Kisame vs Minato

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Not debatable.

Kisame fuses with Samehada and ends any chance Minato had. Rasengan absorbed. Kunai blitz isn't going to work since they'll never pierce his skin. Since it'll be a fusion of both him and Samehada durability and Samehada has already shown it can block blades without any difficulty. Gamabunta blade is never doing anything when WD comes up since it would halt his swing speed and the water alone would slow him down and decrease the momentum behide every swing making kisame able to dodge. If Gamabunta gets caught inside water dome it's a done deal. Minato teleporting Gamabunta out will only drain his chakra much faster since Gamabunta is such a big target. Gamabunta goes for the oil Kisame does GSB. Samehada infused water clones would also prove very difficult to handle here.
 

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Minato either ends it in CQC right away, or the fight gets prolonged with Minato eventually winning.
 

NarutoX28

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Minato possessed unrivaled strength in respect to a Sannin, individuals who Kisame believed to have possessed superlative strength in comparison to his own. Minato more than likely wins and I fail to see why Kisame would regurgitate an entire Waterdome at the beginning of the battle when factoring in Kisame's arrogance when it comes to battle.
 
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Kisame doesn't touch Minato the entire fight.
If it comes down to a battle of outlasting Kisame wins. Minato running speed isn't enough to evade WD as Killer bee states Kisame is faster in the this will force Minato to use ftg and slowly run out his chakra while Kisame is having fun chasing him.
Minato either ends it in CQC right away, or the fight gets prolonged with Minato eventually winning.
Minato isn't blitzing Kisame. A 30% Kisame clone had no difficulty keeping up with Base gai. Actually a 30% clone was .
Minato possessed unrivaled strength in respect to a Sannin, individuals who Kisame believed to have possessed superlative strength in comparison to his own. Minato more than likely win and I fail to see why Kisame would regurgitate and entire Waterdome at the beginning of the battle when factoring Kisame's arrogance when it comes to battle.
Kisame would only resort to WD if the following occurred.

1- Minato decides to just run.
2- Gamabunta is summoned.
 
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KCN

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If it comes down to a battle of outlasting Kisame wins. Minato running speed isn't enough to evade WD as Killer bee states Kisame is faster in the this will force Minato to use ftg and slowly run out his chakra while Kisame is having fun chasing him.

Minato isn't blitzing Kisame. A 30% Kisame clone had no difficulty keeping up with Base gai. Actually a 30% clone was .
And is base Gai faster than, or anywhere close to Minato? The teleporter? If he comes anywhere close, he's getting tagged and it isn't debatable. Not when guys like Ay and Obito were outmanoeuvred from close range by Hiraishin. Kisame is a brawler as well, he likes to clash and exchange in extremely close proximity; all Minato would need to do is touch him, and he's tagged.

No, that's not what happened in that scan. Kisame swung his blade first, and then Guy reacted and swung his foot even quicker allowing Kisame to mentally react, but not physically react (seeing as he was kicked in the face).
 

ToshiZO

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Kisame got blitzed by KCM Naruto. Minato blitzes him, and then once tagged, keeps coming at him till he kills him, won't let Kisame set anything up.
 
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And is base Gai faster than, or anywhere close to Minato? The teleporter? If he comes anywhere close, he's getting tagged and it isn't debatable. Not when guys like Ay and Obito were outmanoeuvred from close range by Hiraishin. Kisame is a brawler as well, he likes to clash and exchange in extremely close proximity; all Minato would need to do is touch him, and he's tagged.
Minato speed without ftg doesn't suggest he much faster than Gai at all. Kisame getting tagged wouldn't help Minato at all. FTG seal is also made up of Chakra which means it could be absorbed right off of Kisame. Obito and Ei were only hit because Minato had ftg kunai already over the BF. Minato isn't blitzing Kisame from the start when he won't have ftg already out. Once Kisame absorbs Samehada and engaged Minato there's nothign Minato can do to harm him. FTG seal are made from chakra they get absorbed. Rasengan gets absorbed. Kunai are tanked. If he decides to use Gamabunta Kisame uses WD.

No, that's not what happened in that scan. Kisame swung his blade first, and then Guy reacted and swung his foot even quicker allowing Kisame to mentally react, but not physically react (seeing as he was kicked in the face).
Kisame reacted physically and mentally. Actually your wrong this is full the when Gai jumped in front of Kisame neither of them was in the act of swinging. They both took their shots at the same time Gai striking speed was clearly superior that was the reason Kisame was hit. Not because he couldn't react. If he opted to block instead of attacking he would have blocked Gai's kick. That's a 30% Kisame clone of course the real Kisame would perform much better.


