[CC] Nekura Training

[Corazon]

I know that lol, I was just asking a question. Nevermind. >.<

» waits for the perverts «

 

[Lucifer]

Spoiler

Interesting idea, though one thing I should point out is that the mechanics of the clan are always evolving as the manga evolves; Keigoku in it's simplest form is Bijuu chakra, or more specifically, Juubi chakra. Initially, it was though that this chakra only existed as a legend and deity like entity that didn't exist anymore. We later learned that this is somewhat true, except now everyone has Juubi chakra ( more or less, anyway ) and that it is the true primordial source of chakra. I'll explain more below.



Nice, nice. Keigoku isn't treated as Natural Energy, however; it can be seen as a form of Bijuu chakra that has special intangibility abilities.



Yes, everyone's cloak holds the same level of power.

Pseudo Jinchuriki, I like that. More or less, it's something akin to that. Nice lol.



Well, the explanation that me and Dork created through a series of talks early last year is related to Yin and Yang but not directly. Below is an excert he wrote about Keigoku:



The portion in bold is something that that is very noteworthy and should be remembered; it forms the basis behind the Irish reasoning of the clans inner workings and the separation between Juubi Malleable Chakra ( or as we dubbed it, JMC ) and Keigoku. Now, adding on to that bold portion. Keigoku can indeed be viewed as an altered form of the JMC that is canon. As per definition, Keigoku is a space/time utilized chakra source, using it through summoning. A sort of "yin summoning" one could say, somewhat a mixture of Space/time with Yamanaka traits to put it loosely. Now,

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refers to the spiritual energy that governs the imagination and the ability to create things from nothingness. Utilizing this with our form of Juubi Chakra as well as space/time ninjutsu, we are able to create a gathering and manifestation of Juubi Chakra from nothing (or, in terms of the RP, the Juubi's vessel on the moon) that we "teleport" to the fields we are in battle in. Due to this utilization of Yin release along with it, it gains a spiritual aspect to it, one to allows it to affect matter on a spiritual level, which in turn is why it has a level of intangibility to it, being able to bypass through things with a spiritual part of them, i.e. sentience. Now, the canon chakra that the Juubi uses in the manga, and by extension that Madara, Obito and the Sage of 6 Paths uses, is similar yet different than our chakra, as Randy stated above. Both have destructive and corrosive properties and the easiest way to explain this would be to simply separate one as the Yin aspect of it and the other as the Yang aspect of it. While this can be seen as true, I believe it to be somewhat different. While Keigoku can be seen as the Yin natured Juubi Chakra, I think the properties of the JMC is inherently different. A key trait of the JMC is it's ability to affect both living and unliving matter, something it has shown in multiple instances. This chakra is also the same chakra used by the Sage to split the Juubi himself into 9 different beasts, using the Creation of All Things, implying that it is both a yin and yang based attack, furthering being implied when it was mentioned by Tobirama of being a yin and yang natured attack, hence why it was able to negate all ninjutsu.
Now, if we accept this as being fundamentally correct, it leads to an issue: If we have a full yin and yang JMC source and derived from it comes the Yin based variant, then wherein lies the Yang variant? In all things there exist balance, more certainly when speaking of bijuu and the concept of yin and both yang. This train of thought leads me to view Sharingdork's original definition as both true and false. While it has the potential and can possibly be the Yang version of our Keigoku, JMC fits more so as the "perfect" chakra source, afflicting both spiritual and physical damage, hence why it is able to completely destroy edo summonings as it deteriorates both the spiritual and physical links that anchor those souls to our plane, which is the logic I based my own Nekura custom on. Now, this brings up a small issue of conflict as there can be two ways to view keigoku:

1. We accept Keigoku as a Yin natured variant of this, and JMC being the ultimate source, which we likely wouldn't reach due to missing the Yang variant and ponder more question on what would be the Yang variant. With this method, it leads us to question what exactly a Yang natured variant of Keigoku could encomporate, likely a form of jutsu disintegration maybe or physical bodily damage through contact, though not on a scale shown when Minato's body deteriorated from contact with the JMC.
or
2. We accept Keigoku as a Yin natured variant of JMC while we view JMC as the Yang variant, although it is stated to be the utilization of both yin and yang, as well as Juubi chakra. We would view it as such to make our own explanations of Keigoku to be in simpler terms, though still incomplete using this method.

I myself am more inclined to view the first one as it seems the more likely and fits closer into the realm of the manga, though we shouldn't even have to worry about manga conceptions with anime conceptions as we are first and foremost a custom clan, meaning everything of our abilities should be custom and as such, canon related realizations shouldn't affect us but I digress..on to the concept of tangiblity.

Alright I understand we pretty much get our mojo from JMC, so anyone who comes in contact with keigoku chakra, who is not from the clan will be dealt with severe pain to the mind and body ? (now I get why it's a variant of yin natured ) . So basically if outsiders are expose to the keigoku chakra for a certain period of time this could destroy their minds, and leave them in a retarded state, no ?

And like you said, we shouldn't worry about manga conceptions.. it'be cool to incorporate yang as well as yin u-u can't be too greedy lol, though if I really had to choose i'd go for Yin.

*A slight breeze revealed Viole's hidden face behind his absurdly long hair, while the breeze would also continue and carry on to lift Morrigan's robe just slightly from behind.* However it was enough, Viole's facial expression said more than words ever could..

Spoiler

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[Souji]

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The "JMC" as it's called by you is all 5 chakra natures and Y/Y simultaneously. Very OP.

