Is Kotoamatsukami non-counterable?

[Observer]

Seriously?

Genjutsu isn't something that overlaps with his body so that makes no sense. I can't see why anyone would even believe that...

Well I think that dude probably thought that if you phase your eyes then it wont affect you. Though It still wouldn't work, because you have your chakra in other parts of your body.

 

[shadowcb]

hmm. I don't remember that. No one can break out of tsukiyomi anyways, except for sasuke. And even if it were detectable, it would take it's toll on the victim before anyone can even break them out of the genjutsu(perfect jins included).

It is possible to defeat the tsukiyomi just like . It is still a genjutsu and follow the same rules. There is no reason it can't be defeated. Just because Sasuke and Kakashi couldn't defeat it doesn't make it unbeatable.

Genjutsu can be defeated by user stopping their chakra flow and then using power to disrupt their chakra flow or having another chakra injected into their chakra -

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Perfect Jin can do both.

People need to stop comparing a perfect jin partner method to a normal person partner method. They are not the same. Kakashi and Gai don't experience the exact same thing and they can't both occupy the same space at the same time. Besides, perfect jin have a better way to deal with genjutsu. They can act as their own partner without needing the tail beast. They have access to at least 2 different chakra types. Naruto and Killer Bee can both access their tail beast chakra and their chakra at the same time. If they are placed in a genjutsu all they would have to do is access the tail beast chakra or whatever chakra is not being control and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled.

 

[shadowcb]

Smh no.... High skill gen is unbreakable by even elite perfect jinks. Time-tsukuyomi, koto and infinite tsukuyomi being in that list. Itachi and shisui gen bypasses even elite sensory and even if they noticed, Time-tsukuyomi mind-rapes them before they can break it like kakashi said to chiyo.

There is no such things as an unbreakable genjutsu. Even infinite tsukuyomi was broken. Like I said, Kotoamatsukami is dangerous because it's hard to detect. That doesn't make it unbreakable.

Perfect jin have the best way to deal with genjutsu. They can act as their own partner without needing the tail beast. They have access to at least 2 different chakra types. Naruto and Killer Bee can both access their tail beast chakra and their chakra at the same time. If they are placed in a genjutsu all they would have to do is access the tail beast chakra or whatever chakra is not being control and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled.

IE: Itachi place Naruto in tsukuyomi and decide he was going to use it for 72 hours. When Naruto realize he's in a genjutsu, that wouldn't take him long to recognize tsukuyomi, he could take one of the other 9 chakra he possesses that's not being controlled and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled.

 

[LoZelda101]

KA can't be detected by the victim... Correct me if I'm missing any details.

One possible counter I can think of,
Strong resolve:
KA doesn't harm you at all, you just get under user's control undetected and can't do against the user's will... So, if you're instructed to do anything that you'd never do in your senses, the clash between the command and strong resolve can alert the target. And I believe it can be get rid of easily just like a normal genjutsu...

Edo-Itachi knew he was under KA's influence because of the conflicting commands in his mind, KA's command took over Kabuto's talisman which created doubt for him and he realized and chose not to undo it, all IMO...

P.S.

If KA is so haxxed and unbeatable, There were multiple occasions on which it could've come in handy but it was a non-factor...
Shisui stopping Danzo,
Itachi stopping Danzo,
Shisui stopping Fugaku,
Itachi stopping Fugaku...

1. Itachi casted it himself which was routed to his eye. Obviously he would know he's in it since he was the one who casted it and had control over his edo body from harming naruto.

2. Koto w/o shisui or hashi cells can only be used once every 10? Years. Itachi would only use it if he had no other choice. Which obviously, killing off the clan was the other option.

3. The reason he was going to use koto on sasuke is because unlike his clan he loved him more than the village. But the moment he found out naruto loved sasuke as a bro too he sealed koto inside him as back up but entrusted naruto enough to bring sasuke back to village willingly, which is confirmed when he questioned kcm naruto why sasuke didn't return back to the village.