Kisame got blitzed by KCM Naruto. Minato blitzes him, and then once tagged, keeps coming at him till he kills him, won't let Kisame set anything up.
he didn't even have his legs at his or arms to use. KM Naruto evasive feats were compared to so this doesn't help your argument. Kisame fused with Samehada nullifies Minato's arsenal. He tags Kisame and Kisame absorbs the ftg seal.
 
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TRE MERCER

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Kisame wins i never understood how any of the ftg users beats Kisame when they have weak offensive abilities and if they can't outlast there opponent there most likely not going to win against there opponent. Also there attacks can get absorbed or tanked.
 

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Minato speed without ftg doesn't suggest he much faster than Gai at all. Kisame getting tagged wouldn't help Minato at all. FTG seal is also made up of Chakra which means it could be absorbed right off of Kisame. Obito and Ei were only hit because Minato had ftg kunai already over the BF. Minato isn't blitzing Kisame from the start when he won't have ftg already out. Once Kisame absorbs Samehada and engaged Minato there's nothign Minato can do to harm him. FTG seal are made from chakra they get absorbed. Rasengan gets absorbed. Kunai are tanked. If he decides to use Gamabunta Kisame uses WD.


Kisame reacted physically and mentally. Actually your wrong this is full the when Gai jumped in front of Kisame neither of them was in the act of swinging. They both took their shots at the same time Gai striking speed was clearly superior that was the reason Kisame was hit. Not because he couldn't react. If he opted to block is stead of attack he would have blocked Gai's kick. That's a 30% Kisame clone of course the real Kisame would perform much better..
Um, what are you talking about? Why are you talking about Minato's speed without FTG when FTG is the technique he employs consistently throughout his battles, and is the reason he's known for his speed. Irrelevant point there, and you're also wrong on the FTG marking. It's just a seal which isn't maintained by chakra, rather it's just a tattoo, you can say. Saying he can absorb that marking is like saying he can absorb the S/T barrier; there isn't any physical manifestation of chakra to absorb like a Suiton or Katon... that doesn't work.

The manga works from right to left fam; Kisame swung his sword first and it shows (as if the manga representation isn't clear enough) as his sword is literally inches from Gai's head, while Gai's foot is still right at beside his hips. Gai's kick just outsped Kisame's strike. For your point to hold true, Kisame's sword would of had to outspeed Gai's kick at the beginning which is definitely not true. Also, the anime makes it clear who struck first.

[video=youtube;hkl_11VtKzo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkl_11VtKzo[/video]
 
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KidGamer65

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Manga intel means that Minato most likely ends Kisame's life long before Water Dome ever comes into play. Kisame is a CQC fighter for the most part. If he engages Minato like he'd engage anyone else either him or his sword would end up getting tagged via Hiaishin V2. Then it's a rape from there on out as he can't react to Hiraishin V2 let alone a tagged assault from Minato.

Full intel means that Minato can keep Kunai far enough away from the battle to escape Water Dome if necessary, the rest of Kisame's attacks can't hit him, so Hiraishin V2 ends it again.


Let's not mention Fukasaku and Shima and Sage Mode. :lol Minato wins.



There is no scenario in this thread where Kisame stands a chance of actually defeating Minato here. None. :lol Give Kisame full intel and Minato zero intel and then it becomes debatable, but even then Minato would still win as he can escape the Water Dome. Toads can swim fine underwater. Minato has S/T Barrier for incoming attacks.
 
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Um, what are you talking about? Why are you talking about Minato's speed without FTG when FTG is the technique he employs consistently throughout his battles, and is the reason he's known for his speed. Irrelevant point there, and you're also wrong on the FTG marking. It's just a seal which isn't maintained by chakra, rather it's just a tattoo, you can say. Saying he can absorb that marking is like saying he can absorb the S/T barrier; there isn't any physical manifestation of chakra to absorb like a Suiton or Katon... that doesn't work.
You said Minato would blitz Kisame before he would ever fuse with Samehada. Are you implying Minato throws Kunai and and then blitz Kisame before he can still react? That is what i was representing when i was talking about Minato base speed. Actually your completely wrong about ftg. [/URL] If there was no chakra link between Minato and ftg he wouldn't even be able to teleport to objects he has tagged since he wouldn't have a link.

The manga works from left to right fam; Kisame swung his sword first and it shows (as if the manga representation isn't clear enough) as his sword is literally inches from Gai's head, while Gai's foot is still right at beside his hips. Gai's kick just outsped Kisame's strike. For your point to hold true, Kisame's sword would of had to outspeed Gai's kick at the beginning which is definitely not true. Also, the anime makes it clear who struck first.

