[VS] Jiriya and Orochimaru vs Kisame and Kakuzu

[Izuna Kakashi Senju]

Team 1 high difficulty.

 

[Yolobito Swagchiha]

Team 1 high diff.

 

[KCN]

lml jiraiya and orochimaru dominate the both of them.

 

[Conspirator.]

You made a big mistake adding kakuzu-he would do nothing but slow kisame down. team 1 wins no lower than mid diff.

 

[UchihaNagashi]

Would love to know how, exactly.

Elaborate please

Samehada dislikes fire, but can slash through the fire. Also, to counter his Katon in other way, he can use his Suiton attacks that have massive AoE. Kisame's best bet would be to activate the dome right away. Orochimaru having no blood, cannot use Kuchiyose. They would die instantly in the hands of Kisame, or Jiraiya goes insane, spills oil and ignites the whole dome which kills all of them. But of course - Jiraiya is not insane. Also, there may be multiple scenarios in this since the enemies won't idle around.

Adding Kakuzu would be too much IMO.​

 

[Apêx1]

Samehada dislikes fire, but can slash through the fire. Also, to counter his Katon in other way, he can use his Suiton attacks that have massive AoE. Kisame's best bet would be to activate the dome right away. Orochimaru having no blood, cannot use Kuchiyose. They would die instantly in the hands of Kisame, or Jiraiya goes insane, spills oil and ignites the whole dome which kills all of them. But of course - Jiraiya is not insane. Also, there may be multiple scenarios in this since the enemies won't idle around.

Adding Kakuzu would be too much IMO.​

「アナタならどうにかこうにかやれ�� �相手でも私じゃあ 分かりませんよ…」
「次元が違う」
"You might be able to somehow defeat him, but me, well I don't know..."
"Our levels are too far apart"

Jiraiya just needs to start off the fight with the toads and he's basically guaranteed an automatic counter. Kisame can breathe under water, since he's a 'fish'. Fish die from oil spills because they can no longer breathe oxygen after their gills are clotted by mucous layers which prevent them from breathing and guarantee no oxygen supply. More so, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons poisons fish significantly (present in oil), and Kisame is once again no exception. I would rather say the dome is his worst option in such a fight, as he will not only guarantee his own death, but also allow for Jiraiya and/or Oro to escape. None of them will be breathing at that point, and Either Oro or Jiraiya will survive as they can go separate ways while the dome follows only one of the two. This means even if Oro or Jiraiya die, one will remain alive and will inevitably have to fight a poisoned fish outside the dome. Either way, whichever the two of them fight will win.

 

[KCN]

「アナタならどうにかこうにかやれ�� �相手でも私じゃあ 分かりませんよ…」
「次元が違う」
"You might be able to somehow defeat him, but me, well I don't know..."
"Our levels are too far apart"

Jiraiya just needs to start off the fight with the toads and he's basically guaranteed an automatic counter. Kisame can breathe under water, since he's a 'fish'. Fish die from oil spills because they can no longer breathe oxygen after their gills are clotted by mucous layers which prevent them from breathing and guarantee no oxygen supply. More so, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons poisons fish significantly (present in oil), and Kisame is once again no exception. I would rather say the dome is his worst option in such a fight, as he will not only guarantee his own death, but also allow for Jiraiya and/or Oro to escape. None of them will be breathing at that point, and Either Oro or Jiraiya will survive as they can go separate ways while the dome follows only one of the two. This means even if Oro or Jiraiya die, one will remain alive and will inevitably have to fight a poisoned fish outside the dome. Either way, whichever the two of them fight will win.

Man tell this to guys who think kisame > minato.

 

[Apêx1]

Man tell this to guys who think kisame > minato.

That's different.. One could make arguments for either side and make either side the victor in this specific scenario. But then again that's off topic.

 

[Oblivionx]

lol at people saying orochimaru can take a direct hit from kakazu's attack with no damage....! if he is hit with fire air combo kakazu used against kakashi, orochimaru would be a toast(by that i mean in bad condition)....! jiraya is the major threat for team 2 here....! overall i see team 1 winning though....!

