Proof that Third Kazekage > Third Raikage (Actual Explanation inside)

[Negative Knight]

I personally thing that the Third Raikage > Third Kazekage on the basis of two things;

His stamina/hype;

Spoiler

The Third Raikage was shown to have a ridiculous amount of Stamina, as he battled10,000 Shinobi for 3 days (I think it was) and he came out on top.

Obviously people will assume that these guys were just fodder, but either way, even if they were, 10,000 is a lot, and for him to even have the Stamina and strength to keep fighting for that long is ridiculous.

His black lightning and his assumed speed that comes with it;

Spoiler

Obviously this guy was a beast, for him to go toe to toe with the Gyuuki is hype enough, but this guy even had the Black Lightning, a fearsome Kekkei Genkai indeed. Now, we know that using a Raiton Shroud increases your speed and raw power as demonstrated by the Raikage, so if Black Lightning is an improved version it is logical to assume that he'd be even faster with this particular type of Raiton.

Overall he wins because of his speed, power and his stamina. tbh we haven't seen much from the 3rd Kazekage so it's harder to determine who would win, but personally, I'd go with the 3rd Raikage ​

Your argument is logical but the Third's tough exterior doesn't affect how strong his brain is, getting electrocuted by his hell stab via Kazekage's iron sand would just overwhelm him

Also Black Lightning would just electrically charge his iron armour meaning it would be even more dangerous to touch/hit

The iron armour's ideal shape is a incomplete sphere that doesn't touch the ground or the Kazekage but the inside allows the Kazekage to stand on the ground.

 

[Ryuu..]

I'm not convinced that the 3rd Raikage can be electrocuted in such a manner.

 

[Beetle]

Good argument, you've made me realize some things about Third Kazekage I didn't consider before. I do think 3rd Raikage > 3rd Kazekage however.

1.) Addressing the point of manipulating blood, I don't think it would be possible. There's simply not enough iron mass in blood to control someone like that. If he could somehow, he could basically control everything..

2.) Iron bullets wouldn't hurt Raikage. The only attack we've seen injure him is his own and Rasenshuriken to some extent. Rasenshuriken molecularly damages on a huge scale. If that doesn't finish him off, i doubt some bullets will.

3.) Raikage's lightning stab wouldn't have much trouble piercing through Kazekage's iron armor or shield. Just his three finger busted through a rock wall that was powered by multiple shinobi.

But we honestly haven't seen much of the Third Kazekage. If he has some crazy speed and reflexes (as in better than Raikage) he could win. Then again we also don't know how effective Raikage's black lightning is. But for what we know, I'd give it to Raikage.

 

[abhiraj]

Good analysis, took some time reading all that wall of text.
I actually cant say who is better..
Kazekage can attack raikage all he wants, but he cant penetrate that shield of his, nothing but his own attack can.
The only Moves we know of Raikage are Lightning based and cant be thrown which is a disadvantage because of the being electrocuted thing.

Maybe if the raikage uses black lightning.
Then again we don't know the full power of black lightning.

The whole thing is that we haven't seen much of these two.
Anyways I'd give Kazekage the upper hand for now, until we know all about black lightning of course.

P.S. it was the 4th Kazekage who invented his gold dust by watching the Shukaku

 

[raju22]

good argument's, you used logic while making this thread and i can see why many people don't want to quote you on this one.

well, while you use good argument's you forgot about few thing's in the Naruto universe, those are...

1-Comman logic and sense fails in naruto world,

Exemple: if a person is using a certain type of nature eliment or has affinity for it, he can neutralize it's effect with the same tecnique or in some case (like this one) tank it head on with no side effec's,

Manga Example: Hatake Kakashi-

Spoiler

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As you can see he neutralized a high powered Raiton attack from Kakuzu just by charging Raikiri in his hand's and his body was not affected by it, now think about third Raikage, who can charge Raiton through his whole body, and can keep it active whole day, so even if his attaks back fire at him due to the nature of iron sand,it will not hurt him in any way since he has total control over Raiton.

