[Gen] Training with Reborn

[Reborn]

Precisely.

The points I like to emphasize with this method and generally with non-hybrid techniques in such a method is the fact that, what I label as deceptive, generally encompasses a factor of difficulty in terms of understanding that one is trapped inside the illusion. That may not be the case for some of the canon techniques. In the series, people aren't as clear headed as we are since the meta factor is around so many of the jutsu in this series aren't so difficult to figure out for us. Just as well, even if you understood, even the most basic genjutsu releasing methods aren't as well known.

Most custom techniques or I should say most good techniques try incorporate some form of deception to make their technique hard to break out of. My very first genjutsu I could easily make appear as though it were a summoning technique akin to Kakashi's. With the exception of maybe one or two of my own techniques, most of my techniques require a deal of metagaming to get out of. Not to mention with right descriptive skills you can add features that would ordinarily make jutsu virtually impossible to "realize" are genjutsu.

Honestly, very few well made customs are purely one of these methods and I'd even care to wager that most of the techniques in the canon list aren't purely belonging to one method. Though the balance is pushed to one side of the spectrum more so. Tree Binding Death could be just as hard to figure out if used by a Wood user if used properly. Flower Head death utilizes aspects of paralysis and deception as the effects of the explosion on the target remain for as long as they are within the genjutsu.

 

[Kai NB]

That's understandable. We're generally put in situations (within the RP) where we need to immediately remove ourselves from the Gen, so we make sure to notice the small details to allow ourselves to escape it.

That makes it reasonable that most Gen techniques that can actually fool someone need to be as believable as possible. Making Gen that replicates one's fighting style is definitely a good approach, because as you said, a Wood User using Tree Binding Death would most likely have the victim believe he's using Wood Release.

Key point to this method, it should be difficult for the victim to notice that he/she is inside of an illusion

 

[Reborn]

List me all the deceptive techniques like you did for the concealment ones.

 

[Kai NB]

(Genjutsu: Kasumi) — Illusion Technique: Servant
Type: Supplementary
Rank: D
Range: Short
Chakra Cost: 10
Damage Points: 20
Description: The user does one handseal and throws a paper bomb at the enemy. The enemy, trapped in a genjutsu will see a clone of the user advancing upon him. As the paper bomb reaches the enemy, it explodes

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(Kori Shinchū no Jutsu) — Sly Mind Affect Technique
Type: Supplementary
Rank: C
Range: Short - Mid
Chakra Cost: 15
Damage Points: N/A
Description: The user casts an illusion on the opponent that makes them believe they are travelling in a straight line, when instead they are moving in circles. This is only effective on moving opponents. If the opponent travels in the circle for hours, they will be exhausted.

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(Genjutsu: Jigoku Gouka) — Illusion Technique: Hell Fire
Type: Supplementary
Rank: C
Range: Short - Mid
Chakra Cost: 15
Damage Points: N/A
Description: The user casts an illusion where the opponent sees a huge ball of fire descending from the sky and enveloping its target.

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(Genjutsu: Iwa Kōka Genjutsu) — Illusionary Arts: Rockslide Genjutsu
Type: Offensive
Rank: B
Range: Short - Mid
Chakra Cost: 20
Damage Points: N/A
Description: This is a technique that can be cast on multiple targets. The user creates an illusion where their target(s) experience several explosions going off near and around them. The ground around and beneath the target(s) will begin to collapse and cause panic and mental damage from the perceived reality of the explosions. The technique, however, is weak when cast upon multiple targets as it only takes one individual to release the technique for large groups of people.

Note: This technique can be cast on multiple targets but when done it only takes one person to release the technique for all parties involved with genjutsu kai. However all members need to be within short range distance.

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(Magen: Kokoni Arazu no Jutsu) — Demonic Illusion: False Surroundings Technique
Type: Supplementary
Rank: D
Range: Short - Mid
Chakra Cost: 10 (+5 if Usage is Doubled)
Damage Points: N/A
Description: The user casts an illusion over an area that allows him to manipulate the way an area looks to fool an opponent. He can only change the way the terrain looks, and not any other feature.

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(Magen: Nijū Kokoni Arazu no Jutsu) — Demonic Illusion: Double False Surroundings Technique
Type: Supplmentary
Rank: B
Range: Short - Mid
Chakra Cost: 20
Damage Points: N/A
Description: The user will do a sequence of 3 handseals, putting his opponents under a double layered Genjutsu. The user is able to create false surroundings to fool his targets, much like the simpler version of the technique. However, the illusion is in fact layered. If the opponent manages to release the first one, he will then feel the effects of the second illusion. If, for example, the first illusion is that of a desert and the second that of a forest, upon releasing the first one, the opponent will see the desert fade away while the forest appears around him, making him think he dispelled the illusion while in essence he is still caught in one. Each illusion is equivalent to C-Rank and both are casted at the same time. While normal releases will release only one illusion at a time, a strong enough pain or an external source of chakra can dispel both at the same time.

