Tsunade and Kakashi vs Pain

[Slug Princess Tsunade]

He also loses to animal path

Kakashi isn't really that much different from the Pain arc kakashi, All thats changed are his kamui feats, Chakra/Ninjutsu/Taijutsu/Speed/Intelligence are still the same as always.

He only really uses kamui as a last resort, hence why he never used it on deva.

One large shinra tensei, Full bodied shinra tensei would simply leave kakashi like this

Spoiler

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Also even after kakashi finally took down Asura path, Deva still ended up defeating Kakashi + Choji + his father + a shinobi back up squad.

1. Yes, that Kakashi used it as a last resort, because he couldn't use it more then 2 times. But now, the current Kakashi can use it like 5-6 times.

 

[Bogard]

He also loses to animal path

Kakashi isn't really that much different from the Pain arc kakashi, All thats changed are his kamui feats, Chakra/Ninjutsu/Taijutsu/Speed/Intelligence are still the same as always.

He only really uses kamui as a last resort, hence why he never used it on deva.

One large shinra tensei, Full bodied shinra tensei would simply leave kakashi like this

Spoiler

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Also even after kakashi finally took down Asura path, Deva still ended up defeating Kakashi + Choji + his father + a shinobi back up squad.

Chakra or stamina did change. Do you see all what he spammed since the begin of the war? Also, his raiden is a great move against multiple opponents. He also has the advantage of knowledge, something he lacked back then. You really think that with knowledge, seeing the threat Pain is and especially in a case where he is outnumbered, he wont ressort to kamui especially when in this case he has a medical ninja by his side? Obviously not, Kakashi isn't that stupid. Thats what he intended to do when he saw Tobi after the kage summit. Gai even implied that they developed strategys to counter every paths techniques. Thats is where having knowledge makes a great difference especially in this case where the opponent has none

Btw i dont believe animal path is stronger than kakashi not at all. Even Deva is weaker than current from my point of view

 

[Exaar]

1. Yes, that Kakashi used it as a last resort, because he couldn't use it more then 2 times. But now, the current Kakashi can use it like 5-6 times.

Chakra or stamina did change. Do you see all what he spammed since the begin of the war? Also, his raiden is a great move against multiple opponents. He also has the advantage of knowledge, something he lacked back then. You really think that with knowledge, seeing the threat Pain is and especially in a case where he is outnumbered, he wont ressort to kamui especially when in this case he has a medical ninja by his side? Obviously not, Kakashi isn't that stupid. Thats what he intended to do when he saw Tobi after the kage summit. Gai even implied that they developed strategys to counter every paths techniques. Thats is where having knowledge makes a great difference especially in this case where the opponent has none

Btw i dont believe animal path is stronger than kakashi not at all. Even Deva is weaker than current from my point of view

Most of his kamui feats in his battle with Obito have been powered by bijuu, be it the hachibi or the kyuubi. No doubt he has gotten better at using it. but even with a medical nin by his side he cannot waste kamui like they're nothing.

Also i believe animal path is stronger than kakashi, Cerberus + rhino + chameleon + Bird + centipede + animal path all focusing on Kakashi, Good luck is all i can say.

 

[Prince of Persia TTT]

He warped a Bijuu like Hachibi 2times after warping himself, so no he won't be exhausted after warping only one Path, and Kakashi is far above every other Paths one on one. Now if they are in group maybe(and it's not even sure), but one on one, Kakashi would destroy them. It's for that reason that Nagato even felt the need to give Asura Path as a back up to Deva Path when he fought Kakashi and even thought that he had to kill him there because he was too dangerous.

do you think im downlplaying kakashi here?
i already like him
but when all of the six paths work together they are an unstoppable force
also you do remember kakashi calling jiraiya crazy taking down all six of them at once

but this will only happen when deva path doesnt uses chibaku tensei from the beginning and in a death match battle all of the six paths can buy more than enough time to chibaku tensei kakashi and tsunade together

 

[Bogard]

Most of his kamui feats in his battle with Obito have been powered by bijuu, be it the hachibi or the kyuubi. No doubt he has gotten better at using it. but even with a medical nin by his side he cannot waste kamui like they're nothing.