2- 3rd Kazekage does not posses any affinity to Raiton, means if he uses his iron to make shield and gets in contact with any of his sand running high in Raiton, he will look like this,

Spoiler

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so it would be very dangerous for Kazekage to go near any of the Raiton powered Iron (including the one on the ground), because 3rd Raikage can go Blanka any time he wants without taking any damage from his Raiton, but Kazekage on the other hand can not survive a High voltage attack.

3- Now we look at 3rd Raikage's physical condition,

Spoiler

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Hmm... strong guy, although it is true that his Raiton armor add's more defense to his body, it is not true that he can not tank high power'd attack without that, because he was the only person who could go through Mabui's 'Tensoo no jutsu' without sustaining any injury,

Spoiler

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Take note that they are Talking about his resilient body Not the Raiton armor, so 3rd Kazekage's 'Satetsu Shigure' will not be able to pierce through his tough skin, and i already cleared that why Raiton won't work on him.

also note that 3rd Raikage's physical power is more great then Sakura, means he can punch any heavy weapon\wall created by iron sand, right back at 3rd Kazekage, and last but not the least 3rd Raikage outlasts 3rd Kazekage in Stamina, chakra, endurance, and speed.

3rd Kazekage can kill a person by using iron in his blood is only a theory and i think it has never been stated in the manga, so we can not take that in to consideration.

 

[Negative Knight]

Good argument, you've made me realize some things about Third Kazekage I didn't consider before. I do think 3rd Raikage > 3rd Kazekage however.

1.) Addressing the point of manipulating blood, I don't think it would be possible. There's simply not enough iron mass in blood to control someone like that. If he could somehow, he could basically control everything..

2.) Iron bullets wouldn't hurt Raikage. The only attack we've seen injure him is his own and Rasenshuriken to some extent. Rasenshuriken molecularly damages on a huge scale. If that doesn't finish him off, i doubt some bullets will.

3.) Raikage's lightning stab wouldn't have much trouble piercing through Kazekage's iron armor or shield. Just his three finger busted through a rock wall that was powered by multiple shinobi.

But we honestly haven't seen much of the Third Kazekage. If he has some crazy speed and reflexes (as in better than Raikage) he could win. Then again we also don't know how effective Raikage's black lightning is. But for what we know, I'd give it to Raikage.

You present a great argument and maybe base iron isnt enough to keep him back, however if a large quantity is condensed into a small spherical all-round shield im confident it could hold back the Third's attack as there is a limit to his strength but no real limit to the condensation of Iron. Also lacing the entire arena in iron would make it harder for the Raikage to run at his fullest. It would also give the Third the ability to intercept everyone of his movements.

The Black lightning would back fire as it would turn his shield into a electrical fence enforced

 

[Negative Knight]

good argument's, you used logic while making this thread and i can see why many people don't want to quote you on this one.

well, while you use good argument's you forgot about few thing's in the Naruto universe, those are...

1-Comman logic and sense fails in naruto world,

Exemple: if a person is using a certain type of nature eliment or has affinity for it, he can neutralize it's effect with the same tecnique or in some case (like this one) tank it head on with no side effec's,

Manga Example: Hatake Kakashi-

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

As you can see he neutralized a high powered Raiton attack from Kakuzu just by charging Raikiri in his hand's and his body was not affected by it, now think about third Raikage, who can charge Raiton through his whole body, and can keep it active whole day, so even if his attaks back fire at him due to the nature of iron sand,it will not hurt him in any way since he has total control over Raiton.

2- 3rd Kazekage does not posses any affinity to Raiton, means if he uses his iron to make shield and gets in contact with any of his sand running high in Raiton, he will look like this,

Spoiler

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so it would be very dangerous for Kazekage to go near any of the Raiton powered Iron (including the one on the ground), because 3rd Raikage can go Blanka any time he wants without taking any damage from his Raiton, but Kazekage on the other hand can not survive a High voltage attack.

3- Now we look at 3rd Raikage's physical condition,

Spoiler

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Hmm... strong guy, although it is true that his Raiton armor add's more defense to his body, it is not true that he can not tank high power'd attack without that, because he was the only person who could go through Mabui's 'Tensoo no jutsu' without sustaining any injury,

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

Take note that they are Talking about his resilient body Not the Raiton armor, so 3rd Kazekage's 'Satetsu Shigure' will not be able to pierce through his tough skin, and i already cleared that why Raiton won't work on him.

also note that 3rd Raikage's physical power is more great then Sakura, means he can punch any heavy weapon\wall created by iron sand, right back at 3rd Kazekage, and last but not the least 3rd Raikage outlasts 3rd Kazekage in Stamina, chakra, endurance, and speed.

