Orochimagus
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Obito has identity issues which he hinted since Madara was revealed. His obvious spite at Kakashi of all people stands out though.
Tobi/ObitoTheories: What, why and how and then some
- Thread starter Avani
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Sentinelsgalore
Member
yeah, I find this strange too. Next chapter I hope to have an explanation of how Obito survived and his connection to Madara. Definitely something fishy happened when he survived the boulder. Zetsu cells are a definite, maybe a similar split personality. Hopefully Kishi can at least give us one answer next chapter, instead of giving us more questions.
Orochimagus
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Read the manga, Ninken. He was "nearly crushed". You don't know how indented the boulder was below. The composition of the boulder is as you take it?
littlebigbaddad
Member
Identity... Means a lot in a world of deception. It is also the main recurring theme in this manga. Every main character has struggled with it to some degree. Tobi is no exception. Is Tobi obito? Or was Tobi "always" Obito? Are his goals identical to Madaras? The manga isnt over yet and despite some good points I think some of us are making logical errors and shouldnt be so quick to judge...
TiddlySkydiver
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Check out how powerful people thought Obito would be if he grew up, from just a couple months ago.
I think you think too much, thats quite imposible but... then again it might be juubi because we all dont know if the Sage of the six paths was friends with the juubi or not, and we know that the sage saperated it to nine bijuu just because he knew that it will rampage again. Otherwise if Bee was dead will the Hachibi rampage after it has revived?
slenderman
Member
I don't know why you guys want so bad that Tobi is not Obito! Just give up you lost!
Tobi is Obito, he in my opinion was saved by Zetsu when he was about to die, just remember when Kisame was decapiteted actually it was a Zetsu body, they can mime exactly the same chakra and looks, when Kakashi thought that it can't be really Obito because he is dead and he saw his funneral, he only saw a Zetsu looking just as Obito that was 6 fith under
Zetsu was sent by Madara, to save Obito, or by obito's father who might just be the first Tobi, as we know or by the judging of their haircut it may be Danzo, Danzo had a sharingan and was old enought to be the first Tobi, now he held to much power to be Danzo but still remains a posibility certanly there were 2 Tobi at first. It is clear from what we saw in chapter 601 that Madara and Tobi knows each other but I still tehre are so much questions, but be just 100% sure that tobi is Obito, his intentions cannot be anticipat because it is too soon to know what was his plan why he changed so much and so on...clearly Zetsu had some talk with him about Madara's plan thats why he has the 1st Hokage's body in that tree and based on what other guys are sayng it can be that Zetsu helds some Madara DNA in him thats why Madara can know him...who can know for sure...aniways, Madara and Obito are on the same page and Madara called him Obito, Zetsu while evryone else from Akatusky called Tobi Madara, the only one who seemd to call Tobi, Tobi was Zetsu because he knew was Obito, and that was just because Kishi did not want to make Zetsu call him Obito earlyer in the manga because then there were no suprise at all for all of ya when you will realise that he really was Obito, he let the suprise ellement to hit ya guys in the face! I still think that this will turn to be a very interesting story :-D
Just my opinion do not get angry on me.
Tobi is Obito, he in my opinion was saved by Zetsu when he was about to die, just remember when Kisame was decapiteted actually it was a Zetsu body, they can mime exactly the same chakra and looks, when Kakashi thought that it can't be really Obito because he is dead and he saw his funneral, he only saw a Zetsu looking just as Obito that was 6 fith under
Zetsu was sent by Madara, to save Obito, or by obito's father who might just be the first Tobi, as we know or by the judging of their haircut it may be Danzo, Danzo had a sharingan and was old enought to be the first Tobi, now he held to much power to be Danzo but still remains a posibility certanly there were 2 Tobi at first. It is clear from what we saw in chapter 601 that Madara and Tobi knows each other but I still tehre are so much questions, but be just 100% sure that tobi is Obito, his intentions cannot be anticipat because it is too soon to know what was his plan why he changed so much and so on...clearly Zetsu had some talk with him about Madara's plan thats why he has the 1st Hokage's body in that tree and based on what other guys are sayng it can be that Zetsu helds some Madara DNA in him thats why Madara can know him...who can know for sure...aniways, Madara and Obito are on the same page and Madara called him Obito, Zetsu while evryone else from Akatusky called Tobi Madara, the only one who seemd to call Tobi, Tobi was Zetsu because he knew was Obito, and that was just because Kishi did not want to make Zetsu call him Obito earlyer in the manga because then there were no suprise at all for all of ya when you will realise that he really was Obito, he let the suprise ellement to hit ya guys in the face! I still think that this will turn to be a very interesting story :-D
Just my opinion do not get angry on me.
