TheEvilOne
Active member
He is right about Tsunade having monstrous strength without CES though. She scores 5 in databook ( strength ), and that's impressive cuz most male characters have only 4 or 4.5.
Katsuyu vs Tsunade (or Sakura)
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I don't think so tbh..Perhaps the problem with this confusion is the comparison of Sakura with Tsunade who has extraordinary strength normally. And the underlined still doesn't seem correct as it isn't stated as magnifying strength but instantly collecting chakra in the fist.
Well to be fair the Sakura Db4 i saw doesn't have that last bold-ed part...i'll have to recheck.
And yh i read through this and it doesn't seem right considering his explanation makes it seem he doesn't believe Tsunade is naturally strong? Tsunade is a senju and they (see spoiler below). Not to mention her strength stat in the DB is 5 and we have someone with a 3 who doesn't use chakra doing
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. So yeah disabling her natural strength was what Kabuto was aiming for and that has no correlation with instantly gathering chakra in the fists. Not to mention he doesn't touch on what the gathered chakra is then used for?Top Secret File #7: A “chain of hatred” that begins with the Father of Shinobi!
The Sage of Six Paths spent his days spreading the word of Shinobi Sect in an attempt to bring peace to the world, but ultimately he approached his death with without realizing his goal and the remaining work was left to his sons. Possessing the eyes of the sage, the elder son sought a peace by way of power, whereas the younger son, inheriting the body of the sage, sought a peace by way of love. Of the two, the sage chose the younger as his successor, and the older son, finding the decision unacceptable, chose to fight his brother!! Time passed and the battle continued with the elder son’s descendants as the Uchiha and the younger son’s as the Senju!! The battle between Madara and Hashirama was indeed inevitable. What now will happen between Naruto and Sasuke…?
Naruto suppressed his feelings for vengeance and chose a path of peace!!
Future destiny was sewn as the Sage of Six Paths chose his successor.
The Senju Clan inherited strong bodies, pulsing with life!!
The Uchiha Clan inherited intense chakra and powerful eyes!!
Now that he has obtained the Mangekyo Sharingan, will Sasuke tread the same path as Madara!?
The Sage of Six Paths spent his days spreading the word of Shinobi Sect in an attempt to bring peace to the world, but ultimately he approached his death with without realizing his goal and the remaining work was left to his sons. Possessing the eyes of the sage, the elder son sought a peace by way of power, whereas the younger son, inheriting the body of the sage, sought a peace by way of love. Of the two, the sage chose the younger as his successor, and the older son, finding the decision unacceptable, chose to fight his brother!! Time passed and the battle continued with the elder son’s descendants as the Uchiha and the younger son’s as the Senju!! The battle between Madara and Hashirama was indeed inevitable. What now will happen between Naruto and Sasuke…?
Naruto suppressed his feelings for vengeance and chose a path of peace!!
Future destiny was sewn as the Sage of Six Paths chose his successor.
The Senju Clan inherited strong bodies, pulsing with life!!
The Uchiha Clan inherited intense chakra and powerful eyes!!
Now that he has obtained the Mangekyo Sharingan, will Sasuke tread the same path as Madara!?
Also, heavenly foot of pain has no mention of chakra
Heavenly Foot of Pain (Tsuuten Kyaku)
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
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yeah i know she is only one one along with gai and kidomaru to have 5 in strength
well it has been stated chakra can be used to increase strength [
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] let us say ces does not increase strength and is just chakra expulsion then u can see when tsunade's muscles was cut off she could have still concentrated chakra in fist and hit kabuto doing massive damage but that did not happen.meaning the purpose of chakra concentration is magnify strength which is dependent on muscles
dunno here is another one
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Well yeah Tsunade has natural super strength[5 in DB] and uses chakra to increase on other hands sakura does not have natural strength and her super strength is fully dependent on chakra
same as sakura reserve is very little compared to tsunade's and yin seal is was makes her chakra pool gigantic on other hand tsunade would still have massive chakra reserve without seal since she is part senju/uzumaki
the only time bold happened in part 1 was when she used painfull sky leg
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Yes...but obviously not to superhuman levels with normal chakra seeing as Naruto couldn't even make it budge while Jirobo who has a 5 in strength carried
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easily. You could argue i can't say for sure which one is heavier but Jirobo would have at the very least been able to make it move a little no?True..but we see Kabuto hit her
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to disable her strength and yet Tsunade uses her untouched right arm to
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and there was no effect. And seeing as the left and right arm both have their own set of muscles, we can come to a conclusion she didn't use the expulsion because she was finding it hard to breathe which could possibly mess with her control. If you look closely btw, there is no crater where Kabuto is squatting before Tsunade decks him.And the underlined would be true except the DB only mentions fingers and fists..no mention of muscles whatsoever.
