Rinnegan Sasuke vs SM Hashirama

[ARGUS]

And I never conceded. Hashirama will always spank Rinnegan Sasuke w/o Rikudo Chakra. The only way he wins is if we:

-Ignore Manga canon.
-Give his CT feats far beyond what it was shown.
-Give his Rinnegan Genjutsu abilities it showed when he was boosted with Hagoromo's chakra.
-Make his PS anywhere near as strong as Madara's.

Etc etc. Go wank elsewhere.

Madara's PS is still worthless to SS

 

[KeyofDestiny]

Madara's PS is still worthless to SS

I was referring to all of those things in combination.

 

[Unorthodox]

Madara's PS is still worthless to SS

agreed Sasuke's ps as an adult is atleast a tier or 2 above it

 

[ARGUS]

I was referring to all of those things in combination.

Even then he's not winning
Bcz CT gets busted. Genjutsu isn't happening and PS gets garbaged regardless of what level we put it at
Your first point of ignoring canon would work though

agreed Sasuke's ps as an adult is atleast a tier or 2 above it

With rikudo chakra ofc
Without It. lol no,

 

[KeyofDestiny]

Even then he's not winning
Bcz CT gets busted. Genjutsu isn't happening and PS gets garbaged regardless of what level we put it at
Your first point of ignoring canon would work though

:lol, I meant that if I gave his Genjutsu his feats from when he had Hagoromo's Chakra and acted like his CT was strong enough to confine SS like I've seen people do then it'd work. Not by actual feats alone.

 

[Unorthodox]

Even then he's not winning
Bcz CT gets busted. Genjutsu isn't happening and PS gets garbaged regardless of what level we put it at
Your first point of ignoring canon would work though


With rikudo chakra ofc
Without It. lol no,

You to huh your suppose to be a disciple we just got back together do try to phuck things up kifflom. to ease the pain Rinnegan Genjutsu 1 shots nb4 its a rikudo feat until you show me hagoromo's chakra changing the mechanics of how a tech work then do not reply unless you agree i show mercy to disciple not for kidlamer though.

:lol, I meant that if I gave his Genjutsu his feats from when he had Hagoromo's Chakra and acted like his CT was strong enough to confine SS like I've seen people do then it'd work. Not by actual feats alone.

Chibaku tensei would be enough to not only confine ss but crush it especially when ss body is what the CT is attracted to it gets smashed by those rocks and its not breaking through mega tons of rocks either

 

[Haizaki]

It's Taijutsu, my bad. But it uses chakra, and Kurama's chakra increases the strength of that chakra, thus it is not a pure physical attack so you literally still don't have a point here. Kaguya's attack follows the same exact principle and is stated to be the origin of the Hyuuga's air palm techniques, and Databook 4 says that she can use this technique because she loads chakra into her palm.

Or are you going to tell me next that Hinata's air palm came about because of her physical strength? :lol, please don't add on to the list of baseless claims you've made over the past 2 days.

So what? Why did you come to have beef with them to begin with? Oh wait, because of a debate. Lol. Don't tell me not to get heated when:

1. You get heated over irrelevant things.
2. I'm not heated. Not even close.

And don't attribute it to it being about a "fictional drawing" when you should know that it's not. I do not care for the hypocrisy. Not one bit.

No not that easy...I should be going mental and having a rant for someone stating something as daft as that. If we were all KG.

Baseless claim? Please show the DB where it states it was the origin of Vacuum palm. It states they are similar but that doesn't support the fact that Vacuum Palm which is a different technique uses Chakra to enhance its power...Let's do you, show me where it states so? Where does it state the technique uses chakra to enhance itself? None. It only has Gentle fist chakra contained in it because that's the principle of the Taijutsu. The Kyuubi's Chakra isn't Gentle fist chakra so its cannot enhance it because its cannot be put in it...However it enhanced the overall technique which was Taijutsu showing it can alter physical techniques.

Then you believe Rock Lee kicking Madara wasn't enhanced physically? What else? Smh.

I don't have beef with them but I said that because they disagreed with my Tier position so your point with River is moot...Lmao who cares if you don't care? Pretty sure no one does..You don't have to repeatedly tell us.

