Sasuke did see his face, WE (the readers) didn't see his face, that was the purpose of the darkness around the masked man. After he stood back up from the amaterasu attack, sasuke could clearly see him.
Hence why no any doubt arised. Further proves he saw same person twice which was obito. geez
appearance can change but answer me this, how did obito change from old (when he met kisame) back to young (currently talking to kisame)?? kisame clearly met an old guy in the past and obito was young
Madara couldnt move his ass, except to give eyes to nagato. Constantly managing a village via kage was out of his reach, so it couldnt be him. What makes u think obito was that young? We clearly dont know much of timeline here but it wasnt that back in the time, plus senju DNA are steroids.
I'm not saying Kisame thought Obito was really Madara. If anything, it seems to me that it is clear that Kisame knew Obito was not really Madara. But Obito said he was Madara so Kisame just simply referred to him as Madara since that's the alias he took on, he didn't ave anything else to call Obito. Later when Tobi reveals himself again to Kisame, Kisame identifies him as Mizukage-sama because the Tobi there and the "Madara" 10+ years ago are same people, he recognizes the scars. Kisame then says "Or Rather Madara-San" because he knew that's what He calle himself to everyone else and decided to continue to play on. At least that's what I was getting from the whole thing.
So... what, kisame didn't believe him so he asked for proof, then when obito revealed himself, kisame confirmed that he was not madara, but decided to go with it anyway?
the person controlling the mizukage was obito not madara, and he lied to him those years ago and that put it in kisame's mind to say yeah thats madara, madara was an old man back then but remember obito grew his hair out to be just like madara's for a while, so with kisame seeing the scars before and seeing the scars on obito's face later on in the series made him beleive that he was seeing the same person which he was
I'm not saying Kisame thought Obito was really Madara. If anything, it seems to me that it is clear that Kisame knew Obito was not really Madara. But Obito said he was Madara so Kisame just simply referred to him as Madara since that's the alias he took on, he didn't ave anything else to call Obito. Later when Tobi reveals himself again to Kisame, Kisame identifies him as Mizukage-sama because the Tobi there and the "Madara" 10+ years ago are same people, he recognizes the scars. Kisame then says "Or Rather Madara-San" because he knew that's what He calle himself to everyone else and decided to continue to play on. At least that's what I was getting from the whole thing.
....the masked man just walked up to kisame and said sorry. Then took off the mask, immediately kisame called him mizukage then called him madara, kisame never met obito that's part of this massive plot hole that kishimoto didn't fill
that's why I thought kagami uchiha was the masked man, the AGE and hairstyle is nearly perfect
Kishimoto doesn't care too much about the small details of Naruto. To explain the first point, the eye-bags were obviously the wrinkled Zetsu portion of his body. I believe Sasuke couldn't see who it really was due to the darkness but I may be wrong. For Kisame, I don't know what to say.. maybe Genjutsu?
So... what, kisame didn't believe him so he asked for proof, then when obito revealed himself, kisame confirmed that he was not madara, but decided to go with it anyway?
....the masked man just walked up to kisame and said sorry. Then took off the mask, immediately kisame called him mizukage then called him madara, kisame never met obito that's part of this massive plot hole that kishimoto didn't fill
that's why I thought kagami uchiha was the masked man, the AGE and hairstyle is nearly perfect
My issue with it being Madara in the past is that Madara was stuck to the Mazou until the day he died, he couldn't go anywhere else. The person Kisame met in the past had to be Obito because it couldn't have been anyone else IMO.
And I actually thought it was Kagami too until someone proved me wrong on it
the person controlling the mizukage was obito not madara, and he lied to him those years ago and that put it in kisame's mind to say yeah thats madara, madara was an old man back then but remember obito grew his hair out to be just like madara's for a while, so with kisame seeing the scars before and seeing the scars on obito's face later on in the series made him beleive that he was seeing the same person which he was
Sasuke never really considered him an ally, he even said so himself.
I was actually talking about Kisame being in a genjutsu, in both cases.
Madara was supposed to have died at the valley of the end, which was around 30/40 years before the series, meaning he wouldn't appear in any bingo book. And he would still look much older than he did when he was young.
didn't you see how kisame commited suicide? I don't think a simple genjutsu will work on him twice and obito didn't have time to use genjutsu the second time
why not?? so because madara is an old criminal, that means all the villages threw his pictures away?? madara has his own statue anyway
What proof that sasuke saw his face u have? Anime clearly shows obito goes into shadows then the mask drops. Stop speculating here.
Hence why no any doubt arised. Further proves he saw same person twice which was obito. geez
Madara couldnt move his ass, except to give eyes to nagato. Constantly managing a village via kage was out of his reach, so it couldnt be him. What makes u think obito was that young? We clearly dont know much of timeline here but it wasnt that back in the time, plus senju DNA are steroids.
