Sakura is a bad role model

[deadp00l]

of course, sakura is a shit tier character and her lust for sasuke who treats her as annoying dirt easily attracts teenage girls in the same situation as her

 

[Tennis Robot]

I wasn't talking about platonic love though

Well it all started in part 1 .
without part 1 the story doesn't make sense .

Huh. You have a pretty interesting take on love Kind of..brash, even.

 

[Natsu Shazneel]

I wasn't talking about platonic love though

Well it all started in part 1 .
without part 1 the story doesn't make sense .

Is your love life like Sakura's?

 

[salsalover64]

Well as Itachi told Sasuke, "....people live their lives bound by what they accept as correct and true. That's how they define "reality." But what does it mean to be "correct" or "true?" Merely vague concepts...their "reality" may be a mirage. Can we consider them to simply be living in their own world, shaped by their beliefs?" Sasuke:" what are you getting at? Itachi: "Like the way you simply decided that Madara must be dead. Like the way you believed I was a kind, caring brother."

Itachi words relate to you and to me as neither one of us know outside what we actually know. I didn't base my post on my perspective, I also used what I've heard from friends, both guys and girls. Why i said majority is because that's what I've most see or hear about, this is where Itachi's words comes in. No one can't base it off of only their own perspective, others can see or understand things you don't and you can gain information of a large group by such limited scopes. This is why I used what I've heard from others as well to see just how well my own results vary.

Correct and in doing so you're using anecdotal evidence wich invalidates your point because there's no way for us to determine whether the events you're referring to are fabricated or if they actually occured

Businesses uses surveys to get a better understanding of what type of customers they should focus on. They can base it off of ***, gender, race, and age group depending on what type of business and/or merchandised they might sell. This is basically how you can gain an ideal of what the majority of the type of customers would want by using small groups of the type you choose to do the test for; you do it to different groups to see if the results are the same. Is that not similar to hearing or witnessing about girls going for bad boys from both guys and girls and a good amount of both types? For both Guys and girls, they can be talking about girls they were trying to get to know/date, girls they're friends with or what they were told by good friends of theirs. So from my "reality" as Itachi put it, it's basibg my use of "mostly" from what I've seen or heard about.

They use surveys to create statistics to determine averages and outliers you're blindly wielding anecdotal evidence without considering whether you're talking about outliers or averages.

So you're saying a 6-7 year old Sasuke up to a 12-13 year old Sasuke does not fit under bad boy but does under sociopath? Idk what manga you've been reading but he wasn't a sociopath until MS Sasuke at 16 where he was talking crazy talk. Part 1 Sasuke was the loner who thought others were annoying, losers, idiots and he did his own thing for the most part.

Yup, I am in fact saying he's a sociopath. Sociopaths can be created through experiencing traumatic events in their environment even the saage said indras reincarnations value power. In this context power over others. I whole heartedly believe sasuke only did what he did in part 1 because he felt as though kakashi could be trusted to help him in his goal of enhancing or improving his power so he could get revenge on his brother as stated in the third episode. The minute he confronted his brother thinking he was all that only to be smacked down is the minute he created a chasm between him and everyone else. Also..sociopaths are capable of mimicking emotions. Sasuke has demonstrated an extensive history of using people and tossing them aside and abandoning them like a prom night dumpster baby when it proves to be beneficial for him. He's almost sacrificed people in fights before and only kept them alive when it's been conducive to HIS agenda.

 

[Tennis Robot]

lol you remind me of myself. Not current myself; myself when I made this account. Or around that time.

 

[salsalover64]

lol you remind me of myself. Not current myself; myself when I made this account. Or around that time.

Who, me??????

 

[legarcon]

Don't blame the character If you interrupt the manga badly .Your shallow description of her character is nothing like what kishi portrayed her.

And for the love of god its not the character fault that someone take a fictional manga (about ninja who fight each other, mind you) character seriously .

The situations are different You cant compare it to real life

-obito killing his teacher and start a war because a girl.