 

[Unorthodox]

Where is this tier list? How come people like apex is placing other he's a phuckin peon.

 

[KeyofDestiny]

No not that easy...I should be going mental and having a rant for someone stating something as daft as that. If we were all KG.

Again with the nonsense exaggerations here huh? There's no rant here. Just me stating facts. If you can't deal with it then take the hypocrisy and move along.

Baseless claim? Please show the DB where it states it was the origin of Vacuum palm. It states they are similar but that doesn't support the fact that Vacuum Palm which is a different technique uses Chakra to enhance its power...Let's do you, show me where it states so? Where does it state the technique uses chakra to enhance itself? None. It only has Gentle fist chakra contained in it because that's the principle of the Taijutsu. The Kyuubi's Chakra isn't Gentle fist chakra so its cannot enhance it because its cannot be put in it...However it enhanced the overall technique which was Taijutsu showing it can alter physical techniques.

Yes. Baseless claim. As baseless as that Night Guy fodder ripping through PS nonsense from the other day.

Eighty Gods Vacuum Attack (八十神空撃, Yasogami Kūgeki) is a Kekkei Mora taijutsu used by Kaguya, made possible by her mastery of chakra. She loads chakra into her palm, and then unleashes it as a barrage of countless fists. The fist attacks can also be used defensively, and when coupled with Kaguya's perfect dojutsu, it has the potential to become the strongest offensive ability. The Hyuga clan uses a similar vacuum palm attack, Eight Trigrams Vacuum Palm, but there is a wide gulf in power between the two.

DB says it's similar, so yes, I'll give you that point. But the only major difference noted is the wide gulf in power. Doesn't change anything though nor is what you are saying making any sense. What's worse is that you are even contradicting yourself and pretty much agreeing with my argument.

I cannot even begin to explain to anyone reading this right now, how little sense you make right here. I don't know who told you about this "special gentle fist chakra", but it doesn't exist. .

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Gentle fist is used by flowing the user's chakra into the opponent. Meaning despite being Taijutsu, Vacuum Palm contains chakra. If your tech is made of stronger chakra, it will be stronger. Kurama's chakra enhances the chakra of the person using the Gentle Fist, thus the chakra they put into their Vacuum Palm is stronger, hence it being enhanced that greatly by chakra. Has jack to do with physical strength lol) and anyone who reads the Manga should know that it has little to do with physical strength.

I mean, really now?

It only has Gentle fist chakra contained in it [/B]because that's the principle of the Taijutsu. The Kyuubi's Chakra isn't Gentle fist chakra so its cannot enhance it because its cannot be put in it

It's almost like you chose to make this stuff up instead of actually looking at what the Manga had to say.

Then you believe Rock Lee kicking Madara wasn't enhanced physically? What else? Smh.

And here we go again. Evani decides not to read before he replies. And then complains when he doesn't get respect, for blatantly ignoring what I've said multiple times no less. :lol Amazing. I said it's not as dramatic as a boost as you are making it out to be.

I don't have beef with them but I said that because they disagreed with my Tier position so your point with River is moot...Lmao who cares if you don't care? Pretty sure no one does..You don't have to repeatedly tell us.

Then please stop crying about me being "supposedly" heated when you get really heated over even smaller and more irrelevant things than this. It's really that simple.

Where is this tier list? How come people like apex is placing other he's a phuckin peon.

Lmaooo.

 

[LuckyMan]

Meanwhile, Meek Mill aired out Drake on Twitter.

Everyone knows Nike Air and Waltz lost in both threads (No shade or hard feelings to either of you bros and no dickriding, just keeping it 100) so no need to entertain this anymore.

This Drake x Meek Mill beef will be good if it turns out Meek is serious. Y'all should go read that instead of this shit.

 

[KeyofDestiny]

Meanwhile, Meek Mill aired out Drake on Twitter.

Everyone knows Nike Air and Waltz lost in both threads (No shade or hard feelings to either of you bros and no dickriding, just keeping it 100) so no need to entertain this anymore.

This Drake x Meek Mill beef will be good if it turns out Meek is serious. Y'all should go read that instead of this shit.

LMFAOOO! You saw that stuff too? Had me rolling. Read that about half an hour ago.