 

[UchihaNagashi]

「アナタならどうにかこうにかやれ�� �相手でも私じゃあ 分かりませんよ…」
「次元が違う」
"You might be able to somehow defeat him, but me, well I don't know..."
"Our levels are too far apart"

Jiraiya just needs to start off the fight with the toads and he's basically guaranteed an automatic counter. Kisame can breathe under water, since he's a 'fish'. Fish die from oil spills because they can no longer breathe oxygen after their gills are clotted by mucous layers which prevent them from breathing and guarantee no oxygen supply. More so, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons poisons fish significantly (present in oil), and Kisame is once again no exception. I would rather say the dome is his worst option in such a fight, as he will not only guarantee his own death, but also allow for Jiraiya and/or Oro to escape. None of them will be breathing at that point, and Either Oro or Jiraiya will survive as they can go separate ways while the dome follows only one of the two. This means even if Oro or Jiraiya die, one will remain alive and will inevitably have to fight a poisoned fish outside the dome. Either way, whichever the two of them fight will win.

Getting inside a toad does not matter. Toads cannot breathe underwater, as they do not have gills. As Jiraiya enters a toads mouth, not only the toad would suffocate but also Jiraiya since the oxygen storage decreases bizarre rate when two beings share it and by the time being, Jiraiya would not have oxygen and would be forced (a moment with no oxygen relaxes muscles which opens the mouth) outside of the mouth. Even when he gets out of the mouth, he would be surrounded by water and have no oxygen. He would be no trouble to Kisame, while he attacks Orochimaru. Kisame proceeds to drain him, and kill them after they are weakened. Also in case you have forgot, he can absorb the oil spills.​

​

 

[Apêx1]

Getting inside a toad does not matter. Toads cannot breathe underwater, as they do not have gills. As Jiraiya enters a toads mouth, not only the toad would suffocate but also Jiraiya since the oxygen storage decreases bizarre rate when two beings share it and by the time being, Jiraiya would not have oxygen and would be forced (a moment with no oxygen relaxes muscles which opens the mouth) outside of the mouth. Even when he gets out of the mouth, he would be surrounded by water and have no oxygen. He would be no trouble to Kisame, while he attacks Orochimaru. Kisame proceeds to drain him, and kill them after they are weakened. Also in case you have forgot, he can absorb the oil spills.​

​

Never did I say Jiraiya would go in Bunta's mouth. Jiraiya can go within the midget toad [

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] to be undetected and still attain capability of breathing. This allows him to remain undetected in addition to being capable of attaining oxygen in unknown ways (impossible to have gone from leaf to rain village within the toad with absolutely no oxygen). This should negate any disadvantages Jiraiya would've received from being within a dome. As Kisame follows Oro, the dome would progressively move away from Jiraiya who is going the opposite direction. Oil spill goes atop of the dome, since it has a smaller specific heat capacity. Once he's out, he just needs to release a Katon on the oil that has alleviated to the top of the dome and say his good byes. RIPKisame2014

 

[UchihaNagashi]

Never did I say Jiraiya would go in Bunta's mouth. Jiraiya can go within the midget toad [

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] to be undetected and still attain capability of breathing. This allows him to remain undetected in addition to being capable of attaining oxygen in unknown ways (impossible to have gone from leaf to rain village within the toad with absolutely no oxygen). This should negate any disadvantages Jiraiya would've received from being within a dome. As Kisame follows Oro, the dome would progressively move away from Jiraiya who is going the opposite direction. Oil spill goes atop of the dome, since it has a smaller specific heat capacity. Once he's out, he just needs to release a Katon on the oil that has alleviated to the top of the dome and say his good byes. RIPKisame2014

He won't remain undetected. Firstly, when fused Kisame is a sensor, and secondly the technique is a big disadvantage. I assume he reduces his size in order to fit the frog. Kisame can easily go cannibal mode and chew it until Jiraiya dies (or is mush).