[video=youtube;hkl_11VtKzo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkl_11VtKzo[/video]
Your right the Manga does work from let to right. They just didn't show Gai swinging his leg but when we see the view of both of them Gai leg is already in it's swinging motion which means he started the swing up off panel. Regardless of Kisame swinging first or being hit first it still doesn't change the fact that a clone reacted to 6gate Gai. This is also irrelevant since that's only a 30% clone and i've already explained how the real Kisame would perform much better.
Manga intel means that Minato most likely ends Kisame's life long before Water Dome ever comes into play. Kisame is a CQC fighter for the most part. If he engages Minato like he'd engage anyone else either him or his sword would end up getting tagged via Hiaishin V2. Then it's a rape from there on out as he can't react to Hiraishin V2 let alone a tagged assault from Minato.

Full intel means that Minato can keep Kunai far enough away from the battle to escape Water Dome if necessary, the rest of Kisame's attacks can't hit him, so Hiraishin V2 ends it again.


Let's not mention Fukasaku and Shima and Sage Mode. :lol Minato wins.



There is no scenario in this thread where Kisame stands a chance of actually defeating Minato here. None. :lol Give Kisame full intel and Minato zero intel and then it becomes debatable, but even then Minato would still win as he can escape the Water Dome. Toads can swim fine underwater. Minato has S/T Barrier for incoming attacks.
None of this is possible when Kisame has full intel. Teleporting Samehada not happening when it absorbs the chakra out of the ftg seal to begin with. Ma and Pa aren't going to make things any easier for Minato. He'd still lack enough offensive power to put down Kisame. SM Rasengan is absorbed.
 
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Zexion~

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Manga intel means that Minato most likely ends Kisame's life long before Water Dome ever comes into play. Kisame is a CQC fighter for the most part. If he engages Minato like he'd engage anyone else either him or his sword would end up getting tagged via Hiaishin V2. Then it's a rape from there on out as he can't react to Hiraishin V2 let alone a tagged assault from Minato.

Full intel means that Minato can keep Kunai far enough away from the battle to escape Water Dome if necessary, the rest of Kisame's attacks can't hit him, so Hiraishin V2 ends it again.


Let's not mention Fukasaku and Shima and Sage Mode. :lol Minato wins.



There is no scenario in this thread where Kisame stands a chance of actually defeating Minato here. None. :lol Give Kisame full intel and Minato zero intel and then it becomes debatable, but even then Minato would still win as he can escape the Water Dome. Toads can swim fine underwater. Minato has S/T Barrier for incoming attacks.
I don't see how Kisame is getting tagged here especially knowing who Minato a hokage is. Kisame is not fighting shirtless so the options on tagging Kisame himself are limited, if he tags the clothing he tanks the first FTG blitz and removes it if he tags the sword he removes the wrap on the sword and continues and is never tagged again. You're also forgetting Kisame turns this battlefield into a river the moment it starts even without WD which gives him a boost in speed and and advantage underwater, can Minato even move a seal across water?

Toads are meat for 1000 sharks underwater, Fusaku and Shima bring absolutely nothing to the table here, only thing I'll give you is that now that I think about it more I'm finding it hard to see how Kisame takes Minato down, however once Minato gets within WD I don't see how he gets out :lol Kunai are followed by water clones, Kisame can spawn 1000 sharks constantly swimming and I don't see how Minato would have any markings outside to begin with here, manga intel does much more for Kisame than it does for Minato.
 
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I don't see how Kisame is getting tagged here especially knowing who Minato a hokage is. Kisame is not fighting shirtless so the options on tagging Kisame himself are limited, if he tags the clothing he tanks the first FTG blitz and removes it if he tags the sword he removes the wrap on the sword and continues and is never tagged again. You're also forgetting Kisame turns this battlefield into a river the moment it starts even without WD which gives him a boost in speed and and advantage underwater, can Minato even move a seal across water?

Toads are meat for 1000 sharks underwater, Fusaku and Shima bring absolutely nothing to the table here, only thing I'll give you is that now that I think about it more I'm finding it hard to see how Kisame takes Minato down here, however once Minato gets within WD I don't see how he gets out :lol Kunai are followed by water clones, Kisame can spawn 1000 sharks constantly swimming and I don't see how Minato would have any markings outside to begin with here, manga intel does much more for Kisame than it does for Minato.
Lol Ma and Pa hardly helps Minato at all.
 

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Minato takes this.

- Summonings and clones mean Kisame would never touch Minato as he'll just teleport to any available. Matter of fact, Minato would have them swim in different direction making it difficult for Kisame to actually touch him. This enables him to escape the dome.

