[Theory] Tobi's and Madara's moon eye plan are different

Taluannhan

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Hello everybody. It's finally weekend and now I have some time to spare on thoughts about Naruto manga. Let's start by collecting some facts:

1. Both Tobi and Madara want to perform the Moon eye plan, the infinite Tsukuyomi which will lead the world to "true peace" (by their definition)

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2. Tobi had plenty of chances to capture Naruto before. He just had to touch Naruto and warp him away. Yet he didn't do it. But now, in the midst of war, he is using the most precious weapons in his hand (tail beast chakra and Gedo Mazo) trying to capture Naruto. One quesiton: why not do it earlier?

He didn't have much trouble finding Naruto:

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He keeps repeating himself that he wants a fight between Sasuke and Naruto, and Naruto is merely "to stimulate Sasuke".

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3. It's quite certain that Madara was planned to revive by Rinne Tensei from Nagato's Rinnegan, and the war was never in Madara's plan.

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Lots of us noticed the inconsistence in Tobi's actions. To sum them up:

1. Tobi did not even try to capture Naruto earlier.
2. Tobi started the war without any good reason.
3. Tobi revived (imperfect) Ten-tails amidst battle and is now going to fight Naruto to protect it, while he could easily do it before without any hinderance.

Therefore some of my predictions:

1. Madara probably learned about the Ten-tails and its power, as well as the possibility of the infinite Tsukuyomi genjutsu, after he awoke his Rinnegan and read the stone tablet. Unfortunately for him, his days were numbered, he could not do it himself. He developed a plan: after his death, his Rinnegan were to be transplanted to a proper person (in this case, Nagato), who will use them to revive Madara later. The one who would see it done was no one else than Tobi.
Why didn't Nagato revive Madara earlier? Perhaps to revive a long dead person, you need a huge amount of chakra, which is only available after all tail-beasts are captured. Or because Tobi doesn't want it. (see below)

2. Tobi double-crossed Madara. He doesn't want to revive Madara, he wants to carry out the moon eye plan himself. As he said here:

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he wants to be the Ten-tails' Jinchuriki.

3. Why does Tobi need Sasuke? Perhaps the current body of Tobi is not up to the demanding task of containing Ten-tails. He needs a better one, with powerful eyes to control the monster within. Nagato was the choice, but he sacrificed himself reviving the Leaft (and thus was marked as "traitor"). Now Sasuke will fullfill this role. But Tobi wants to awake all of Sasuke's potentials before taking over. Is there any better way than pushing Sasuke in countless battles and life-or-death situations? That's why there's a war. To push Naruto and Sasuke against each other.

4. What's about the issue of reviving Ten-tails amidst battle? Isn't it just easier to do it at home? Perhaps the answer is: Reviving an incomplete Ten-tails has huge risk. Either through the imbalance of chakra, or because Tobi still doesn't have the powerful body to control the beast. I'm quite convinced things would go out of control and the Ten-tails will just go amok.

Itachi once warned about the risk of chakra imbalance
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5. Put things together, it looks like Tobi is in rush. He now has quite a few things working against him: his master, Madara, is at large. Naruto and Bee working together prove too tough to beat. Edo Tensei "allies" are gone. I think the moment he reveals himself is not very far away.

6. Another thought comes to my mind. You still remember the Kyubi's attack at the Leat village 16 years ago, don't you. The masked man (probably Tobi) captured the Jinchuriki, extracted the beast. Guess what, he didn't just disappear and seal the Nine-tails chakra in Gedo Mazo, he used it to attack the village. Does it sound strange?
My guess: it was an attack carried out by Tobi but under the direct command of Madara (who was still alive then). There was no Moon eye plan at this time.

Hope you enjoy my theory. Feel free to comment and tell me what you think or if you agree/disagree with me.
 

Negative Knight

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This theory was really interesting, i hope you continue to make threads like this

However Tobi and madara were originally partners, Madara willingly giving his rinnegan to Nagato on his deathbed (via Tobi) to use Rinne of Rebirth.

You can use when Tobi went "That Rinne of Rebirth was meant for me!" which clearly shows he had another purpose for it.

Tobi had to be someone he trusted i'm assuming Kagami Uchiha (in theory his nephew)

Originally Tobi had the same plans but must of changed them due to his ever changing view on the world due to events after the death of Madara

+Rep
 

ImNoOne

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Great theory! Great work! 19 posts and all this quality, a mind like this is welcomed sight amidst all the noobs and fan boys posting nowadays. Thank you.
 