I like the idea of Keigoku being a Yin variant; it gives us similarities to the 2nd Mizukage's Clam jutsus (which were Yin variants + water release if I remember), but logically stronger.

Otherwise, great explanation! Hopefully the Yang variant can become an essential part of the clan in the future. What that Yang variant is will definitely be a good discussion.

 

[-Broly-]

So now what

 

[Corazon]

We wait till LoK remembers he's supposed to be teaching us. U_U

 

[Lord of Kaos]

Alright I understand we pretty much get our mojo from JMC, so anyone who comes in contact with keigoku chakra, who is not from the clan will be dealt with severe pain to the mind and body ? (now I get why it's a variant of yin natured ) . So basically if outsiders are expose to the keigoku chakra for a certain period of time this could destroy their minds, and leave them in a retarded state, no ?

And like you said, we shouldn't worry about manga conceptions.. it'be cool to incorporate yang as well as yin u-u can't be too greedy lol, though if I really had to choose i'd go for Yin.

*A slight breeze revealed Viole's hidden face behind his absurdly long hair, while the breeze would also continue and carry on to lift Morrigan's robe just slightly from behind.* However it was enough, Viole's facial expression said more than words ever could..

Spoiler

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Exactly this; Keigoku affects the mind of any sentient being that touches it and doesn't belong to the clan, Which brings up my next question:

In your words, what is sentience? How does Keigoku affect sentient weapons and creatures?

 

[Imperfect]

In your words, what is sentience? How does Keigoku affect sentient weapons and creatures?

In general, sentience is present in any form of living organism that has awareness of external stimuli and interactions through their own senses, mostly sight, smell, touch, taste and hearing. Sentience can also be defined as any living organism that has the ability to rationally think for themselves. People and Summoning Animals both have these fundamental traits, meaning they can feel experiences that are not simply a result of their own biological functions, which is why we experiences concepts like emotion or pain. On the other hand, a Sentient Weapon may lack the ability to feel pain or emotion or think rationally, however as there has only been a single Sentient Weapon shown in any large way in the series, I'll be focussing on that one for my analysis of Sentient Weapons. Samehada, while it relies on it's host, it has been shown that it can think/ act on it's own, and thus doesn't need a wielder. It simply prefers to have a wielder, especially strong wielders, as they are no doubt drawn to stronger foes, with stronger Chakra which Samehada can feast on. This proves that, despite being physiologically different from say a human or a Summoning Animal, Samehada has it's own mind and strategy with which it has survived countless battles and many wielders, and thus has some form of Sentience. Since Samehada has some semblance of sentience, and is aware of external stimuli (It can even discern who is wielding it, and act accordingly if they are an enemy), it can be inferred that the effects of Keigoku would work on Samehada, as it has even shown that it can experience pain, or at the least discomofort, as when Killer Bee used Samehada to absorb the Fire Style Chakra of Itachi Uchiha's Fireball, it protested to the hot temperature. Keigoku, as it inflicts extreme amounts of mental pain on it's recipient, would most certainly affect a Sentient Weapon if they were at all like Samehada, and as Humans and Animals also have forms of external senses that Keigoku can exploit, it would work on them as well.

When Keigoku is used on a Human, as they are much stronger mentally (in most cases) than say a Summoning animal, they would experience the Clan's signature extreme mental pain and trauma. As noted in the Clan Submission, if it's used on Animals, they turn on their user. I can only assume this is because the pain inflicted by the Keigoku causes the Summons, which have less of a resistance to mental attacks and manipulation of this kind, they are forced into a wild rage, and attack the thing nearest to them, which is usually their Summoner. In the case of Sentient Weapons, I assume it would result in the same effect, as their conscience and general sense of sentience and self would be less developed than a human's, and thus would be more susceptible to being nudged into a fit of rage and attack it's master.

Probably one of the best features of the Keigoku in regards to other beings is the fact that a Bijuu will never take up arms against a member of the Nekura. Of course this doesn't include the Jinchuriki host of a Bijuu, as they have their own beliefs and opinions, but I like it regardless. It's basically immunity to Tailed Beasts in general.

As the Clan's Submission only really has one line dedicated to this subject, I assume I'll have maybe gotten something wrong, so if I have, please let me know, otherwise I hope everything is good enough to move on.

 

[Lord of Kaos]

Waiting on others now......

 

[Souji]

Sentience, as defined, is:

the ability to feel, perceive, or experience subjectively.

I personally believe all living beings have varying degrees of sentience. Whether it's something as base as food/water or something as high as sapience (the ability to reason, morals, etc. etc.), sentience is probably one of the defining characteristics of -organic- life. Mechanics and robotics can simulate sentience, and eventually, we'll all die from Terminators.

"Freedom is the right of all sentient beings" - Optimus "Murica" Prime

:|

Anyway, back to the effects of Keigoku on Sentient beings. Since we've already agreed on the general idea of Keigoku, I'd assume it causes suffering and excruciating pain to its target. Considering how it affects its users, I wouldn't be surprised if it was compounded on a target, especially with the intention to harm.

I'm not sure about specifics and what exactly Keigoku would do in special scenarios, etc. so I'd like an expounding on that for the best clarification. I was speaking in general terms, so pardon me

 

[Lord of Kaos]

Wow, only you two replied so far? So we're waiting on who, Lee and Lucifer?

 

[Souji]

Any updates on this, Dark Lord?