Sasuke vs Neji in chunin exam

BLAZE · Apr 24, 2017

Hakke said:
The 1st Gate increases muscle power from its 20% restricted level to close to 100% , which means he can run much faster , punch much faster and is all around more agile than his Base self in all forms of physical attribute that requires extensive or minimal effort , which includes having more power in the legs to move them faster when running

Oh you love making shits up huh

or being able to quickly combo kick Gaara in mid-air after the initial kick , before the sand shield could even come close while also considering Gaara was weighed down by the heavy armor.

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What part of 100% strength you didn't understand
also the multiple kicks were to gain height for a stronger lotus along with keeping his sand away from him.

increase in speed no.Gaara's sand weren't keeping once lee has thrown away the weight

Kakashi said performing that level of high speed Taijutsu puts a huge strain on the body. Keywords is that level of speed meaning a higher level of speed is attained w/Lotus

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then learn to read what has been posted.One of the reason that lee is able to perform lotus is his own speed.No higher level of speed is not attained by lotus.lee's fighting style high speed taijutsu

Clearly showing that it increases combat speed and Gai also confirms it by saying the Lotus will let him strike his foe at high speed , so clearly without the Lotus he isn't striking his foe at the same speed as w/Lotus and the speed has to be substantial else the risk would outway the technique.

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Epic facepalm.this is lotus or what gai was talking about [

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databook said:
-Then, he falls at high speed. He won't even give the slightest of pauses to the enemy...

That clearly shows that w/lotus Lee charges the foe at a greater speed than normal which is why its opened in the first place. The initial high speed attack is described as laser sharp.

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which is his own base speed the reason sasuke can copy that.if the speed and initial kick was result of tearing of muscles sasuke's sharingan won't be able to mimic it

Then it was praised by Kimimaro used by a slower Lee

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Kimi praising lee's who was the fastest genin in manga's speed.what does it prove.
lee is fast oh everyone knows that

unknownvillain1254 · Apr 24, 2017

BLAZE said:
Oh saying sakura beats neji is sakura fapping and this coming from a tard who claimed hiashi beats madara and neji beats kakuzu along with hinata beating deva with prep time.Irony
Oh me telling someone that his point that he made was wrong when it was an asinine point as your posts is wrong but you blaberring inbetween every debate with shitposts that are blatant ignorance of manga isn't

Oh yeah becoz footspeed was exactly the thing that neji was struggling again kyuubi enhanced naruto

But then again the same guy who claimed 5 y.o tsunade's strength >sakura's is trying prove something is laughable when can't accept his ass is biased whenever sakura is brought by trying to downplay here.
And calling others fapboy when I NVR claimed sakura beats deva while this troll has claimed hinata beats him lmao

Hiashi dose beat madara base

BLAZE · Apr 24, 2017

if you think enhancing of speed occurs becoz of strength being increased via effect on muscles you would also believe tsunade or sakura are speedsters since they enhace strenth via ces on muscles.the reason messing their muscles leave them without superstrength [

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as kg explained on other thread

unknownvillain1254 said:
Hiashi dose beat madara base

yeah tell me more.expecting common sense from you guys would be dishonesty

KidGamer65 · Apr 24, 2017

Lmfao did my post get deleted? Smh.

Hakke said:
because it's purpose would be to enhance Neji's reaction not to block the attack

Chidori would need to make it way through a layer of Chakra. and once Sasuke attack the emitted Chakra. Neji would sense the attack which would give him a better Chance for reaction

Wrong. Chidori would rip through it with no resistance, thus there is no "enhancement" of reaction. Stop making stuff up and start using your brain.

stop reaching. Lee would obviously try a top speed charge. the reason he needed Ura renge. and how the **** would Neji defeat Lee if he didn't manage to dodge or counter ?!

