[Theory] [Official]The Giant Tobi Discussion/Theory Thread

Who is the man behind the mask


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toadvenom

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Tobi has made everyone believe he is Madara, including Itachi, Kakashi, the Kages and others. Maybe he is doing this to throw everyone off, or maybe he has a plan involving Madara (which explains why Tobi was shocked looking at Kabuto's coffin, i think the coffin had Madara's body in it). Why?
Because after reading Chapter 501, we can conclusively say that Tobi (the man in the mask) is not Madara. He has achieved the same level of skill as Madara with EMS, but its not Madara. Let me explain

We know from Sasuke vs. Itachi fight that the power of the MS is to control the Kyuubi:

When Itachi began to tell Sasuke that awakening the MS leads to blindness, sasuke responded by saying this:
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So we know that although MS leads to blindness, it also allows one to control the fox. But the condition is that the Fox must be loose. If the Fox is in a Jinchukriki, MS cannot control the Fox. This is why TOBI told Kushina that he waited so long for Naruto's birth. Simply put, he needed the seal to be undone if he was to control the Kyuubi.
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But here is the thing: We know what Madara's MS and EMS looks like. We have seen it several times:
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Not only this, but we also know what Madara's EMS looked like while he was controlling the Kyuubi during the Hashirama fight:

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It clearly looks like the same EMS Madara had always had. So, we can say for sure that Madara's EMS did not look any different when he was specifically controlling the Kyuubi.

But what do we see in 501?
The masked man who controlled the Kyuubi with his MS once Kushina could not hold it in anymore looks completely different!!!! Here we see an image of the Kyuubi's eyes reflecting the change in Madara's eyes.. (we all know that when sharingan users control bijuu or summons, whatever the user's sharingan looks like becomes reflected on the beasts eye) (we saw this when Sasuke controlled Manda)

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That sharingan is NOT Madara's sharingan. It is a completely different design
The middle pupil grows untill the tomoes are pushed out to the edge. This is the masked man going from sharingan to MS. Again, Tobis Sharingan looks nothing like Madara's Sharingan

Therefore Tobi is NOT madara. I dont know who Tobi is but its not madara. The proof is in the pudding. People should just put this issue to rest already.
 
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kisamexRocks

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

The middle pupil grows untill the tomoes are pushed out to the edge. This is the masked man going from sharingan to MS. Again, Tobis Sharingan looks nothing like Madara's Sharingan

Therefore Tobi is NOT madara. I dont know who Tobi is but its not madara. The proof is in the pudding. People should just put this issue to rest already.
Madara is Tobi. Tobi is Madara.

I don't understand why everyone cannot realize that the eye being shown and zoomed in to where the tomoes are pushed to the edge is the FOXES EYES. The reason the PUPIL is EXPANDING and the TOMOES are being pushed is to SHOW CONTROL OF THE FOX.
The eye zooming in is the Foxes LEFT EYE. The eye we see Madara use is his RIGHT EYE. LOOK AT THE ANGLES THE EYES ARE SHAPED.
 
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Jinchuuriki of Juubi

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Madara is Tobi. Tobi is Madara.

I don't understand why everyone cannot realize that the eye being shown and zoomed in to where the tomoes are pushed to the edge is the FOXES EYES. The reason the PUPIL is EXPANDING and the TOMOES are being pushed is to SHOW CONTROL OF THE FOX.
The eye zooming in is the Foxes LEFT EYE. The eye we see Madara use is his RIGHT EYE. LOOK AT THE ANGLES THE EYES ARE SHAPED.
exactly I don't see why people can't figure that out
 
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Mino

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Madara is Tobi. Tobi is Madara.

I don't understand why everyone cannot realize that the eye being shown and zoomed in to where the tomoes are pushed to the edge is the FOXES EYES. The reason the PUPIL is EXPANDING and the TOMOES are being pushed is to SHOW CONTROL OF THE FOX.
The eye zooming in is the Foxes LEFT EYE. The eye we see Madara use is his RIGHT EYE. LOOK AT THE ANGLES THE EYES ARE SHAPED.
what he said
 
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whoami28

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Your argument for that Madara used the EMS to control the fox is also a little off. Madara was using the EMS to fight the 1st hokage, which he would have required to fight the hokage with or without the fox. Sasuke was able to dissipate the fox within Naruto only using his regular sharingan
 
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toadvenom

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

when biju is under sharingan control, the type of sharingan being used to subdue the biju becomes reflected in the biju's eyes. The same is true for controlling summons. Look at pein. His summons had rinnegan becuz he was controlling them. Manda too when sasuke controlled him. So the sharingan we see in the kyuubi is Tobi's sharingan.
 

toadvenom

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

And its different from Madaras sharingan. Which means Tobi is not Madara. Period. U guys will see, ill put a million dollars on it.
 

kisamexRocks

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

And its different from Madaras sharingan. Which means Tobi is not Madara. Period. U guys will see, ill put a million dollars on it.
We will have to wait for the next chapter to see if Madara actually uses someone else's sharingan or his own. If Madara uses his MS or EMS and it's exactly the same as his original one, then it has to be Madara nobody else. We'll have to wait till next week.
 