He only got a power up from Kyubi once, and that was when Obito warped him in the other dimension. Before that, he had been fighting 2days against 7swordsmen, 6Bijuus, Gedo Mazo and Obito, all that spamming raikiris(something like 10times), raiden, Kage bunshins, doton and kamuis(5 or 6times). The amount of jutsus he used is completely on another level from what he used against Pain. With more chakra, your strategys become different since you can easily waste one of 2moves to accomplish what you intend to accomplish

Also i believe animal path is stronger than kakashi, Cerberus + rhino + chameleon + Bird + centipede + animal path all focusing on Kakashi, Good luck is all i can say.

Only problem is Cerberus who can be warped by Kamui- Others would either be killed/sliced in half by Raikiri-kunai or raiden. And that's when i forget to mention that Kakashi is not forced to fight the summons at all. He can easily attack the user directly. Once he is destroyed, the summons disappear. With his doton hiding mole, it's an easy task for him. Even Deva Path almost

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and was only saved by an instant Shinra tensei. So no, kakashi has all what it takes to defeat Animal Path

 

[Exaar]

He only got a power up from Kyubi once, and that was when Obito warped him in the other dimension. Before that, he had been fighting 2days against 7swordsmen, 6Bijuus, Gedo Mazo and Obito, all that spamming raikiris(something like 10times), raiden, Kage bunshins, doton and kamuis(5 or 6times). The amount of jutsus he used is completely on another level from what he used against Pain. With more chakra, your strategys become different since you can easily waste one of 2moves to accomplish what you intend to accomplish

Yes because i'm sure within those two days kakashi didn't receive any treatment from the medical division or anything huh.

Even here kakashi states he is worried about his chakra levels, So much so he didn't want to make any clones, even one was a big deal for him to make

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The next attack kakashi does after he used a clone/raikiri was many many chapters later, it was naruto who was fighting the bijuu's, Kakashi and Gai didn't get back into the fight untill gedo mazo was brought into the battle.

Here it seems kakashi is being Given chakra by the 8tails, Since we know bijuu can share chakra, Kakashi saying "Good that amount of chakra should be enough" when earlier he said he is worried about his chakra levels. For me this indicates him borrowing chakra.

Spoiler

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Next one he does is again after (i think) he has been Topped up by the 8tails.

Spoiler

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3rd One he has used since being topped up

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4th one he uses puts him flat on his face

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This makes far more sense than a kakashi who was worried about making one Mere clone, Yet used kamui 4 more times.

Only problem is Cerberus who can be warped by Kamui- Others would either be killed/sliced in half by Raikiri-kunai or raiden. And that's when i forget to mention that Kakashi is not forced to fight the summons at all. He can easily attack the user directly. Once he is destroyed, the summons disappear. With his doton hiding mole, it's an easy task for him. Even Deva Path almost

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and was only saved by an instant Shinra tensei. So no, kakashi has all what it takes to defeat Animal Path

But the point it, Kakashi will be getting attack from Underground, The sky while being attacked by the rhino and Cerberus at the same time, let alone dealing with the chameleon's sneak attacks, with all these contantly attacking him he wouldn't have time to pick them of one by one, for even use kamui.

While animal also hides inside the chameleon to keep himself safe, No way kakashi has the chakra levels to kamui all boss level/sized animals.

If they attacked one at a time your post would work.

 

[Bogard]

@Exaar when he talk about the amount of chakra who should be enough he is talking about himself. Kakashi needed to accumulate enough chakra to warp something as big as Gedo Mazo's head. It's why he needed some time for that. We see it again when he attempted to warp Juubi's TBB that he needed sometime to accumulate the quantity of chakra necessary. It's exactly what he was talking about there.