Prelims Neji would have to react to the initial hit well enough to Dodge it since being forced to Block would leave a interval for Lee to pull off high speed combos w/Lotus active like he did to the much heavier Gaara not to mention the obvious increase in physical power which could be a problem for Neji's guard while Lee can continue to perform a series of attacks on him in that instance while boosted by the Lotus since unlike Kimimaro Prelims Neji cant absorb the impact of Lee's kick

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So a successful Block would still send him flying or greatly stagger him while Lee boosted by the Lotus would begin a combo with enhanced speed

Lmao shut up. The only person who needs to stop reaching is you. When you block you take more of the impact than you would if you hadn't blocked. Did Gaara block? No. Thus he was left open to successive strikes. Temari blocked Lee's kick during their fight and did she go flying? No. The only time Neji would be left open to successive attacks is if Lee's first attack can break through his guard. But he can't so that + whatever Lee attempts next is blocked then Neji retaliates. It's really that simple. That or Neji meets his strike with Gentle Fist just how Naruto met Chidori with his Rasengan. 1 Touch is enough to deal moderate damage AT LEAST to Lee's hand or foot when he tries to kick him. Stop trying to make it seem like Neji has to be able to outright dodge a top speed strike to win this fight. Pure idiocy.

hand speed is what to tie to that ability more than the movement speed. because Kakashi only moved his hand fast to grab Sasuke and Naruto and throw them

does Neji lack the skills ? No. does Neji lack the hand speed ? Hell No. does Neji lack the reaction ? No. he was able to react to a much faster opponent

Irrelevant. Neji's hand speed that you and some others love to wank is nothing but his striking speed. Period. This has jack shit to do with striking speed. This is movement and reaction speed. Movement and reaction speed that Kakashi is >>> Neji in so please stop comparing the two.

BLAZE · Apr 24, 2017

KidGamer65 said:
Irrelevant. Neji's hand speed that you and some others love to wank is nothing but his striking speed. Period.

preach man dunno why people like to believe since 64 palms users strikes opponents multiple times within seconds someone with pretty good reaction and speed won't be able to counter him/her.
The only one against who 64 palms were succesfully used are part 1 base naruto;part 1 hinata and a juubi minion none of them had shown any kind of reaction or speed.

Its not somekind of jutsu that grants you superspeed.The user uses his own striking speed and then needs to keep up with so he can block the chakra points of opponents precisely.

Hakke · Apr 24, 2017

KidGamer65 said:
Lmfao did my post get deleted? Smh.

eh.. not my fault. I was going to ask you to post again and I am glad that you did

Wrong. Chidori would rip through it with no resistance, thus there is no "enhancement" of reaction. Stop making stuff up and start using your brain.

the reason that Neji managed to react to Kido's super sonic arrow -that is faster and has much piercive force than Chodori [

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],[

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]- was because that he simply released Chakra to slow it down and to deflect it's path [

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]. he can do the same but on a smaller scale to enhance his reaction to Chidori

Lmao shut up. The only person who needs to stop reaching is you. When you block you take more of the impact than you would if you hadn't blocked. Did Gaara block? No. Thus he was left open to successive strikes. Temari blocked Lee's kick during their fight and did she go flying? No. The only time Neji would be left open to successive attacks is if Lee's first attack can break through his guard. But he can't so that + whatever Lee attempts next is blocked then Neji retaliates. It's really that simple. That or Neji meets his strike with Gentle Fist just how Naruto met Chidori with his Rasengan. 1 Touch is enough to deal moderate damage AT LEAST to Lee's hand or foot when he tries to kick him. Stop trying to make it seem like Neji has to be able to outright dodge a top speed strike to win this fight. Pure idiocy.

Lmao.. I get your point, but Temari blocked Lee with weights kick. Lee's w/o weights attacks are far lethal.

this is Lee's w/ weights attacks

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this is Lee's w/o weights attacks

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LOL it even made it way through Gaara's sand shield

can't see how Neji (a gentle fist user who doesn't depend on physical strength in his fighting style) would be able to block that, let alone blocking Lee w/ 1st gates enhanced attacks

and he wouldn't be able to block it even with the gentle fist since once Lee's top speed charge make contact, it would send him flying. you won't argue that he can also meet the Raikage's top speed attacks with the gentle fist would you ?

like I said the only logical reason to Neji's superiority that he managed to dodge or at least counter Lee's top speed strikes

Irrelevant. Neji's hand speed that you and some others love to wank is nothing but his striking speed. Period. This has jack shit to do with striking speed. This is movement and reaction speed. Movement and reaction speed that Kakashi is >>> Neji in so please stop comparing the two.

the point is the hand movements speed. and Neji can move his hand fast. and in that feat Kakashi has only moved his hand fast enough to grab Sasuke's arm and throw him. and he was also skilled enough to do it. and I wasn't comparing Lmao. I only used as an example of what Neji can do in a scenario where he wouldn't be able to dodge