Yeah this is the one i saw and the bold is a bit tricky. Removing the need to yet again explain the specifics of the chakra filled punch could be one of the reasons what it's generally thought to be called (superhuman strength) is used there.
CES isn't a thing because:
- Naruto couldn't carry that frog statue which makes sense as there are
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in the body. So despite his massive reserves he could not enhance his muscles to superhuman levels.- The DB never even mentions muscles. it lists fists and fingers and the force of a punch cannot be generated from the fists/fingers.
- The War arc CBI. Looking at the surface area of the explosion relative to Sakura's fist, i don't see how that can even be chalked up to just enhanced muscular strength.
Also i might sound like a broken record but that description only talks about fists and fingers..nothing about heels. And besides, there is no talk of chakra in the sky legs' description which is published in the same DB2.
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well yeah thats was my point no doubt tsunade has natural strength but we don't know the extent of it.She repeteadly does use Chakra enhancement something she passed down on sakura since the latter completely lacks strength and traing her in fighting style same as her own would be waste if sakura doesn't have monster strength
man kabuto explicitly stated it :| [
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] after saying that he struck her on intercostal muscle thus she had trouble in breathing.Tsunade's case as stated above
Then there is the case of Tsunade useing chakra enhancement to lift Bunta's giant tanto.If CES was only chakra expulsion she won't have been able to do it.
yes it not natural superhuman strength thats what it is most likely referring to
Yes i know.Its just a term coined up by fanbase for defining the ability sakura and tsunade or sarada uses
Yeah
Still it mentions lifting of Bunta's sword and last line talks about crater that only Tsunade's kick made
Sakura's punch feats before war arc
She created a crater large enough despite not trying to kill kakashi or naruto [
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]she punched a whole iron sand construct backwards [
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][
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]killed a giant centipede summon with one blow [
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]destroying giant boulder [
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]This is the massive damage sarada did wither punch [
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] and she was much younger than sakura with no such training as sakura compare these feats to this [
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] or this [
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].The thing thats clear is the out is propotional to both chakra used and chakra control latter supported by dbSakura continiously storing large chunk of her chakra in seal which requires epitome of chakra control hampered the overall output of her punch before releasing the seal.Thus output of her final punch was that large
as i said earlier the only time tsunade made crater in part 1 was with her kick[painful sky leg] that db mentions
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FemmeFatale
Active member
Awards
Actually Naruto could've just lacked the chakra control to do so. when Gai and Lee release the gates, the chakra that is released in their body allows them to perform superhuman strength, and Sakura have in fact lifted up a boulder with relative ease during her fight with Sasori. The Frog mentioning that proves that it can be done, it was even mentioned eariler.
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And this would explain why Jincuriki get stronger when exposed to its chakra.
Sakura having perfect control over her chakra negates the limiters, which is why she stores chakra and releases it.
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The bold is based on?
I'm not sure what you're saying here but i'll just say a quick search shows the rectus femoris muscle he says he struck is in the thigh which we even see him touch.
Now how would we claim chakra enhances the muscles for her punch when the DB states chakra is instantly collected in the fists and fingers...Parts of the body far away from the rectus femoris muscles?
When he meant enormous strength, he was referring to her normal strength which is already super human. It's almost like you're creating a whole new technique with this Tsunade uses chakra to enhance her muscles thing.
You read it..it says chakra is collected instantly into the fists. How would that have assisted in lifting bunta's sword? Tsunade is naturally strong..Jirobo has demonstrated how levels of strength are different when you score a 5 in the stats.
And you think it wouldn't have mentioned it enhances the muscles for Bunta's case? What about the fact the sky legs description doesn't have one mention of chakra in it? The bunta sword and crater are not related to the first paragraph because that specifically states instantly collecting chakra in fists and fingers.