- karin following and lusting over sasuke who doesn't want her to the point she plans to attack(rape) him at his sleep and then run to him like a dog after he stabbed her .

But sakura is the bad role model .

Talking about shallow descriptions yet you just described one of deepest characters in such a shallow way, obito showed great character development and besides he had a harsh childhood,he was an orphan, rin wasnt only a crush, rin was his family and the first person who showed appreciation towards him, rin was the person for whom he almost died and also the reason why he gave kakashi his sharingan, thus he witnessed before his eyes her death by the hands of his best friend and you still wonder why he went nuts, besides after he realized of his mistakes he felt remorse for what he did and tried to make up for that, he saved the lives of the mains more than once and by saving them he saved the world.

Sakura as of now is still a sasuke fangirl, the same she was 700 chapters ago and i kinda agree nobody should take the characters of a ninja story as row models.

 

[Little My]

Sakura is

Brave

Kind hearted

Looking always for the best in people

Smart

Cares and loves her team mates to extent she would go to great lengths to rescue and help them

Selfless

Hardworking

Beautiful

Yep she's a bad role model, with no redeeming qualities!

 

[Sjhsgjhsgjshjshjsh]

Talking about shallow descriptions yet you just described one of deepest characters in such a shallow way, obito showed great character development and besides he had a harsh childhood,he was an orphan, rin wasnt only a crush, rin was his family and the first person who showed appreciation towards him, rin was the person for whom he almost died and also the reason why he gave kakashi his sharingan, thus he witnessed before his eyes her death by the hands of his best friend and you still wonder why he went nuts, besides after he realized of his mistakes he felt remorse for what he did and tried to make up for that, he saved the lives of the mains more than once and by saving them he saved the world.

Sakura as of now is still a sasuke fangirl, the same she was 700 chapters ago and i kinda agree nobody should take the characters of a ninja story as row models.

I did describe it in a shallow way intentionally just like people describe sakura.
it doesn't mean i meant it .

"Fangirl" you really look deep into characters.

One of the stupidest arguments is "sakura is a fangirl" You can say that only to early part 1 sakura .

-If she was a sasuke fangirl she wouldn't risk her life to shield him
-She wouldn't Keep loving him for more than 8 years
-She would stop liking him after he became a criminal and lost his cool she would go fangirl for other cooler guys and forget sasuke( go for the hero just like in her fake confession)

-She wouldn't care about sasuke well being and mentality as long as he is handsome .
-she wouldn't keep loving and caring for him even after he tried to kill her.

Sakura doesn't even think about ending up with him anymore she just wants to save him and wants to see him happy even if it costs her life .This fangirl who had no special abilities spend years training becoming strong as the hokage for the reason to save the guy she has "child crush" for .

If thats a fangirl then obito is nothing but a fanboy .

 

[xxSAGExx]

Correct and in doing so you're using anecdotal evidence wich invalidates your point because there's no way for us to determine whether the events you're referring to are fabricated or if they actually occured



They use surveys to create statistics to determine averages and outliers you're blindly wielding anecdotal evidence without considering whether you're talking about outliers or averages.



Yup, I am in fact saying he's a sociopath. Sociopaths can be created through experiencing traumatic events in their environment even the saage said indras reincarnations value power. In this context power over others. I whole heartedly believe sasuke only did what he did in part 1 because he felt as though kakashi could be trusted to help him in his goal of enhancing or improving his power so he could get revenge on his brother as stated in the third episode. The minute he confronted his brother thinking he was all that only to be smacked down is the minute he created a chasm between him and everyone else. Also..sociopaths are capable of mimicking emotions. Sasuke has demonstrated an extensive history of using people and tossing them aside and abandoning them like a prom night dumpster baby when it proves to be beneficial for him. He's almost sacrificed people in fights before and only kept them alive when it's been conducive to HIS agenda.