KidGamer65 · Apr 24, 2017

Hakke said:
eh.. not my fault. I was going to ask you to post again and I am glad that you did

I know it's not your fault. Was just wondering.

the reason that Neji managed to react to Kido's super sonic arrow -that is faster and has much piercive force than Chodori [
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],[
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]- was because that he simply released Chakra to slow it down and to deflect it's path [
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]. he can do the same but on a smaller scale to enhance his reaction to Chidori

That's with FAR more chakra than what he's been shown to manipulate during the Chunnin Exams so it doesn't matter here. Kido's arrow being stronger than Chidori doesn't make your point valid.

Lmao.. I get your point, but Temari blocked Lee with weights kick. Lee's w/o weights attacks are far lethal.

this is Lee's w/ weights attacks

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this is Lee's w/o weights attacks

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LOL it even made it way through Gaara's sand shield

can't see how Neji (a gentle fist user who doesn't depend on physical strength in his fighting style) would be able to block that, let alone blocking Lee w/ 1st gates enhanced attacks

and he wouldn't be able to block it even with the gentle fist since once Lee's top speed charge make contact, it would send him flying. you won't argue that he can also meet the Raikage's top speed attacks with the gentle fist would you ?

like I said the only logical reason to Neji's superiority that he managed to dodge or at least counter Lee's top speed strikes

No, you don't get the point. that's why you are making irrelevant comparisons. The point is blocking an attack doesn't leave you open unless it can smash through your guard, and Lee's kicks couldn't do that to Temari. Lee's kicks do NOT have the power to smash through Temari or Neji's guard. The reason why his punches were partially making it through Gaara's sand shield is because he increased his speed, thus the regular amount of sand couldn't bundle up in time. lmao. That is literally what Gaara vs. Lee was all about. We've already seen that his physical strength alone can't do anything to Gaara's Sand nor does increasing his running speed by taking off weights increase the speed he strikes at. (Using his fists)

Lmao what? Neji's fighting style not being brute strength doesn't mean that he can't block attacks that are just brute strength? Wtf? Stop making these excuses man. They aren't getting you anywhere.

-It sending him flying is nonsense.
-It breaking his guard is nonsense. Thus he will NOT be left open for subsequent strikes.
-Your Ay comparison is nonsense, because Ay has physical strikes that can bust through a Ribcage Susanoo. If he made contact with Neji's palm he'd rip Neji in half. Lee doesn't have that kind of physical power, thus if he meets his palm w/ Lee's hand Lee takes damage and Neji at the very most feels some pain on his palm.

the point is the hand movements speed. and Neji can move his hand fast. and in that feat Kakashi has only moved his hand fast enough to grab Sasuke's arm and throw him. and he was also skilled enough to do it. and I wasn't comparing Lmao. I only used as an example of what Neji can do in a scenario where he wouldn't be able to dodge

Yet you can't prove any of this. It's all talk with no evidence behind it on top of the lackluster responses that don't even address 100% of my posts. Kakashi was able to do that because Kakashi was fast enough. Neji is not Kakashi nor have you shown that Neji is fast enough to do this.

Neji's only noteworthy hand speed is the speed of his 64 palms, which is striking speed. Not regular movement which is what he needs to counter in this method. Irrelevant point to make. Skill? Another irrelevant point to make. Instead of repeating the same thing over and over again why don't you just use Neji's actual feats and not off panel make believe stuff to support your point?

KidGamer65 · Apr 24, 2017

BLAZE said:
preach man dunno why people like to believe since 64 palms users strikes opponents multiple times within seconds someone with pretty good reaction and speed won't be able to counter him/her.
The only one against who 64 palms were succesfully used are part 1 base naruto;part 1 hinata and a juubi minion none of them had shown any kind of reaction or speed.

Its not somekind of jutsu that grants you superspeed.The user uses his own striking speed and then needs to keep up with so he can block the chakra points of opponents precisely.

lmao right. That and you don't need to even dodge each individual strike you can simply dodge the person as a whole.

Also jabbing and grabbing and other forms of hand movements are all separate movements entirely. Neji being able to jab doesn't put his regular hand movements on any kind of noteworthy level. Cause I've also seen "since he can jab fast w/ 64 palms he shits in CQC cauze he can move his hands fast in general".