 

[LuckyMan]

LMFAOOO! You saw that stuff too? Had me rolling. Read that about half an hour ago.

Yeah that ish is crazy. I never seen anyone compare him to Drake though. Maybe Ace Hood or someone in that tier but Drake? He said himself its levels to this shit so he should know he's not on Drakes level.....

 

[KeyofDestiny]

Yeah that ish is crazy. I never seen anyone compare him to Drake though. Maybe Ace Hood or someone in that tier but Drake? He said himself its levels to this shit so he should know he's not on Drakes level.....

Lmao, exactly what was going through my head when I was reading his tweet. Died when he said that Drake doesn't write his own raps. :leaf:

And he deleted all his photos of Nicki. Wonder what happened there? Hmmm

 

[LuckyMan]

Lmao, exactly what was going through my head when I was reading his tweet. Died when he said that Drake doesn't write his own raps. :leaf:

And he deleted all his photos of Nicki. Wonder what happened there? Hmmm

Well if Drake doesn't write his raps, he needs to hire whoever Drake did because his shit is mediocre as fuck. Then that moment when you realize the hottest song on DWMTM is with Drake...... SmH.

Hmm I'm interested in why he deleted those pics too....

 

[KeyofDestiny]

Well if Drake doesn't write his raps, he needs to hire whoever Drake did because his shit is mediocre as fuck. Then that moment when you realize the hottest song on DWMTM is with Drake...... SmH.

Hmm I'm interested in why he deleted those pics too....

Lmao, ain't that the truth. Damn. :lol

Well, I'm just hoping this dude decides to keep this up. In fact, I'm hoping that Nicki or Drake respond or some shit like that. One of his tweets also claimed that Nicki doesn't write her own raps either, though he deleted that.

I lol'd when this dude said he always thought SB was gay. Lmao. This guy is too much.

 

[Kagustuchi]

That was more of in response of Sasuke being able to quickly intercept Juubito's attack whereas KCM Naruto couldn't even perform a simple reaction such as extending his Chakra Arms to evade it.

That displays superior reactions, not to mention Madara easily slapped SM Naruto away who has superior reflexes in comparison to KCM Naruto whereas Madara praised EMS Sasuke's reflexes. It's clear EMS Sasuke is more reflexive than KCM Naruto.

Minato made his comment before Sasuke ever reacted to Juubito. He made it when Sasuke told Naruto to watch the Edo Kage fight since they can't die, Minato then praised his itelligence. So that point it void.

SM Naruto definate doesn't have better reactions than KCM, get that out of your head. He stated he has better sensing, but that's it. Never did he mention his actual speed, especially when feats has KCM Naruto taking a dump on V2 Ays speed. Then moving so fast that Bee couldn't even see him.

 

[Rιver]

Minato made his comment before Sasuke ever reacted to Juubito. He made it when Sasuke told Naruto to watch the Edo Kage fight since they can't die, Minato then praised his itelligence. So that point it void.

SM Naruto definate doesn't have better reactions than KCM, get that out of your head. He stated he has better sensing, but that's it. Never did he mention his actual speed, especially when feats has KCM Naruto taking a dump on V2 Ays speed. Then moving so fast that Bee couldn't even see him.

Why wouldn't HM Naruto be mentally able to react to V2 E?

 

[Haizaki]

There is no "Kaguya's feat" that'd even begin to prove that in terms of reaction speed, RSM scales down to BSM in that category because BSM is the only one that'd include sensing. I really hope you aren't referring to when Kaguya pulled Sasuke into her portal, as that is a terrible comparison because:

1. That was a back attack. Sasuke only equals Naruto's reaction speed with Sharingan. How can he predict jack with Sharingan when he can't see the attack? Oh wait, he can't. And please don't reply saying that it proves his reaction speed is inferior.

2. Sasuke already matched BSM in sensing/tracking and reaction speed. So please tell me how you are getting BM=EMS Sasuke in reaction speed?

Yes there is...Sasuke already knew about the attack since he experienced it and saw the clear mechanics of the Jutsu. He even anticipated something like that shown with how he was surprised in the bottom panel after seeing her hand go in

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Yet he failed to dodge it...Naruto on the other hand was in the same exact category while the attack came from his blindspot. Sensing wasn't the key feat since that's not as easy when it just pops up from the portal...His reflexes are above that of EMS Sasuke implied by the Manga. Naruto is naturally faster

1 Oh please that feat is has no relevance here...Sasuke was enhanced. I already explained this to you..Kyuubi cloak enhanced him.