Orochimaru would be next, who's position would at all times be in his knowledge due to sensing. Orochimaru without Kuchiyose has near zero chances to fight him in water.​

 

[Apêx1]

He won't remain undetected. Firstly, when fused Kisame is a sensor, and secondly the technique is a big disadvantage. I assume he reduces his size in order to fit the frog. Kisame can easily go cannibal mode and chew it until Jiraiya dies (or is mush).

Orochimaru would be next, who's position would at all times be in his knowledge due to sensing. Orochimaru without Kuchiyose has near zero chances to fight him in water.​

Da****. He will very much remain undetected. Databook descrption of it

Hiding in a Toad Technique (蝦蟇隠れの術, Gamagakure no Jutsu)
Ninjutsu, C-rank, Supplementary
User: Jiraiya

Using a toad's mouth as cover
A waterside infiltration technique!!

The user of this infiltration technique summons a "Diving Toad" (潜り蝦蟇, Moguri Gama) from Mt. Myouboku and hides themselves inside its stomach.
This toad can dive up to 100 metres in fresh water. It is particularly effective when infiltrating an enemy camp surrounded by a lake or river. Inside the stomach is also a chakra-blocking barrier space, protecting the user from detection-type ninjutsu.

Chakra blocking. Protecting from detection type ninjutsu. Need I say more?
And no, if Kisame eats it than he can only wait for Jiraiya to pop out and literally burst his lower jaw from the rest of his head.

Orochimaru isn't as weak as you are making him seem.. He can extent his neck like this

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and take Kisame an immense distance away, enough so that the dome has followed him all the way and Oro has gone out. At this point two of them would be safe and Kisame would be there with an immense amount of chakra wasted and an unusable technique (Oro and Jiraiya won't get caught twice by such a technique.)

 

[FloriGlori]

Samehada dislikes fire, but can slash through the fire. Also, to counter his Katon in other way, he can use his Suiton attacks that have massive AoE.

You're most likely referring to Bee getting rid of Gokakyou no Jutsu [

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], in which case I must disappoint you: Samehada ate those flames, which is clearly seen by the large chunk of fire missing in the middle. By all means, the idea of a sword splitting a much bigger fireball with mere physical force is ridiculous; especially when said fireball's impact is strong enough to crack even rocks [

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]. Even in case that was somehow possible; a comparatively thin sword, slicing a gap this wide [

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] into the fire? That is clearly not what happened.

Of course, countering any fire Jiraiya might use with Suiton is perfectly possible; but only to a certain extent. Orochimaru is free to fan any of his partner's Katon techniques with Fuuton; that works especially fine with Gamayu Endan.

Spoiler

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Imagine this massive fire being enhanced by Orochimaru's wind [

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]; at that point, any Suiton is effortlessly vaporized [

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]. Mind you that despite the amazing size, Jiraiya was still drugged at that point; a fully powered, additionally fanned Gamayu Endan would be absolutely devastating.

Of course, that's just one of many possible combinations open to Jiraiya and Orochimaru.

Orochimaru having no blood, cannot use Kuchiyose.

To be honest, I'm no friend of this entire Oro-has-no-blood-chitchat. Then again, I'm no friend of Zetsu-Oro in general; there are just too many variables. We have no precise knowledge on the extent to which he can utilize Zetsu's powers; for all we know, he might not even be in possession of Kusanagi no Tsurugi anymore. I'm not even starting on the blatant inconsistency of blood and Kuchiyose; keyword is Edo Tensei. The Orochimaru I refer to is the one we've truly seen in action; the one who faced Kyuubi Naruto, the one perfectly capable of summoning.

Kisame's best bet would be to activate the dome right away. They would die instantly in the hands of Kisame, or Jiraiya goes insane, spills oil and ignites the whole dome which kills all of them. But of course - Jiraiya is not insane. Also, there may be multiple scenarios in this since the enemies won't idle around.