Hakke · Apr 25, 2017

KidGamer65 said:
That's with FAR more chakra than what he's been shown to manipulate during the Chunnin Exams so it doesn't matter here. Kido's arrow being stronger than Chidori doesn't make your point valid.

it would still enhance his reaction to some degree

No, you don't get the point. that's why you are making irrelevant comparisons. The point is blocking an attack doesn't leave you open unless it can smash through your guard, and Lee's kicks couldn't do that to Temari. Lee's kicks do NOT have the power to smash through Temari or Neji's guard. The reason why his punches were partially making it through Gaara's sand shield is because he increased his speed, thus the regular amount of sand couldn't bundle up in time. lmao. That is literally what Gaara vs. Lee was all about. We've already seen that his physical strength alone can't do anything to Gaara's Sand nor does increasing his running speed by taking off weights increase the speed he strikes at. (Using his fists)

I did get your point. but what Temari blocked was not near the power of Lee's w/o weights attacks let alone Lee enhanced w/ 1st gate. and yes your point is somewhat valid, but even a thin layer of sand should be durable. you can see yourself the distortion on Gaara's sand meaning that his attacks were powerful enough to make it through it. and it is true that taking off his weights does not increase his hand speed, but increasing his speed would increase the momentum of his attacks and the more momentum his attacks gain the more forceful it would be. that is the main point since we are speaking about reacting to top speed attacks. and obviously, Lee's w/o weights top speed attacks would be stronger than w/ weights. and you also ignored Lee's w/ 1st gate enhanced attacks which Neji obviously need to dodge since he wouldn't be able to absorb the impact

Lmao what? Neji's fighting style not being brute strength doesn't mean that he can't block attacks that are just brute strength? Wtf? Stop making these excuses man. They aren't getting you anywhere.

not my point. my point is that he lacks the physical strength to block a top speed charge from Lee w/ 1st gate.

-It sending him flying is nonsense.
-It breaking his guard is nonsense. Thus he will NOT be left open for subsequent strikes.
-Your Ay comparison is nonsense, because Ay has physical strikes that can bust through a Ribcage Susanoo. If he made contact with Neji's palm he'd rip Neji in half. Lee doesn't have that kind of physical power, thus if he meets his palm w/ Lee's hand Lee takes damage and Neji at the very most feels some pain on his palm.

Neji blocking a top speed strike from Lee w/ 1st gate is nonsense

Yet you can't prove any of this. It's all talk with no evidence behind it on top of the lackluster responses that don't even address 100% of my posts. Kakashi was able to do that because Kakashi was fast enough. Neji is not Kakashi nor have you shown that Neji is fast enough to do this.

Neji's only noteworthy hand speed is the speed of his 64 palms, which is striking speed. Not regular movement which is what he needs to counter in this method. Irrelevant point to make. Skill? Another irrelevant point to make. Instead of repeating the same thing over and over again why don't you just use Neji's actual feats and not off panel make believe stuff to support your point?

if he can strike fast with his hands to the point that he was able to strike a needle tip sized points precisely 64 times in 64 different spots in a matter of seconds, so he should obviously be able to move his hands fast in general. not as fast when striking, but he would still be able to move it fast enough. and nope skills have a lot to do with this feat so it is not irrelevant

and @underline. weak argument. I mean really? just because something had happened off panel then that means that it doesn't count?

you said yourself that portrayal > feats. and Neji was portrayed as that powerful guy who Lee would not stand a chance against without Ura range and was called a monster by Kankuro [

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here are my points:

-Chidori is just a palm thrust that adds extra few inches of reach and the only thing it prevents is a direct block. and the user use his own striking speed to thrust

-Sasuke's speed = Lee's w/o weights speed which means that Neji can obviously react to it

-Lee and Gai clearly stated that Lee needed Ura renge to defeat Neji which means that any lower level of Taijutsu won't work on him and that includes initial lotus where Lee is using the first gate [

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].