3rd Kazekage can kill a person by using iron in his blood is only a theory and i think it has never been stated in the manga, so we can not take that in to consideration.

True his iron bullets wont penetrate the Third skin but indirectly kill him would be the approach e.g. electrocuting to kill his brain to take him down

The Third was considered a genius like no other

No matter how strong you are, your brain cannot become steel strong still just a pink fragile thing

 

[raju22]

True his iron bullets wont penetrate the Third skin but indirectly kill him would be the approach e.g. electrocuting to kill his brain to take him down

The Third was considered a genius like no other

No matter how strong you are, your brain cannot become steel strong still just a pink fragile thing

That would be true in a condition that he is affected by it, but as we can see that he runs Raiton through his entire body without feeling any current or negative effect on his brain, so a Raiton charged iron won't hurt him, and remember that 3rd kazekage was taken down by Sasori, who if we compare to 3rd Raikage is a less powerful Shinobi.

 

[Beetle]

You present a great argument and maybe base iron isnt enough to keep him back, however if a large quantity is condensed into a small spherical all-round shield im confident it could hold back the Third's attack as there is a limit to his strength but no real limit to the condensation of Iron. Also lacing the entire arena in iron would make it harder for the Raikage to run at his fullest. It would also give the Third the ability to intercept everyone of his movements.

The Black lightning would back fire as it would turn his shield into a electrical fence enforced

Well lacing everything in iron is a bit difficult because Kazekage would have to carry around a set amount of iron sand to use (similar to Gaara's gourd sand). Also, the electric damage that has shown to be taken is fairly minimal. Consider when Sasuke send Chidori's current through his body, it didn't exactly fry him. Then consider 3rd Raikage's lightning armor and durability, probably won't even faze him. Also, electrically charged armor or shield is a double edged sword.

 

[abhiraj]

That would be true in a condition that he is affected by it, but as we can see that he runs Raiton through his entire body without feeling any current or negative effect on his brain, so a Raiton charged iron won't hurt him, and remember that 3rd kazekage was taken down by Sasori, who if we compare to 3rd Raikage is a less powerful Shinobi.

he had poisons.
and sasori was strong too, he just was not strong like 3rd raikage.
Everyone has different strengths and weaknesses

 

[Negative Knight]

Kisame < Guy

Guy < Sasori's Poisons

Sasori <<<< Kisame


Like abhiraj said everyone has a weakness related to their powers

 

[raju22]

he had poisons.
and sasori was strong too, he just was not strong like 3rd raikage.
Everyone has different strengths and weaknesses

I know Sasori is strong but if we put him in the same category as Raikage he will look week, i only used him as a example, because he actually made a puppet out of third Kazekage who was said to be the strongest of all kazekage.

 

[Negative Knight]

Yeah i get what you mean by the Third was assasinated not beaten in a fight so you cant really judge him by that criteria

 

[Amaterasuice]

Third Kazekage vs Third Raikage​

Third Kazekage's Profile (written by Negative Knight):

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Third Raikage's Profile: (Written by Leoj of the Teinken)


Why the Third Kazekage is stronger than the Third Raikage ?


Hell Stab is said to be the signature move of the Third Raikage, a superior version of Chidori. By nature its a lightning physical attack that requires direct contact on the person you need to hit.

The Third Kazekage's Iron Armour Defense (ideal shape would be in a incomplete sphere which doesn't touch the ground but has an inside where the 3rd is safely touching the ground)

In scientific terms iron conducts electricity so the lighting for the Hell Stab would electrify the defense to a devastating voltage which would reflect the effects to the user of the Jutsu as the full circuit would circulate and hit the third raikage with his own attack.

Also this would make the defense even stronger as the Third Raikage took the liberty of adding a lethal electric fence.

The Third Raikage's lightning release armour could also act as a disadvantage to him as contact with the iron sand would just cause his own lighting armour to have the effect on which it has on his enemies.