 

[Reborn]

Remember what I had you do for the other techniques in previous methods? Determining the advantages and weaknesses/tells. Do that for these techniques.

 

[Kai NB]

(Genjutsu: Kasumi) — Illusion Technique: Servant

Advantages - The clone hides the fact that a paper bomb is headed towards the victim
Disadvantages - The clone would have to move in a linear fashion only
Tell - The clone couldn't move anyway a kunai couldn't, so it would move at a constant rate forward. Also, the clone would be illusionary, so striking it with a kunai wouldn't do anything, it'd just pass through it (unless you hit the kunai :/)

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(Kori Shinchū no Jutsu) — Sly Mind Affect Technique

Advantages - Can effectively cause someone to tire themselves out
Disadvantages - Can only be used on a moving target
Tell - You would see the spot you originally started running from after a short while

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(Genjutsu: Jigoku Gouka) — Illusion Technique: Hell Fire

Advantages - Can temporarily deceive an opponent and make them lose focus of the opponent
Disadvantages - The fire doesn't actually cause any pain
Tell - No heat emanating from the fire

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(Genjutsu: Iwa Kōka Genjutsu) — Illusionary Arts: Rockslide Genjutsu

Advantages - Can be cast on a bunch of people
Disadvantages - Only 1 person really needs to figure it out to release everyone from it
Tell -

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(Magen: Kokoni Arazu no Jutsu) — Demonic Illusion: False Surroundings Technique

Advantages - Can alter the terrain slightly to hide hidden traps in terrain
Disadvantages - Changes made to the terrain are only visual, so they don't have any tangible feeling coming from them
Tell - Drastic terrain changes are obvious. Whatever is made won't actually be felt the way it is supposed to be

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(Magen: Nijū Kokoni Arazu no Jutsu) — Demonic Illusion: Double False Surroundings Technique

Advantages - Casts 2 Gens at once, so saves a move. If the first one is destroyed, the second one can still be in place possibly
Disadvantages - Low level Gens, only works one after the other, not at the same time.
Tell - The terrain appears to have changed, but isn't really. You wouldn't be able to touch things that appear to be there.

 

[Reborn]

If you were to combine this with trick wire, you could negate the disadvantage you gave for the first technique. If your clone's movement is contingent on the movement of the weapon, then all you would need to do is control the movement the way you'd like. Though you do have a point about the clone itself being an illusion. Physical contact would give it away.

Best part about this is, if used in a battle the tell itself wouldn't be immediate since you would need to recognize the pattern first before you can actually say "oh I know it's a genjutsu." Most people tend to metagame way too easily out of this though.

False, when used in the anime there were waves of heat that appeared as a result of the illusion as well as the fact that those hit by the fire itself were screaming as if they were in pain. The moment impact would immediately give it away as a false entity so why did the people hit by the flames continue to scream? That is why I always say this technique does produce heat, at least enough to make this more than a visual illusion.

Insufficient, don't try to rush through this, give me more of an answer. How would you tell this technique is an illusion?

What if somebody isn't stupid enough to drastically change the terrain? What is the tell then?

Why would you need for both gen to appear at the same time. You cast both techniques at the same time and when your opponent breaks one they fall into the other (normal circumstances not necessarily in practical use in our RP). Few would presume another gen layered on top without meta.

 

[Kai NB]

4) If the user never threw paper bombs or aren't pet of Blast corps, there would be no explanation as to how the explosions start.
5) If they don't drastically change the terrain, the tell is that you wouldn't feel or be able to interact with any of the false images, or the reverse, you would feel stuff that are hidden.

Understood on the other stuff

 

[Reborn]

I suppose that would work but you could only assume such a thing if you were always keen on the movements of your opponent before hand. Should they have removed themselves from your vision or ability to detect what they were doing, they could always make the argument of "Well I could have planted those while you weren't looking." So that's a bit iffy but it works.

 

[Kai NB]

Gotcha, what's next

 

[Reborn]

Next method, tomorrow. Or rather later today. I'm lightheaded rn. I think it's the hypnotic techniques. Explain to me what those are.

 

[Kai NB]

Hypnotic Genjutsu revolve around actually Genjutsu that can actually control the actions of the victims that the Genjutsu are placed on. Hypnotic Genjutsu are not without flaws, as people can realize when they are being controlled (bar Kotoamatsukami). Sharingan Genjutsu seems to be especially capable of doing this, which is great for RP purposes.

These are the Hypnotic Gens from the Canon List

(Magen: Narakumi) — Demonic Illusion: Hell Viewing
Type: Supplementary
Rank: D
Range: Short
Chakra Cost: 10
Damage Points: N/A
Description: The user performs two handseals causing it to appear as if a swirl of leaves surrounds the opponent. The swirl eventually falls away, and after a few seconds, the opponent sees the image of whatever they fear the most, shocking them and potentially causing them to faint.