I would answer all this but i just want to ask a question first. Do you honestly believe [
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]-[
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] was done with muscular strength?He lacked the control to do it with normal chakra but got the control when he had sage chakra? If it had to do with control i think it'll have been noted.
Actually with the context, the frog was sorta showing it can't be done with normal chakra..The scan with the frog was all to hype sage chakra.
What's durbies? And Sasori's a puppet? He can't weigh that much can he?
Yeah this one's just incorrect.
Databook statement and her fight against madara.Her punches were strong enough to shatter V1 susanno.
Her punch in part 1 failed to kill orochimaru[thus i doubt it was chakra enhanced.Maybe becoz she was running low on chakra] while tore right through Edo madara or overpower a v3 legged susanoo in strength
And Brachii which are on biceps thus rendering both her punches and kicks
Chakra most likely strengthens the muscles in
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;
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;
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;
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or
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or both the arms in case of throwing bunta's tantoso even if Brachii or rectus femoris gets cut her punches and kicks become useless
I already gave you example of chakra enhancement in fights and nope
Epic Facepalm man both are just stated here
:| bro you for real
caption
verb
1.
provide (an illustration) with a title or explanation.
the two last points are from picture that is used to define the first paragraph.
here is the image on left.Upper part of scan is painfull sky leg while the part below it defines what we call chakra enhanced strength.The caption part are the pics that are its examples
edit
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also i was wrong on the part where i said crater referred to painfull sky leg.It referred to tsunade splitting the ground.But don't think you will argue that tsunade didn't use Chakra enhancement in Painfull sky leg since the crater in was much larger than anything of the one she has made
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Look man...I really do feel what is confusing you is the CES term which quite frankly defines itself in the way you're mentioning. The same logic can be applied to chakra enhanced speed with the only difference being it actually has a db entry in the name of Body flicker. You however admit it's made up so try to look at the explanations without the term in mind?
If what it does is strengthen muscles, it would have been mentioned and you wouldn't have to use words like the one you used in the Bold with underline.. In the case of body flicker its specifically stated chakra is used to vitalize the whole body to achieve superhuman speeds while in the DB you keep posting as proof of CEStrength it literally says Chakra is gathered up and instantly collected in the fists. Not spread throughout the body.. no mention of muscles... simple and plain collected into the fists and fingers.
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however proves chakra can actually be used to enhance strength but not to the superhuman levels you think it does. Tsunade was able to lift bunta's sword without any hitches while Naruto was unable to move -even a little- a statue that pales in comparison to that sword until he used senjutsu chakra which boosts all his physical stats.The lightning chakra mode also boosts the raikages physical stats iirc but would he or SM Naruto have been able to replicate the damage output from Sakura's war arc cbi despite their modes augmenting their strengths? With the Raikage especially at
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having a
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massively in comparison with hers?It all boils down to the db clearly stating chakra is gathered in the fists and fingers..something your explanations seem to flat out ignore. If i asked again what the chakra is gathered in the fists for, you would tell me it strengthens the muscles and i still can't see how fists and fingers correlate with muscles a whole forearm away.
Bro :lol
Heavenly Foot of Pain (Tsuuten Kyaku)
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
Its description has no mention of chakra and besides you see the difference between
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and
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. Chakra is expelled in the former and not in the latter if not it would have done more than simply crack the surface despite the momentum she put into it by jumping first.yes its a made up term that doesn't discredit it
it has an explanation in DB has been repeteadly used in manga
no both are not same.shunshin is one of the most basic jutsu[E rank] meaning its very easy to performOn other hand ces is derivative of medical ninjutsu which is hard to learn and require great control in chahra itself.
You keep ignoring that it also explictly states Tsunade used it to lift Bunta's tanto
No what it does prove is that is only true in naruto's case.Base naruto's punch is not causing damage that tsunade and sakura does with punch;kicks;finger or elbow no reason to believe he can lift it something using it like tsunade did
And you point is when neither sm naruto or raikage uses chakra enhancement like tsunade or sakura.Its more related to medical ninjutsu
SM enhances physical strength to lift along with magnifying the power of chakra based jutsu.If naruto doesn't use chakra enhancement in his punches and kicks like tsunade or sakura no reason to believe his output will be close
Databook page
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its translation
The whole part in red is traslation of example of first para shown in pictures
care to read databook
And does that change the fact that directly below it explanation of tsunade's fighting style.Rather than reading becoz its not mentioned it doe not uses chakra read the first part of the extract.using it via finger and fist are just one example of it.