Nothing shows or even implies that Hachibi was giving him chakra. Hachibi was only there to put him in a good position for his kamui(that's why he asks him to elevate him). There is only one time where Kakashi received chakra and that's when Kurama gave him that, and when he gave him, there was a direct explication from Kishimoto after that, and Kakashi also further thanks Kurama. Like i've said, nothing implies Hachibi gave him chakra, like Kakashi didn't even thank him later for that like he did with Kurama for example

This is even what the Japanese translation says about it:

kaka: bee-san! bring me up high, please!\\
sfx: shuffle\\shuffle\\
guy: it’s best to avoid direct-contact attacks...!\\
hachi: up you go!\\
7
naru: chou mini bijuudama!! (super mini bijuu bomb)\\
kaka: mangekyou sharingan!\\
sfx: swish\\
sfx: swish\\
guy: soushuuga!! (twin attacking fangs)\\
8
sfx: suu\\
sfx: suya\\
tobi: this...\\
tobi: is not him...\\
sfx: poof\\
tobi: this is.\\
sfx: suya\\
10
guy: hiyaa!\\
11
sfx: smack\\
sfx: smack\\
sfx: swish\\
sfx: suya\\
tobi: I’ll get rid of you first...\\
sfx: smack\\
sfx: su...\\
12
sfx:smack\\
sfx: smack\\
naru: that was awesome, thick brows-senseil!!\\
13
kaka: perfect! I should have molded enough chakra!\\

Hachibi/Bee only helped to put him in a perfect condition to aim by bringing him up. Kakashi was molding chakra to attack the Gedo Mazo with his kamui

Concerning the fact he worried about his chakra levels, it's normal. Kage Bunshin takes half of your chakra and he certainly knew that the battle would take long, so he didn't want to waste chakra that recklessly especially after fighting that long already

 

[Exaar]

@Exaar when he talk about the amount of chakra who should be enough he is talking about himself. Kakashi needed to accumulate enough chakra to warp something as big as Gedo Mazo's head. It's why he needed some time for that. We see it again when he attempted to warp Juubi's TBB that he needed sometime to accumulate the quantity of chakra necessary. It's exactly what he was talking about there.

Even if i am wrong about his borrowing chakra, If it takes him time to warp large objects, it only helps my argument about Animal path even more so.

Tsunade alone wouldn't be able to stall long enough, and kakashi in a 1v1 with animal wouldn't have the time to do so.

He either
Nothing shows or even implies that Hachibi was giving him chakra. Hachibi was only there to put him in a good position for his kamui(that's why he asks him to elevate him). There is only one time where Kakashi received chakra and that's when Kurama gave him that, and when he gave him, there was a direct explication from Kishimoto after that, and Kakashi also further thanks Kurama. Like i've said, nothing implies Hachibi gave him chakra, like Kakashi didn't even thank him later for that like he did with Kurama for example

Nothing imply's that he did not borrow chakra either, I'm simply making a Logic answer.
For someone who was worrying about his chakra levels to the point he didn't want to make one Clone, Then he goes and uses 4/5 kamui.

As i said, it makes far more sense to him of borrowed chakra than being able to use 5 kamui even while being worried about his chakra levels to the point that making one clone was a big deal.

Concerning the fact he worried about his chakra levels, it's normal. Kage Bunshin takes half of your chakra and he certainly knew that the battle would take long, so he didn't want to waste chakra that recklessly especially after fighting that long already

If he has enough chakra to use kamui that many times without help, one clone taking 50% of the chakra need for 4 kamui isn't going to be a huge deal for him.
Let alone for him to be worried about it.

As for the Japanese translation, Do you have any proof of this?.

 

[TheTailedSage]

Pain wins High Diff.