-Neji's reaction for the initial hit must be a dodge or a counter since a direct block would send him flying because he lacks the strength to absorb the impact of the kick like Kimimaro [

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],[

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that's being said if Neji was able to dodge or counter a top speed charge from Lee w/ 1st gate then he should be able to do the same with Chidori.

simple.

unknownvillain1254 · Apr 25, 2017

BLAZE said:
if you think enhancing of speed occurs becoz of strength being increased via effect on muscles you would also believe tsunade or sakura are speedsters since they enhace strenth via ces on muscles.the reason messing their muscles leave them without superstrength [
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]
as kg explained on other thread

yeah tell me more.expecting common sense from you guys would be dishonesty

Let's be honest you wouldn't know the truth even if it slapped you in the face man

Hiashi beat base madara

UnknownJin · Apr 25, 2017

unknownvillain1254 said:
Let's be honest you wouldn't know the truth even if it slapped you in the face man

Hiashi beat base madara

that logic...

KidGamer65 · Apr 25, 2017

Hakke said:
it would still enhance his reaction to some degree

No, it wouldn't. :lol If it can't provide resistance it can't increase his reaction. That simple. Stop arguing it can when you literally have zero evidence.

I did get your point. but what Temari blocked was not near the power of Lee's w/o weights attacks let alone Lee enhanced w/ 1st gate. and yes your point is somewhat valid, but even a thin layer of sand should be durable. you can see yourself the distortion on Gaara's sand meaning that his attacks were powerful enough to make it through it. and it is true that taking off his weights does not increase his hand speed, but increasing his speed would increase the momentum of his attacks and the more momentum his attacks gain the more forceful it would be. that is the main point since we are speaking about reacting to top speed attacks. and obviously, Lee's w/o weights top speed attacks would be stronger than w/ weights. and you also ignored Lee's w/ 1st gate enhanced attacks which Neji obviously need to dodge since he wouldn't be able to absorb the impact

Doesn't matter. The temari example shows that blocking and bracing yourself results in you moving less when you get hit by some kind of force. The thin layer of sand being durable is something you can't show. Stop making nonsense up. Increasing speed does increase power, but does that prove your point? No. Your point is that Neji can't make contact with Lee's attacks or can't block Lee's attacks even though breaking through a thin layer of sand is not evidence for that point. What is shown is that Lee's physical power can't bust through Gaara's Sand, thus he had to outspeed it. End of story.

And no, I didn't ignore anything. Your entire argument has been addressed. Lee being able to land combos on Gaara who failed to block has jack shit to do with Lee doing the same against a Neji who can block and match his hits.

not my point. my point is that he lacks the physical strength to block a top speed charge from Lee w/ 1st gate.

Your point is literally based on nothing.

Neji blocking a top speed strike from Lee w/ 1st gate is nonsense

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Nonsense but you can't provide any rational evidence for this being the case. Spare me the BS.

if he can strike fast with his hands to the point that he was able to strike a needle tip sized points precisely 64 times in 64 different spots in a matter of seconds, so he should obviously be able to move his hands fast in general. not as fast when striking, but he would still be able to move it fast enough. and nope skills have a lot to do with this feat so it is not irrelevant

Two completely different movements. This won't change no matter how many petty excuses you make. Stop attributing one to the other. Being able to jab fast has nothing to do with general movement speed. "Not as fast when striking" being all you can say means that you can't properly quantify how fast he can move his hands. Stop giving Neji the feats of Shinobi far beyond his level.

and @underline. weak argument. I mean really? just because something had happened off panel then that means that it doesn't count?

Don't be stupid. Where did I say off panel feats=no feats? I said stop taking off panel occurrences and using them as evidence when you don't know shit about how any fights between Neji and Lee went down. Stop saying "Neji can beat Lee, thus he can do this and this and this and this". Nothing but nonsense pulled from your ass.

you said yourself that portrayal > feats. and Neji was portrayed as that powerful guy who Lee would not stand a chance against without Ura range and was called a monster by Kankuro [
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Yes. Portrayal says Neji>Lee. THAT'S IT. End of story. Quit adding details not supported by canon.

here are my points:

-Chidori is just a palm thrust that adds extra few inches of reach and the only thing it prevents is a direct block. and the user use his own striking speed to thrust

-Sasuke's speed = Lee's w/o weights speed which means that Neji can obviously react to it

Correct.

-Lee and Gai clearly stated that Lee needed Ura renge to defeat Neji which means that any lower level of Taijutsu won't work on him and that includes initial lotus where Lee is using the first gate [
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].

