Proof that Second Mizukage > Second Hokage (Actual Explanation Inside)

[TrollingSage]

I love how everyone thinks they know everything there is to know about Tobirama despite seeing him in only one fight where he used 2 or 3 water jutsus.

 

[Owo]

we don't know enough about tobirama
but nice done! I like the theorie

 

[Zygomic]

I kind of agree with this because him being able to absorb the Second Hokage's techniques would give him a great advantage but at the same time since they are both water it would be a drawn out and long fight because it wouldn't have much effect on the Second either.

 

[Avi1771]

As we saw until now i do like to say that Second Mizukage will win
But According what we heard about senju clan i will choose the Second Hokage

 

[Myogen]

Great thread Negative Knight it inspired me to go back and read up on Nindiame Mizukage's abilities. It also made me feel like a dummy because I never made the connection that Nindaime Mizukage had Suigetsu's Suika no Jutsu. However because of this I realized a flaw in this thread.

Suigetsu is weak to Raiton because his body turns into water, but Nindaime Mizukage's body turns mostly into Oil with a bit of water in it. Oil does not conduct electricity, so Nindaime Mizukage should actually be highly resistant or outright immune to Raiton. Also I do not think Mizukage is weak to Katon. As seen with Joki Boi when he is heated up, he explodes, the same would happened if Mizukage was hit with a Katon powerful enough to overcome his Suiton techniques (The explosion could actually be pretty bad for his enemies). But as was we saw with Joki Boi after the explosion the water vapor rises into the atmosphere cooling down, turns to hail, and than reforms Joki Boi. Again the same thing should apply to Mizukage, making him immune to Katon and actually making it dangerous for the enemy to use Katon against him.

Essentially Mizukage's unique Suika no Jutsu has no weakness, it just makes him all around one of the most durable Shinobi in the manga cannon. It's no surprise why Mu's Jinton was Mizukage's natural enemy back in the day, since it's molecular destruction is one of the few techniques which can actually over come the defense of Mizukage's unique Suika no Jutsu.

With that out of the way I'll discuss the actual match up. It's an interesting one because Mizukage's Suika no Jutsu would make him immune to Tobirama's Suiton Ninjutsu. But I feel we lack the necessary information on the Clam's Genjutsu to decide whether Mizukage is Top Tier or not.

We do not know how the Clam's Genjutsu effects Mizukage's opponents and so we don't whether or not the Genjutsu can be broken or avoided. If it can't be than Mizukage is certainly Top Tier and I really have no clue how Mu forced a draw with him. But if not, than he's probably not Top Tier. If he's not Top Tier, I'm pretty sure Tobirama as one of the previous Hokages with Edo Tensei and hax'd S/T Jutsu is and he'd defeat Mizukage regardless of whether his suitons work or not.

So I think we need to wait till the fourth data book which will detail the clam's jutsu to figure out who would win this match. Though as of right now I lean towards Tobirama based on statements, hype, and the fact that Mu and him draw'd.

 

[USSJ Future Trunks]

idk but i think Tobirama takes it, i mean he's a senju and senju carries a huge amount of chackra

theres nothing that says all senjus have large chakra, only versatility hence their name "clan of a thousand skills"

but I think that Tobirama's genjutsu could even the playing field. The genjutsu caught someone as skilled as Hiruzen in it and made it difficult for him to defend himself

no such genjutsu exists. darkness was used by hashirama

but I would have to give Tobirama and his S/T techniques the upper hand in speed.

you mean the ones we know nothing about?

Imo, the second mizukage would win unless Tobirama had intel on him and also was able to edo a few high ranking fire or lightning release shinobi.

and is that supposed to help vs oil?

also tobirama can use edo tensei

nothing says he has it set up already in OP

Add to this the fact that Tobirama was able to survive an attack from the Gold and Silver brothers...

maybe they intentionally spared him

tobirama can detect where he is despite the genjutsu due to his location technique.

hed only detect the mirage. its not sensing chakra but movement

same as Nagato getting one shotted by Itachi).

no it isnt as nagato wasnt oneshotted. in that case fodders oneshotted third raikage since they binded him

One more thing, the senju were noted as masters of all 3 types of shinobi combat. Just because ninjutsu doesn't work, does not mean genjutsu and taijutsu are out of the question. Not to mention he does have edo tensei, and a "space time ninjutsu" that received praise from minato.

yes they are. talking about tobirama is like sakumo. he has maybe one feat and thats it. we know almost nothing else about him. and not all senjus are masters of everything like not all uchihas have MS.

Any water technique he do will backfire at him as he is fighting the best water jutsu user and manipulator.

hes fighting kisame now?

Something which has never been done in manga, is just not appropriate to argue with.

your a giant hypocrite. a SENTENCE ago you said tobiramas the best suiton user and this has never been demonstrated in the manga. so its not appropriate

 

[TheGr8Uchiha]

nice thread! to bad we need to see more of the 2nd hokage and his space time techniques.

 

[KillaCam]

It's hard to make an accurate assumption especially since we really haven't seen a all out fight with 2nd Hokage.

Yes we saw him use a few High Leveled Water Jutsu vs the third in edo form, but it was said that he knew varoius space time ninjutsu and who knows what else he knew.

But with the current information I'd give it to mizukage, his techniques are Feirce.

But thats only with the current info.

2nd hokage was the brother of the first Harashima.

I doubt he was a push over, ninjas of that era were beast, so im sure he was able to hold his own, he was the thirds teacher for god sake.

So in all honest for me its undecided until they show a serious fight with 2nd hokage.

 

[Naruto N Uzumaki]

Very, very nice thread.

 

[USSJ Future Trunks]

, he was the thirds teacher for god sake.

ebisu taught naruto for a while and i wouldnt call him beast

 

[Unorthodox]

tobirama is featless

 

[USSJ Future Trunks]

how would any of his attacks even have the slightest effect on someone made of oil and water? absurd thread

 

[24farone]

Okay now that we have learned the the 1st and 2nd hokages are on way different scales then the others. Tobirama would wreck the mizukages all if them he is considered THE BEST water user in his time now that would INCLUDE the 2nd mizukage lol also his flying raijin not to mention he created majority of the Jutsu then hidden leaf possesses in the hidden scrolls example the shadow clone Jutsu edi tensei. The hokages are on a whole bother scale then the other kages the only one I think out of the other kages only the third could defeat tobirama bit the mizukages and I'm not being biased hashirama and tobiramas chakra is on while other levels obviously hashirama's lol this thread should be closed

 

[Koibito]

solid argument

 

[Uverdore9]

Tobirama indeed cannot affect the Mizukage.I wonder if he even can break out of the alliance control genjutsu.