- Water attacks like this can be useful when taking down sharks

I don't see how Kisame wins considering he doesn't even have intel on Minato's abilities. Meanwhile the only troublesome technique for Minato would be the Water Dome which isn't difficult for one to figure out as it moves when Kisame does. Something that didn't take Hachibi time to notice at all. Not much to say regarding this battle.
 

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You said Minato would blitz Kisame before he would ever fuse with Samehada. Are you implying Minato throws Kunai and and then blitz Kisame before he can still react? That is what i was representing when i was talking about Minato base speed. Actually your completely wrong about ftg. [/URL] If there was no chakra link between Minato and ftg he wouldn't even be able to teleport to objects he has tagged since he wouldn't have a FONT=Georgia]Your right the Manga does work from let to right. They just link.]


No, it takes chakra to create but not maintain. The databook describes it as a cursed seal [ ] so that would be like saying Kisame could of absorbed Bee's Jinchuriki seal... that's no limits fallacy. Kisame cannot absorb something with a physical base. Chakra is used to make it but no chakra resides inside of it, as it just becomes a formula.

[didn't show Gai swinging his leg but when we see the view of both of them Gai leg is already in it's swinging motion which means he started the swing up off panel.
Regardless of Kisame swinging first or being hit first it still doesn't change the fact that a clone reacted to 6gate Gai. This is also irrelevant since that's only a 30% clone and i've already explained how the real Kisame would perform much better.
@Bold: Gai didn't start the kick off panel because Gai's foot was still by his side at the point where Kisame's blade was inches from his head. Gai attacked afterwards, and Gai probably has one of the best attack speed in the manga so there's no way Kisame got that close without having a headstart.

Like I said, the anime made it clear.
 
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KidGamer65

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I don't see how Kisame is getting tagged here especially knowing who Minato a hokage is. Kisame is not fighting shirtless so the options on tagging Kisame himself are limited, if he tags the clothing he tanks the first FTG blitz and removes it if he tags the sword he removes the wrap on the sword and continues and is never tagged again. You're also forgetting Kisame turns this battlefield into a river the moment it starts even without WD which gives him a boost in speed and and advantage underwater, can Minato even move a seal across water?

Toads are meat for 1000 sharks underwater, Fusaku and Shima bring absolutely nothing to the table here, only thing I'll give you is that now that I think about it more I'm finding it hard to see how Kisame takes Minato down, however once Minato gets within WD I don't see how he gets out :lol Kunai are followed by water clones, Kisame can spawn 1000 sharks constantly swimming and I don't see how Minato would have any markings outside to begin with here, manga intel does much more for Kisame than it does for Minato.
There is no evidence that Kisame w/ Manga intel knows how Hiraishin works. Match starts, Kisame and Minato engage each other in close quarters and Kisame gets raped by Hiraishin.


Anyway, there is no tanking the first Hiraishin blitz. The first blitz is the last blitz because he'll kill him with a Kunai straight to the back of the neck. Just swap out B's tentacle with Kisame's neck.

And bold isn't an argument. Kisame has no way to prevent himself from being tagged unless he's already in Kisamehada mode, but tagging is not necessary. Kisame can't react to Hiraishin V2 so forget about a tagged assault for now. Kisame turning the battlefield into a river doesn't matter nor does he need to move the seal through water when Minato can stand on water. The only thing that changes is that the Kunai sink when they hit the ground, but any Kunai that is tossed will be warped to in mid air anyway so it's not like that really changes anything.

And :lol @ Fukasaku and Shima being useless. Fukasaku's tongue is sharp enough to cut apart Pain's summonings and metal pipes. That wipes out the 1000 Sharks in a matter of seconds, and it'd kill Kisame if it landed since he can't absorb something that isn't pure chakra like the tongue. Frog Call paralyzes Kisame and then:

-Minato marks him.
-Or Minato escapes from the Water Dome.
-Or he uses a clone and does both.

Then it's GG.

The Gama Trio would fodderize Kisame's 1000 Sharks too. Gamabunta alone would fodderize 1000 Sharks let alone w/ the help of Gamaken and Gamahiro. Bunta's Water Gunshot and his blade are enough to destroy most if not all of them due to the AoE of these techniques. Don't say that they blitz when they have no speed feats letting them do so. Don't say they evade all attacks when there are also no speed feats for that either. And I hope you aren't serious with the underlined. Not only do they have a limited range, they are fodder. What do they do when they find a Kunai? Minato would teleport to it, one shot it and teleport back in a split second.

If Kisame doesn't know how Hiraishin works, Minato wins easily. If not, Minato mid-high diffs at the very worst, and that's only because of how annoying WD will be. In reality Minato will end this fight without getting a scratch on him.

@Jugram Haschwalth: Lmao I'll let KCN tear your arguments apart..
 
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