Correct.

-Neji's reaction for the initial hit must be a dodge or a counter since a direct block would send him flying because he lacks the strength to absorb the impact of the kick like Kimimaro [
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],[
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]

that's being said if Neji was able to dodge or counter a top speed charge from Lee w/ 1st gate then he should be able to do the same with Chidori.

simple.

The rest of this is based on nothing. Neji being unable to guard against Lee's attack is based on nothing. Lee has zero physical strength or offensive feats that'd make any shinobi unable to block his attacks. You sound hilariously foolish claiming that he does. Lee does NOT have super strength. If he had strength on that level he'd be doing serious damage to people who take direct hits from him.

But he doesn't. So cut the BS.

BLAZE · Apr 26, 2017

unknownvillain1254 said:
Let's be honest you wouldn't know the truth even if it slapped you in the face man

Hiashi beat base madara

Let me tell you again expecting common sense from you would be dishonesty

Hakke · Apr 26, 2017

KidGamer65 said:
Doesn't matter. The temari example shows that blocking and bracing yourself results in you moving less when you get hit by some kind of force. The thin layer of sand being durable is something you can't show. Stop making nonsense up. Increasing speed does increase power, but does that prove your point? No. Your point is that Neji can't make contact with Lee's attacks or can't block Lee's attacks even though breaking through a thin layer of sand is not evidence for that point. What is shown is that Lee's physical power can't bust through Gaara's Sand, thus he had to outspeed it. End of story.

And no, I didn't ignore anything. Your entire argument has been addressed. Lee being able to land combos on Gaara who failed to block has jack shit to do with Lee doing the same against a Neji who can block and match his hits.

let us not forget that Gaara was much heavier than Neji due to his sand armor yet Lee's attacks were powerful enough to send him flying. and Lee only broke off his guard in the first kick but as you can see on the top left panel.

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Gaara was trying to block his combo but Lee's attacks were still powerful to send him flying and Gaara has an armor of sand covering him and he was much heavier.

Again Neji lacks the physical strength to block his enhanced with 1st gate attacks which are 5x stronger than base

Your point is literally based on nothing.

-Lee > Neji in physical strength.

-Lee w/ 1st Gate is 5x stronger than base meaning Lee >>>>>> Neji in physical strength

-Neji can not absorb the impact of the initial kick like Kimmimaro's bones because he lacks the physical strength to do so. once Lee's kick make contact it would break Neji's bones

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Nonsense but you can't provide any rational evidence for this being the case. Spare me the BS.

yeah sure Neji who is far outclassed in strength would absolutely be able to block Lee enhanced w/ 1st attacks which are 5x more powerful than base and sent a heavier enemy flying in the air

I thought that there was no need to state the obvious

Two completely different movements. This won't change no matter how many petty excuses you make. Stop attributing one to the other. Being able to jab fast has nothing to do with general movement speed. "Not as fast when striking" being all you can say means that you can't properly quantify how fast he can move his hands. Stop giving Neji the feats of Shinobi far beyond his level.

yes, they are two different movements but the main point is the movements speed of the hands and Neji has it. if he can strike so fast with his hands then that means that he should be able to move his hands fast in general. Sure it would not be as fast as when striking but it would still be fast. much faster than Sasuke

And I didn't give him Kakashi's feat. But I just used it as an example of what Neji can do in a scenario where he wouldn't be able to dodge.

And he had all that it takes to do it

Skills ? check.
reaction ? check.
hand movements speed? check.

Don't be stupid. Where did I say off panel feats=no feats? I said stop taking off panel occurrences and using them as evidence when you don't know shit about how any fights between Neji and Lee went down. Stop saying "Neji can beat Lee, thus he can do this and this and this and this". Nothing but nonsense pulled from your ass.

Yes. Portrayal says Neji>Lee. THAT'S IT. End of story. Quit adding details not supported by canon.

why not look into details and see why Neji was superior

-what was stated is that Neji is superior to Lee and Lee clearly stated that he needed extreme lotus to defeat him meaning that any lower form of Taijutsu won't work and that includes initial lotus.