Pro - The user experiences their worst fear, resulting in them potentially fainting
Con - People can resist fainting
Tell - Anybody's worst fear suddenly appearing randomly is enough of a tell.

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(Genjutsu: Jinmon) — Illusion Technique: Interrogation
Type: Supplementary
Rank: C
Range: Short
Chakra Cost: 15
Damage Points: 30
Description: The user of this technique, upon casting on a stationary opponent with physical contact with them, is able to convince the enemy to give away information. However, this will only work on ninja two ranks lower and below than the caster.

Pro - Excellent for RP purposes and gathering information within the NW
Con - Needs physical contact to work and can only work on lower ranked victims.
Tell - The fact that the victim would give secret information is enough of a tell to make the victim realize they're being controlled.

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(Nehan Shōja no Jutsu) — Temple of Nirvana Technique
Type: Supplementary
Rank: A
Range: Short - Mid
Chakra Cost: 30
Damage Points: N/A
Description: The user makes one handseal, placing all the targets in the area under an illusion where feathers appear to fall from the sky. This slowly puts the opponents to sleep after one turn.

Pro - Can affect multiple opponents at once and cause them to fall asleep. If one cancels the technique, other people are still stuck in the Gen
Con - Effects take time before actually happening, so the victim can react before being affected
Tell - Feathers randomly falling

 

[Reborn]

One of these does not belong, spot the one that does not belong, tell me why it does not belong.

 

[Kai NB]

(Magen: Narakumi) — Demonic Illusion: Hell Viewing
Type: Supplementary
Rank: D
Range: Short
Chakra Cost: 10
Damage Points: N/A
Description: The user performs two handseals causing it to appear as if a swirl of leaves surrounds the opponent. The swirl eventually falls away, and after a few seconds, the opponent sees the image of whatever they fear the most, shocking them and potentially causing them to faint.

This one, because it does not actually do anything to control the actions of the opponent. Their actions as a result of the Genjutsu are entirely their own, whereas the other two Gens will forcibly cause them to act one way.

 

[Reborn]

You are correct that the technique is not a hypnotic one, however hypnotic techniques are not necessarily about controlling the actions of your opponent. They're more about detaching the mind and spirit from the opponent such that it is within your ability to implant your own will and make them puppets. Yes it may entail control but as you can see with the Temple of Nirvana it does not control the user, it simply puts them to sleep. It dwindles their mind and prevents them from responding should they not react in time to release the technique. Needles to say most hypnotic based techniques won't be approved in this day and age of the RP. Specifically Uchiha techniques are almost entirely hypnosis based which is why we can't create them.

Also the interrogation jutsu is a rather unique technique. This is something I'd argue that you wouldn't be able to break once caught properly. Your mind is no longer in control so you can't consciously break the technique. It makes sense, the technique only works on stationary opponents to begin with, subduing your opponent and preventing them from moving and then using this technique, it's not a game breaker since it's not as though the victim is under complete control, the jutsu will just force a loose tongue.

 

[Kai NB]

Ah, that makes more sense. And I expected that Hypnotic Based Gen customs wouldn't be approved in the current RP

Everything else sounds good

 

[Reborn]

We're basically finished. You have all the techniques so genjutsu is technically completed. However since I still want you to do a few things before I send you on your way I'll give you the custom I promised you since we didn't "officially" finish by the time I said. Think of it as a graduation gift.

I'm giving you a final test which I will post in a matter of hours after I go through our posts and construct a few questions that I think are essential that you should know by now both for theoretical purposes and practical purposes. In the mean time if you have any questions or want to go back over anything post here and i'll respond throughout the day until I construct the test. If you fail this test I won't let you leave, pass and you can go, pass it with flying colors and I'll try putting your name out there for...a potential reward beyond my capabilities of giving you.

 

[Kai NB]

We're basically finished. You have all the techniques so genjutsu is technically completed. However since I still want you to do a few things before I send you on your way I'll give you the custom I promised you since we didn't "officially" finish by the time I said. Think of it as a graduation gift.

I'm giving you a final test which I will post in a matter of hours after I go through our posts and construct a few questions that I think are essential that you should know by now both for theoretical purposes and practical purposes. In the mean time if you have any questions or want to go back over anything post here and i'll respond throughout the day until I construct the test. If you fail this test I won't let you leave, pass and you can go, pass it with flying colors and I'll try putting your name out there for...a potential reward beyond my capabilities of giving you.

Sounds good. I'll be going through the entire thread myself as well so that I can review the material, and if I think of any questions or scenarios that I'll need to know, I'll be sure to ask

 

[Reborn]

Too tired to do this rn so you're done. If you pass the sensei test don't do anything stupid when teaching genjutsu. Good luck