Well there's no reason to lie about something like that, if you want to go talk to a bunch of people I did talk to you can go play an online game called NexusTK that I used to play and varies from 100-300 people around the world. Sasuke still had morals, something a sociopath wouldn't have right? Sasuke aim was only Itachi and Orochimaru even said Sasuke showed mercy to his foes (the many sound ninjas) to which Sasuke said he wouldn't show Itachi mercy. In part 1 he was actually starting to forget about his revenge (well not make it his focus) while he bonded with his friends. The sound 4 taunted Sasuke about it after Itachi mentally tortured him and awokened that hatred.

O.T. Well who would you say is a role model in Naruto?
-Naruto who focus on Sasuke who wants to kill him over true friends like Gaara or Shikamaru?
-Sasuke who became mentally unstable after finding out Itachi killed his clan to stop them from causing trouble then joining the other guy who helped killed his clan then wanting to rule the world in a Hitler fashion?
-Kakashi who couldn't stop Sasuke from leaving, couldn't save Obito or Rin, treated his friends like crap after losing Obito and Rin, and wasn't there for Naruto at all growing up when Minato was his teacher?
-Minato who sealed a demon beast in his son and choose to die to give his son this demon when his wife stated he could have used other seals?
-Hiruzen failed to deal with Danzo who created a lot of future trouble fr the world and village, said he failed to maintain what Tobirama left him, and failed to kill Orochimaru in the past when he was killing children, women, and men.
-Shikamru show to slack off for the majority of your life until being forced to grow up?
-Choji to eat all the time, be scared, let anger control you when called fat.
-Ino and Sakura love Sasuke after he showed no interest in them and turns evil and both still had feelings for him in the current arc.
-Hinata stalk the one you like, talk to them a total of 6 times while fainting or being too shy to talk to them but tells them you love them without them really knowing you or building any kind or romantic relationship.
-Neji believed you can't change your faint and almost killed his cousin due to hating her family being the main branch.
-Tsunade lost 2 loved ones, quits living and goes around getting drunk and gambling.
-Shizune betrays her teacher and oldest friend by reporting to the elders which got Danzo involved.
-Orochimaru experiment on children, women, and men in many experiments that may have been painful.
-Itachi doesn't tell Hiruzen Danzo took Shisui eye which made him kill himself, killed his parents, mind-rape his brother 3 times.

You can find bad traits in many characters. Are you going to say how dumb Ino is for still loving Sasuke? She was crying when K11 decided to kill Sasuke and when she sees him in the war she runs to him as if she's forgetting he was their enemy as Shikamaru had to remind her. Or Hinata for stalking a kid for most of her life then telling him she loves him which he never talks to her about and shows he likes another girl right in front of her yet she still loves him. Or Karin for going back to Sasuke and being far worst than Ino and Sakura when it comes to Sasuke.

 

[uzumakinaruto389]

I sometimes wonder, how it feels to give such a bad bait. And then I think, how it feels when everybody takes it.

 

[MAN OF SIN]

@bold

But didn't she? When she tried to go off and kill him? Hadn't she given up on Sasuke at that moment and believed he had fallen so low to the point of no return?

And didn't Kakashi make her feel ashamed of even contemplating the act, because she shouldn't carry that burden for herself? And didn't Naruto get mad at her as well. He was the one who stirred up hope in her again if I'm not mistaken.

In retrospect, Kishimoto treated her character pretty poorly.

Sakura later turned down a guy asking her out because she was still in love with Sasuke.

 

[salsalover64]

Well there's no reason to lie about something like that, if you want to go talk to a bunch of people I did talk to you can go play an online game called NexusTK that I used to play and varies from 100-300 people around the world. Sasuke still had morals, something a sociopath wouldn't have right? Sasuke aim was only Itachi and Orochimaru even said Sasuke showed mercy to his foes (the many sound ninjas) to which Sasuke said he wouldn't show Itachi mercy. In part 1 he was actually starting to forget about his revenge (well not make it his focus) while he bonded with his friends. The sound 4 taunted Sasuke about it after Itachi mentally tortured him and awokened that hatred.

