The alternate reality theory, Naruto style

Floydical

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First off, I want to give credit where credit is due. has had some great ideas on this topic and his ideas inspired some of my own. Thank you Gyakusetsu for being another person who likes to push the envelope! So with that, lets get to the theory!

Parallel dimensions/ alternate realities, the RL theory:

I first want to explain the RL theory which I will relate to the Naruto world after.

Note: I do not personally believe in this theory, but that doesn't mean its not possible. In addition, that does not mean that a manga writer like Kishi doesn't believe it and perhaps utilize it in his manga.

The theory is that every decision you make on a daily basis can, perhaps, create an alternate reality of our own that differs slightly. If you consider the hundreds of decisions you make on a daily basis, the number of alternate realities you may create is staggering. Compound this with the millions of other people all around the world, causing potentially just as many alternate realities as you. Compound this even further by taking a chunk of time, say 20 years, and imagine how one random person's decision from back then might affect your current reality.

Possible results if such a thing were true:

If you consider the possibility that decisions made by other people a long time ago can affect your current reality, then the limits on its influence are potentially unlimited. Lets take some simple examples.

Are you currently wearing a shirt with a brand and logo on it? If so, what if a decision make 20 years ago affected the logo of that brand? Lets say your shirt logo is a mountain top. What if in an alternate reality its a snow-capped mountain top? What if in another its a snow-capped mountain top with a man hiking up it? What if, in even another alternate reality, it shares the same logo but the brand name is different?

Continuing this line of thought, what if decisions make 20 years ago affected your current state of being? What if there's a version of you that was involved in a terrible car accident? There might be a version of you that's a paraplegic. There might be a version of you that's missing an arm. There might be a version of you that after loosing your arm, decided to invest in an artificial arm. The point is that the possibilities are endless.

Relating this theory to Naruto:

What I am suggesting is that perhaps Kishi is using this idea in his manga. Do you recall all those dozens of mistakes being made in the last chapters? Do you recall the hundreds of mistakes that Kishi has made during the war arc? If you haven't, then I suggest you get out from under your rock.

What I'm suggesting that these mistakes that Kishi is making perhaps aren't mistakes, but intentional. Potentially, these mistakes can be explained with the alternate reality theory. I'm gonna pick three very obvious mistakes and concentrate on them, but please realize that there are literally hundreds of others out there.

We all know about Minato's missing flames on his coat:

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What if, in an alternate reality, decisions lead to Minato's coat design not having flames on it? Don't shy away now, I'm just getting into the nitty-gritty.

We all also know about Minato's missing arm suddenly appearing then disappearing again a page later:

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

Who's to say there's not a reality where Minato didn't loose his arm in the fight with Obito?

Most recently, we saw Madara's sharingan in the wrong socket and swapped back to being correct in just one panel:

You must be registered for see images

Who's to say there's not a reality where Madara had his Rinnegan in his left socket rather than his right?

How Kishi might be implementing this idea into his manga:
Now you might be asking, "How does the alternate reality theory potentially relate to these mistakes?". The answer is quite simple. Perhaps, for very short periods of time, individuals from alternate realities are swapping for very short amounts of time. The durations are so short, that they can span a single page or as little as a single panel. In addition, the differences between these alternate realities are minor enough to where the individuals swapping into the other realities don't even know it happened.

So considering the examples I gave above, is it impossible to think that for one panel, Minato was swapped with a Minato from a reality where he has no flames on his jacket? Is it impossible that a version of Minato that never lost his arm while fighting Obito swapped realities with our Minato for a short duration while they were counter-attacking Obito?

In Madara's wrong eye case, isn't it possible that in an alternate reality Obito was crushed on his left side rather than his right? In the same reality perhaps Kakashi was wounded on his right eye. In such a reality, Kakashi would have been given Obito's right eye and all the eye placements would be revered. In such a reality, Madara would have stolen and implanted Kakashi's right eye rather than his left. Who's to say that version of Madara did not swap into the last chapter for 1 panel then swapped back again after?

Again, all these swaps would happen seamlessly and would be subtle enough that not even the victims of the transfer would realize it happened.

What would all this mean?

At this point you might be asking, "Why would Kishi do this?" or "What would be the purpose of introducing such a complication?". Well it would be to establish another player in the Narutoverse. It would imply that there is perhaps someone of a higher power manipulating things to go the way they want it to. Now they might be directly causing these reality swaps, or perhaps their manipulation of reality is unintentionally causing these swaps. Either way, I believe someone else is causing them, and the answer might have come very recently in the manga:

You must be registered for see images

Madara absorbed the God Tree, but he did so because it told him to. This means the tree is conscious. We see implications that it might be Kaguya's that resides within the tree. Is she conscious in the tree? That we do not know but the possibility is there.

