Kakashi having MS is illogical

[HadouKage]

Tobirama was talking about how to awaken the MS, not how to activate it. Its not like you need to kill someone close to you every time you want to use it.
As for what Obito said, he may just not have known about it. But I see what you are saying.



Ask Kishi not me... I don't write the Manga.

This brings me to my point, and Bogard's thread, it's illogical

 

[MisterX]

my only explanation is that since Obito saw it in such close vacinity, when one of his eyes changed, it made the other one do it also

this^^
It was said that both eyes are connected so I assume that when one changes, the other does also,

+ remember that obito was able to see Rin being stabbed before he was at the battlefield, he saw it through Kakashi's sharingan, so that proves that both eyes are connected

 

[VangBro95]

Irrevelent. Everybody suffers from that, Uchihas just happen to have a bloodline that gives them the ability to unlock the Sharingan.

 

[iSpeak]

This brings me to my point, and Bogard's thread, it's illogical

Its not illogical, it just hasn't been explained yet.

 

[HadouKage]

To my utter shame i quote myself (see the second part):

Well it may be a special case as Obito was able to see through his eye implanted Kakashi minutes before awakening his MS, which suggests a a strong direct connection ..... also it may be that given the nature of Obito's MS the T/S rules didnt apply (or applied weakly) to the pair.

PS we dont have many many living Uchiha who transplanted their eyes..... so the effects are not clear.
PPS It was explained that shringan strengthens with the feelings of loss..... Kakashi just killed one of dearest friends... so he was supposed to feel sad.

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Read what the second hokage said

 

[VangBro95]

The Uchihas are like the Sayains in DBZ, experience emotional feelings and transform, combine and get stronger.

 

[HadouKage]

One was when he first awakened it and he was knocked out after. In that case it was obito who awakened it.
The second awakening isn't really an awakening because he had already awakened it and forgotten. In that case what tobirama said doesn't contradict at all because kakashi had it already due to obito, just forgotten about it.

Again this isn't the first time in an anime we have seen that a character's tool/weapon, etc awakens when they shows some form of emotion at their masters grief, even in death.

Their eyes are linked.

Ill give you examples.
Naruto as we know is kurama's jinchurcki. Yet when gin/kin bro's went bijuu mode, naruto could feel kurama's chakra [

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]. There is a form of link between them because of kurama.

Or zetsu reacting to naruto's chakra and turning into a tree, similar to yamato using mokuton.

These examples aren't exactly the best, but as you can see, because certain opponents share some trait/ability they might also have some form of connection, or perhaps even the jinchrucki realm that jins can enter

That is not how the second said you awaken MS

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[kralomer]

Everyone has those special chakra at their disposal, they just don't have Uchiha DNA so if they get depressed they won't get sharingan, but if they get sharingan then they can get MS through depression.

 

[HadouKage]

Its not illogical, it just hasn't been explained yet.

Tobirama was talking about how to awaken the MS, not how to activate it. Its not like you need to kill someone close to you every time you want to use it.
As for what Obito said, he may just not have known about it. But I see what you are saying.

???
@Bold
That is exactly how you awaken it, we're not talking about activating it, activating it would be him using Kamui
He awakened it through Obito, which doesn't make any sense nor does it fit what the 2nd said

 

[esenn1]

When Kakashi killed Rin, he saw Obito watching him and thus told him not to go and wait a minute. Obito stood and Kakashi gave the sharingan to Obito and said to him "now that u're activating ur MS, please activate mine too" and showed a laughing troll to obito. And Obito said "**** on this story, ok, but promise me that it was the last time you kill someone dear to me" and both laughed and had a happy life since then. That's the only logical explanation for it.

 

[Prince Charles]

Obito holds his empty eye socket and starts to see Kakashi's hand inside Rin's chest through what is shown as Kakashi's POV.

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Thread.

 

[Klad]

Either he is not an Uchiha,still he has the sharingan.

 

[iSpeak]

???
@Bold
That is exactly how you awaken it, we're not talking about activating it, activating it would be him using Kamui
He awakened it through Obito, which doesn't make any sense nor does it fit what the 2nd said

You were talking about why Obito was able to see what Kakashi was seeing for that brief moment and why they cant see through each others eyes all the time right? Im saying that it hasn't been explained yet, but it is evident in the Manga that it happened.

I told you before Kakashi never awakened it. Obito awakened his MS, which caused a chain reaction and awakened Kakashi (since both eyes awaken simultaneously). It had nothing to do with Kakashi, that is what I was saying.
What Obito said does cause confusion i'll admit, but he may just not have known about it since he thought he was just seeing illusions at that time.

 

[Bogard]

Nice catch and nice thread. But I'm going to have to disagree of the problem you mention. I honestly see no problem of Obito saying "Kakashi unlocked it on his own". Obito lacked knowledge and couldn't understand the link between the eye. He even thought that he was day dreaming when he saw this:

Spoiler

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From there on he didn't know himself on how it works, so Obito just gave credit to Kakashi "for unlocking it" when actually it was him.

He thought he was dreaming sure, but after coming directly to the place and seeing what was happening he should have known that what he thought was a dream was actually true right? So no, he didn't lack knowledge at all, but still said Kakashi awakened the mangekyou. Like Hadoukage said, there is no relationship between Obito's brain and Kakashi's Sharingan, so how could the special chakra that is builded in Obito's brain affect Kakashi's eye? There is definitely something fishy in what Kishimoto explained

 

[Douryoku]

What is illogical is you assuming Tobirama's explanation for the (basic) Sharingan's awakening also applies to the Mangekyō Sharingan.​

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[Bogard]

What is illogical is you assuming Tobirama's explanation for the (basic) Sharingan's awakening also applies to the Mangekyō Sharingan.​

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And what you don't understand is that Tobirama was talking in a general case concerning Uchihas, and it's further proven on the next page where Tobirama explains the deeper the darkness the stronger the eye becomes, and Hashirama even takes the example with Madara after losing his brother. He was obviously referencing to MS/EMS in this case:

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[Brother Numpsay]

He thought he was dreaming sure, but after coming directly to the place and seeing what was happening he should have known that what he thought was a dream was actually true right? So no, he didn't lack knowledge at all, but still said Kakashi awakened the mangekyou.
That is true but I'm trying to point out was that Obito didn't know that the eye he gave was going to unlock too, thats why he gave him credit


Like Hadoukage said, there is no relationship between Obito's brain and Kakashi's Sharingan, so how could the special chakra that is builded in Obito's brain affect Kakashi's eye?

The best explanation would be how it's possible for Obito see through Kakashi's eyes. They both have connections so they should both react through the same connection.

 

[Masked man]

I think it was so much psychological strain for Kakashi which can be equal of Uchiha's feeling when they see their close friend is dying..

 

[King-Panda]

This is anime, not reality

Before asking that, how could even someone transplant an eye? lol

 

[Bogard]

The best explanation would be how it's possible for Obito see through Kakashi's eyes. They both have connections so they should both react through the same connection.

Ok i see your point but you have to admit that it's still speculative and that there still exist a contradiction especially with what Tobirama said in this chapter