-Neji's reaction for the initial lotus must be a dodge since he lacks the physical strength to block a top speed kick from Lee w/ 1st gate because it is 5x stronger than his base and it sent a far heavier opponent who was armored flying so it would do the same to him

that means that Neji has the reaction speed and the reflex to dodge something that is faster than Sasuke's strike with Chidori

The rest of this is based on nothing. Neji being unable to guard against Lee's attack is based on nothing. Lee has zero physical strength or offensive feats that'd make any shinobi unable to block his attacks. You sound hilariously foolish claiming that he does. Lee does NOT have super strength. If he had strength on that level he'd be doing serious damage to people who take direct hits from him.

But he doesn't. So cut the BS.

the first gate increases his strength and muscle power making it 5x times stronger and Lee's initial kick have sent an armored and a far heavier opponent flying in the air. and Gaara was trying to block his attacks in mid-air. yet with each kick, he was still sent a distance upward

how can Neji defend against that with a direct block?

and @bold can you imagine kid Hinata or kid Konahamaru blocking the initial kick from Lee w/ 1st gate? yeah me neither

KidGamer65 · Apr 26, 2017

Hakke said:
let us not forget that Gaara was much heavier than Neji due to his sand armor yet Lee's attacks were powerful enough to send him flying. and Lee only broke off his guard in the first kick but as you can see on the top left panel.

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Not as relevant as you are trying to make it seem. Not even close, especially since we are talking about blocking. Not weight.

Gaara was trying to block his combo but Lee's attacks were still powerful to send him flying and Gaara has an armor of sand covering him and he was much heavier.

Can you stop ignoring the panel? Gaara tried to block and FAILED, leaving him open to successive strikes.

Again Neji lacks the physical strength to block his enhanced with 1st gate attacks which are 5x stronger than base

Based on nothing.

-Lee > Neji in physical strength.

-Lee w/ 1st Gate is 5x stronger than base meaning Lee >>>>>> Neji in physical strength

-Neji can not absorb the impact of the initial kick like Kimmimaro's bones because he lacks the physical strength to do so. once Lee's kick make contact it would break Neji's bones

-True.

-Bold is based on nothing.

-Based on nothing. Lee being stronger than Neji doesn't translate to Neji being able to block a hit. Lmao it breaking Neji's bones is also horseshit that you made up.

yes, they are two different movements but the main point is the movements speed of the hands and Neji has it. if he can strike so fast with his hands then that means that he should be able to move his hands fast in general. Sure it would not be as fast as when striking but it would still be fast. much faster than Sasuke

"he has it" isn't an argument. End of story. You keep saying he has this, and he has this yet you can't prove any of it. :lol Not interested in your opinions. Only interested in arguments, and you don't have any.

why not look into details and see why Neji was superior

-what was stated is that Neji is superior to Lee and Lee clearly stated that he needed extreme lotus to defeat him meaning that any lower form of Taijutsu won't work and that includes initial lotus.

-Neji's reaction for the initial lotus must be a dodge since he lacks the physical strength to block a top speed kick from Lee w/ 1st gate because it is 5x stronger than his base and it sent a far heavier opponent who was armored flying so it would do the same to him

that means that Neji has the reaction speed and the reflex to dodge something that is faster than Sasuke's strike with Chidori

Let someone who isn't a biased fanboy look into the details. Nothing in this Manga supports the claim that if Lee kicks Neji and Neji blocks he will be left with broken bones. Nothing at all. Thus you do not have a point.

-The first gate releases 80% of the brain's power. That doesn't mean that this same multiplier translates to physical strength.

-Lee's strength feats w/ the first gate consist of landing a direct kick right to Gaara's chin and not doing any noticeable damage with the first strike.

Where are these feats that give Neji broken bones if he blocks Lee's kick? Oh wait, they don't exist. You are desperately trying to make it seem like Lee would break his bones with a direct hit because you've run out of petty excuses to make. Knocking someone heavier than Neji into the air doesn't support the point that Neji can't block or match Lee's attacks while in the first gate without getting broken bones. Lmao.

So we went from CE Naruto being much faster than Rock Lee, to Rock Lee's physical hits being enough to break Neji's guard despite him literally NEVER EVER IN THIS MANGA showing strength feats on that level.

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Lmao. If VoTE Sasuke can use a one armed guard against KN0 Naruto's full power strike and not have a broken arm afterwards then there's no way that Rock ****ing Lee in the 1st Gate is going to break Neji's guard with his kick. Or are you going to claim that 1st Gate Lee is far superior to KN0 in physical strength next? Smh.