Banshou tenin To pull in kakashi like last time and then stabs him with the long ass needle, we've seen that kakshi is pretty much useless against it, the only thing icould say that kakashi turns deva to fodder is kamui which i think he could use how ever this isnt just deva hes fighting, its 6 on 2 while tsunade is summoning katsuya it will get that nice chibaku tensei or animal path to counter, if ANY OF THE PATHS DIE OUTHER PATH BRINGS THEM BACK, any justsu thrown at them and preta jumps in

 

[UchihaInza]

a draw ???i respect that xd Uchiha Inza

 

[Kusanagi35]

As I remember the weakest Sannin defeated Oro pretty easily

LOL girl, you make me laugh my ass off every time.

Easily? She got her ass completely handed :rofl:
Just are we reading the same manga? Perhaps you're reading it upside down

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Tsunade is getting trashed here
note: Oro was armless, I will let you imagine what would have happened if he was healthy
Tsunade is the weakest sannin, unfortunately, you cannot contradict Kishi.

 

[Slug Princess Tsunade]

LOL girl, you make me laugh my ass off every time.

Easily? She got her ass completely handed :rofl:
Just are we reading the same manga? Perhaps you're reading it upside down

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Tsunade is getting trashed here
note: Oro was armless, I will let you imagine what would have happened if he was healthy
Tsunade is the weakest sannin, unfortunately, you cannot contradict Kishi.

Tsunade protected Naruto. She wasn't fighing Oro.
And you should re-read the manga, kid. Orochimaru's hands were sealed, but Tsunade wasn't on battlefield after Dan's death. Which was like 25 years ago


And yeah, she defeated him EASILY. with 1 punch:

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[karol the don]

nagato is a godlike pimp he gonna burst these two fellas down so hard like tupac did with biggie !

he pull them both with his mighty tensei crap and bang em down men lol

 

[Kusanagi35]

Tsunade protected Naruto. She wasn't fighing Oro.
And you should re-read the manga, kid. Orochimaru's hands were sealed, but Tsunade wasn't on battlefield after Dan's death. Which was like 25 years ago


And yeah, she defeated him EASILY. with 1 punch:

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What's your point? He could have easily killed her but his target was Naruto, she was just getting in the way
Yeah but no, she didn't even kill him with that punch not to mention he had to be armless for her to actually stand a chance. Healthy Oro would trash her, oh wait, he already did, even without his arms :rofl:

Go re-read previous chapters, not only she got her ass handed by Oro but..

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Yep, that proves my point.

 

[Slug Princess Tsunade]

What's your point? He could have easily killed her but his target was Naruto, she was just getting in the way
Yeah but no, she didn't even kill him with that punch not to mention he had to be armless for her to actually stand a chance. Healthy Oro would trash her, oh wait, he already did, even without his arms :rofl:

Go re-read previous chapters, not only she got her ass handed by Oro but..

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Yep, that proves my point.

Orochimaru NEVER defeated Tsunade, but Tsunade defeated him. It is manga fact, you can't deny. Try harder, kid.

 

[karol the don]

bitches cant act like a Boss dont forget that rofl men

 

[Slug Princess Tsunade]

bitches cant act like a Boss dont forget that rofl men

True, your mother isn't a boss.

 

[Kusanagi35]

Orochimaru NEVER defeated Tsunade, but Tsunade defeated him. It is manga fact, you can't deny. Try harder, kid.

Lol I don't care, the facts remain the same. Oro is stronger than Tsunade by a long shot.
You could say the exact same thing about Sasuke defeating Itachi back in the days. Was he necessarely stronger than Itachi just because he defeated him?
Nope, same here. Tsunade is trash. She even had a hard time defeating an armless man.
Manga facts.

 

[karol the don]

True, your mother isn't a boss.

Wow ofc she cant be,its time to pick blue berrys for a euro per hour or ?
Wannabe tsunade fan,face it that she is just spot waste,and oro could nuke her life.

 

[Ψ Veritas Ψ]

pain, no arguement here