Are you going to argue becoz sakura used elbow
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she did not use chakra enhancement becoz databook only said fingers and punchesits beyond me that How does it makes sense to you that tsunade will use chakra enhancement against kid naruto but will not use chakra enhancement when going for a kill shot against an opponent whose strength is well know to her
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- the underlined and second line bold contradict
- the last line bold was never said. Collecting chakra in the fists and fingers is not CES
No it doesn't.
"To give things a name, by instantly collecting chakra into her fist and fingers, she obtains a power of destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve."
Carrying something heavy isn't a power of destruction feat.
@bold: but in the second line of your post you say it has been used repeatedly in the manga?
Then by this logic Jirobo
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too? And are you implying base Sakura is stronger than base Naruto?This makes no sense when you are claiming Tsunade and Sakura achieve their destructive feats by enhancing their muscles which is what sage mode does with Naruto.. But what do we know the byakugou duo do that Naruto doesn't? You guessed right..Concentrate Chakra in their fists
Yes i've read it but you're obviously not reading the db i'm posting. The one where there is no mention of chakra..just pure unadulterated strength which Tsunade has.
Heavenly Foot of Pain (Tsuuten Kyaku)
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
The bold would have been the best place to mention chakra no?
That wasn't her elbow....if it was, her fists would be ahead of the impact site. Look at it well...her elbow would be directly over Zetsu's left shoulder and the impact point is on Zetsu's back.
She said one finger was enough before he shocked her with the rasengan though. And she only used it to make him lose his feet nothing more. And again do you really believe muscle strength alone would make Tsunade touch the ground with one finger and it'll crack open like that?
And if you're referring to sky leg for Orochimaru:
Heavenly Foot of Pain (Tsuuten Kyaku)
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
- No mention of chakra
- The bold confirms its still a killshot irregardless
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No they don't
Term was made up but the explanation is there on databook
What the hell
so your point is when it literally gives up lifting of bunta's tanto as a feat of ces or whatever you want to call it
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^^^^ the scan is literally posted multiple times
you can clearly see her pic of stabbing manda with bunta's blade and flicking naruto away there which is mentioned in translation
No jirobo's fighting style is literally different from what Tsunade or sakura does.
Its Arhat fist in which Jirobo uses pure physical strength which gets increased from use of curse mark massively
Yes and thats what i am saying.Ninja's can use to lift things using simple chakra.Tsunade's was more insane becoz she has insane chakra control which is simply part of her fighting style that databook defined there on the panel i posted multiple times.The same fighting style for which we use the term chakra enhaced strength for
senjutsu chakra potency just made it pretty easy for naruto to lift the frog statue which his less potent ninjutsu chakra didn't
Becoz it is literally defined on the same page below Painfull sky legs entry
Lmfao this is just desperation.See the panel [
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].it was her elbow.lmao the elbow is on zetsu's back becoz she turned back jumped and elbowed zetsu.You can clearly see her above the ground.
facepalm she used it before he even showed rasengan [
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]the panel is clearly there above tsunade and manda panel on datbook [
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]And i will post this again why it was chaklra enhanced
yes which is not true when she is isn't using chakra to enhance her strength
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compare the crater she made on first hit[
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] to the ones she made later on[
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] when she was tired you will see the diifference
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Honestly, if only the first part with artful and fine tuning was stated, then there wouldn't be any argument on my side... The problem is immediately after that statement, it says ''to give things a name''which indicates the following statement would simplify the previous one. And it's simplified form is artful/fine tuning refers to instantly collecting chakra in the fists/fingers.
Then four images.
- Carrying the frogs tanto is not a destruction feat
- In the jutsu section, Sky leg has no mention of chakra whatsoever
- Tsunade flicking Naruto is as a result of chakra in the fingers as clearly stated
- Tsunade cracking the floor wide and deep enough for Naruto to fall in with just a finger is fine-tuning as if she used it on Naruto he won't survive and it is a feat > sky leg's which only
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it looks like some sort of comparison between Tsunade's own strength and her feats when she collects chakra in her fingers to expatiate on the last part she obtains a power of destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve
Jirobo didn't have curse mark active and i've brought Jirobo into this because its seeming you think its impossible that Tsunade would be able to carry the tanto with pure strength alone?