BM and EMS are equal, RSM and RG Sasuke scale down to them, yet BM Naruto obviously wouldn't react to EMS Sasuke as well as RSM Naruto did to RG Sasuke because while RG Sasuke only has his speed being boosted by the chakra, RSM Naruto gets his speed boosted by the chakra and he gets a Sage Mode, which gives him sensing abilities.

Irrelevant.

You said Naruto's V1 cloak, and that's the only V1 cloak feat he has. If you have anymore, go ahead and share them. Otherwise, stop arguing this point. Cause you haven't provided any evidence at all.

So Im explaining to you why that feat doesn't count because THAT WAS ONE TAILED worth of chakra.

You said I have no proof that the cloak enhances Naruto up to that extent and I said you have no proof that it doesn't. V1 power varies in terms of tails..1 tail is far weaker than the highest power V1 can give in terms of counting the tails. However, you dropped a scan of one tail enhancing Naruto's Jutsu and said " I should forget about it being that high" because of the comparison top CM Sasuke...Proof of the other tails? You obviously have none.

The main point is you have 0 proof that the highest power V1 can offer won't enhance Naruto's Jutsu the same way it did to the alliance...I'm not welcoming your one tailed example. You asked me "When was it shown that V1 could enhance his Jutsu to such a level" I've shown one tailed could power his Jutsu(Not like the alliance but could still power it up). However, you have 0 proof that the strongest form of V1(More tails=More power) could not power Naruto's Jutsu drastically to their level. This is my point which you cannot disprove.

Read that again. He was controlling the chakra to defend the shinobi. He never focused power into them remotely. He lost KCM because he used up too much of his own power trying to save them. N

Exactly and what's funny is how Naruto has better control of his chakra than he did at VOTE against Sasuke...So even if your example at VOTE was relevant, your comparison still fails since he had much better chakra control that when he was mindless in his one tailed state.

So now you are claiming that they get a KCM level speed boost? Lmfao. What is next? Baseless claims after baseless claims. Naruto's Ninjutsu does not get a boost anywhere close to what the Shinobi alliance got when they received his chakra, so there is no reason to believe that the shinobi alliance gets a speed boost anywhere near that of what Naruto gets when he uses KCM. All of the cloak's powers were highlighted in the chapters they were shown in.

Embarrassing...Please read first and understand.

I said what's important is the Kyuubi's chakra has shown to enhance Naruto and the statement I made was in reference to VOTE and not KCM. You need to relax before you post.

1. You tried to differentiate both cloaks and I am proving to you that Naruto's V1 cloak enhances him which was shown in just his one tailed state...You're trying to relate KCM but I am proving to you that KCM and V1 have different properties since your reason for what Naruto's cloak being different to theirs is the fact that he has different properties.

And massive speed boost is not one of them.

It enhances speed...Don't care whether massive but logically Naruto being enhanced to the extent where he could slap Orochimaru across trees in the forest is an example of the strength when he didn't posses that before. Naruto becoming faster than he was in his V1 is an example of speed.

Trying to argue that Sasuke wasn't enhanced or made faster in the Kyuubi cloak is just too funny...Hence everything he showed against BSM Naruto is proof that he was better off at least.

We are still here having a discussion where you claim the cloak gave some kind of massive speed boost even though nothing was shown. Like I've said, it was either nothing major or there was none at all.

As long as it improves speed...Sasuke's feat against Naruto isn't proof of them being equal. I don't care for anything else because I'm not arguing against that.

Smh. I asked you to prove that Naruto gets a massive Ninjutsu boost on par with what the SA received, and you haven't proven that. You've only repeated the same thing over and over again while ignoring the fact that you have to provide evidence.

I said V1 cloak and KCM both have different properties and showed you an example so him not showing the same boost in KCM isn't proof like you acknowledged or you won't be introducing the V1 cloak in VOTE.