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Tobi has made everyone believe he is Madara, including Itachi, Kakashi, the Kages and others. Maybe he is doing this to throw everyone off, or maybe he has a plan involving Madara (which explains why Tobi was shocked looking at Kabuto's coffin, i think the coffin had Madara's body in it). Why?
Because after reading Chapter 501, we can conclusively say that Tobi (the man in the mask) is not Madara. He has achieved the same level of skill as Madara with EMS, but its not Madara. Let me explain

We know from Sasuke vs. Itachi fight that the power of the MS is to control the Kyuubi:

When Itachi began to tell Sasuke that awakening the MS leads to blindness, sasuke responded by saying this:
You must be registered for see images


So we know that although MS leads to blindness, it also allows one to control the fox. But the condition is that the Fox must be loose. If the Fox is in a Jinchukriki, MS cannot control the Fox. This is why TOBI told Kushina that he waited so long for Naruto's birth. Simply put, he needed the seal to be undone if he was to control the Kyuubi.
You must be registered for see images


But here is the thing: We know what Madara's MS and EMS looks like. We have seen it several times:
You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images


Not only this, but we also know what Madara's EMS looked like while he was controlling the Kyuubi during the Hashirama fight:

You must be registered for see images

It clearly looks like the same EMS Madara had always had. So, we can say for sure that Madara's EMS did not look any different when he was specifically controlling the Kyuubi.

But what do we see in 501?
The masked man who controlled the Kyuubi with his MS once Kushina could not hold it in anymore looks completely different!!!! Here we see an image of the Kyuubi's eyes reflecting the change in Madara's eyes.. (we all know that when sharingan users control bijuu or summons, whatever the user's sharingan looks like becomes reflected on the beasts eye) (we saw this when Sasuke controlled Manda)

You must be registered for see images

That sharingan is NOT Madara's sharingan. It is a completely different design
The middle pupil grows untill the tomoes are pushed out to the edge. This is the masked man going from sharingan to MS. Again, Tobis Sharingan looks nothing like Madara's Sharingan

Therefore Tobi is NOT madara. I dont know who Tobi is but its not madara. The proof is in the pudding. People should just put this issue to rest already.
its also been proven that Tobi A.K.A Maddara can take other peoples sharingan! and kakashi proved that you can use MS of the sharingan you take so mabey Maddara diddnt want to get his sharingan damaged if minato tried to strike his eyes.
 
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whoami28

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Why do people quote the longest posts then have so little to say about them?

Also Madara/Tobi (w/e you want to call him, I think they are the same, Tobi was just a pseudonym b/c letting everyone know he was Madara would be risky, and it's easier to survive when no one knows who you really are as a ninja, especially if the ninja is already well known) said he had "waited so long" which to me sounds like it really IS Madara who has waited over 100 years to get back at Konoha.

As for Madara/Tobi not using the Mangekyo, I was trying to say that sharingan users don't need to use the Mangekyo to control the fox, whereas you are stating that because Tobi/Madara didn't use the Mangekyo to control the fox Tobi/Madara must not be able to use it. Perhaps this is true that he has no access to or limited access to the Mangekyo, but I don't think that because he didn't use it on the fox we can definitively say Tobi/Madara doesn't have the Mangekyo.

Perhaps I'll be proved wrong, but I think people are reading into the Tobi/Madara thing too much, just like people are reading into the Obito/Tobi/Madara thing too much. Madara is Madara, Tobi was a fake identity so Akatsuki wouldn't be given the highest priority of all the villages. At least that is the way I understand it.
 
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notgoma

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Just a comment. TOADVENOM's theory is really well supported by evidence and I appreciate him for that. There's a logic behind his theory unlike some people who just butt out their opinions without any evidence to back it up with.

I just don't like people arguing to close the issue that TOBI is 100% MADARA. You guys aren't the author and as we know, kishi likes to put lots of twists in naruto. I just hope people would be open to the idea that TOBI isn't MADARA and appreciate people who voice out their opinions. Have a little respect for our fellows in this forum. I just find it rude for someone to say: "TOBI IS 100% MADARA. PERIOD. GET OVER IT". My reply: "DUDE you aren't the author, pls be open to ideas"

TOBI not being MADARA is a high probability based on how KISHI turns up with twists and the many subtle hints in the manga (which i don't like to elaborate anymore because many people would just disprove my hints, although my hints didn't need disproving coz i emphasize that there are also other hints supporting that TOBI is in fact MADARA. ^_^

Again, nice theory by TOADVENOM. :)
 
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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

heres what i noticed.. every photo of madara you can only see his left eye, and well with tobi, you could only see his right eye..