If this is the case Jirobo who doesn't use medical ninjutsu as you have stated should show it's possible. He only has the db stat of 5 backing him and he's able to lift and throw that like its nothing while Tsunade despite not having an overwhelming presence has both the db and hype to back her strength.
Are you trying to say it was because of control or potency? Because Naruto would have still needed control to use the sage chakra to enhance his muscles to lift and surely tsunade's normal chakra can't have the same potency as senjutsu chakra.
Also the raiton armor according to the db iirc enhances the raikage's physical attributes and
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looks =
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. But despite having the physical appearance of a brute, wearing barbells like wrist-watches implying his base strength is no small thing and having a technique similar to tsunade's skyleg, he is still considered lesser in strength to her. Why?Again it gets worse when we realize at top
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and speed,
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is what he produces with a punch and you know that pales pitifully compared to Sakura's. Sakura obviously did something different to the raikage who enhances his strength with chakra and that's concentrating chakra in the fist and releasing it.Not desperation..i was just basing it off
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. Whatever that white thing is spreads in opposite directions from the point of impact and i can see
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her fist is over the center of impact like in the juubi one.Well yeah....
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Orochimaru knew one punch like the one that brought down the structure (chakra in fists) would kill. That's why only when he noticed Tsunade getting weak suggesting she was low on chakra, he
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. We see he was right because the next punch from Tsunade was
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and that's why i kept saying the enormous strength Kabuto was referring to when he cut her muscles was nothing but her base strength.the line between naruto getting flicked and tsunade stabbing manda literally translates
"-One finger, and Naruto cannot close in on her. And she can handle Gamabunta's huge dosu** with absurd ease...?!"
so yeah it is part of chakra enhancement that tsunade uses
now Do i need to circle the part that i am referring to :|
That matters why when it was literally shown on databook to be same thing.Not being mentioned does not matter
Becoz sasuke has shown to teleport without using any object to switch himself[thus pure teleportation] you are going to argue it not amenotejikara [
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][
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][
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][
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]take in account the entry repeteadly also mentions sasuke teleports himself while we have seen him teleporting both madara and kaguya while trying to teleport sakura against chakra arms.are you going to argue that was not amenotejikara
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Becoz sky legs talks about outrageous strength and in the same page outrageous strength strength is defined to chakra enhanced in the next entry that talks about tsunade's fighting style
not much difference [
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][
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] the only difference is area on and amount of force applied.If it would be her fist with chakra enhancement the exact same result would be samealso no picture of tsunade using fist there so are you going to say she doesn't and it was talking only about fingers becoz it was shown in picture in db despite fist being mentioned :lol
Jirobo has a different fighting style that them.entirely different jutsu
so does might gai have you seen him lifting anything.No
They use different jutsu and some aspects maybe comparable but all are not
Needing control does not mean to have enough control to do a jutsu that requires.Have very great control does mean precise enough control which in case is required here
physical appearence don't matter in a manga
kid sauke knocked down a gigantic bear [
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]raikage;sm naruto and jirobo does not use ces so dunno why you are bringing them up
Those are not ces.CES is term we use explictly for what tsunade and sakura does.
:| that is just impact like mei Kicking zetsu [
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] and many other caseswhich is not true since her kick was stronger than the punch you posted.
Yes Yes later on she was getting low on chakra and you can compare the damage her pure physical strength was doing which is far inferior to her painfull sky leg thus its obvious painfull sky leg uses chakra enhancement
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Chakra enhancement that is literally referred to as instantly collecting chakra in the fists? You do know lifting strength isn't from the fists right?
It not being mentioned does matter because carrying the dosu requires lifting strength different from the strength of destruction the paragraph tries to explain. And i don't get the Sasuke reference...it can't be argued that it isn't teleportation when we've seen he can do it in the manga but in your CES case it has been mentioned twice that its concentrated in the fists and fingers and once that it isn't superhuman strength. And strength =/= punching power.
