[Theory] [Official]The Giant Tobi Discussion/Theory Thread

[Mino]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

I TOO THINK THAT TOBI IS NOT MADARA BUT EVERY HINTS ARE GOING AGAINST.I FORGOT THE EPISODE BUT WHEN HE OPEN HIS MASK INFORNT OF KISAME ,HE SAYS HE IS MADARA.THERE IS SOMETHING THAT KISI IS HIDING FROM US.HE WANT US TO BELIEVE THAT TOBI IS MADARA.

HE HAS NEVERSHOWN
HIS MS UNTIL KNOW SO IT IS NOT SURE THAT HE IS MADARA CUZ MADARA HAS EMS.

does not mean he has to spam it like sasuke would. he is subtle and wants everyone to know as little as possible about him. as far as we know Kisame has seen his face and recognized him as madara.. I also think that Zetsu have seen madara without his mask. kisame and zetsu are his closest known allies.

 

[GaaratheFifth]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Really good post, OP.

I just cannot believe that Tobi would still be wearing the mask and playing his cards so close to his chest if he was Madara. He probably has Madara's eyes, but come on.

Also, notice at the end of the chapter when Sasuke's mother is sensing the fight, and the father, the chief of the police, is nowhere to be found??

 

[Perkele311]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

It doesn't mean that he isn't Madara. He must be hiding something. But if you remember the only reason a Ninja Alliance was created is because they are going up against Madara. So with his reputation it would also make sense for him to hide himself and abilities. It was the same with pein. His identity was not revealed till the end really. I am thinking he went by Tobi to blend in with the Akatski members. Which caused the whole Kabuto calling madara Tobi because that is what he was called by Akatski. Or it could really be someone else that uses multiple sets of eyes and collects them. But on the topic of this post I don't think this means Madara isn't able to use MS it hasn't been established yet what his ocular powers are still capable of. I am going to wait and see.

 

[elcob32]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

I don't for a moment believe that Tobi is Madara, and I disagree with those in this post who said it has been proven.

Kishi has been keeping the story of Tobi incredibly quiet, so there is no way to prove it one way or another.

Also there is no place in this chapter that Tobi's MS is shown.

 

[kisamexRocks]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

I don't for a moment believe that Tobi is Madara, and I disagree with those in this post who said it has been proven.

Kishi has been keeping the story of Tobi incredibly quiet, so there is no way to prove it one way or another.

Also there is no place in this chapter that Tobi's MS is shown.

Who can Tobi possibly be? OBITO????????????

 

[InevitablePAIN]

How is TOBI NOT MADARA?
When Itachi died, Tobi revealed himself to Kisame

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Kisame saying "I didn't think you were pulling the strings madara" Tobi took off the mask , are you suggesting that Kisame was blind or don't know who is madara?
P.s check the page before when he takes off his mask.

 

[elcob32]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Tobi, has nearly everyone believing that he is Madara, with the possible exception of Kabuto. Why is it so unreasonable to believe that he also has Kisame fooled.

Kisame, also calls him Mizukage, but No one has suggested that his real identity is Yagura the forth Mizukage.

 

[Jinchuuriki of Juubi]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

I don't for a moment believe that Tobi is Madara, and I disagree with those in this post who said it has been proven.

Kishi has been keeping the story of Tobi incredibly quiet, so there is no way to prove it one way or another.

Also there is no place in this chapter that Tobi's MS is shown.

Tobi's MS has yet to be seen.kishi's got something weird going on

 

[Jinchuuriki of Juubi]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

How is TOBI NOT MADARA?
When Itachi died, Tobi revealed himself to Kisame

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Kisame saying "I didn't think you were pulling the strings madara" Tobi took off the mask , are you suggesting that Kisame was blind or don't know who is madara?
P.s check the page before when he takes off his mask.

i think Kisame would know better.and he said it straight up too.and he said that he was glad to know the operation was in better hands....thats a pretty crazy statement.pain was the leader.and he states he feels better knowing madara is the actual one pulling strings.

 

[Regulus]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Tobi, has nearly everyone believing that he is Madara, with the possible exception of Kabuto. Why is it so unreasonable to believe that he also has Kisame fooled.

Kisame, also calls him Mizukage, but No one has suggested that his real identity is Yagura the forth Mizukage.

YOu cant say he has everyone fooled unless he is fooling them, if Tobi is Madara then he is fooling no one

 

[silenceofthelambs]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

If "Tobi" really isn't Madara, then he has done quite an excellent job feigning his identity, because apparently, almost every person (all with a good amount of intelligence) is convinced that he is Madara Uchiha.