That's a very fragmentary analysis. The dome would not be of any danger to them, considering their large summons can move and fight perfectly well underwater. Two of Orochimaru's giant serpents [

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] are sent into Kisame's direction, while Bunta grabs the Sannin and heads towards the exit; works the other way around, as well. Should Kisame send any techniques their way or approach them directly, Rashoumon or even Sanjuu Rashoumon serves as rear cover; on top of the two snakes attacking and distracting him, of course. Should that not be enough, Gamaken can be summoned to constantly guard them with his shield. Bunta and Jiraiya might as well pull off a combo Henge, transforming into something capable of fast underwater-movement - faster than Kisame, for that matter.

Spoiler

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Then again, of course, there's the simple method of splitting up or using Kage Bunshin, something both Jiraiya and Orochimaru are capable of. There's a variety of ways for them to escape the dome, all within the realm of possibility.

In the end, I still don't see Kisame taking on both at the same time; not even remotely. Individually, he is matched against them quite fine. Let them team up, though, and he is defeated doubtlessly.

 

[GodKage]

team one shits on kakazu and kisame

 

[Icelerate]

Team 1 wins mid-high difficulty.

 

[UchihaNagashi]

Da****. He will very much remain undetected. Databook descrption of it
Chakra blocking. Protecting from detection type ninjutsu. Need I say more?
And no, if Kisame eats it than he can only wait for Jiraiya to pop out and literally burst his lower jaw from the rest of his head.

Orochimaru isn't as weak as you are making him seem.. He can extent his neck like this

You must be registered for see images

and take Kisame an immense distance away, enough so that the dome has followed him all the way and Oro has gone out. At this point two of them would be safe and Kisame would be there with an immense amount of chakra wasted and an unusable technique (Oro and Jiraiya won't get caught twice by such a technique.)

Kisame can create Suiton Bunshin to combat both of them.​

You're most likely referring to Bee getting rid of Gokakyou no Jutsu [

You must be registered for see links

], in which case I must disappoint you: Samehada ate those flames, which is clearly seen by the large chunk of fire missing in the middle. By all means, the idea of a sword splitting a much bigger fireball with mere physical force is ridiculous; especially when said fireball's impact is strong enough to crack even rocks [

You must be registered for see links

]. Even in case that was somehow possible; a comparatively thin sword, slicing a gap this wide [

You must be registered for see links

] into the fire? That is clearly not what happened.

Does it really matter if it even warped them?

1. The fire was slashed in two, strongly enough to provide a gap for two people.

2. There was nothing indicating it ate it, it could have been through sheer force. Kirābī has proven to be strong on multiple occasions anyway.

The fire was slashed, that's it. Gamayu Endan did not have greater pressure than Itachi's Katon, it only had a larger area of effect due to the oil he ignited. He can also use Dochū Senkō for this.​

Of course, countering any fire Jiraiya might use with Suiton is perfectly possible; but only to a certain extent. Orochimaru is free to fan any of his partner's Katon techniques with Fuuton; that works especially fine with Gamayu Endan.

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

Imagine this massive fire being enhanced by Orochimaru's wind [

You must be registered for see links

]; at that point, any Suiton is effortlessly vaporized [

You must be registered for see links

]. Mind you that despite the amazing size, Jiraiya was still drugged at that point; a fully powered, additionally fanned Gamayu Endan would be absolutely devastating.

Of course, that's just one of many possible combinations open to Jiraiya and Orochimaru.

Keep in mind that Kisame has never battled in his full strength in manga. There's nothing stopping him creating water the size of the dome (Dai Bakusui Shōha), which was created by a 30% Kisame. Hypothetically, he could have more than three times the size of this dome.​

To be honest, I'm no friend of this entire Oro-has-no-blood-chitchat. Then again, I'm no friend of Zetsu-Oro in general; there are just too many variables. We have no precise knowledge on the extent to which he can utilize Zetsu's powers; for all we know, he might not even be in possession of Kusanagi no Tsurugi anymore. I'm not even starting on the blatant inconsistency of blood and Kuchiyose; keyword is Edo Tensei. The Orochimaru I refer to is the one we've truly seen in action; the one who faced Kyuubi Naruto, the one perfectly capable of summoning.

