Oh come on, Mizuki was literally only in the one episode (well, until that other filler later), lol he barely counts
His relevance or lack thereof does not change his status as a villain also i just remembered the kyubi flashbacks so mizuki would be the second villain at this point in the story however he would be the first major villain as he's presented as a antagonist to the main character unlike the nine-tails demon who at this point is just a flashback character
Zabuza was the first serious, relatively powerful villain for all of the main cast (Sasuke, Sakura, & Kakashi).
Mizuki was powerful in relation to naruto and iruka which is what matters as those are the people that he would be fighting and being powerful is relative to who your fighting like if i fight mike tyson im a weakling but if im compared to something like a domestic house cat then i would be the more superior combatant.
You need your villains to be more powerful or strong enough to harm your heroes or else there's no tension in your story.
the fact that he wasn't the first antagonist is irrelevant.
You claimed that he was first villain which is plain incorrect and you should know this if you actually watched the show prior to the land of waves arc
Sasuke killed all those Zabuza water clones on the bridge too. But my point was more about how common it is for people to say Zabuza was really weak relative to the later series
Do you have a gif of sasuke doing that plus what is to say that water clones are the same strength or relative to the original when shadow clones are forbidden due to that,taking up alot of chakra and forbiliy injecting memories experienced by these clones into you.
Zabuza is really weak compared to later characters in the series like gamabunta,kisame and even haku like kisame even treats zabuza as nothing more then a kid and the demon of mist sees haku as stronger then himself but this is to be expected as characters in shonen grew stronger so the need for stronger opponents also arises like at hunterxhunter where you go from characters like majitani to hanzo in that same arc
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Like Zabuza legitimately used some caltrops against Kakashi as a legitimate strategy - not knocking their use, but compared to idk, giant chakra-mech spirits, it's a pretty lame technique.
I liked that it was more realistic and feasible in early part 1 as everyone felt like human beings as they could be harmed by normal weapons and had character to them like pein cant be even seen as a real person due to how comedically bad that he's wrote like he views himself as some god in the jiraya fight but in the naruto fight he tells naruto about were mortal men looking for revenge in justice contradicting his previous view on himself however it gets worse as pein suddenly becomes a different character with different motives once naruto talks him like that type of interaction just never happens in early part 1 like even zabuza caring for haku was hinted at before his talk with naruto like he trained this little girl and took her in which never would of occurred had he been some heartless monster.
Also yea realistic ninja with some powers are nothing compared to people who can tank nukes and be launched across large forest like even kidomaru did some insane feat like that as did jirobo with throwing a giant choji around
We've been over this argument so I don't want to get into it too much.
There's no debate to be had in regard to this subject matter as it's literally stated and shown that sakura can keep up and react to sasori, This is not a opinion as it's a literal fact said in the story itself by both chiyo and sasori
Sakura being able to do something because of how hard she can punch =/= other characters with weaker punches being able to do it just because they rank higher on the power scale.
So do you think the kyubi naruto who slapped her out with just one tail cant do the same or do you think sasuke who casually bodied all of team 7 twice cant do the same like even kakashi's raikiri has done more considering it pierced though kakuzu and killed him mind you this is the same guy who can tank full on attacks from bjuu mode yugito and it's also stated that he barely survived fighting hashirama so yes everyone higher then sakura could kill sasori in one way or another
Well first of all this is from some anime filler so it's character accuracy is even less likely to be consistent than manga canon.
It being from the anime matters not as it's detailing the country destruction mentioned beforehand and there's no manga canon as it's never been stated that there is one like this is not star wars where their exists a canon and legends universe, It's naruto where every material is generally treated the same like filler characters appear in the manga all the time like juzo and matsuri.
Canon as it stands in naruto, Is just fans excluding what they dislike from discussion while keeping what they like and their standards for what is deemed as acceptable discourse is utter nonsense like if the muh creator standard mattered so much then you same people would not count boruto as it's wrote by kodachi and not kishimoto.
I do not care about canon or what the community thinks as it's not representative of any fact or any rational argumentation like the only defending argument people have is consensus and shaming tactics as if using literal fallacies makes your spitefilled argument any better
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And second: That guy isn't a 'random samurai'. [HERE is what happened to actual 'random samurai'.] They got murked.
They got murked yes but even then so these guys are all still below genin naruto including tatewaki himself
All I said was they are "high chunin/jonin level" which is obvious enough just from his main fight,
They never damaged or even tagged sakura or chiyo, They are only good for rat packing people which means next to nothing in naruto as if a character is slightly stronger then another then they can solo entire armies or platoons of those weaker like take edo madara vs the shinobi alliance or guruguru obito vs kirigakure anbu.
Zabuza or even part 1 neji could take down these puppets if they were not rat packing him as these puppets are created to be easily controlled so that many can be used at once like you dont design swarm tactics around being strong, You understand that right as if the individual might of person was so great then there be no need for swarm tactics as they would just beat the person on their lonesome like madara did to the shinobi alliance as a example.
Numbers are used to compensate for physical weaknesses as shown in the animal kingdom many times over with things like ants,humans and wolfs like in a straight fight with any physically imposing animal in relation to them, they die everytime like a take one bear vs one wolf or one wolf vs one cougar
Add in all the puppet advantages: more durable, don't feel pain, they can fly, they have hidden weapons, they all have Sasori's poison
Puppets cant fly unless you think holding something up by marionette strings is the same as bird or plane if so then guess irl puppeteers have the ability to grant real life objects the ability of flight.
Without strings, puppets are just inanimate objects no different to real life in that sense and their not that durable as basic sword swings can take them out like mind you katana's of feudal japan are made of low quality steel so it's not even like good blade cuts down these puppets also dont say history does not apply to naruto when everything is based on japanese history and myths like sasuke and hanzo are named after famous japanese ninjas of the past as a example.
He appears in episode 309 of Naruto Shippuden, reanimated during the War Arc and then Naruto recognizes him. As an Edo he was easily fighting off an entire squad of other 'random' ninja.
Rando ninja are below average as even hayate bodied some of them mind you this guy died to baki remember the jonin squad leader of gaara's team and if hayate of all people can body some rando shinobi then do you think beating these characters is even noteworthy when their hype material for literally anyone including some white zetsu clones and haku.
so what we have here is a guy who makes your average ninja look like fodder,
Average ninja are fodder though as any named characters has beat them when they fought like even asuma took out ten sound jonin causally as did shikaku and choza during the same konoha crush arc.
Also, it was very nice of you to post a heavily edited gif that takes out all the moments of Sasori's puppets keeping up with him but you can watch the full fight
He bodies the puppets in every instance shown like sasori was shocked that he did that well and it's gif so it cant be the entire fight as gif files can only go up to a minute at best so it's going to be edited regardless of who is making said gif plus it could be worse as ive used to think that sasori was below part 1 naruto as he lost to him in a infinite tsukuyomi dream but to my credit, I didt know it was a infinite tsukuyomi dream.
like aside from one puppet parrying a attack once and one puppet attacking the feudal lord's gf from behind, He really does not face much challenge from these puppets including hiruko whom he cut the tail off of like he even blocked most of senbon needles however one touch is enough to kill a person due to the potency of his position so he died
win a 1v100 fight against Zabuza because I do not believe that Zabuza can take out 100 Chunin+ level fighters
I do agree here as just sasuke and naruto was enough to make him move let alone 100 plus puppets who are stronger then those two combined