Could the Madara Itachi met, (looking exactly like him - his hair and such, but behind a mask) have been a Zetsu clone, no wonder Itachi didn't recognize him, cuz he could copy chakra. + Another thing, Zetsu clearly didn't know of Tobi's power until l8r on in the manga, I don't think he is the one who saved him... Recall to the episode where Sasori dies and Tobi picks up his ring.
Sentinelsgalore
Member
yeah, Tobi acted as a good boy on his debut with Zetsu when nobody was around to deceive. Therefore, I dont think Zetsu was the one who saved Obito.
General khan
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KiraKorotome
Member
Ok, here's what I know:
Edo Tensei puts your body back to the way it was before death. Madara could have achieved Rinnegan, died, and had his eyes transferred to Nagato.
When we see him in his Edo Tensei state, that's the way he was before the loss of his eyes. This is supported by Itachi gaining his own eyes back.
When we see Obito fighting the Fourth Hokage, Minato Kazekage, he had a fully developed body. This may or may not be explained by his Kamui which places him into another dimension. Time may have different rules within that dimension.
A counter to that theory is that only part of is body is shifted during combat. So his body being cut off from time would separate the rest of his body from the part that is transferred.
Obito's immense knowledge in surgery is also something I'd like to point out. How would he come by that knowledge? Madara Uchiha seemed to not have that much time left and teaching surgical abilities to someone of Obito's person just seems impossible. We all know Obito was a slacker in school.
This could be countered by his sharingan, the sharingan can copy hand movements as they are being made, and it practically makes the brain remember each frame down to the teeth, so he could have copied Rin's surgical techniques and learned from them over time.
The theory that his body is being possessed. It seems literally impossible, this is because of his immense disdain for Kakashi's inability to protect Rin, he believed she didn't live a happy life like he wanted her to. Also Madara said "You seem to be having alot of fun, Obito". This could mean that he was not in control of Obito, and that Obito might have enjoyed what he was doing currently.
His disdain towards war is fueled by the loss of his comrade. Supposedly, he and Kakashi are sides of the same coin, Kakashi, kept moving forward despite the loss of his comrades, where Obito did not. He moved back.
The great rock escape can be easily explained by his Kamui awakening.
Edo Tensei puts your body back to the way it was before death. Madara could have achieved Rinnegan, died, and had his eyes transferred to Nagato.
When we see him in his Edo Tensei state, that's the way he was before the loss of his eyes. This is supported by Itachi gaining his own eyes back.
When we see Obito fighting the Fourth Hokage, Minato Kazekage, he had a fully developed body. This may or may not be explained by his Kamui which places him into another dimension. Time may have different rules within that dimension.
A counter to that theory is that only part of is body is shifted during combat. So his body being cut off from time would separate the rest of his body from the part that is transferred.
Obito's immense knowledge in surgery is also something I'd like to point out. How would he come by that knowledge? Madara Uchiha seemed to not have that much time left and teaching surgical abilities to someone of Obito's person just seems impossible. We all know Obito was a slacker in school.
This could be countered by his sharingan, the sharingan can copy hand movements as they are being made, and it practically makes the brain remember each frame down to the teeth, so he could have copied Rin's surgical techniques and learned from them over time.
The theory that his body is being possessed. It seems literally impossible, this is because of his immense disdain for Kakashi's inability to protect Rin, he believed she didn't live a happy life like he wanted her to. Also Madara said "You seem to be having alot of fun, Obito". This could mean that he was not in control of Obito, and that Obito might have enjoyed what he was doing currently.