However the Vote shows that Naruto gets an enhancement from V1 cloak but that was just his one tailed state...More tails = More power hence more enhancement. Now I've asked you to prove to me that Naruto upon getting more power(More tails) from his V1 cloak won't have his Jutsu enhanced to the level of the alliance. That's it but you failed to do so or you just ignored it.

Once you can prove that, then you might even have a point that the Naruto's own V1 cloak is different in terms of what it gives to the Shinobi alliance since Naruto also showed much better chakra control.

So basically you are going to ignore everything you read and continue believing that the cloak grants a massive strength boost? Lmao. Does it grant a boost? Sure. A boost on par with what you are imagining? Yeah, no. Baseless.

Imagining what? The cloak grants a noticeable change which should be clear. It alters the physical...My point, My arguments. Rock Lee is an example because he never showed feats that close before.

A physical technique? Vacuum Palm is Ninjutsu, it uses chakra. Doesn't prove that physical parameters get an equal boost.

The funniest part and you've been up and down talking about fail....This is unbelievable.

Except you haven't proven me wrong. I stated that if I'm wrong, they are on the same tier. What you should've done is say "Ok" instead of responding with "hurr you're lying", along with "my point not standing" and all that irrelevant stuff that has nothing to do with the argument. You assumed that "my point" referred to "who's superior?" when my point that was made before you replied to me had nothing to do with that argument.

Lol Now I see why you got pumped up...Well I only said you were lying because of how your aggressive your response was. The main argument was in respect to who had better reactions..I was only going to respond strictly to that because you weren't convinced. I wasn't interested in that section..Just why I thought Naruto was superior regardless of the Tier talk.

I'm getting slightly annoyed because I'm tired of you people coming around here not reading before you reply. Not to mention me saying "I don't give a damn", barely counts as heated. I suggest we stop trying to exaggerate things here and focus on the argument. :lol

"You're saying irrelevant shit" "You're talking nonsense" "Except I don't care" (Especially how you put it)...Telling that's not rude is a joke. Don't know who told you these sorts are not signs of rudeness.

You keep complaining about me reading wrong but I'm not actually because we misunderstand each other sometimes which I've noticed especially on the internet which can be understandable...It could be the way you put it. Stop whining. You've done the same quite sometimes but I haven't acted this mad

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--->

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There are other which I've seen you do but I just keep quiet about but I don't get crazy because of this..Looking at those you definitely deserve worse than this trust me. What's funny is I don't have to agree with you if I feel they are wrong.

What's funny is that you chalk it up to the drawing when in reality it's because of you acting incompetent. Smh. Please save it. :lol What's even funnier is that you've gotten much more heated than this over even more irrelevant nonsense. So now you are exaggerating and you're being a hypocrite.

I'm not a hypocrite. You're only referring to the River situation which was a already tensed due to something that occurred between him, FT and Bronze. Zexion and Apex put me down..I have 0 problems with them. Stop jumping into something you have little knowledge about.

Plus that doesn't relate to this at all...I've always given you respect here and anytime we debate. You're being unnecessarily rude which is shameful.

"Incompetent" Lmaoo thank you very much bro. I have more going for me to bother with this seriousness you're trying to bring in so please don't bring that in. I have a 4.0 GPA in BSc Economics Degree so this lack of skill means almost nothing to me if that's how you want to disrespect me to make yourself feel good...Smh I beg of you not to take this out of place and rather debate with the same respect I've been giving you..Never had a problem with you but I can't be quiet or afraid of someone talking to me this way when it's truly a debatable topic.

I'm gonna have to ask you to read that again. Both panels above show Naruto and Sasuke pulling their arms back prepping the attack. Where do you see Sasuke striking first? Where do you see anyone striking first? All you see is them pulling their arms back, and them hitting their target at the same time. Their Avatars are factually equal in speed, so there is absolutely no way you can claim that one attacked first anyway.

Which doesn't go well for you...The previous panel shows Naruto saying 'here" which means he already timed it. Both panels shows them in motion but some acting first. Look back at the tip of Sasuke's sword and even the lines around the sword properly and even the lines indicate he was in motion towards Obito...Look at the Japanese symbols on both panels which clearly indicates this as well

Then again, you'll still be wrong be regardless of how you look at it the panels shows Sasuke acting first even though in the previous panel clearly shows Naruto saying "Here" first.

