can get away.

Running downhill or on a level surface is much easier than running up hill. Your acceleration will be less because of the influence of gravity but since Ay exerts many Gs, I guess you can argue its negligible.

True.

I agree, his punches don't possess the same level of momentum as his own body. Since that is Sakura and we are discussing Tsunade, I'll let this one slide but once my Sakura speed analysis comes out, you're going to have to try better than that.

Lol, I'm actually looking forward to that.

What first point of mine?

Lol my bad. That was part of your post that I didn't include in the quoted area for some odd reason.

 

[KingHashirama]

wow. tsunade waz first to block fir, whih means bee must be faster thn naruto cause he saved him first from ei. conlclusion: all them are slower than tobi=madara

Clearly you didn't read properly.

 

[KingHashirama]

No it was not, It was Mei's job to do it, others can't do it

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Tsunade pulled through because the fire was small but it still burned her badly and she fainted once the byakugou ran out.

Otherwise she too relied on Mei to counter the fire.

Spoiler

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Yet somehow you created a fanfic that Tsunade has greater speed/reactions from this, when he wasn't competing with Tsunade on who acts first.

It was all of their jobs..... :yeah: They are god damn kages, not some children on battlefield who rely on someone else to counter shit if they can already do it. Onoki was not out of chakra, thats straight up bullshit. The man had enough chakra to fly and to do a earth technique... but he stood there.

Raikage had enough chakra to move his ass, but he stood there.

Gaara had enough chakra to use his sand, but he stood there.

Mei was attempting to use a water style jutsu, but the attack was too fast for her to even do it.

Accept the fact Tsunade was the quicker one. Her reactions are the best out of the Gokage. She is a ninja who has fought hand to hand combat majority of her life, and practices perfect chakra control. If you do not know what chakra does.. it enhances your body's normal physical traits if used correctly.

She didn't "rely" on Mei. Mei was going had enough time to do it.. if she didn't she would've tanked that fire attack without any problem.

Did King Hashirama say that Tsunade's reaction speed is on par with Minato and KCM Naruto?

So how is Minato's reactions higher? Saying he used a technique that is instant with his mind to dodge someone who he was able to see coming right at him, doesn't automatically put his reactions on "god level".

At the end of the day mostly all those who are "kage" have the reactions to "react" in a way to Ay's speed. Issue only occurs that if they have the physical speed to deal with him. Unlike Minato, Tsunade has the striking speed to deal with Ay's blitz. And once the blitz is dealt with there is hardly anything Ay can do.

BUT , lets say she can't instantly react to a face blitz. There is the thing about Ay having to charge up to blitz, giving her the chance to put up a defense form and prepare herself, so a blitz isn't working that way either. She has also displayed more precision in attacks than Ay, her strikes are also quicker than Ay's, if they get involved in a CQC. And then she simply needs to hit the back of his neck, that will pretty much end the match. Unless you are purposing she has no way to hit the back his neck.. then that is a bad argument simply, because she can overpower him in strength in a close combat.

Katsuyu is useless in this fight, and Tsunade won't bring her out. Not her style of fighting.