The Theory:

Perhaps Kaguya is manipulating current events. Perhaps she wants Madara to succeed. Is she on Madara's side? She could just be using him in order to make her takeover more easy. Perhaps she plans to use him later. Is Kaguya's influence causing realities to be swapped right before our eyes? Is she using some insanely immense power that alters reality and space-time in such a way?

The Conclusion:

1. Perhaps Kishi is introducing the idea of alternate realities into his manga. These alternate realities differ only slightly and changes as simple as the look of clothing or symbols may exist. In addition, the course of battles and their outcomes might have differed in these realities.

2. The mistakes we see in the war arc could be explained by individuals from separate realities swapping temporarily with their alternate reality counterpart. These swaps are noticeable because they live in a reality where they look different or experienced something different in their reality.

3. There could be a higher power manually controlling these changes, or they could be a result of this person taking sides and attempting to aid one side in winning this fight. Kaguya could be the culprit, and she's helping Madara to win his current battle.

If you are still here at this point, I want to thank you for taking the time to read. This thread was a long time coming and I really hope that people consider the possibility. I don't know what to expect from posting such a thread, but I hope it at least gets some people's mind's wandering. Again, thank you for reading and I want to hear everyone's thoughts on this!
 

SkyGodHorus

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First off, I want to give credit where credit is due. has had some great ideas on this topic and his ideas inspired some of my own. Thank you Gyakusetsu for being another person who likes to push the envelope! So with that, lets get to the theory!

Parallel dimensions/ alternate realities, the RL theory:

I first want to explain the RL theory which I will relate to the Naruto world after.

Note: I do not personally believe in this theory, but that doesn't mean its not possible. In addition, that does not mean that a manga writer like Kishi doesn't believe it and perhaps utilize it in his manga.

The theory is that every decision you make on a daily basis can, perhaps, create an alternate reality of our own that differs slightly. If you consider the hundreds of decisions you make on a daily basis, the number of alternate realities you may create is staggering. Compound this with the millions of other people all around the world, causing potentially just as many alternate realities as you. Compound this even further by taking a chunk of time, say 20 years, and imagine how one random person's decision from back then might affect your current reality.

Possible results if such a thing were true:

If you consider the possibility that decisions made by other people a long time ago can affect your current reality, then the limits on its influence are potentially unlimited. Lets take some simple examples.

Are you currently wearing a shirt with a brand and logo on it? If so, what if a decision make 20 years ago affected the logo of that brand? Lets say your shirt logo is a mountain top. What if in an alternate reality its a snow-capped mountain top? What if in another its a snow-capped mountain top with a man hiking up it? What if, in even another alternate reality, it shares the same logo but the brand name is different?

Continuing this line of thought, what if decisions make 20 years ago affected your current state of being? What if there's a version of you that was involved in a terrible car accident? There might be a version of you that's a paraplegic. There might be a version of you that's missing an arm. There might be a version of you that after loosing your arm, decided to invest in an artificial arm. The point is that the possibilities are endless.

Relating this theory to Naruto:

What I am suggesting is that perhaps Kishi is using this idea in his manga. Do you recall all those dozens of mistakes being made in the last chapters? Do you recall the hundreds of mistakes that Kishi has made during the war arc? If you haven't, then I suggest you get out from under your rock.

What I'm suggesting that these mistakes that Kishi is making perhaps aren't mistakes, but intentional. Potentially, these mistakes can be explained with the alternate reality theory. I'm gonna pick three very obvious mistakes and concentrate on them, but please realize that there are literally hundreds of others out there.

We all know about Minato's missing flames on his coat:

You must be registered for see images

What if, in an alternate reality, decisions lead to Minato's coat design not having flames on it? Don't shy away now, I'm just getting into the nitty-gritty.

We all also know about Minato's missing arm suddenly appearing then disappearing again a page later:

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

Who's to say there's not a reality where Minato didn't loose his arm in the fight with Obito?

Most recently, we saw Madara's sharingan in the wrong socket and swapped back to being correct in just one panel:

You must be registered for see images

Who's to say there's not a reality where Madara had his Rinnegan in his left socket rather than his right?

How Kishi might be implementing this idea into his manga:
Now you might be asking, "How does the alternate reality theory potentially relate to these mistakes?". The answer is quite simple. Perhaps, for very short periods of time, individuals from alternate realities are swapping for very short amounts of time. The durations are so short, that they can span a single page or as little as a single panel. In addition, the differences between these alternate realities are minor enough to where the individuals swapping into the other realities don't even know it happened.

So considering the examples I gave above, is it impossible to think that for one panel, Minato was swapped with a Minato from a reality where he has no flames on his jacket? Is it impossible that a version of Minato that never lost his arm while fighting Obito swapped realities with our Minato for a short duration while they were counter-attacking Obito?