Of course we didn't see the face in the anime THATS THE PURPOSE, the identity was a secret at that time. Sasuke clearly seen him face but we didnt, just like kisame saw the old guy face but WE didn't see the face. smh
OBITO WAS TO YOUNG TO MEET KISAME BACK THEN, that's the plot hole. Kisame wasn't even in akatsuki yet when he first met "madara", kisame has been in akatsuki for 10+ years SO that means obito was young around this time.
We don't know everything madara could do, your speculating. how do you think madara gave nagato his eyes??? by sitting on his butt??? no he got up and walked to nagato more than likely
senju dna cant make you look like the old guy that kisame was talking too in the past, I know that
My issue with it being Madara in the past is that Madara was stuck to the Mazou until the day he died, he couldn't go anywhere else. The person Kisame met in the past had to be Obito because it couldn't have been anyone else IMO.
And I actually thought it was Kagami too until someone proved me wrong on it
Zetsu. It seems that Madara already had Zetsu out and about plus Zetsu recognized Nagato himself so that's not so far-feteched. Moreover, I believe this because like I said, Madara wasn't able to disconnect himself from the Mazou and leave the cave. It's also possible that Zetsus kidnapped baby Nagato and brought him to the cave himself so that Madara could transplant his eyes. His parents didn't seem like shinobi so I doubt Zetsus would have a hard time kidnapping him and then bringing him back.
Zetsu. It seems that Madara already had Zetsu out and about plus Zetsu recognized Nagato himself so that's not so far-feteched. Moreover, I believe this because like I said, Madara wasn't able to disconnect himself from the Mazou and leave the cave. It's also possible that Zetsus kidnapped baby Nagato and brought him to the cave himself so that Madara could transplant his eyes. His parents didn't seem like shinobi so I doubt Zetsus would have a hard time kidnapping him and then bringing him back.
good answer but you forgot how will zetsu know to target nagato?? zetsu could've did the implant but madara would have to be there because nagato never left the scene, remember nagato got the eyes after the saved yahiko and jman showed up soon after
Nah u remember when deidara died and yahiko told akatsuki that tobi died to and only one who thought tobi was some useful was kisame.
so u r not seeing the plot,
kisame likes tobi.*_**_**_*
good answer but you forgot how will zetsu know to target nagato?? zetsu could've did the implant but madara would have to be there because nagato never left the scene, remember nagato got the eyes after the saved yahiko and jman showed up soon after
@ bold, now you're getting your facts mixed up man. Nagato had Rinnegan way back when his parents got killed, before he was saved by Yahiko.
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Madara more than likely told Zetsu to find him an Uzumaki, a person of tinted, red hair so that he could transplant his Rinnegan. After a few trials, they probably discovered that Nagato at probably 3 years old or less, (too young to remember), realized he was an Uzumaki and then transplanted the eyes and brought him back. A little bit of speculation on my part but I feel it's completely reasonable and plausible in this case.
I doubt it was last minute. It was way too obvious. Isn't it convenient that the only eye exposed through the mask with a Sharingan is his right eye and Kakashi's eye is a left Sharingan? And we also know that Kakashi got a Sharingan from Obito... It was too obvious.
Nah u remember when deidara died and yahiko told akatsuki that tobi died to and only one who thought tobi was some useful was kisame.
so u r not seeing the plot,
kisame likes tobi.*_**_**_*
@ bold, now you're getting your facts mixed up man. Nagato had Rinnegan way back when his parents got killed, before he was saved by Yahiko.
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Madara more than likely told Zetsu to find him an Uzumaki, a person of tinted, red hair so that he could transplant his Rinnegan. After a few trials, they probably discovered that Nagato at probably 3 years old or less, (too young to remember), realized he was an Uzumaki and then transplanted the eyes and brought him back. A little bit of speculation on my part but I feel it's completely reasonable and plausible in this case.
ok I was wrong about when nagato got rinnegan, thanks but now this is even more proof. Madara had to choice nagato personally because I doubt zetsu could find what madara was looking for and capture nagato, also nagato is an uzumaki for it makes even more sense for madara for find him personally since we all know uzumaki and senju are together
another reason nagato had to be found my madara is because if nagato got captured by zetsu wouldn't he remember?? its not like zetsu can use jutsu to stop nagato
now that I think about it, this changes nothing, obito is still to young to hav talking to kisame that long ago
I doubt it was last minute. It was way too obvious. Isn't it convenient that the only eye exposed through the mask with a Sharingan is his right eye and Kakashi's eye is a left Sharingan? And we also know that Kakashi got a Sharingan from Obito... It was too obvious.