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Whatever "Tobi" has done to fool so many people, it is brilliant. Only Kabuto seems to know his true identity, but in my opinion, Madara is who he says he is. But, of course, that might be proved wrong. There is something suspicious about the way Kishimoto keeps his identity hidden, but I suppose that is to build greater suspense. After all, not knowing who he actually is makes the story that much better.

 

[whoami28]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

IMO Kabuto doesn't know his true identity, but rather knows his weakness, and that weakness relates to whatever was in the last coffin. I also don't think Kishi is keeping him hidden because he isn't Madara, but rather because his face may still hide something important. But it is surprising that Kisame didn't mention anything unique about Madara's face, perhaps because Kisame already met Madara before as the Mizukage.

 

[kisamexRocks]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

IMO Kabuto doesn't know his true identity, but rather knows his weakness, and that weakness relates to whatever was in the last coffin. I also don't think Kishi is keeping him hidden because he isn't Madara, but rather because his face may still hide something important. But it is surprising that Kisame didn't mention anything unique about Madara's face, perhaps because Kisame already met Madara before as the Mizukage.

Madara was Mizukage during the time he met with Kisame, I also think that Kisame worked for Madara in the past, before he created Akatsuki and went after the tailed beasts. Well Madara did say Kisame was dear to him and very close. So I am assuming that those only close to Madara and are trusted enough are shown his true face.

 

[eebster]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

I was just wondering after reading the 500 episode..why would Kishi ask "Whos face lies behind the mask!".
Now it could have been a bad translation.
Then again if it wasn't, clearly kishi is trying to say something and couldn't throw out a clearer hint then that! seriously! it's like drawing Naruto at an end of a manga episode staring at his apponent and writing "and who could this young blonde boy from Konaha be?!?!".
We should have already come to the conclusion the man behind the mask is Tobi, Tobi was a hidden identity and the real identity is Madara who leads the Akutski from behind Pain....and that's something that a 12 year old could have managed as it wasn't something that needed any figuring out "whats it's been written in BOLD letters in the past few episodes".
Yet for some odd reason now he asks..."Whos face lies behind the mask!"?

It's easy to argue that, perhaps Kishi intention was to make it seem that WE may know, but neither Minato or Kushina do (yet that seems a little ameture for such an experienced Manga writer).
Or he could have done it to intentionaly confuse us (which to me as also very ameture like, and it would just be the same as mentioned before with the drawing Naruto example, I would concider it weak from the writer).

The only realistic thing I can think of which sounds kind of fine was that he send that plant guy to do the work for him...BUT then comes episode 501, which clearly shows him controling the 9 tails and the Sharingen....

So if his intention was the first I mentioned...it gets me wondering, who is this masked man? and is that person in the coffin Madara?

 

[Xentinel]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

I TOO THINK THAT TOBI IS NOT MADARA BUT EVERY HINTS ARE GOING AGAINST.I FORGOT THE EPISODE BUT WHEN HE OPEN HIS MASK INFORNT OF KISAME ,HE SAYS HE IS MADARA.THERE IS SOMETHING THAT KISI IS HIDING FROM US.HE WANT US TO BELIEVE THAT TOBI IS MADARA.

HE HAS NEVERSHOWN
HIS MS UNTIL KNOW SO IT IS NOT SURE THAT HE IS MADARA CUZ MADARA HAS EMS.

Well, his right. That was the only prove that tobi is Madara...Although, tobi face is hidden in this chapter..but it appear that Kisame claim that tobi is Madara, saying the formal Mizukage. Kisame weren't lying, he telling the truth. So if we say that tobi is obito..or saying that madara actually controled obito body...then why Kisame say it is Madara??

For my opinion, Kishi actually do it this on purpose..He wants us to be suspicious and predictable abt this...He even doesnt want to revealed Madara's face U_U It is impossible for him drawing madara face in the chapter was such a pain. Who knows...Kishi doesnt want draw his face, cuz he too ugly and old lol..Well,what I think is that tobi is Madara...not anyone else or obito or whoever it is..but it is Madara, no doubt abt it :|

Spoiler

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[Naruto Chapter 404, pg 1-2]

 

[eebster]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

I'd also like to add, after looking at every link that silenceofthelamb has placed there (thank you for your effort), I'd like to point out what was going through my head.

At first it seemed it was all clear that the man behind the mask is Tobi who is Madara.
he also shows himself to Kisame who I guess knew Madara from before and believed this was Madara.
Or was that just to throw us off?