Sarutobi Sasuke

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Great theory. No really! :hint:+REP

I dont agree fully, but anyways, great job.

*********************************************************************​

The thing I disagree with the most is Madara being alive during the Kyuubi incident.

1. Madara said he activated his Rinnegan just before he died.

2. Tobi, under the guise of Madara, said that Nagato's Rinnegan originally belonged to him.

3. Nagato was a small boy the first time he used his Rinnegan.

4. If Madara died shortly after activating his Rinnegan and transplanted his rinnegan into a very young Nagato, wouldn't that automatically mean that Madara died when Nagato was still a small "brat"?[/B]

5. Nagato is probably older than Minato

6. Minato was an adult by the time of Kyuubi incident. Which means that Nagato was also an adult by that time.

So, how could Madara be alive during the Kyuubi incident if he died shortly after activating his Rinnegan?
 
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sharingan17

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Awesome theory makes sense, except for the part madara was still alive when tobi attack, I say this because he was revive young, not an old person and I believe et brings u back exavtly as u die?
 

ImNoOne

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Great theory. No really! +rep :hint:

I dont agree fully, but anyways, great job.

*********************************************************************​

The thing I disagree with the most is Madara being alive during the Kyuubi incident.

1. Madara said he activated his Rinnegan just before he died.

2. Tobi, under the guise of Madara, said that Nagato's Rinnegan originally belonged to him.

3. Nagato was a small boy the first time he used his Rinnegan.

4. If Madara died shortly after activating his Rinnegan and transplanted his rinnegan into very ----young Nagato, wouldn't that automatically mean that Madara died when Nagato was still a ------small "brat"?[/B]

5. Nagato is probably older than Minato

So, how could Madara be alive during the Kyuubi incident if he died shortly after activating his Rinnegan?
Yes that's actually the only flaw. Yet it could have only been that at that time Tobi didn't had the all the other 8 bijuus either. And he wouldn't start off with the capturing of the Nine tails. On the other hand Kushina was renowned as a very good vessel/seal for the Nine tails, and it seems it would have been very hard for Tobi to get the Nine Tails out of her in any other circumstance. So I think the attack 16 years ago was only meant to rip the Nine Tails out of it's strong vessel so that later on when he had to capture the bijuus he didn't had to deal with a strong Kushina.
 

vUmbrav

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2. Tobi had plenty of chances to capture Naruto before. He just had to touch Naruto and warp him away. Yet he didn't do it. But now, in the midst of war, he is using the most precious weapons in his hand (tail beast chakra and Gedo Mazo) trying to capture Naruto. One quesiton: why not do it earlier?

There have been several attempts on Naruto by the Akatsuki just not Tobi himself. I don't know how you can say that.

Plus it was Tobi's aim to get ALL the tailed beasts. The octopus tentacle and Kin/Gin chakra was a consolation not his primary goal. When Kabuto released ET he said he failed and it can't be helped. He is in desperation mode right now.
 

Sarutobi Sasuke

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Yes that's actually the only flaw. Yet it could have only been that at that time Tobi didn't had the all the other 8 bijuus either. And he wouldn't start off with the capturing of the Nine tails. On the other hand Kushina was renowned as a very good vessel/seal for the Nine tails, and it seems it would have been very hard for Tobi to get the Nine Tails out of her in any other circumstance. So I think the attack 16 years ago was only meant to rip the Nine Tails out of it's strong vessel so that later on when he had to capture the bijuus he didn't had to deal with a strong Kushina.
That is the best explanation for why Tobi started with the Kyuubi. +rep.

Also, Tobi appears to have a summoning contract with the Kyuubi. And he's also able to control the Kyuubi. So it would have made a great summoning for Tobi. And would have helped tremendously in capturing the rest of the Bijuu.




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This makes me wonder.

When did Tobi establish a summoning contract with the Kyuubi anyway? The Kyuubi's been sealed away inside different Jinchuurikis since the Battle at the Valley of the End. If Tobi does have a contract with the Kyuubi then it could only have been established before Mito sealed the Kyuubi within herself. That would make Tobi reeeaaalllyyyy old. About as old as Madara would have been.

Or was he mearly using the real Madara's blood to summon Kurama. I say this because Kabuto once used Orochimaru's blood to summon Manda on Oro's behalf (Oro's arms were useless.)
.
 
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