BLAZE · Apr 26, 2017

so if during primary lotus from lee gaara was able to leave his sand armor and escape it when he is inferior to neji in both reaction and speed[according to db] why would it be a threat to neji

Hakke · Apr 26, 2017

BLAZE said:
so if during primary lotus from lee gaara was able to leave his sand armor and escape it when he is inferior to neji in both reaction and speed[according to db] why would it be a threat to neji

because Neji would need to dodge it or counter it because a direct block would sent him flying in the air along with some external damage being caused on his arms. but it breaking his bones was just exaggerating I admit.

BLAZE · Apr 26, 2017

Hakke said:
because Neji would need to dodge it or counter it because a direct block would sent him flying in the air along with some external damage being caused on his arms. but it breaking his bones was just exaggerating I admit.

if gaara survived multiple kicks from same lee using his sand armour despite it getting ripped off repeteadly in the fight and was able to pull a escape why would neji be affected if he use chakra expulsion from his body

Hakke · Apr 26, 2017

BLAZE said:
if gaara survived multiple kicks from same lee using his sand armour despite it getting ripped off repeteadly in the fight and was able to pull a escape why would neji be affected if he use chakra expulsion from his body

we were talikng about prelims Neji who didn't master Kaiten or the Chakra expulsion yet. but it was still stated that he was superior to Lee and that the only way for Lee to defeat him was by extreme Lotus meaning that any lower level of Taijutsu won't work on him and that includes initial lotus. Meaning that Neji had the reflex to react to Lee's top speed attacks. and Neji's reaction for the initial kick must be a dodge or a counter since a direct block would send him flying in the air along with causing external damage on his arms.

that's being said if he can react to a top speed attack from Lee enhanced w/ 1st gate then he should be able to react to Chidori which the user uses his own striking speed to thrust which = Sasuke's which = base Lee w/o the weights =which Neji can obviously react to

anyway my debate with KidGamer is not over yet

BLAZE · Apr 26, 2017

Hakke said:
we were talikng about prelims Neji who didn't master Kaiten or the Chakra expulsion yet.

That does not mean he lacks it completely

but it was still stated that he was superior to Lee and that the only way for Lee to defeat him was by extreme Lotus meaning that any lower level of Taijutsu won't work on him and that includes initial lotus. Meaning that Neji had the reflex to react to Lee's top speed attacks. and Neji's reaction for the initial kick must be a dodge or a counter since a direct block would send him flying in the air along with causing external damage on his arms.

[

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] gaara was unable to fend off lee's attacks once he removed weight.he was totally outmached
[

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][

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][

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][

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] he ripped through gaara's defence but even chouji was able to follow him barely but still follow him.Would chouji react to him in fight.hell no
[

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] gaara was unscratched from it
[

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] gaara was defensive whole fight after lee removed weights
[

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] yes sand was increasing his weight the reason lee used multiple kicks to gain height.Does this remotely mean neji will get his bones broken.nope
[

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][

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] gaara still escapes it within small amount of time gap he got

Neji is physically faster has shown superior reaction somehow getting overwhelmed by it.how

and lee in first gate ain't breaking someone's bone when sasuke was fine after taking his kick[

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] and so was dosu[

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]

lotus's destructive powers comes from pile driving opponent nowhere does it say open first gate and using 100% strength allows you cause massive damage to them.sasuke took his kick directly on face came out unharmed.so what does it do to neji who will have chakra armour protecting him.uhh nothing

that's being said if he can react to a top speed attack from Lee enhanced w/ 1st gate then he should be able to react to Chidori which the user uses his own striking speed to thrust which = Sasuke's which = base Lee w/o the weights =which Neji can obviously react to

sasuke equals lee
lets say hypothetically lee using 1st gates somehow does everything what he did to gaara till primary lotus.then what.neji escapes at last moment and lee gets shatted on later on
so yeah its pretty obvious lee needs secondary lotus

sasuke on other hand has chidori and sharingan if he is hypothetically against same neji he proceeds to stab him with chidori ending the fight.he does not need secondary lotus since he has a jutsu to put neji down lee does

anyway my debate with KidGamer is not over yet

whatever

Sasuke vs Neji in chunin exam

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