I jst think that maybe, he only has 1 eye EMS? xd

you could see in one page above.. that madara only took the left eye.. maybe jst maybe both the UCHIHA brothers madara and izuna are still alive and both shared there eyes with one another.. just a thought.. i dnt have any proof or anything.. I know madara said that "what was the point of my brothers sacrifice.." or somthing.. but still, i havent seen madara with both eyes having EMS..
 
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Mino

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Madara is Tobi. Tobi is Madara.

I don't understand why everyone cannot realize that the eye being shown and zoomed in to where the tomoes are pushed to the edge is the FOXES EYES. The reason the PUPIL is EXPANDING and the TOMOES are being pushed is to SHOW CONTROL OF THE FOX.
The eye zooming in is the Foxes LEFT EYE. The eye we see Madara use is his RIGHT EYE. LOOK AT THE ANGLES THE EYES ARE SHAPED.
again.. what he said. there is no evidence to support this theory. madara did simply not use MS...
 

BarBoBot

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Just a comment. TOADVENOM's theory is really well supported by evidence and I appreciate him for that. There's a logic behind his theory unlike some people who just butt out their opinions without any evidence to back it up with.

I just don't like people arguing to close the issue that TOBI is 100% MADARA. You guys aren't the author and as we know, kishi likes to put lots of twists in naruto. I just hope people would be open to the idea that TOBI isn't MADARA and appreciate people who voice out their opinions. Have a little respect for our fellows in this forum. I just find it rude for someone to say: "TOBI IS 100% MADARA. PERIOD. GET OVER IT". My reply: "DUDE you aren't the author, pls be open to ideas"
TOBI not being MADARA is a high probability based on how KISHI turns up with twists and the many subtle hints in the manga (which i don't like to elaborate anymore because many people would just disprove my hints, although my hints didn't need disproving coz i emphasize that there are also other hints supporting that TOBI is in fact MADARA. ^_^

Again, nice theory by TOADVENOM. :)
can anyone say hypocrite? You find it rude if someone says tobi is madara 100%, but you have no problem with the OP saying tobi is not madara. period.

I guess its only rude when you dont agree with it? :flaw:
 

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

Madara is Tobi. Tobi is Madara.

I don't understand why everyone cannot realize that the eye being shown and zoomed in to where the tomoes are pushed to the edge is the FOXES EYES. The reason the PUPIL is EXPANDING and the TOMOES are being pushed is to SHOW CONTROL OF THE FOX.
The eye zooming in is the Foxes LEFT EYE. The eye we see Madara use is his RIGHT EYE. LOOK AT THE ANGLES THE EYES ARE SHAPED.
You can be right in end, cause right now the only 100% certainty is with kishi, but your argument has a flaw as KisamexRocks pointed out!


can anyone say hypocrite? You find it rude if someone says tobi is madara 100%, but you have no problem with the OP saying tobi is not madara. period.

I guess its only rude when you dont agree with it? :flaw:
LOL..is an hypocrite!!Agree...
 
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Grim

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

im sure Kishi want us belive that tobi is Madara but in otherhand we dont have any 100% pruff, we didnt see his face, and we saw Sasukes MS billion times, and yet kishi didnt show us Tobis :p its quite weard, thats why im quite sure that Kishi is yet to show us real truth... so please, dont flame other peoples thoughts when ur not sure urself, u can dissagree....but not educate the others
 
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Mino

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

well so far have Kishi presented "Tobi" as madara and therefore he is madara and I cant se ANY reason for why he should not be? because we haven't seen his face without the mask? clearly he is hiding something, but i doubt that he has another identity. it is rather something related to his eyes. to let the enemy know as little as possible about themselves is the tactic. he clearly has the momentum and is shrouded in mystery.. he is after all madara
 

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Re: Tobi is not Madara. Period.

:cool:I TOO THINK THAT TOBI IS NOT MADARA BUT EVERY HINTS ARE GOING AGAINST.I FORGOT THE EPISODE BUT WHEN HE OPEN HIS MASK INFORNT OF KISAME ,HE SAYS HE IS MADARA.THERE IS SOMETHING THAT KISI IS HIDING FROM US.HE WANT US TO BELIEVE THAT TOBI IS MADARA.

HE HAS NEVERSHOWN
HIS MS UNTIL KNOW SO IT IS NOT SURE THAT HE IS MADARA CUZ MADARA HAS EMS.
 
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