You're completely missing the premise behind why anecdotal evidence is considered a logical fallacy and will not be tolerated or recognized in this debate. You're letting your emotional attachment to those experienced cloud your judgement as I stated before the real issue is because of the small sample, there is a larger chance that it may be unreliable due to cherry-picked or otherwise non-representative samples of typical cases. You don't seem to be able to understand that regardless of how many times I say it. I don't care how you feel about there's a reason anecdotal evidence is considered a logical fallacy and if you don't like it then don't even participate in debate.

A sociopath can be defined as a person who has Antisocial Personality Disorder. This disorder is characterized by a disregard for the feelings of others, a lack of remorse or shame, manipulative behavior, unchecked egocentricity, and the ability to lie in order to achieve one's goals. - Dictionary.com

Antisocial behavior is about the creation of a chasm between one person and everyone else, so much so that the primary emphasis becomes their perspective and ONLY their perspective. It's perfectly possible for sociopaths to have morals,..morals they expect others to adhere to and the morals they generally have for themselves are based on values which involve their own personal gratification no matter the cost it has on others. Sasuke has demonstrated before all throughout part one even that his main motive is doing what's beneficial for himself. As I said, sociopaths can mimic emotions. Sasuke choosing to kill or spare his foes in itself is irrelevant because there were other things he did that completely negate that and prove that he lacks any real empathy or understanding for his comrades and as I've stated before people generally become sociopaths based ont heir environment. He couldn't even acknowledge his own mistake in regards to what happened with itachi instead he blamed the villiage and aspired to destroy them instead of evaluating his own actions. His main goal is to exert power over other in any and everyway he can as is the case with most indra reincarnations. Sasuke wasn't just some "loners" even loners are capable of recognizing the role other people play in their lives.

O.T. Well who would you say is a role model in Naruto?
-Naruto who focus on Sasuke who wants to kill him over true friends like Gaara or Shikamaru?
-Sasuke who became mentally unstable after finding out Itachi killed his clan to stop them from causing trouble then joining the other guy who helped killed his clan then wanting to rule the world in a Hitler fashion?
-Kakashi who couldn't stop Sasuke from leaving, couldn't save Obito or Rin, treated his friends like crap after losing Obito and Rin, and wasn't there for Naruto at all growing up when Minato was his teacher?
-Minato who sealed a demon beast in his son and choose to die to give his son this demon when his wife stated he could have used other seals?
-Hiruzen failed to deal with Danzo who created a lot of future trouble fr the world and village, said he failed to maintain what Tobirama left him, and failed to kill Orochimaru in the past when he was killing children, women, and men.
-Shikamru show to slack off for the majority of your life until being forced to grow up?
-Choji to eat all the time, be scared, let anger control you when called fat.
-Ino and Sakura love Sasuke after he showed no interest in them and turns evil and both still had feelings for him in the current arc.
-Hinata stalk the one you like, talk to them a total of 6 times while fainting or being too shy to talk to them but tells them you love them without them really knowing you or building any kind or romantic relationship.
-Neji believed you can't change your faint and almost killed his cousin due to hating her family being the main branch.
-Tsunade lost 2 loved ones, quits living and goes around getting drunk and gambling.
-Shizune betrays her teacher and oldest friend by reporting to the elders which got Danzo involved.
-Orochimaru experiment on children, women, and men in many experiments that may have been painful.
-Itachi doesn't tell Hiruzen Danzo took Shisui eye which made him kill himself, killed his parents, mind-rape his brother 3 times.

You can find bad traits in many characters. Are you going to say how dumb Ino is for still loving Sasuke? She was crying when K11 decided to kill Sasuke and when she sees him in the war she runs to him as if she's forgetting he was their enemy as Shikamaru had to remind her. Or Hinata for stalking a kid for most of her life then telling him she loves him which he never talks to her about and shows he likes another girl right in front of her yet she still loves him. Or Karin for going back to Sasuke and being far worst than Ino and Sakura when it comes to Sasuke.