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A single finger cracks open the floor deep that Naruto's whole body falls in and wide enough for several meters while her foot with perhaps 4x the momentum of that finger + a larger aoe of contact from which more force can escape from only
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and there is not much difference? Come on now...that would imply she wasn't aiming to kill Oro and Kabuto.:lol that would be outright ignoring of facts i can't say that xD
He doesn't use any jutsu to lift the rock and throw it though does he? And also Jirobo is stronger than Tsunade since he doesn't need enhancements to lift stuff while Tsunade does. Is this right?
Precise enough is referring to an application of medical ninjutsu as db3 explains so, no. Precise control won't be needed to enhance strength with chakra since we see Naruto try and we know he doesn't use medical ninjutsu plus the raikage enhances his also and most definitely doesn't use medical ninjutsu.
Apart from Tsunade and possibly Gai..who would you say is stronger in base than the Raikages?
lol this doesn't sound right considering chakra enhanced strength means enhancing one's strength with chakra and SM Naruto throws pains bull summon meaning his strength is enhanced by Sage chakra and raikage
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implying his lightning shroud enhances his strength much like his speed but both won't be able to replicate Sakura's WA feat. So yeah she's obviously doing something different to enhancing her muscles.No. If she's tired she obviously won't be able to produce 100% of her muscle strength and the sky leg also has a lot more momentum behind it.
Both scentence are so contradictary since The scan literally shows Tsunade lifting Bunta's tanto as feat of ces
and there is literally the picture of Tsunade of doing that on entry of ces which you are outrightly ignoring
Simply it means since it wasn't mentioned in databook doesn't mean its not true.On other hand CES used for lifting is has picture right there on the databook page taken from the manga
Now take example of same Amenotejikara case [
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].Explicitly mentions "He can switch places with the targeted object he saw with his eyes"Also unlike Databook CES entry it has no panel of sasuke switching with something or someone he is not seeing but that case is literally different in manga where he teleported behind naruto despite his Los covered fire fireball [
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][
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] or when he teleported directly behind madara transforming into kaguya despite his Los being covered by dust and inflated madara [
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][
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] or to another place despite looking at madara [
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][
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]you are not going to argue that sasuke can't teleport to or switch place with object he cannot see despite its not being mentioned in databook becoz it happened in manga then the fact tsunade's lifting feat is mentioned both on databook using the mangascan on the entry of what we call ces so don't even see whats the problem
no its pretty similiar [
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][
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]the output is literally similiar [
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][
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] with tsunade's being largercomparing it with singer finger is fallacy when we have seen a Chakra enhanced punch making same damage
Since i don't know how arhat fist works i won't comment.i just know i once read the databook entry which talked about it being his herculean strength with no mention of chakra anywhere in any of his physical jutsu.
and nope since part 1 chouji beat his ass up
lmao read it again
bold is true but chakra enhanced strength is adaptation of same so it will also require precise control
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again sm naruto and and Ei don't use chakra enhanced strength in manga
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becoz ces is just a term fans made to define the fighting style tsunade and sakura use,it has an entry in DB but the name of the technique is not given
raikage does not use ces
yes but the difference between what painfull sky leg's AOE that is larger than starting of part 2 sakura's punch AOE is far larger than any of her hits when she was panting.
the outrageous strength of painfull sky leg is defined to be chakra enhanced in the entry of tsunade's fighting style right below it,it doesn't get more simpler
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Contradictory? Not in the slightest since my whole argument has been based on what was explained in that db2 paragraph. ces is a fan made term so the tanto feat can't be listed as a feat of ces.
I've enjoyed this little debate tbh but i feel it would be pointless to continue if you can't admit the simple fact that lifting the tanto would require muscular strength that wasn't stated in that paragraph, isn't a destruction feat and is outright dismissed as an effect of the chakra collected in fists technique in the db3 translation..The part where it says "though generally considered to be superhuman strength"
The problem is that what you're implying contradicts. The paragraph clearly states chakra is instantly collected in the fists and then we have a picture of her lifting something that would require muscular strength and then you say it means she enhanced her muscles with chakra which doesn't feel correct because the paragraph says instantly collected in the fists...not collected in the fists but instantly collected. Why would she instantly collect chakra in the fists if she needs it for muscular strength?