His disdain towards war is fueled by the loss of his comrade. Supposedly, he and Kakashi are sides of the same coin, Kakashi, kept moving forward despite the loss of his comrades, where Obito did not. He moved back.
The great rock escape can be easily explained by his Kamui awakening.
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KiraKorotome
Member
It could mean he no longer cares for who he once was but what he was going to become, the bijuu's jinchuuriki.
chortleballz
Member
okay children! heres my take on this whole thing from the past few chapters. tbh, i admit, i was one of the people that didnt beleive that tobi was obito, and ofcourse with great himiliation, i was wrong, along with many others and those who still think it isnt obito, or some lad using orochimarus jutsu to take over obito's body. thats just a bit too farfetched at this point. so, from reading the end of the latest chapter i immediately pieced everything together and now come up with a solid theory! here goes...
so first of all we all question obito being tobi because of all these things he has supposedly done in the past and everything he knows, such as, being the one who convinced yahiko to form akatsuki and "giving" nagato the rinnegan and being the orchestrator of the 9 tails attack. So! heres what i think. i reckon, that all the stuff about yahiko and nagato that he says was a lie and at the same time true. If you think about it, we never actually get any proof that obito was the one who was behind it all besides his word. no flashbacks, no nothing. So, i reckon that the Real Madara was actually behind those claims. he made yahiko form akatsuki, he "gave" nagato the rinnegan by unknown means (yous can discuss that theory among yourselves, i originally thought obito might have given nagato madaras eyes but ive dropped that theory due to madara still having his eyes during his elder days) and intended to use nagato again in the future. So now we get to the Obito part. As you may have seen at the end of the last chapter, obito was rapped up and saved from his encounter with the dirty big rocks ontop of him by an old man who possesses the sharingan. Anyone who has common sense would realise that that old man was madara uchiha as an elderly. I beleive he saved Obito, and then after his wounds had been healed, he manipulated obito into joining his cause. (Havent really figured out how yet, maybe rins death and the realisation that reality is not worth livinig if she's dead caused him to drastically change his ways, i dunno, you guys can decide) and then was trained by Madara so that he may be able to do his bidding such as controlling the mizukage (this one may have been madara, although i dont think so, as kisame, remembered obitos face when he showed him)and taking control of the 9 tails (yes i realise that the time frame of these events would mean that obito is only 16-17, but he's an uchiha. If sasuke can become almost as strong as itachi in 2 years, im sure obito can learn to control the fox in the same time frame). Why? because madara uchiha at this point is 100 years old and too old to do any of this shit so he got someone else to do it for him, and if anyone asks, hes madara uchiha himself. So, aware of his own mortality, madara set out a plan for obito to follow, which included taking control of akatsuki under the alias of madara uchiha (because nagato probably wouldnt have followed him if he wasn't and not to mention he was armed with all the history of madara uchiha from the time he spent with him), capture the 9 tailed beasts and then when the time would come, obito would have nagato revive madara to his prime, so that he would be strong again. he would then take control of the 10 tails and become its jinchuuriki and activate infinite tsukiomi. DAMN IM GOOD!
The unfortunate truth is...Tobi, the main antagonist of the second half of the naruto series turns out to be nothing more then a pawn. and it turns out madara uchiha IS behind it all!
So thats my theory, which to me seems to be the most likely as it possesses next to no plot holes. If i did, feel free to point them out and im confident i'll be able to answer them!