That's exactly why I said no one in this anime series should be considered a "role model". How about instead of looking for role models we evaluate our own behavior and try to improve by ourselves. I've always hated the idea of role models from the get go because it at that point you've created such a large chasm between you and another person in an effort to build them up that all of the positive aspects you find admirable about them seem to become unattainable and at that point they just become a figure head in your life. In addition, it's places such a heavy emphasis on the role another person plays in their own lives and a desire for that role that people don't really bother evaluating what their own role in their own lives are. You'd know that if you read my original post which clearly stated "I don't believe anyone male or female alike is a good role model in this anime". If you mean they have admirable aspects of their character then yes, I'd agree with you but I'd never look up to anyone in this series because for the most part a lot of the characters are well..unstable based on what transpired in their lives.

 

[Tennis Robot]

^That's pretty depressing

 

[salsalover64]

^That's pretty depressing

And what's so depressing about it?

 

[xxSAGExx]

You're completely missing the premise behind why anecdotal evidence is considered a logical fallacy and will not be tolerated or recognized in this debate. You're letting your emotional attachment to those experienced cloud your judgement as I stated before the real issue is because of the small sample, there is a larger chance that it may be unreliable due to cherry-picked or otherwise non-representative samples of typical cases. You don't seem to be able to understand that regardless of how many times I say it. I don't care how you feel about there's a reason anecdotal evidence is considered a logical fallacy and if you don't like it then don't even participate in debate.

A sociopath can be defined as a person who has Antisocial Personality Disorder. This disorder is characterized by a disregard for the feelings of others, a lack of remorse or shame, manipulative behavior, unchecked egocentricity, and the ability to lie in order to achieve one's goals. - Dictionary.com

Antisocial behavior is about the creation of a chasm between one person and everyone else, so much so that the primary emphasis becomes their perspective and ONLY their perspective. It's perfectly possible for sociopaths to have morals,..morals they expect others to adhere to and the morals they generally have for themselves are based on values which involve their own personal gratification no matter the cost it has on others. Sasuke has demonstrated before all throughout part one even that his main motive is doing what's beneficial for himself. As I said, sociopaths can mimic emotions. Sasuke choosing to kill or spare his foes in itself is irrelevant because there were other things he did that completely negate that and prove that he lacks any real empathy or understanding for his comrades and as I've stated before people generally become sociopaths based ont heir environment. He couldn't even acknowledge his own mistake in regards to what happened with itachi instead he blamed the villiage and aspired to destroy them instead of evaluating his own actions. His main goal is to exert power over other in any and everyway he can as is the case with most indra reincarnations. Sasuke wasn't just some "loners" even loners are capable of recognizing the role other people play in their lives.




That's exactly why I said no one in this anime series should be considered a "role model". How about instead of looking for role models we evaluate our own behavior and try to improve by ourselves. I've always hated the idea of role models from the get go because it at that point you've created such a large chasm between you and another person in an effort to build them up that all of the positive aspects you find admirable about them seem to become unattainable and at that point they just become a figure head in your life. In addition, it's places such a heavy emphasis on the role another person plays in their own lives and a desire for that role that people don't really bother evaluating what their own role in their own lives are. You'd know that if you read my original post which clearly stated "I don't believe anyone male or female alike is a good role model in this anime". If you mean they have admirable aspects of their character then yes, I'd agree with you but I'd never look up to anyone in this series because for the most part a lot of the characters are well..unstable based on what transpired in their lives.

But that's not Sasuke, your examples are of Shipudden Sasuje who I said was sociopath and he mostly showed it when he had MS. He also showed some craziness in part 1 but that was after meeting Itachi again and being reminded of his deep hatred for him. Sasuke does think of others, he thought of Sakura and Naruto. He actually risked his life for both of them at different points such as Haku for Naruto and was going to try to buy time for them against Gaara even though he was pretty much out of chakra.

