Should Shinobi's give up their family for the village?

[Inmate]

Their was no easy way. In my opinion, even if they did save the Uchiha, there would still be distrust.

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This looks to me like Danzo had two objectives:

(a) Acquire Sharingan through the massacre

(b) Like hitting two birds with one stone, eliminate the threat of a new Madara rising to potentially force his plans to halt


This was obviously what he personally wanted, and he was also shrewd to "conceal" it by covering it up with favorable circumstances eliminating Uchiha clansman that would emerge as a result:

(a) Uchiha no longer being a threat to the village

(b) Think of a few for yourself

A white lie to me if you ask me because Tobirama surely contemplated as much, but he knew well they were more an asset than a liability to the village. Hence why he accepted the task of investigating their nature in relation the awakening of the Sharingan, and thus far had achieved results as he had deciphered their reason for acting vehemently in most situations

As per preached, they are realists, and their vanity and Sharingan enhances their realism and tendency of separating themselves as superior; believing to be the descendants of a shinobi-god and further believing they're always in the right consequently

Without further ado, I'll be modest as not to say that the village were right in their actions, or wrong.

Indeed, desperate situations call for desperate measures:

Hiruzen was well aware of what was going, but Danzo was always more hands-on and acting than Hiruzen. He would have waited for Itachi to make the final decisions (I can't provide scans) but he didn't really give much choice to Itachi or Danzo

Itachi was:

(a) Cornered to act for the village and Danzo's personal agendas

(b) Made to believe massacring a whole clan and sparing one would provide a better beginning to an end

My conclusion is:

I'm with Tobirama's convictions. The Uchiha shouldn't have been eliminated. They were only defending themselves and their legacy. Tell me which family wouldn't go to some extremes to protect their name from vanishing off the earth?

Would you conform and allow your family to fade into extinction just because a rumor was spread, or would you attempt ensuring its continuation?

 

[Darth AniCetuS]

Their was no easy way. In my opinion, even if they did save the Uchiha, there would still be distrust.

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Maybe so but Hiruzen wanted some more time for negotiations that tells me that they could've waited a bit longer but in the end they didn't and went on with the massacre. Besides the point is they let the situation deteriorate in the first place after Tobirama came into power. The uchihas were discriminated for almost two generations and during that time nobody tried to improve the situation.

 

[whiteboy2345]

The real question isn't entirely about whether Itachi's decision was right, but whether shinobi should have these completely random and baseless loyalties to their villages.

 

[The Work]

Itachi was right.

As he is always

 

[adeshina365]

Who wouldn't be pissed off and want revenge for the people they love? If people really expected Sasuke to go back and act like everythng is okay after learning all the shady crap that the village did to his family since Tobirama's rise to power, they're dumb.

But what make me laugh is how people could rationalize it and say they wouldn't want revenge. So if someone kills their family to save a nation that is full of corruption and is known for starting wars (Sounds like the USA) and is also known for discriminating, oppressing, dehumanizing, and treating their family like dogs (Sounds the same as what happened to Native Americans and Black people), they wouldn't be angry.

Ha! :lol

Seconded.

 

[whiteboy2345]

Itachi was right.

As he is always

He wasn't right and corrected Sasuke for saying that he was perfect.

 

[Amenotejikara]

Yes. MS sasuke likely reflects what would've happened had itachi spared any uchiha's from the massacre. Itachi knew he fuccked up by sparing sasuke, which is why he made himself the villain to spare the village but still keep sasuke alive.

edit: after reading comments, change half of my statement. he did entrust sasuke to do the right thing. and would've been successful had orochimaru and obito not influenced sasuke. (explains why itachi went extra measures to kill them)

 

[Amenotejikara]

If I was a neutral third party that had to decide who gets to live, I'd obviously choose the village. More innocent people, simple as that.

If I was a part of the family, I'd never sacrifice them or myself for a bunch of nobodies that I couldn't care less about. What Itachi did was "heroic" only when you take into account this strange and quite honestly stupid obsession every character in this manga has with their village, especially since Konoha hasn't done anything for the clan to warrant this kind of devotion.

lmfao exactly. sasuke tried to figure out what made konoha and shinobi so special but instead got some gay ass love story between hashirama and madara.

