Perfect Susanoo needs Rinnegan

[dareak]

Madara says that Hashirama was the only one who could stop him, so he is saying that Hashirama can stop this form. Which must mean he had it before.

Also, if the Rinnegan is the final form of the Sharingan then Nagato should've been able to use MS/EMS techs.

Kinda got skipped.

 

[sasukeEMSrules]

explains everything + rep

Madara says that Hashirama was the only one who could stop him, so he is saying that Hashirama can stop this form. Which must mean he had it before.

Also, if the Rinnegan is the final form of the Sharingan then Nagato should've been able to use MS/EMS techs.

rinnegan was given to nagato by madara :sy:
he was not an uchiha therefore he could not use ms/ems techniques and since he didn't possess sharingan in the first place so it means he didn't awaken mangekyo and that leads to the conclusion that he could not use sussano, amaterasu etc...
rinnegan> ems so rinnegan sussano> ems sussano

 

[xlilyx]

Agreed. Brilliant work, explained it very well.

 

[El Batman]

Sharingan is just a weakened and inexperienced form of the Rinnegan. Much like 2 tomoe sharingan is to 3 tomoe sharingan.

 

[girya]

Madara didn't have the rinnegan when fighting hashirama, so why would tsunade question if he faught against that susano'o, and why would madara know that hashirama could still beat him...? I believe it's just an EMS technique. Also he uses every other form of his susano'o using the rinnegan, so IF the "perfect" susano'o is a rinnegan tech, then all other forms are as well.

exactly what i thouht abt hashi vs madara. there is doubt if perfect sasanoo requires rinnegan. Else hashi to beat a madara with rinnegan and kyubii under control.. difficult. also, madara quotes he awakened rinnegan just before dying and we know he was alive for a quite sometime after the battle with hashi to handover the rinnegan to nagato.

 

[IzunaUchiha2]

probably lolo

 

[Kingace003]

Agreed

 

[Marcusgoode77]

Disagree for a moment sasuke perfected his susanoo against kakiashi before his eyes gave out

 

[Champ]

Perfect Susano'o only requires EMS

 

[dareak]

rinnegan was given to nagato by madara :sy:
he was not an uchiha therefore he could not use ms/ems techniques and since he didn't possess sharingan in the first place so it means he didn't awaken mangekyo and that leads to the conclusion that he could not use sussano, amaterasu etc...
rinnegan> ems so rinnegan sussano> ems sussano

Yes, but according to the OP. The Rinnegan is a Sharingan, the final form of it. If the Rinnegan is a Sharingan then that means it should be able to use MS/EMS techs.

 

[Super Kami Guru]

Yes, but according to the OP. The Rinnegan is a Sharingan, the final form of it. If the Rinnegan is a Sharingan then that means it should be able to use MS/EMS techs.

it does but only in the fact that you have to be and uchiha to use its true power.. For example take kakashi using his sharingan isnt like an uchiha using it, it drains him more and his ms is completely different from that of madaras, itachis, and sasukes. By your logic he should be able to use susanoo and the other 2 techs. My point is if youre an uchiha and progress pass your ems you awaken rinnegan which is true because kabuto hypothesized about it and madara told him it that it was true. Now when one awakens their rinnegan they gain it's powers plus the additional powers it can add their their ems or atleast stabilize their susanoo aka perfect susanoo

 

[kotoamatsukami]

What he told Tsunade is really irrelevant in the fact that he has said the same line more than once to different questions.

The answer to your second question is the Uchiha tablet, which the 3rd section is only readable by rinnegan eyes. Lots of Uchiha secret information there.

And lastly Itachi only knew how to obtain EMS. He seemed to know nothing further of obtaining a rinnegan. And Madara was able to take over countries because he was feared and one of the strongest shinobi of all time. Not because he got 1 power-up.

he did not have the rennigan so how could he hav read it come on now make sense he got rennigan from kabuto.

no itachi knew about the 1 new power up thats wat he told sasuke thats how he was able to take over other countries cuz of PS.

I know this thread has been made thousands of times in the last two weeks but im sick of people ignoring facts. The rinnegan is the next evolution of sharingan as state by kabuto here and next page madara proves it true:

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Also for those who say well madara is just using rinnegan but it's an ems tech and narutopedia says so i will now post parts of the manga from madara fighting clearly show him switching between different eyes to use different techs:
Page 1: Madara has been using final form susanoo an ems tech but as he sees he's going to be hit he switchs to rinnegan

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Page 2:Madara uses Chibaku Tensei to create giant meteor or atleast pull them in clearly same tech kishi is getting lazy with saying jutsu name aka he spams "sharingan genjutsu"

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Page 3: 5 kage fight madara's wood clones with susanoo all using susanoo.... and madara uses a sharingan gen on the raikage WITH THE EMS:

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Page 4: Madara awakens perfect susanoo with the rinnegan activated:

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Also if rinnegan is the final evolution of the sharingan IT IS TECHINQUELY A SHARINGAN so saying well its and ems tech seriously just doesnt work. Why would the wood clones be using ems if they could just have rinnegan open to use those techs and original madara is just standing there with rinnegan activated?

if ur saying rennegan is a sharingan then y make this thread.... rennigan an sharingan r two different things he can switch bac an forth he had rennigan out when he activated susanoo when he first threw a meteor out an it wont PS susanoo

 

[Super Kami Guru]

he did not have the rennigan so how could he hav read it come on now make sense he got rennigan from kabuto.

no itachi knew about the 1 new power up thats wat he told sasuke thats how he was able to take over other countries cuz of PS.



if ur saying rennegan is a sharingan then y make this thread.... rennigan an sharingan r two different things he can switch bac an forth he had rennigan out when he activated susanoo when he first threw a meteor out an it wont PS susanoo

i know he can but than why does he have rinnegan active when he activated PS? clearly has rinnegan on for that and complete susanoo if they are different he's using "ms" techs with a rinnegan aka not possible if they werent related....

second part itachi said nothing of conquering nations he said it gave birth to completely new doujutsu.... basically one with no reprecussions and eternal ms.... one that never loses it's light thats the power up he's refering too

 

[Troyg39]

Dude, the ONLY time Madara actually switched eye techniques was when he did so to suck up Naruto's Rasenshuriken, he's been fighting in Rinnegan ever since. Trust me, I actually took the time to look at every scan on NB from chapter 560 until the recent one over again. That means he's been using Susanoo and all other EMS techniques with Rinnegan active. He never switched back. The ONLY other eye switch we do see is his CLONE trying to use Genjutsu on the Raikage. Which proves absolutely nothing and is irrelevant as far as Susanoo is concerned. The real one still has the Rinnegan active. Another thing to note is that if this is Madara's first time using Perfect Susanoo, how the heck does he know how to use it so well? I'm sorry, your points were good but they don't prove what you set out when you put them all into context with whats been going on in the manga. I'm not trying to say you're opinion is wrong, I'm just saying that these "facts" you have don't do anything to prove what you were trying to.

 

[CopyCatNinja]

i agree

 

[Everlasting Peace]

Didn't read, Susanoo is a MS ability, not Rinnegan.

Itachi has a completed Susanoo, he doesn't even have EMS.

Let's just make realistic threads ..

 

[Super Kami Guru]

Didn't read, Susanoo is a MS ability, not Rinnegan.

Itachi has a completed Susanoo, he doesn't even have EMS.

Let's just make realistic threads ..

ooo really how about reading.... it would be helpful because than youd know why i made this thread soooo please read or dont comment if you want posts play forum games

 

[zombiejesus]

no one knows for sure to be honest

 

[Super Kami Guru]

no one knows for sure to be honest

i know thats why its a theory just trying to explain some ways it could be true and others have brought up reasons i could be wrong

 

[ElectricClover]

It's much more likely it's an EMS technique. No one can say definitively 'cept Kishi so to act like one knows for sure is arrogant. It is however very likely perfect susano'o comes with the EMS, not rinnegan.

Susano'o is a sharingan technique, first of all, rinnegan moves beyond that nonsense. It's been shown that one's susano'o improves over the course of an eye. Take Sasuke. He got MS and then the skeleton susano'o. Then he got the arrow susano'o. Now he has EMS and has hawk susano'o. It's only logical that he will obtain perfect susano'o as the next step of EMS. Especially since EMS doesn't seem to have any other powerups besides stamina, as Itachi had the same type of susano'o as Sasuke in mere MS. If Itachi got EMS he would have nothing else, so it's very probable perfect susano'o is solely a perk of EMS.

You are only basing the fact that perfect susano'o needs rinnegan on Madara having rinnegan while using it. Like it's been said, he has had rinnegan up the whole battle, all while using susano'o. He can use EMS techniques even if his rinnegan is showing. In other words, we can extrapolate that he is using his EMS perfect susano'o but doesn't need to switch to EMS to use it.

Exactly when Madara obtained perfect susano'o is unclear, but my bet is before he fought Muu and Oonoki. Oonoki said that he was going easy on them when he saw perfect susano'o and Madara agreed. This pretty much says for itself that Madara had perfect susano'o but didn't use it on them. It would also be my guess that Madara had perfect susano'o when he fought Hashirama. Tsunade wondered if Hashirama fought against it, and Madara all but said yes, asserting that only Hashirama could stop him with perfect susano'o. Madara's fights with Hashirama and the Tsuchikages were before he got rinnegan, so perfect susano'o couldn't have come with it.

From the facts we can't say with absolute certainty perfect susano'o is an EMS tech and doesn't require rinnegan, but almost. It is near sure that perfect susano'o belongs to EMS.