The socio Sasuke had was when he told Kakashi what if he killed everyone he loved then how would he feel but Kakashi merely said they are all dead which Sasuke looked shocked and knew Kakashi knows the pain he does. Kakashi goes on to say they aren't worst off since they have conrades who care about them and Sasuke thought of Naruto and Sakura. After Kakashi left he was struggling between Naruto and Sakura against Itachi and what he wants to do. He built bonds with his team. I'm talking about chapter 177. I wouldn't call kid Sasuke a socio since he didn't fake any emotions, he actually had the bonded with others and didn't only think about himself after he got those bonds, he put the lives of his teammates ahead of his goals that requires him to live instead of risking his life.

I added the end for the thread creator who specified one person when he should just say no one from a manga who job is to kill each other on missions should be role models. I do think some characters have some wise words but that's about all and I like all the characters I used so not bashing them or anything, just was making a point.

 

[Team7monaa]

Why on earth would you take a fictional character as a role model.
Sakura is the best Female in the series when it comes to development.

 

[SuperChief]

Not necessarily. She's flawed, but she has her virtues. Sakura is forgiving and dedicated to her friends, and she's a hard worker that pushed herself to get where she was her own merits.

She's not the only flawed character. Just look at some of the other females. Tsunade drinks too much, Ino is a flirt and Hinata is far too reserved.

And the same can be said for the males as well. Regardless of their virtues, every character has their flaws. That doesn't mean we should judge them by it.

 

[salsalover64]

But that's not Sasuke, your examples are of Shipudden Sasuje who I said was sociopath and he mostly showed it when he had MS. He also showed some craziness in part 1 but that was after meeting Itachi again and being reminded of his deep hatred for him. Sasuke does think of others, he thought of Sakura and Naruto. He actually risked his life for both of them at different points such as Haku for Naruto and was going to try to buy time for them against Gaara even though he was pretty much out of chakra.

Yes he did all that and do you know why he did all that??? Because at that point in time they proved to be conducive to his primary goal which was killing his brother. He assumed they played a role in the enhancement of his strength. Really, I'd assert that the only reason he was every that nice is because at that point in time he knew he was at the top of his class and he kne whow easy it would be to exert power over both naruto and sakura. He had created a chasm between himself and them from the beginning he never felt like the could understand him as a person so all of the potential for him to develop into that type of person was already there, it's really just a deviation of who he always was in the beginning. The only difference is the curse mark made those grudges and all that hidden rage more prominent but it was always there.

The socio Sasuke had was when he told Kakashi what if he killed everyone he loved then how would he feel but Kakashi merely said they are all dead which Sasuke looked shocked and knew Kakashi knows the pain he does. Kakashi goes on to say they aren't worst off since they have conrades who care about them and Sasuke thought of Naruto and Sakura. After Kakashi left he was struggling between Naruto and Sakura against Itachi and what he wants to do. He built bonds with his team. I'm talking about chapter 177. I wouldn't call kid Sasuke a socio since he didn't fake any emotions, he actually had the bonded with others and didn't only think about himself after he got those bonds, he put the lives of his teammates ahead of his goals that requires him to live instead of risking his life.

Hey, sociopaths build bonds to and most of those bonds are established based on what other people can do/provide for them and how they can manipulate and use them. As I stated he's an indra reincarnation and always showed signs of being an indra reincarnation it would never really about how he could make a contribution to the team is was always about how the team contributed to his own personal endeavor for empowerment and them wanting to be there for him without realizing the real role they played in his life.

I don't know why you keep repeating yourself. You're not going to change my mind so if that's your intention you may as well just quit. This debate doesn't seem to be yielding any beneficial outcome at this point it seems as though you're only responding just to get the last word with no real deviation in your posts. I don't even know whether or actually listening to anything I've said in fact I don't believe you are.

 

[MAN OF SIN]

Why on earth would you take a fictional character as a role model.
Sakura is the best Female in the series when it comes to development.

Only in her skill set. She is still a Sasuke fangirl.