Overall if the Third Kazekage were to disperse iron sand along the floor it would prevent the Third Raikage from using any of his lightning release techniques which make up for the large bulk of his ninjutsu.


Strengths and Weaknesses against Other Elements (Third Kazekage's Iron Sand)

Spoiler

Immunity to Fire Techniques - would become useless in the face of this apart from Madara and a few select other's techniques.

Immunity - Water would instead of soaking into it like with ordinary sand would just wipe off.

Immunity - Even the most powerful wind techniques won't do much damage, a hurricane vs a iron house?

Immunity - Earth wouldn't be strong enough to compete with the iron sand

Immunity against Lightning Melee Attacks as they would electrocute the users themselves

Weakness against Lightning Projectiles -The iron conducts lightning so the iron sand can't be touching him physically as a Armour otherwise it becomes like a electrified fence/cage.

Lightning also strengths the Third's Defense as it causes his shield to be literally untouchable as the lightning circulating around it would electrocute anyone who comes close

Also if you check the the spoiler tag above on the Third Kazekage's elemental strengths and weaknesses, you would see that whatever other chakra natures the third has would just back fire on him.

His Black Lightning his signature Kekkei Genkai (Storm Release) would also act as a burden because the Di-charged nature of water would mean it could complete a circuit on its own increasing the devastation of the Third's lightning techniques on himself.

The Third Kazekage's Iron Sand Bullets which are propelled by replusion of the Magnet Release technique could reach speed close to the Third's because of the nature of magnetism, and each hit could be electrocuting until the third's body is worn out by electrocution, not to mention no matter how hard his exterior his heart and brain can only take so much electrocution

Finally, the Third's theoretical technique of blood bending because of iron in the blood means that he's gonna leave before this battle begins...because we all know in the end which of the Kages is gonna win.



For those who didn't read basically The Third Raikage electrocutes himself over and over till his brain can't take it

Magneto >>>> Beast


Who do you guys think is stronger between these two Kages and give reasons?

To be honest, from what we've seen I'd give it to the third Raikage. But, the third Raikage seems to only have a small arsenal, and the Third Kazekage doesn't.

So, I think the Third Raikage wins due to match-up, but isn't technically stronger.

A lot of the third Kazekage's attacks would need a lot to pierce through the third Raikage's power, as he even took on the eight tails.

But, if it was a fight between one of them versus Hiruzen, the third Raikage would die first. As the third Kazekage has a more larger arsenal.

Raikage most likely wins against the 3rd Kazekage, but it definately wouldn't be easy, and the 3rd Kazekage still has a chance.

 

[Naruto N. Uzumaki]

depends on the location in the desert the Kazekage could win and the same thing in a grassy filed then the raikage has the upper hand and could win

but the third got killed by sasori and the 3rd raikage tank 10k ninjas for 3 days

i would bet on the raikage

 

[Negative Knight]

To be honest, from what we've seen I'd give it to the third Raikage. But, the third Raikage seems to only have a small arsenal, and the Third Kazekage doesn't.

So, I think the Third Raikage wins due to match-up, but isn't technically stronger.

A lot of the third Kazekage's attacks would need a lot to pierce through the third Raikage's power, as he even took on the eight tails.

But, if it was a fight between one of them versus Hiruzen, the third Raikage would die first. As the third Kazekage has a more larger arsenal.

Raikage most likely wins against the 3rd Kazekage, but it definately wouldn't be easy, and the 3rd Kazekage still has a chance.

Nice to see your open minded about it but people haven't considered the factor of intelligence that comes into play. Which obviously is to the advantage of the Third Kazekage.

depends on the location in the desert the Kazekage could win and the same thing in a grassy filed then the raikage has the upper hand and could win

but the third got killed by sasori and the 3rd raikage tank 10k ninjas for 3 days

i would bet on the raikage

Sasori assassinated the third as the manga stated there was no sign of struggle

Also without his Third Kazekage puppet, Sasori didn't seem to be that strong

 

[Amaterasuice]

Nice to see your open minded about it but people haven't considered the factor of intelligence that comes into play. Which obviously is to the advantage of the Third Kazekage

I know the third Kazekage is much smarter, that helps him a lot. That's why I said, the 3rd Kazekage was stronger.

