New Info about Hyugas and Kaguya/Hamura translated

[MAN OF SIN]

Already explained how it is not an evidence due to dilution. Tailed Beasts and his extremely potent chakra that matched Indra's produced the TSBs. Ninshuu apparently is the key to TSBs, as Sasuke took out the chakra by force and Naruto didn't. He is also an Ashura incarnate, who was able to produce them himself. Indra never did.

Yeah, what did you mean by they diluted? And Obito and Madara were all using the tailed beasts/Juubi by force and still produced TSBs. Lol

Really? I wonder why Kaguya and Hamura had them when Sage of the Six paths is some kind of pre-requisite for it.

I said Six Paths Sage Chakra, which is not exclusive to Hagoromo. Kaguya and Hamura both have it.

It will be true for Naruto as his own chakra is extremely weak, but Ashura at least had the potential to awaken extremely powerful chakra. Which he did so later on.

That's what I've been saying.

What? The Juubi is Kaguya. Break them up, and it's Kaguya in nine parts. Not sure what your point is here.

The Gedo Mazo is Kaguya's body. The tailed beasts are her chakra(along with the rest of world's chakra).

He didn't have the sage's strong chakra genes. He awoke his own chakra, a potent one, through his own hard-work. Again, the manga is clear cut on this. The ones the manga showed were.

This is getting too tedious. I have yet to see any manga scan that refutes the sage's statement. One cannot magically develop genes when he doesn't have any. In Ashura's case, he didn't inherit the Sage's strong chakra genes. He developed his own Chakra. And I am out as it feels like beating a dead horse at this point.

You can't develop strong chakra without having the genetic potential to begin with. Look at Minato, the guy's chakra was weaker than his infant son's as Kurama's chakra was too heavy for his body. It's also shown that it is hard to found compatible jins so you just can't just develop strong chakra from nothing.

A person's genes is completely from their parents. So who did Ashura get the strong chakra genes to rival his brother from, if not from his father? His mother? Lol

Like I said the genes were just recessive. Another explanation wouldn't make sense.

 

[1Told]

Why didn't Kaguya get Tenseigan?

Kishi fodderized her, she should've been the ultimate creation

cause it's a weapon not just an eye evolution like with the sharingan, you have to sacrifice a huge amount of byakugan to the tenseigan altar battery just to start the process.

 

[shelke]

Yeah, what did you mean by they diluted? And Obito and Madara were all using the tailed beasts/Juubi by force and still produced TSBs. Lol

I said Six Paths Sage Chakra, which is not exclusive to Hagoromo. Kaguya and Hamura both have it.



That's what I've been saying.



The Gedo Mazo is Kaguya's body. The tailed beasts are her chakra(along with the rest of world's chakra).



You can't develop strong chakra without having the genetic potential to begin with. Look at Minato, the guy's chakra was weaker than his infant son's as Kurama's chakra was too heavy for his body. It's also shown that it is hard to found compatible jins so you just can't just develop strong chakra from nothing.

A person's genes is completely from their parents. So who did Ashura get the strong chakra genes to rival his brother from, if not from his father? His mother? Lol

Like I said the genes were just recessive. Another explanation wouldn't make sense.

I said I wouldn't, but ... Damn:

1 - Because they awoke the Sage's chakra by combining the chakra of both the transmigrants. Obito had Hashirama cells as half his body and was using Madara's Rinnegan. Madara is self-explanatory. Nagato didn't have Hashirama's Chakra, therefore , he never awoke it, nor did he tampered with the Bijjus. The Bijuus are Kaguya. Combine that with the Transmigrants chakra and they awaken the Sage's Senjutsu, which produces TBB. It is clearly explained by the Sage:

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.

2 - Ashura didn't have the Sage's Chakra genes, but he carried the potential for a strong Chakra regardless. Being a direct descendant from the Kaguya also had its affects. The Sage also states that he 'gave ' Ashura the entire Ninshuu legacy which includes the naming and coorporation:

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.

3 - He was able to use TSB' because he was getting closer to Kaguya's power, as the TSB originally comes from her:

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- Because she's the original progenitor - A fact BZ repeats:

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4 - Sasuke lacks the second half of the puzzle, Ashura's chakra. Naruto has corporation on his side through Ninshuu and the names of the beasts, along with the Sage's chakra. Naturally he would awaken TSBs as this is how Ashura did. Is it a coincidence, that all of these people with TSBs house all the Bijuus and/or have parts of chakra from both the transmigrants? Is it also a coincidence, that Naruto has TSBs, knows the names of all Bijuus via Ninshuu like Ashura, and is also the transmigrant of Ashura? I don't think so. There is no evidence in the manga to refute this claim, so even try.