that doesn't change the fact that obito is still too young to have met kisame that long ago, I have no problem with the current obito being the masked man, but the masked man from long ago doesn't match obito's age, and that's a massive problem.
my problem isn't that obito is the masked man, my problem is the timeline has an insane plot hole in it, and that make obito being the masked man a stupid idea IMO.
and maybe that's why kishimoto changed his mind, because the kakashi story fits better but the whole but everything else is a plot hole that's where kishimoto failed IMO
sasuke only looked at his eye and amataresu happened.he was not in a condition to ques. and give me a scan where sasuke ever called him madara.also itachi told him that madara was alive and obito came out of amataresu unscratched.these 2 things was enough for him to believe.
kisame,he saw obito only and believed that he is madara,thinking who else have the power to control the perfect jin.
so don't be butthurt that he didn't turned out the person you wanted him to be.tobi=obito was the perfect choice,obvious choice.
izuna,kagami,madara,etc. had no connection to the present generation of people we know and never were introduced in depths either.
so because kisame said tobi could've been useful that means they met before??
all akatsuki members are strong so of course they SHOULD be useful
ok I was wrong about when nagato got rinnegan, thanks but now this is even more proof. Madara had to choice nagato personally because I doubt zetsu could find what madara was looking for and capture nagato, also nagato is an uzumaki for it makes even more sense for madara for find him personally since we all know uzumaki and senju are together
another reason nagato had to be found my madara is because if nagato got captured by zetsu wouldn't he remember?? its not like zetsu can use jutsu to stop nagato
now that I think about it, this changes nothing, obito is still to young to hav talking to kisame that long ago
You ignored what I said, I said he captured Nagato when he was too young to remember which was mentioned here.
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All Zetsu would have to do is kidnap children who fit Madara's description, bring them to the cave and bring em back.
OT: Obito was not too young to talk to Kisame.
Obito's hair was long at two times. Here
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And here:
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In the second spoiler, it is probably 5-6 years later (Naruto and Sasuke were both very young) as it's during the Uchiha Massacre. The Bloody Mist Era was also during this time, the time where Obito would have definitely been old enough to talk to Kisame as he had long hair in both that the Uchiha Massacre and the Bloody Mist Era. It's not a plothole man
sasuke only looked at his eye and amataresu happened.he was not in a condition to ques. and give me a scan where sasuke ever called him madara.also itachi told him that madara was alive and obito came out of amataresu unscratched.these 2 things was enough for him to believe.
kisame,he saw obito only and believed that he is madara,thinking who else have the power to control the perfect jin.
so don't be butthurt that he didn't turned out the person you wanted him to be.tobi=obito was the perfect choice,obvious choice.
izuna,kagami,madara,etc. had no connection to the present generation of people we know and never were introduced in depths either.
so because obito avoided amaterasu, that means sasuke has to believe he's madara even after seeing his face??
what do you mean got in condition to question?? if obito wanted sasuke dead he'll be dead, sasuke just didn't say anything
who said I was mad because obito turned out to be the masked man???? I just said it had massive plot holes, which it does because obito was to young to talk to kisame.
obito is perfect in the present but in the past their are massive plot holes
why would kisame ask to see madara's face if he didn't know what madara looked like?? I think kisame talked to the real madara since we know madara was really alive back then
btw madara is kinda connected, he was still alive when obito was crush by the boulder and was alive awhile longer this is manga fact
You ignored what I said, I said he captured Nagato when he was too young to remember which was mentioned here.
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All Zetsu would have to do is kidnap children who fit Madara's description, bring them to the cave and bring em back.
OT: Obito was not too young to talk to Kisame.
Obito's hair was long at two times. Here
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And here:
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In the second spoiler, it is probably 5-6 years later (Naruto and Sasuke were both very young) as it's during the Uchiha Massacre. The Bloody Mist Era was also during this time, the time where Obito would have definitely been old enough to talk to Kisame as he had long hair in both that the Uchiha Massacre and the Bloody Mist Era. It's not a plothole man
I just told you ok, nagato getting rinnegan doesn't change the fact that obito was too young to meet kisame in the past
obito is around kakashi's age
so think about it, kakashi and guy were teens during the kyuubi attack on konoha, so that means obito was a teen
now, think about akatsuki, oro was in akatsuki when he left konoha WAY BEFORE itachi even grew up and joined, that means kisame join akatuki 16+ years ago AT LEAST (kisame made a comment about oro leaving which proves they were in akatsuki TOGETHER, ill find the link if you want), while obito was only a teen maybe younger and obito wasn't even a member of akatsuki yet, nagato was the leader. And this is only if I assume kisame joined akatsuki immediately.