If only I didn't already explain this. The fact that both their Avatars (equal in speed) reacted and struck and hit at the same time means that Naruto and Sasuke told them to, at the same time, meaning that they reacted at the same time.

I didn't get your exact point probably because of how you put them.

No..I already said something which should be convincing that Sasuke acted first. Look back at that scan but then the enhancements acts as a factor.

Which is irrelevant to my point. Once again, something I've had to say about oh, maybe 3x now? Susanoo's speed is not relevant to my point nor does it have anything to do with Sasuke's mental reaction speed.

Read above...Sasuke can mentally react but why your comparison fails is because of the enhancements(Kyuubi) and the fact that Sasuke was shown to act first which according to you should mean he's superior in terms of reactions.

Which is before his precognition leveled up, thus irrelevant. Not to mention being attacked isn't the only way to measure reaction speed. :lol. FT's arguments against the Minato fans should have made that very clear.

Which I did as well but I can tell you have no knowledge if you're trying to compare the 2...This is much more irrelevant to that.

This is much more inaccurate or I'd have accepted it long time ago...Not to mention, Me and FT never closed the window to any other form of reaction shown. Just that Gai wasn't faced with them but we know from his feats, he can definitely do so. However Sasuke has been faced with one which gives us even less reasons to believe your own feats.

Again with the nonsense exaggerations here huh? There's no rant here. Just me stating facts. If you can't deal with it then take the hypocrisy and move along.

That's incredibly silly to say...You can't be talking about "Fail" when you say something that silly. Not that it's bad normally that you didn't know but you can't be talking about fail when you say this Lmao.

Yes. Baseless claim. As baseless as that Night Guy fodder ripping through PS nonsense from the other day.

So? That's nowhere as bad...My opinion that it can. Cry about it elsewhere if you want.

DB says it's similar, so yes, I'll give you that point. But the only major difference noted is the wide gulf in power. Doesn't change anything though nor is what you are saying making any sense. What's worse is that you are even contradicting yourself and pretty much agreeing with my argument.

Lmaoo so you admit that was a baseless claim? Thank God we know you can make some and kill others as well.

I cannot even begin to explain to anyone reading this right now, how little sense you make right here. I don't know who told you about this "special gentle fist chakra", but it doesn't exist. .

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Gentle Fist chakra is known as the users chakra which should be clear....If not anyone should be able to replicate the same but its unique to the user so yes. Gentle Fist charka is the users chakra...Anyone should seriously understand this aspect especially when I say "Gentle fist chakra" because of the chakra being unique to that Taijutsu.

Gentle fist is used by flowing the user's chakra into the opponent. Meaning despite being Taijutsu, Vacuum Palm contains chakra. If your tech is made of stronger chakra, it will be stronger. Kurama's chakra enhances the chakra of the person using the Gentle Fist, thus the chakra they put into their Vacuum Palm is stronger, hence it being enhanced that greatly by chakra. Has jack to do with physical strength lol) and anyone who reads the Manga should know that it has little to do with physical strength.

I'll concede this point because I misunderstood the Kyuubi's chakra would enhance the damage done to the vitals...Didn't think so which was why I differentiated them. Good point but hardly changes my main point which should be clear.

It's almost like you chose to make this stuff up instead of actually looking at what the Manga had to say.

Every single person should know what Gentle Fist chakra is..It's used to differentiate the Hyuugas. This is the first time I've mentioned it and someone has a complaint about it.

And here we go again. Evani decides not to read before he replies. And then complains when he doesn't get respect, for blatantly ignoring what I've said multiple times no less. :lol Amazing. I said it's not as dramatic as a boost as you are making it out to be.

The reading and understanding part is funny when I've shown you do worse and then change back in Gai thread I've encountered with you. Not only that even.
It should be clear it is dramatic after seeing Rock Lee..Then again all I really care about is how it can enhance the physical...If it enhances the physical then I don't have to tell you that the Kyyubi cloak which has this properties as I've explained should easily increase speed. Anyone should know this

 

[KeyofDestiny]

I'll agree that he got a boost in speed, but not massively. The rest of the nonsense in your post is something I can't even be bothered to address.

 

[TRE MERCER]

So Evani who do you thinks wins this?​