5 - Naruto's base chakra is nothing special. Neither in volume nor in potency. It's not overwhelmingly potent like Sasuke's or Madara's. He never had the Sage's strong chakra genes. He may have the potential for strong chakra regardless. Every strong chakra doesn't make it analogous to the Sage's chakra. Your argument doesn't even make any sense, when the sage and the manga and the author disagrees with you. He awoke it through hard work, and that chakra was not the Sage's chakra.

6 - Recessive Genes? This isn't ****ing biology when Chakra has no scientific evidence within science. Does the manga state it? No. Is it backed in any manner? No. Then your posts are absurd.

Bring out facts or don't waste my time by playing with semantics to suit your baseless posts. Believe you me, my knowledge in this (semantics) domain exceeds yours.

 

[MAN OF SIN]

I said I wouldn't, but ... Damn:

1 - Because they awoke the Sage's chakra by combining the chakra of both the transmigrants. Obito had Hashirama cells as half his body and was using Madara's Rinnegan. Madara is self-explanatory. Nagato didn't have Hashirama's Chakra, therefore , he never awoke it, nor did he tampered with the Bijjus. The Bijuus are Kaguya. Combine that with the Transmigrants chakra and they awaken the Sage's Senjutsu, which produces TBB. It is clearly explained by the Sage:

You must be registered for see links

.

2 - Ashura didn't have the Sage's Chakra genes, but he carried the potential for a strong Chakra regardless. Being a direct descendant from the Kaguya also had its affects. The Sage also states that he 'gave ' Ashura the entire Ninshuu legacy which includes the naming and coorporation:

You must be registered for see links

-

You must be registered for see links

.

3 - He was able to use TSB' because he was getting closer to Kaguya's power, as the TSB originally comes from her:

You must be registered for see links

- Because she's the original progenitor - A fact BZ repeats:

You must be registered for see links

4 - Sasuke lacks the second half of the puzzle, Ashura's chakra. Naruto has corporation on his side through Ninshuu and the names of the beasts, along with the Sage's chakra. Naturally he would awaken TSBs as this is how Ashura did. Is it a coincidence, that all of these people with TSBs house all the Bijuus and/or have parts of chakra from both the transmigrants? Is it also a coincidence, that Naruto has TSBs, knows the names of all Bijuus via Ninshuu like Ashura, and is also the transmigrant of Ashura? I don't think so. There is no evidence in the manga to refute this claim, so even try.

5 - Naruto's base chakra is nothing special. Neither in volume nor in potency. It's not overwhelmingly potent like Sasuke's or Madara's. He never had the Sage's strong chakra genes. He may have the potential for strong chakra regardless. Every strong chakra doesn't make it analogous to the Sage's chakra. Your argument doesn't even make any sense, when the sage and the manga and the author disagrees with you. He awoke it through hard work, and that chakra was not the Sage's chakra.

6 - Recessive Genes? This isn't ****ing biology when Chakra has no scientific evidence within science. Does the manga state it? No. Is it backed in any manner? No. Then your posts are absurd.

Bring out facts or don't waste my time by playing with semantics to suit your baseless posts. Believe you me, my knowledge in this (semantics) domain exceeds yours.

1-You need to be near death to to combine Ashura and Indra's chakra. This never happened with Obito.

2- So you're saying that Ashura got strong chakra genes through his grandmother? If so, then you contradicted your entire argument there...:| Btw, since it takes Ashura and Indra's chakra to awaken Hagoromo's chakra...wouldn't that mean Ashura did inherit his father's chakra?

3-He said that he was trying to get close Kaguya's level. Kaguya's power is far above Madara's, remember? He wasn't getting anywhere near close

4-Sasuke does have Ashura's chakra. Hashirama gave him some of his power, remember?

5-Naruto's strong chakra(which he got from his mom) is able to hold half of Kurama inside as an infant while an adult Kage can't. Tsunade even said that no one will be able to control Kurama's chakra like he can. It's special alright.

6- It's been shown through Indra that chakra can work like genetics. The Sharingan genetics skipped his father but he got it.

 

[shelke]

1-You need to be near death to to combine Ashura and Indra's chakra. This never happened with Obito.

2- So you're saying that Ashura got strong chakra genes through his grandmother? If so, then you contradicted your entire argument there...:| Btw, since it takes Ashura and Indra's chakra to awaken Hagoromo's chakra...wouldn't that mean Ashura did inherit his father's chakra?

3-He said that he was trying to get close Kaguya's level. Kaguya's power is far above Madara's, remember? He wasn't getting anywhere near close

4-Sasuke does have Ashura's chakra. Hashirama gave him some of his power, remember?

5-Naruto's strong chakra(which he got from his mom) is able to hold half of Kurama inside as an infant while an adult Kage can't. Tsunade even said that no one will be able to control Kurama's chakra like he can. It's special alright.