so first of all we all question obito being tobi because of all these things he has supposedly done in the past and everything he knows, such as, being the one who convinced yahiko to form akatsuki and "giving" nagato the rinnegan and being the orchestrator of the 9 tails attack. So! heres what i think. i reckon, that all the stuff about yahiko and nagato that he says was a lie and at the same time true. If you think about it, we never actually get any proof that obito was the one who was behind it all besides his word. no flashbacks, no nothing. So, i reckon that the Real Madara was actually behind those claims. he made yahiko form akatsuki, he "gave" nagato the rinnegan by unknown means (yous can discuss that theory among yourselves, i originally thought obito might have given nagato madaras eyes but ive dropped that theory due to madara still having his eyes during his elder days) and intended to use nagato again in the future. So now we get to the Obito part. As you may have seen at the end of the last chapter, obito was rapped up and saved from his encounter with the dirty big rocks ontop of him by an old man who possesses the sharingan. Anyone who has common sense would realise that that old man was madara uchiha as an elderly. I beleive he saved Obito, and then after his wounds had been healed, he manipulated obito into joining his cause. (Havent really figured out how yet, maybe rins death and the realisation that reality is not worth livinig if she's dead caused him to drastically change his ways, i dunno, you guys can decide) and then was trained by Madara so that he may be able to do his bidding such as controlling the mizukage (this one may have been madara, although i dont think so, as kisame, remembered obitos face when he showed him)and taking control of the 9 tails (yes i realise that the time frame of these events would mean that obito is only 16-17, but he's an uchiha. If sasuke can become almost as strong as itachi in 2 years, im sure obito can learn to control the fox in the same time frame). Why? because madara uchiha at this point is 100 years old and too old to do any of this shit so he got someone else to do it for him, and if anyone asks, hes madara uchiha himself. So, aware of his own mortality, madara set out a plan for obito to follow, which included taking control of akatsuki under the alias of madara uchiha (because nagato probably wouldnt have followed him if he wasn't and not to mention he was armed with all the history of madara uchiha from the time he spent with him), capture the 9 tailed beasts and then when the time would come, obito would have nagato revive madara to his prime, so that he would be strong again. he would then take control of the 10 tails and become its jinchuuriki and activate infinite tsukiomi. DAMN IM GOOD!
The unfortunate truth is...Tobi, the main antagonist of the second half of the naruto series turns out to be nothing more then a pawn. and it turns out madara uchiha IS behind it all!
So thats my theory, which to me seems to be the most likely as it possesses next to no plot holes. If i did, feel free to point them out and im confident i'll be able to answer them!
chortleballz
Member
good explanation! except if you read the latest chapter, madara appears at the end as an elderly. Well, it isnt confirmed to be him ofcourse, but we can both agree its obvious and during the conversation with kabuto, i recall them talking about madaras "prime"? and how kabuto brought him back beyond his prime. If you think about it, its context can be considered past-tense, meaning last time he was alive, he was no longer in his prime, but could have been old. noooot to mention, we dont even know how madara died. My best bet would be he died of old age, because if the first couldnt kill him, i doubt any one else could beat a badass like that, so that could mean that the caster of the reanimation jutsu can control the ages in which the subject is brought back.
KiraKorotome
Member
Obito was a slacker in school, explain how he learned surgery so quickly. Also explain his fully developed body when he's younger than Kakashi during his fight with the Yondaime. Don't say it was Madara, because he doesn't possess kamui. Plenty of people have said that already.
Seems simple, he could have gained a sample from his battle with the first Hokage.
Tobi/Obito theories, predictions and discussions
Go here for Tobi/Obito theories, predictions and discussions after chapter 601:
Seeing that Tobi ID theories are STILL one of the most popular and repeatedly made thread, it is stickied yet again. So here is a thread for you to post your theories filling the gaps and to explain how it is possible till Kishi does it himself.
Now play nicely and stop making separate threads for it every time you want to come up with some new ideas about Tobi's behaviour and what might have been the reason for his change of heart.
Go here for Tobi/Obito theories, predictions and discussions after chapter 601:
You must be registered for see links
Seeing that Tobi ID theories are STILL one of the most popular and repeatedly made thread, it is stickied yet again. So here is a thread for you to post your theories filling the gaps and to explain how it is possible till Kishi does it himself.
Now play nicely and stop making separate threads for it every time you want to come up with some new ideas about Tobi's behaviour and what might have been the reason for his change of heart.
chortleballz
Member
except if tobi made out that he was minatos student it would have been obvious that he was his student and minato would have found out