[Theory] Peace through Strength: was Danzo on to something?

[Meowazziel]

People that become violent gets locked in jail.

Here, People that become violent gets locked with a seal.

It's the same idea.

Not perfect, but infinitely better than nothing.

indeed better than nothing.

But with my advanced ninshuu idea, ppl wont need to be locked or sealed.

They would get the wisdom, experience and insights of the immortal transmitted into their system, so that they would learn and want to maintain peace though.

A question about your seal system.
Can they act violent and will they than get sealed?
Or does it prevent them fron acting violent?
Because how can you seal someone who hasnt done something violent yet.

What do you think of my ninshu idea?

 

[david098]

you idiots talk about peace like it is a good thing. it makes people fat and lazy. -_-

(in reality, of course.)

 

[GhostProject]

The only thing Danzo was onto was fascism.

For peace to be real, it has to be an agreed thing. Otherwise it's meaningless. When someone has absolute control like this, only their ideas and interpretations end up mattering. That's not peace, it's tyranny.

But if someone were aiming to do it, this would be an incredible way to control...anyone over anything really. It would end in the hiding of newborns who would grow up trained to rebel and cause revolution, but it would be hard to accomplish.

 

[Senju Bean]

indeed better than nothing.

But with my advanced ninshuu idea, ppl wont need to be locked or sealed.

They would get the wisdom, experience and insights of the immortal transmitted into their system, so that they would learn and want to maintain peace though.

A question about your seal system.
Can they act violent and will they than get sealed?
Or does it prevent them fron acting violent?
Because how can you seal someone who hasnt done something violent yet.

What do you think of my ninshu idea?

The Seal system merely stops someone as they are about to attack. It's ok to seal preeptively. In real life, hitmen are often uncovered before the actual killing but still go to jail because of their intent to kill.

The ninshu idea is a good one, it actually may work.

But I still think it is better to put the seals on as a precautionary measure, even if he does the ninshu method

 

[Senju Bean]

The only thing Danzo was onto was fascism.

For peace to be real, it has to be an agreed thing. Otherwise it's meaningless. When someone has absolute control like this, only their ideas and interpretations end up mattering. That's not peace, it's tyranny.

But if someone were aiming to do it, this would be an incredible way to control...anyone over anything really. It would end in the hiding of newborns who would grow up trained to rebel and cause revolution, but it would be hard to accomplish.

So throwing someone in jail for violence is tyranny??? Are you serious?

The seal is the same thing except that it also stops the violence.

 

[Your Creepy Stalker]

The problem with that idea, is that If Danzo died, all the curse marks would vanish, and everyone would start being violent again, and since they are people, they would be violent.

 

[Narutosixpaths]

I mean in order to put these seals on people whoever was doing it would more or less have to subdue well everybody. Some people might agree willingly, but there are very few who would give up their freedom because even if it only freezes you in violent action you've now stripped yourself of any ability to defend yourself. I mean just too many questions with this like who gets to be the guy keeping his powers and sealing everyone else etc. Might as well just set out to be the next Kaguya and take over the world, just don't have any kids. :snick:

 

[valandil988]

indeed better than nothing.

But with my advanced ninshuu idea, ppl wont need to be locked or sealed.

They would get the wisdom, experience and insights of the immortal transmitted into their system, so that they would learn and want to maintain peace though.

A question about your seal system.
Can they act violent and will they than get sealed?
Or does it prevent them fron acting violent?
Because how can you seal someone who hasnt done something violent yet.

What do you think of my ninshu idea?

I'm sorry mate on the surface your idea SOUNDS nice but the real fact is that your own idea is just as bad as the Ops.

Fact is in your idea people don't learn on their own anyway, transmitting the thoughts and experiences of a "righteous immortal" is more or less no different from mind control. Your not teaching people, your telling them.

The truth is the only way true peace can come about is through generations upon generations of cultural advancement. To the point where conflict is no longer socially acceptable in anyway. Sure you will still get bad things happening outside of social norms but at least for the majority this is not a problem. And eventually even those that act outside of social norms would be sublimated.

Violence will still exist hatred will still existed. Yet covered by a very thick layer of civilization.

 

[Senju Bean]

I mean in order to put these seals on people whoever was doing it would more or less have to subdue well everybody. Some people might agree willingly, but there are very few who would give up their freedom because even if it only freezes you in violent action you've now stripped yourself of any ability to defend yourself. I mean just too many questions with this like who gets to be the guy keeping his powers and sealing everyone else etc. Might as well just set out to be the next Kaguya and take over the world, just don't have any kids. :snick:

There would be no need to defend since no one can attack. That's the whole point.

Well, the guy would presumably put the seal on himself after everyone is tagged, as a gesture of good faith.

 

[Senju Bean]

I'm sorry mate on the surface your idea SOUNDS nice but the real fact is that your own idea is just as bad as the Ops.

Fact is in your idea people don't learn on their own anyway, transmitting the thoughts and experiences of a "righteous immortal" is more or less no different from mind control. Your not teaching people, your telling them.