6- It's been shown through Indra that chakra can work like genetics. The Sharingan genetics skipped his father but he got it.

- No. Madara awoke it near death, because of such a small amount he used. It was just a very small piece of meat.

- Where did I contradict my argument? Plenty of people have strong chakra. He simply didn't have the genes' for Hogoromo's - a statement from Hogoromo himself. Frankly speaking, the manga gives zero explanation on this, so the best possible guess has to be potential. Whether it came from Kaguya or not is a moot point.

- Doesn't matter to me. I am showing you what the Sage states. Given that he lacked one half of Kurama and portions of all Bijuus. Even Kaguya was not at full power.

- No. Because the transmigration has already occurred within Naruto. Hashirama doesn't have Ashura's chakra anymore.

- I don't want to get into Naruto's chakra debate, to be honest. It's another discussion.

- Yes, which is why separate chakra genes are shown to be within individuals - a gene Ashura lacked.

 

[Kirin The Dragon Sage]

The answer is

Spoiler

Masashi Kishimoto and Team

but now is save if we stick to

Otsutsuki>Kaguya>Hamura>Hyugas

 

[SakuraHarunoHaterSlayer]

the hyuga clan is fodder still

 

[MAN OF SIN]

- No. Madara awoke it near death, because of such a small amount he used. It was just a very small piece of meat.

- Where did I contradict my argument? Plenty of people have strong chakra. He simply didn't have the genes' for Hogoromo's - a statement from Hogoromo himself. Frankly speaking, the manga gives zero explanation on this, so the best possible guess has to be potential. Whether it came from Kaguya or not is a moot point.

- Doesn't matter to me. I am showing you what the Sage states. Given that he lacked one half of Kurama and portions of all Bijuus. Even Kaguya was not at full power.

- No. Because the transmigration has already occurred within Naruto. Hashirama doesn't have Ashura's chakra anymore.

- I don't want to get into Naruto's chakra debate, to be honest. It's another discussion.

- Yes, which is why separate chakra genes are shown to be within individuals - a gene Ashura lacked.

- Where was it stated that it was because it was a small piece of meat?

- You said that being Kaguya's grandchild(on his father's side) made him have strong chakra, that would mean his father's genetics did play a role. And again, if Ashura didn't inherit father's chakra why does his chakra mixed with Indra's make up Hagoromo's? Either dormanted genes(like what I've been saying) or plot hole.

- Yeah, he doesn't say that he was getting close. Just that he was trying.

-Madara still had some Indra chakra left after his soul left. Hence the awaking of Hagoromo chakra.

-Fine.

-Okay, so chakra genes can be dormant in people.

 

[shelke]

- Where was it stated that it was because it was a small piece of meat?

- You said that being Kaguya's grandchild(on his father's side) made him have strong chakra, that would mean his father's genetics did play a role. And again, if Ashura didn't inherit father's chakra why does his chakra mixed with Indra's make up Hagoromo's? Either dormanted genes(like what I've been saying) or plot hole.

- Yeah, he doesn't say that he was getting close. Just that he was trying.

-Madara still had some Indra chakra left after his soul left. Hence the awaking of Hagoromo chakra.

-Fine.

-Okay, so chakra genes can be dormant in people.

- How much chakra do you even think was contained in that small piece of meat? It would be the logical answer.

- Not really. I gave you a possible explanation, as the manga states that he didn't inherit his father's chakra genes. It doesn't say he had the potential to awake his chakra either. That only leaves one with the other option that it must have been because of his grandmother. Because, ultimately Hogoromo is related to Kaguya and Ashura is the second direct descendant. According to the Sage, the Juubi Jins were in reality, trying to get close to his mother. I even gave you the scans.

- He doesn't have Ashura's chakra now. Madara awoke how he died - he had already gone through the mutation. Indra's chakra is now in Sasuke, not in Madara. The Mutation produces the Rinnegan, it doesn't make you a Juubi Jin. For that the user needs the Mezo and then the sealed Bijuus. The Rinnegan is just one very very small part of the Puzzle.

- No. The manga doesn't state it, so don't fish around for arguments when the manga doesn't have them.

 

[Blackdeath667]

while that may be how genetics work in real life... this is just ridiculous

 

[Made in Heaven]

from p 18
BYAKUGAN; the kekkeigenkai running only in the Hyuga clan.
(passed) From Kaguya to Hamura.
And later, after skipping many generations, the Byakugan Kaguya possessed was inherited (=genetic throwback) exclusively by the Hyuga clan. Since then, the Hyuga clan based on the head family, giving the top priority to the protection of this 'kekkeigenkai' have prospered.
↓Hyugas Byakugan. the Byakugan eyes of the(=hyuga's) head family have particularly high biocompatiblity with Hamuras descendants (bodies) when transplanted.

from p.21
The THOUSAND YEARS DARKNESS; light shall be sealed off from the entire posterity for a thousand years hence.
Hamura was firm in his resolve. He sealed all the eyeballs of (/for) a thousand years of his (mostly unborn) descendants into "Tensei-gan" to store up gargantuan volume of power.
that was the force to be unleashed after ascertaining whether or not the earthlings in a thousand years' time are using chakra properly

Thus
Hyugas arent hamuras descendants

retsu no sho says hagoromo was the only ootsutsuki who remained on the earth when the clan moved to the moon.