You see, towards the last few Episodes things started to give us a window to question whether Tobi is Madara or not (which wasn't possible 50-60 episodes before).
When the Kage's asked him "if you were Madara why would you beat around the bush, surely with your powers you can execute anything without anyones help" (yes I'm aware he gave an excuse for that, which should be expected either way.

Then comes the question, now he's admiting to everyone he is Madara and want the word to spread, why is he still hiding his face? clearly not for the sake of hiding an identity anymore (someone can say it's because theres something special..or strong that he will reveal when he unmasks), yet when Kisame saw his face he didn't act like he saw something strange, and actually just walked away. So why would he be still hiding his face?

Then comes Kakashis small amount of doubt, which you can hear it time and time again, even after he's sais he's Madara. when he said he was Madara again Kakashi tells him "so you admit you're Madara!". Then when he goes and speaks to the Hokage, after she asks him "so Uchiha Madara is still alive" he replies with "I don't have any Solid proof" which means he believes it a high chance to be true, but he still has some sort of doubt.

But the final episode he linked just opened this window WIDE open.
After Kabuto opens the last coffin. and Tobi tells him that he will be watching him, Kabotu replies in a cocky manner "I didn't expect anything less fro Uchiha Madara" just for Tobi to reply "Cheeky brat.." (a little corny but i'm sure it sounds better in Japanese). And a drawing of Kabuto giving a cheeky smirk after that...
I could be looking too deep into it, but it just looks like he was telling Tobi "I know you're true identity but I wont tell anyone".

 

[whoami28]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

At first it seemed it was all clear that the man behind the mask is Tobi who is Madara.
he also shows himself to Kisame who I guess knew Madara from before and believed this was Madara.
Or was that just to throw us off?

In some ways Kisame was surprised, but only that he didn't know Tobi was Madara. Other than that Kisame did not seem surprised in any way that would suggest that Madara had 'changed' since he knew him as the Mizukage. The point I was trying to make earlier was that Madara had most likely remained the same after losing to the 1st Hokage, as that was the time period when he became the Mizukage.

But the final episode he linked just opened this window WIDE open.
After Kabuto opens the last coffin. and Tobi tells him that he will be watching him, Kabotu replies in a cocky manner "I didn't expect anything less fro Uchiha Madara" just for Tobi to reply "Cheeky brat.." (a little corny but i'm sure it sounds better in Japanese). And a drawing of Kabuto giving a cheeky smirk after that...
I could be looking too deep into it, but it just looks like he was telling Tobi "I know you're true identity but I wont tell anyone".

As for Madara's response to Kabuto, I felt that "Cheeky brat..." was more of Madara being annoyed at someone so new to his powers could be so cocky around Madara Uchiha, a very intelligent and experience ninja.

As for the entire thread, I still think that Madara only used Tobi as a pseudonym as there were ninjas from the villages gathering info on Akatsuki, and if he went around boasting that he was Madara some of the other ninja villages would become worried about Akatsuki, previously they were only considered terrorists that would be dealt with once they became a direct threat. However, I will agree that both sides have good arguments, and that I would not be surprised if Madara and Tobi are really separate ninjas. Kishi is good with his twists, and perhaps it is because I am so adamant that Madara is Tobi and vice versa that the truth will be different from what I expect.

 

[darkraikiri]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

It seems like someone is jumping to conclusions.
Just cause the little circle doesn't come out looking a sharingan doesn't mean anything. If we look back to when the Kyuubi attacked 12 years ago, it doesn't have a sharingan. And if I looked at that picture correctly, when Madara fought the first, it didn't seem to have a sharingan eye anyway.

Myself, I believe Tobi isn't Madara either since he never clearly stated it but only talked in third person. But your evidence is slightly wishywashy...

 

[Honord Sage]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

If Tobi is not Madara, then who is He? A missing Uchiha we do not know of? I do admit their some discrepancies between the Madara of legends and this Madara, but there is at this time not enough information at had to be 100% sure who is this Madara for sure only His corps examined by the experts can verified for sure who He is.

 

[angelg33]

Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Tobi, has nearly everyone believing that he is Madara, with the possible exception of Kabuto. Why is it so unreasonable to believe that he also has Kisame fooled.

Kisame, also calls him Mizukage, but No one has suggested that his real identity is Yagura the forth Mizukage.

...I did a long time ago. I've always thought that. I'm usually wrong, but I like the surprises when I AM wrong