In Madara's wrong eye case, isn't it possible that in an alternate reality Obito was crushed on his left side rather than his right? In the same reality perhaps Kakashi was wounded on his right eye. In such a reality, Kakashi would have been given Obito's right eye and all the eye placements would be revered. In such a reality, Madara would have stolen and implanted Kakashi's right eye rather than his left. Who's to say that version of Madara did not swap into the last chapter for 1 panel then swapped back again after?

Again, all these swaps would happen seamlessly and would be subtle enough that not even the victims of the transfer would realize it happened.

What would all this mean?

At this point you might be asking, "Why would Kishi do this?" or "What would be the purpose of introducing such a complication?". Well it would be to establish another player in the Narutoverse. It would imply that there is perhaps someone of a higher power manipulating things to go the way they want it to. Now they might be directly causing these reality swaps, or perhaps their manipulation of reality is unintentionally causing these swaps. Either way, I believe someone else is causing them, and the answer might have come very recently in the manga:

You must be registered for see images

Madara absorbed the God Tree, but he did so because it told him to. This means the tree is conscious. We see implications that it might be Kaguya's that resides within the tree. Is she conscious in the tree? That we do not know but the possibility is there.

The Theory:

Perhaps Kaguya is manipulating current events. Perhaps she wants Madara to succeed. Is she on Madara's side? She could just be using him in order to make her takeover more easy. Perhaps she plans to use him later. Is Kaguya's influence causing realities to be swapped right before our eyes? Is she using some insanely immense power that alters reality and space-time in such a way?

The Conclusion:

1. Perhaps Kishi is introducing the idea of alternate realities into his manga. These alternate realities differ only slightly and changes as simple as the look of clothing or symbols may exist. In addition, the course of battles and their outcomes might have differed in these realities.

2. The mistakes we see in the war arc could be explained by individuals from separate realities swapping temporarily with their alternate reality counterpart. These swaps are noticeable because they live in a reality where they look different or experienced something different in their reality.

3. There could be a higher power manually controlling these changes, or they could be a result of this person taking sides and attempting to aid one side in winning this fight. Kaguya could be the culprit, and she's helping Madara to win his current battle.

If you are still here at this point, I want to thank you for taking the time to read. This thread was a long time coming and I really hope that people consider the possibility. I don't know what to expect from posting such a thread, but I hope it at least gets some people's mind's wandering. Again, thank you for reading and I want to hear everyone's thoughts on this!
The Road to the Ninja movie is an alternate timeline of the Narutoverse.
 

dark legion

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wow .. the best thread I ever read .

this is so scary !!!!

can it be related with Kakashi'new eye :U said that in the other reality Obito lost his other eye , which means Kakashi(of the other reality) had sharingan on the other side ... and Naruto took the normal eye from that reality and placed in the eye he lost recently ???

+rep for this .. from now on you have my respect
 

Floydical

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The Road to the Ninja movie is an alternate timeline of the Narutoverse.
Exactly! Even more evidence that the theory may be a reality!

wow .. the best thread I ever read .

this is so scary !!!!

can it be related with Kakashi'new eye :U said that in the other reality Obito lost his other eye , which means Kakashi(of the other reality) had sharingan on the other side ... and Naruto took the normal eye from that reality and placed in the eye he lost recently ???

+rep for this .. from now on you have my respect
I'm glad you liked it! But yes, considering the possibility of alternate realities, literally anything that could happen...... has happened.
 

Floydical

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I agree. I would also like to ask, where would you point the start of these alternate's?
The start of the war arc, specifically when Kabuto brought Deidara into battle.

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I had this one sitting around, look how often his eyes switch back and forth. Perhaps in one reality Deidara didn't die (reason he has normal eyes sometimes) and was working with Kabuto? This swapping between the present reality of him being an edo.
 

Urda

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The start of the war arc, specifically when Kabuto brought Deidara into battle.

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I had this one sitting around, look how often his eyes switch back and forth. Perhaps in one reality Deidara didn't die (reason he has normal eyes sometimes) and was working with Kabuto? This swapping between the present reality of him being an edo.
You thinking way into this.
 

Glazebone

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That theory would be very interesting. However given the fact that Kishi clearly stated the Manga WILL end in 2014, and considering it's already May, we may have some 10-12 chapters more. I doubt he has the time, nor the energy, to implement this. And even if he did, it would be way too difficult to explain and it would take way too much time.

I like the idea but I just think Madara will have to be defeated and that would be the end.
 

Floydical

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That theory would be very interesting. However given the fact that Kishi clearly stated the Manga WILL end in 2014, and considering it's already May, we may have some 10-12 chapters more. I doubt he has the time, nor the energy, to implement this. And even if he did, it would be way too difficult to explain and it would take way too much time.

I like the idea but I just think Madara will have to be defeated and that would be the end.
I don't think so. It could be misinformation that its ending in 2014 and even if it was, that would mean we should have more like 20-25 chapters before the year is over.