Hyugas arent hamuras descendants as they have eyeballs.
They got byakugan as a long throwback to kaguya, which implys that they are descended from hagoromo.

Source:TakL

So if Hinata has had Hamura's chakra within her since birth, yet she's not from Hamura's lineage, does that make her Hamura's incarnation?

 

[WalksInShadows]

i'm not inclined to believe this translation, primarily because Hagoromo made no mention whatsoever of the Hyuuga being descendants of his and secondly because Hamura was seen with the Byakugan and judging from Madara's story about Hagoromo, his powers were a product of the ones Kaguya acquired from the Shiju's fruit and not Kaguya's own genes so it only stands to reason that the Hyuuga clan is more directly associated with Hamura. Until something shows how a Rinnegan is genetically related to a Byakugan, it isn't as far as i'm concerned.

 

[RedRobin]

Well that makes things more simple. Basically every KKG is from Kaguya and Hago's descendants randomly picked up recessive genes over time like the Byakugan and Kimi's KKG.

 

[MAN OF SIN]

i'm not inclined to believe this translation, primarily because Hagoromo made no mention whatsoever of the Hyuuga being descendants of his and secondly because Hamura was seen with the Byakugan and judging from Madara's story about Hagoromo, his powers were a product of the ones Kaguya acquired from the Shiju's fruit and not Kaguya's own genes so it only stands to reason that the Hyuuga clan is more directly associated with Hamura. Until something shows how a Rinnegan is genetically related to a Byakugan, it isn't as far as i'm concerned.

Hagoromo didn't mention the Uzumaki clan either iirc and he didn't always have the Rinnigan. No where does it say that the Byukugan is from Kaguya's genes(it's requires hand seals and uses charka iirc). Hamura does have abilties that are products of the fruit as well, like chakra and truth seeking balls.

Madara's story is from the rewritten tablet, remember? Kaguya was never a princess and Hagoromo was never a jin(plot hole/retcon) according to the databook.

 

[HyuugaHeir]

So if Hinata has had Hamura's chakra within her since birth, yet she's not from Hamura's lineage, does that make her Hamura's incarnation?

Possible. I mean Hamura chose her.

 

[HyuugaHeir]

So many intelligent fans.
Why not leave it as hyuuga is connected to Hamura because of the last saying so?

be it by blood or an asspull reincarnation, all we can do is wait and respect each other speculations and theories.
Anyway it is fun hanging out here and reading stuffs.

 

[Char Aznable]

Hopefully the 4th Databook clears all this up.

Kishi wanked the Uchiha clans to unbelievable levels during Part 2. Leaving the Hyuga, Senju and Uzumaki clans to twist in the wind.

 

[HyuugaHeir]

On a sidenote, have you read something about juugo being from the hagoromo Clan?
I remember a dead man on the river being from the Hagoromo clan.
You know from that falshback chapters of hashirama.

 

[Char Aznable]

On a sidenote, have you read something about juugo being from the hagoromo Clan?
I remember a dead man on the river being from the Hagoromo clan.
You know from that falshback chapters of hashirama.

Probably like how Kimimaro is from the Kaguya clan.

Dat Oro

He must have been trying to gather the powers of Kaguya and the sage of the six paths.
Kimimaro - Bone manipulation like Kaguya
Juugo - Natural senjutsu
Karin - Uzumaki chakra chains
Sasuke - Sharingan


The only one he didn't get was a Hyuga

 

[HyuugaHeir]

Probably like how Kimimaro is from the Kaguya clan.

Dat Oro

He must have been trying to gather the powers of Kaguya and the sage of the six paths.
Kimimaro - Bone manipulation like Kaguya
Juugo - Natural senjutsu
Karin - Uzumaki chakra chains
Sasuke - Sharingan


The only one he didn't get was a Hyuga

Yes. And maybe that is what hiashi is protecting all this time.
Or mayb e the Hyuga is just ignored really.

So we have Hagoromo, Kaguya, and Hyuuga.
and Senju, Uchiha and Uzumaki.

six clans most likely inherited KKG from kaguya herself thru Hagoromo and hamura


Wait maybe that is how Oro comes back in part 3. he finally learns the final piece and that is a hyuuga. And Bolt and Himawari comes to play. haha.

Oh wait, Oro didnt get Sasuke. Be careful Sarada.