If Orochimaru has blood, he would need to breathe. He would suffocate along with Jiraiya. Not to mention, he would have no sensing etc. I don't think that's an advantageous to the opposition. But snake is still much slower than a shark - a blue shark travels about 44/mph underwater. Snake travels about 5/mph.​

That's a very fragmentary analysis. The dome would not be of any danger to them, considering their large summons can move and fight perfectly well underwater. Two of Orochimaru's giant serpents [

You must be registered for see links

] are sent into Kisame's direction, while Bunta grabs the Sannin and heads towards the exit; works the other way around, as well. Should Kisame send any techniques their way or approach them directly, Rashoumon or even Sanjuu Rashoumon serves as rear cover; on top of the two snakes attacking and distracting him, of course. Should that not be enough, Gamaken can be summoned to constantly guard them with his shield. Bunta and Jiraiya might as well pull off a combo Henge, transforming into something capable of fast underwater-movement - faster than Kisame, for that matter.

You seem to be thinking Kisame is alone in this match-up. Assuming the last time a 30% Kisame had to use most of his Chakra to create the dome, he can use only up to 3 Suiton Bunshin's. One of them stays to take care of the serpents, one chases Bunta and other goes on surface in case it goes extreme. Of course, the dome follows the original one who would be chasing Bunta. Kisame as a sensor, would notice such attack immediately. Rashōmon is passed by easily, while sharks compete with the snakes which is summoned by the Kisame on top of the dome. Kisame also sends sharks to chase Bunta, who are much faster than him and are still not out of the dome due to original Kisame chasing them. Sharks would catch up immediately, coming from front and Kisame coming from the back, leaving them no escape. If the Bunshin Kisame behind him falls out of the dome, it doesn't matter. All that's really needed is the Kisame on top of the dome and Kisame confronting the Sannin. Gamaken would be no trouble - Kisame has precognition due to sensing, and is better at fighting underwater. The sharks would be a constant nuisance for Bunta from front, and giving him hard time due to him being enormous and sharks being small and fast. Eventually, both of them would run out of breath and so would Jiraiya and Orochimaru - toads cannot breathe underwater, as they do not have gills. As Jiraiya & Orochimaru enter Bunta's mouth, not only would Bunta suffocate but also the Sannin since the oxygen storage decreases bizarre rate when two beings share it and by the time being, Sannin would not have oxygen and would be forced (a moment with no oxygen relaxes muscles which opens the mouth) to come out of the mouth. Even when he gets out of the mouth, they would be surrounded by water and have no oxygen. Their Chakra would be drained, and they would eventually fall in concussion.​

Then again, of course, there's the simple method of splitting up or using Kage Bunshin, something both Jiraiya and Orochimaru are capable of. There's a variety of ways for them to escape the dome, all within the realm of possibility.

In the end, I still don't see Kisame taking on both at the same time; not even remotely. Individually, he is matched against them quite fine. Let them team up, though, and he is defeated doubtlessly.

Bunshin is competed with Bunshin. It's useless.​

 

[Apêx1]

Kisame can create Suiton Bunshin to combat both of them.​

Suiton Bunshin cannot absorb as it doesn't contain Samehada within it, or at least nothing implies it will. More so, I already explained Jiraiya isn't detectable. Unless he's creating Bunshins to team-up on Oro I don't see your point. Oro can also easily dictate which is the clone. Just use temporary paralysis and see if the clone is effected. Once he knows which one is which, he can proceed to 'kusanagi sword-neck stretch' Kisame 100 meters away as I showed in the picture above.

 

[eagle8]

team1 win s

 

[HNIC]

Samehada dislikes fire, but can slash through the fire. Also, to counter his Katon in other way, he can use his Suiton attacks that have massive AoE. Kisame's best bet would be to activate the dome right away. Orochimaru having no blood, cannot use Kuchiyose. They would die instantly in the hands of Kisame, or Jiraiya goes insane, spills oil and ignites the whole dome which kills all of them. But of course - Jiraiya is not insane. Also, there may be multiple scenarios in this since the enemies won't idle around.

Adding Kakuzu would be too much IMO.​

You don't need to draw blood to summon, so Orochimaru has his summoning