Bottom line, there is still a lot of manga left an I doubt it will end in 2014. The mountain of evidence regarding intentional mistakes being made by Kishi grows every chapter and he must have a plan for it.
 

Jako98146

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I chalk it up to casual drawing mistakes, but this theory is so far out. It kind of reminds me of Injustice: God's Among Us slightly, but digressing from that, that's an interesting thought that Kaguya is manipulating things, and alternate realities are being introduced due to Kaguya's influence.

But taking it one step further, couldn't it be interpreted that Kaguya is trying to meld these alternate realities into one, which would explain the "The time to become one has come" comment.

It's an interesting thought, and it seems like a possibility if you open your mind to it
 

Floydical

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I chalk it up to casual drawing mistakes, but this theory is so far out. It kind of reminds me of Injustice: God's Among Us slightly, but digressing from that, that's an interesting thought that Kaguya is manipulating things, and alternate realities are being introduced due to Kaguya's influence.

But taking it one step further, couldn't it be interpreted that Kaguya is trying to meld these alternate realities into one, which would explain the "The time to become one has come" comment.

It's an interesting thought, and it seems like a possibility if you open your mind to it
Definitely a possibility, but if she is trying to correct the anomalies, than what was the original cause of them? Perhaps she has decided the time has come to combine them, but it still makes sense to me that her influence was the original cause.
 

Gyakusetsu

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Awesome work. Just a few more thoughts on the subject. While I agree that attempts at correction seems the most appropriate answer, I differ that the correction takes place within a single timeline. It is more likely in my opinion that they indicate multiple timelines that are stuck looping. Some of the variances have little value other than serving as a markers of each cyle.

From a storyline perspective, as each cycle occurs the main antagonist must adjust to the variables and try to fix things to arrive at the desired conclusion. This is where I believe Zetsu's recording ability comes into play. The true antagonist needs to see what took place before and make the necessary adjustments. If the true antagonist were changing things on the fly to manipulate a desired outcome their prophetic powers would be near omniscient as they would have to know what was needed prior to said event. If that were to occur variances could be accounted for before they took place.

Finally, the writer can use the loop as the main item which the protagonist must overcome. Everyone is stuck in a trap "doomed" already and needs the savior to free them from the loop.
 

Floydical

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Awesome work. Just a few more thoughts on the subject. While I agree that attempts at correction seems the most appropriate answer, I differ that the correction takes place within a single timeline. It is more likely in my opinion that they indicate multiple timelines that are stuck looping. Some of the variances have little value other than serving as a markers of each cyle.

From a storyline perspective, as each cycle occurs the main antagonist must adjust to the variables and try to fix things to arrive at the desired conclusion. This is where I believe Zetsu's recording ability comes into play. The true antagonist needs to see what took place before and make the necessary adjustments. If the true antagonist were changing things on the fly to manipulate a desired outcome their prophetic powers would be near omniscient as they would have to know what was needed prior to said event. If that were to occur variances could be accounted for before they took place.

Finally, the writer can use the loop as the main item which the protagonist must overcome. Everyone is stuck in a trap "doomed" already and needs the savior to free them from the loop.
Hmm okay. So do you agree the antagonist is likely Kaguya? What do you believe will be the trigger for the protagonist (I assume Naruto) to become aware of it and attempt to fix it? Do you believe Zetsu is in contact with said antagonist or are they simply able to unknowingly tap into Zetsu's recordings remotely?
 

Gyakusetsu

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Hmm okay. So do you agree the antagonist is likely Kaguya? What do you believe will be the trigger for the protagonist (I assume Naruto) to become aware of it and attempt to fix it? Do you believe Zetsu is in contact with said antagonist or are they simply able to unknowingly tap into Zetsu's recordings remotely?
Kaguya is probably just another link in the chain of puppets used by the main antagonist. It's important for the main antagonist to have some kind of deeper relationship to the main protagonist or else readers don't, feel as strongly about the situation and it helps build empathy for the main protagonist. Zetsu definetly is the chief tool of the main antagonist but is likely unaware of who he indirectly works for.

We now know that Sasuke = Mind, Naruto = Body but look at what is missing? In Ninjutsu there is something called Sanmitsu. It represents Mind, Body and Word (The Word corresponds to mantras spoken, but in this context you could interchange Word with spirit.). All three must be in harmony with one another. For example, were you ever successful with something if your heart wasn't in it, or were you ever mentally and spiritually ready to take something on but your body wasn't ready? That's a very basic representation of why you need all three to work in harmony (incidentally the snake>toad>slug>snake could share a common theme here with mind>body>spirit>mind). In Buddhism, this equates to the three Kaya (Trikaya) or the three Vajras. So we've got mind and we've got body but where is the thing which joins idea and action together to help form reality?
 
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