The truth is the only way true peace can come about is through generations upon generations of cultural advancement. To the point where conflict is no longer socially acceptable in anyway. Sure you will still get bad things happening outside of social norms but at least for the majority this is not a problem. And eventually even those that act outside of social norms would be sublimated.

Violence will still exist hatred will still existed. Yet covered by a very thick layer of civilization.

Well, a certain amount of control is needed.

We are slaves to the law, yet the law protects us from criminals.

Should we abolish all laws and allow absolute freedom?

 

[Senju Bean]

The problem with that idea, is that If Danzo died, all the curse marks would vanish, and everyone would start being violent again, and since they are people, they would be violent.

Well, it would be placed by someone like Hagaromo. Surely such seals would never fade.

 

[Your Creepy Stalker]

Well, it would be placed by someone like Hagaromo. Surely such seals would never fade.

No, it would fade when he died.

 

[kageking]

Well op, you answer your own question. How would you enjoy your life being dictated and controlled in that way? Would you really be satisfied? A danzou like figure who takes for himself the power to decide what is right and wrong for everyone else. Why does that even sound like a remotely good idea to you? If however you truly believe it is a good idea perhaps you should try living in north korea for a while. I hear it's wonderful this time of year.

 

[Zorø]

Nice theory bro.

 

[Senju Bean]

Well op, you answer your own question. How would you enjoy your life being dictated and controlled in that way? Would you really be satisfied? A danzou like figure who takes for himself the power to decide what is right and wrong for everyone else. Why does that even sound like a remotely good idea to you? If however you truly believe it is a good idea perhaps you should try living in north korea for a while. I hear it's wonderful this time of year.

North Korea? That's way off topic.

The seals are the same exact thing as the current legal system right now. I indicated that many times throughout this thread.

If someone kills someone, they get thrown in jail. That is the same exact thing as the seal system I mentioned.

No one seemed to have read that point.

 

[Meowazziel]

I'm sorry mate on the surface your idea SOUNDS nice but the real fact is that your own idea is just as bad as the Ops.

Fact is in your idea people don't learn on their own anyway, transmitting the thoughts and experiences of a "righteous immortal" is more or less no different from mind control. Your not teaching people, your telling them.

The truth is the only way true peace can come about is through generations upon generations of cultural advancement. To the point where conflict is no longer socially acceptable in anyway. Sure you will still get bad things happening outside of social norms but at least for the majority this is not a problem. And eventually even those that act outside of social norms would be sublimated.

Violence will still exist hatred will still existed. Yet covered by a very thick layer of civilization.

I agree with what you say about civilization.
I think so too. But that seems more of a idea for the real world.

My idea for the naruto world wont be forced as you say.

You say:
True peace can come about through generations upon generations of cultural advancement. To the point where conflict is no longer socially acceptable in anyway. Sure you will still get bad things happening outside of social norms but at least for the majority this is not a problem. And eventually even those that act outside of social norms would be sublimated.

Basically the immortal would speed up the proces.
The immortal would transmit for example, certain stories to people. They would know what conflict is about, but it will not happen in the real world, but it would help people to understand. He could transmit other information.
All this information would lead to someone going through experience or phases to want peace.

Its not like the immortal transmits the wish to want and maintain peace to people.
The information he sends, will lead to people wanting it themselfs.

This only works though if a certain something would be true for mankind in the naruto world.
That when a human goes through certain experiences, and gain certain insights, that it makes him/her want peace.
Just as when you add yellow to blue, it turns green. The immortal wont wait for yellow to find blue (wont wait for conflicts, wars etc. to occur and generations of cultural advancement to have happened), but he will add the yellow to the blue.

Basically one needs to know conflict to know peace.
Instead of conflict and wars needing to happen in the naruto world, from which people through experience, could learn the insights to want and maintain peace, the immortal will make them have the right experiences, without them having to happen in the naruto world.

One would know conflict through transmitted data from the immortal.
A bit similar to how people changed and understood Naruto and Hashirama, when the stories of their hearts were transmitted to them.
They didnt have to go through the same experiences in the naruto world, to understand their feelings.

So if Naruto is where he is, through expriences of conflict, lonelyness, losing people etc., than all that can be prevented to happen in the naruto world, by having such experiences be transmitted to someone, so that they can learn the same, without casualties having to happen.

I am not saying the immortal will transmit Naruto's story.
It is just an example.

 

[valandil988]

Well, a certain amount of control is needed.

We are slaves to the law, yet the law protects us from criminals.

Should we abolish all laws and allow absolute freedom?

Ahhh but we are talking about the Idealized peace and freedom.


Which in truth would be a world without laws an restrictions but only pure understanding of one another. This kind of world simply cannot exist. It is a world without pragmatism and only exists in story books.

Kishi says it himself, when two opposing forces work together peace and happiness can be found. Ergo the middle path is one which concerns both light and dark acts.

Light: Freedom within reason.

Dark: Laws within reason.

And between them, Understanding.

 

[Vapid]

I don't think Danzo was trying to bring peace to the world in any way.