 

[Hakke]

I don't think that the village should've put on above the family , but Itachi case was different , his family was about to start a massacre in the village , so he had to chose between the life of dozens or the life of thousands , besides , even if he wasn't the one to kill his family , Danzo would've been the one to do the Job anyway , but Itachi wanted to spare his little brother Sasuke , so Itachi didn't just do it for the village , he did it to spare his little brother (his family) .

could you Imagine the pain that Itachi had to go through , can you imagine what it feels like to be forced to kill your own family , believe he didn't enjoy it .

this will give a better view on the situation
[video=youtube;j2Tgu-9q61U]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2Tgu-9q61U[/video]

 

[whiteboy2345]

If anything, throughout the series Itachi wants to play God at all times, determining who or what lives or dies.

He even told Sasuke that he didn't kill him because he didn't know about the clans inner-workings, probably meaning that Sasuke would have died had he known.

But I'm still asking the question. Should shinobi's put the village before their family? Itachi isn't the only subject on the table here you know.

 

[unknownvillain1254]

I completely understand you on that one. He should've wen after all the elders and Konoha's council for what happened. He already got Danzo.

I can also agree with that I wish him and neji by left Village to handle old scores

 

[unknownvillain1254]

Oh, but they were; Itachi could've chose any route he wished, he was given a choice, a choice isn't self-action. Everything Itachi had done pertained to his own volition.

Failing is subjective, but yes as anyone can; thus, is human nature. Itachi did trust Sasuke, but trust must not be mistaken for blind acceptance, or security -- Kotoamatsukami simply acted as a fail-safe.

No, Itachi saved the village -- Think, what if the Uchiha attacked the village? The village undoubtedly would've sustained many casualties from the uprising. This would lead to several other possibilities the most prominent being:

-Hostile takeover; i.e. another rivaling village taking advantage of Konoha's weak state, doing what the Uchiha planned to do (if the Uchiha didn't succeed in their coup d'etat).

Just because the Uchiha were part of the village doesn't make them any less of a problem, they were planning to disrupt the natural order of Konoha, things had to be done in order to cease the issue, as what happens in any political situation; actions are taken.

The Uchiha were the villages strength? Clearly. But that could be said about every other shinobi in the village too. In a literal scenario they all were the villages strength, every clan, and non-clan.

Each village had their own tailed beast, the Uchiha weren't tasked with such actions in present era. If that were the case:

A. The Uchiha would've never been oppressed.
B. The council would've never devised the clan's elimination as they'd be too important.

The Uchiha were equal in the current villages system, hence why they were susceptible to extermination.

actually I would have more respect for the uchiha if they would have went about the coup d'etat the right way if they would have had got half of the Hyuga(branch) to break off with the clan. And persuade one of the other four noble Clans to help and they would have successfully accomplish the goal

 

[unknownvillain1254]

The idea of the majority coming before the minority is usually used in the case of power hungry politicians putting themselves before their own people. The point of a republic like the USA is meant to protect minorities from the tyranny and apathy of the majority, which won't always work. The Uchiha could have been saved, but Konoha was a spoiled village if anything, having survived three consecutive wars and an attack from the Nine-Tails. Danzo didn't believe in anything but his own interests, and coerced Itachi into putting the "majority" before the minority.

Konoha as a majority has in fact become tyrannical and careless as to what their village does, regardless of whether it's good or evil, but will be the first to object to "evil" if it suits them. The very same evil they defend created evil people like Madara and Obito, and yet they tried to stop those two men. It's quite hypocritical.


And to Pretentious, everything that happened was a set of circumstances created by the weakness of the Hokage and the corruption of Danzo. I'm sure Danzo was thinking of putting the majority before the minority when he revealed Uzushio's secrets to other villages in order for the clan to be exterminated so Konoha could recover while in the war. Sooner or later, this majority before minority thing has to be sorted out and dissected completely before just throwing it out as a statement. The majority can be guilty.

naw that's where you f***** up

 

[unknownvillain1254]

Which is my point, Danzo planned on wiping out the entire group to begin with. That is what I mean about the majority becoming drunk and careless with power.

What gave Konoha the right to discriminate against an entire clan of people and kill them at the slightest hint of resistance? I'm very disturbed by the seemingly random allegiance and loyalty that these shinobi have for their villages despite the latter having done nothing for them. Sasuke loving Konoha out of nowhere was my biggest pet-peeve, along with Itachi loving it out of nowhere as well.

I liked Sasuke much more as a character because he cherished the bonds that mattered like family and people that were close to him, and refused to stay loyal to a bunch of people that only cared about him because of his lineage.

I feel like you are missing part of the problem there were two issues one madara attack the village and danzo