Overall powerful wise, take away intelligence, Raikage is too strong for him.

But add intelligence, then the kages will have a closer fight.

 

[FizzyDrink]

Kisame < Guy

Guy < Sasori's Poisons

Sasori <<<< Kisame


Like abhiraj said everyone has a weakness related to their powers

First of all, nonono, nono, nono. Sasori beats Kisame. He has the Third Raikage puppet plus poisoned Iron Sand! If they go into that big water dome, it's game over for Kisame, because Sasori just poisons the water. But that's not what we're talking about here.

I actually agree. Seeing as I have argued for Sasori in the past, I know of the Third Kazekage's abilities, and how underrated they really are.

To begin with, lets create a handicap for the Third Raikage, saying that there is NOT enought iron in his system to be used to kill him (or at least, it is so tiny that the Third Kazekage can't control them correctly), and he can't be electrocuted by the electrocuted iron.

One thing people seem to forget is that the Third Kazekage can use his sand to fly, flying out of reach of the Third Raikage. The ability to fly is incredibly underrated as well. With this ability, the Third Raikage should not even be able to reach the Third Kazekage to kill him. Now what next? Maybe the Third Kazekage could try to corral the Raikage, or at least force the Raikage to come in contact with his sand. Seeing as he is conducing electricity with his armor, the sand can be made to stay on him. This could be a method to slow down the Raikage in order to aim for his weak spots, namely the eyes and mouth. Possibly the Kazekage could use the sand alread on his body and have them travel up into his eyes or mouth, thus ending the battle. Now that is a scenario in which the Kazekage could definitely win in my opinion, barring the use of the iron in the Raikage's body.

How would the Raikage kill the Kazekage though? Unless he can jump really high, or has amazingly long range with his raiton, there shouldn't be a way for him to reach the Kazekage in the first place! So really, the one with the advantage here is the Kazekage.

Edit: Also, I would have Sasori beating the Third Raikage. If the Third Kazekage would have the upper hand, then Sasori would have an even greater advantage.

 

[Bogard]

Remember he was killed by Sasori :|

 

[Negative Knight]

First of all, nonono, nono, nono. Sasori beats Kisame. He has the Third Raikage puppet plus poisoned Iron Sand! If they go into that big water dome, it's game over for Kisame, because Sasori just poisons the water. But that's not what we're talking about here.

I actually agree. Seeing as I have argued for Sasori in the past, I know of the Third Kazekage's abilities, and how underrated they really are.

To begin with, lets create a handicap for the Third Raikage, saying that there is NOT enought iron in his system to be used to kill him (or at least, it is so tiny that the Third Kazekage can't control them correctly), and he can't be electrocuted by the electrocuted iron.

One thing people seem to forget is that the Third Kazekage can use his sand to fly, flying out of reach of the Third Raikage. The ability to fly is incredibly underrated as well. With this ability, the Third Raikage should not even be able to reach the Third Kazekage to kill him. Now what next? Maybe the Third Kazekage could try to corral the Raikage, or at least force the Raikage to come in contact with his sand. Seeing as he is conducing electricity with his armor, the sand can be made to stay on him. This could be a method to slow down the Raikage in order to aim for his weak spots, namely the eyes and mouth. Possibly the Kazekage could use the sand alread on his body and have them travel up into his eyes or mouth, thus ending the battle. Now that is a scenario in which the Kazekage could definitely win in my opinion, barring the use of the iron in the Raikage's body.

How would the Raikage kill the Kazekage though? Unless he can jump really high, or has amazingly long range with his raiton, there shouldn't be a way for him to reach the Kazekage in the first place! So really, the one with the advantage here is the Kazekage.

Exactly why i brought you to this thread! Lol yeah i never thought about his ability to fly not to mention manipulate ordinary sand. In this particular scenario it leaves the Third Raikage severely disadvantaged because he mostly specializes in close range melee attack and the Third Kazekage could reach ranges impossible for a sharpshooter to get a good shot.

Also i just realized Sasori is a human puppet he doesn't drown and can counter kisame in a lot of ways. But Kisame can use his Super Shark Bomb Jutsu to just overwhelm sasori and kill his living core.

Really Nice post +Rep