The entire premise seems very incorrect especially with db3 pointing out that it isn't superhuman strength which is what it would be if chakra enhanced the muscles.
I wasn't comparing with Sakura before though but from your scan [
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] you can see its obviously greater than tsunade's sky leg as if Kakashi was underneath tsunade's sky leg he wouldn't have been revealed as much as he was in the left bottom panel with how little earth was excavated.Look for the large chunks of displaced Earth [
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]... [
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] and note Sakura was probably holding back...Tsunade wasn't.But fighting style has nothing to do with lifting strength though does it? Arhat fist has no correlation whatsoever to Jirobo being strong enough to lift and throw what he did the way he did. Agreed with the last part.
What i'm reading from there is "though generally considered to be superhuman strength" which means not superhuman strength lol
Chakra enhanced strength...literally defines itself. Use of Chakra to enhance one's own strength..Naruto obviously doesn't use his base strength
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because his strength has been enhanced by senjutsu chakra. The raikage implies upping his raiton chakra would allow an
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something the db confirms.Raiton Chakra Mode
Raiton Chakra collects on the body, it's a body invigoration ninjutsu. From inside the body lightning gushes out, the speed of ones nerve transmissions rises. The body is wrapped in lightning, the jutsu durability is like that of armor. The Raikages' application of it causes their combat power to rise considerably.
It managed to chase Naruto's Bijuu Chakra Mode, however it was inferior to the great speed of the Yellow-Flash
Raiton Chakra collects on the body, it's a body invigoration ninjutsu. From inside the body lightning gushes out, the speed of ones nerve transmissions rises. The body is wrapped in lightning, the jutsu durability is like that of armor. The Raikages' application of it causes their combat power to rise considerably.
It managed to chase Naruto's Bijuu Chakra Mode, however it was inferior to the great speed of the Yellow-Flash
And even Pa gets a ces feat as we definitely can't claim his base strength allows him to do
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?So yeah except you have another definition of the 'ces' you say the byakugou users do, these are examples of where chakra was used to enhance strength and yet neither of them would be able to accomplish Sakura's wa cbi which is an enhanced strength feat as you claim.
Larger? yes.. but there is no arguing which caused more damage when comparing impact sites....And Sakura was probably holding back.
As for the last part isn't the konoha 100 leaves section different from the jutsu section because the jutsu section is where i got the sky legs translation that has no mention of chakra which supports my point again that the images below that paragraph were to compare what she can do with bodily strength and what she can do by collecting chakra in the fists especially since it ends with '....destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve'
But yeah like i said before it'll be pointless to go on if you can't admit lifting the tanto is a strength feat and not a destructive one. Nevertheless though, the little debate's been great.
No it has not been you are literally ignoring that lifting of tanto is the feat from same scan.
Call it ces or even call it tfgfnksvbka or whatever lift of tanto would remain a feat of what tsunade and sakura use which we term as ces
its not physical superhuman strength that is what it mean.It repeteadly categories CES as superhuman strength in same DB and follows same in DB4
DB 3
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becoz thats the only way she can lift it.Next is Kabuto cutting her her musles and her strength becoming nonfactor so ces had nothing to do with muscles she would have still killed him
Check the last panel when she is attacking kabuto and oro it is almost exactly the same.Bold appears to you becoz sakura's punch was shown from much closer in manga than tsunade's kick
Note the fact tsunade was off the field for 20 years
Becoz it literally written there on databook :|
No its not physical superhuman strength just chakra enhanced version of it
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"As for superhuman strength,it is more more important to have the courage and ability to assess the situation."
He is a sage mode user :| so why would it base strength
as i said earlier CES is simply a term for what the fighting style sakura and tsunade use.It has nothing do with raikage's raiton armour
just like arhat fist is for jirobo;strong fist for lee and gai;gentle fist for hyuga's or Frog Kata for tsm users.
Those are not what we are talking about or next Ohnoki and kitsuchi can use chakra enhanced strength since they can strengthen their punche via earth style that requires chakra too just like raikage.Or since Susanoo users are ces users or jinchuriki's are ces users
Becoz tsunade was out of action for 20 something years
Both are on page 250
This first half is painfull sky leg tsunade's jutsu
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second half is konoha 100 leaves thing explains tsunade's jutsu
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This is translation of whole page
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