 

[Scryed]

Smh no.... High skill gen is unbreakable by even elite perfect jinks. Time-tsukuyomi, koto and infinite tsukuyomi being in that list. Itachi and shisui gen bypasses even elite sensory and even if they noticed, Time-tsukuyomi mind-rapes them before they can break it like kakashi said to chiyo.

Tsukyomi can't be broken by a Perfect Jin since by the time the genjutsu is over, it would've only been like a second in the real world for anyone who wasn't the victim or the user. That means the Bijuu wouldn't even have time to break them out.

KA seems to be undetectable by the victim or rather, the victim doesn't realize it. The moment Mifune was informed he was under the effects of KA, he snapped out of it. However, Itachi outright placed a command on the other eye to react to his eyes. He was aware he was under the genjutsu but it was still in effect.

It could end up having different functions just like Kamui despite being the same ocular power. Like either placing a command or manually controlling someone (influencing their decisions) without them realizing it.

Just speculation though. I guess the only downside to it is only usable once per ten years or once per day (with Senju DNA).

 

[LoZelda101]

There is no such things as an unbreakable genjutsu. Even infinite tsukuyomi was broken. Like I said, Kotoamatsukami is dangerous because it's hard to detect. That doesn't make it unbreakable.

Perfect jin have the best way to deal with genjutsu. They can act as their own partner without needing the tail beast. They have access to at least 2 different chakra types. Naruto and Killer Bee can both access their tail beast chakra and their chakra at the same time. If they are placed in a genjutsu all they would have to do is access the tail beast chakra or whatever chakra is not being control and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled.

IE: Itachi place Naruto in tsukuyomi and decide he was going to use it for 72 hours. When Naruto realize he's in a genjutsu, that wouldn't take him long to recognize tsukuyomi, he could take one of the other 9 chakra he possesses that's not being controlled and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled.

Sigh..... It's unbreakable if the victim is caught in it undetected or has time manipulation. If a 3rd party intercepted then yeah. But that's not the topic.

Nope

Time-tsukuyomi > perfect jinks. By the time a bijuu notice and attempts to break the gen it would already passed 72hrs mind-rape game over.

Initial infinite Tsukuyomi cast was never broken. The "light phase" already went away, all sasuke did was block the light from piercing through his susanoo until it faded.

 

[LoZelda101]

Tsukyomi can't be broken by a Perfect Jin since by the time the genjutsu is over, it would've only been like a second in the real world for anyone who wasn't the victim or the user. That means the Bijuu wouldn't even have time to break them out.

KA seems to be undetectable by the victim or rather, the victim doesn't realize it. The moment Mifune was informed he was under the effects of KA, he snapped out of it. However, Itachi outright placed a command on the other eye to react to his eyes. He was aware he was under the genjutsu but it was still in effect.

It could end up having different functions just like Kamui despite being the same ocular power. Like either placing a command or manually controlling someone (influencing their decisions) without them realizing it.

Just speculation though. I guess the only downside to it is only usable once per ten years or once per day (with Senju DNA).

More or less what i said to shadowcb

 

[shadowcb]

Sigh..... It's unbreakable if the victim is caught in it undetected or has time manipulation. If a 3rd party intercepted then yeah. But that's not the topic.

Nope

Time-tsukuyomi > perfect jinks. By the time a bijuu notice and attempts to break the gen it would already passed 72hrs mind-rape game over.

Infinite Tsukuyomi was never broken. The "light phase" already went away, all sasuke did was block the light from piercing through his susanoo.

The jutsu is hard to detect, but not undetectable. Genjutsu are dangerous because they can be used in alot of different situations. It's not limited to just the battlefield. That's the advantage. Ninjas would be more prepared to face genjutsu on the battlefield than off the battlefield.

Jin and their tail beast experience time different in their world than the real world. Besides, I have already explained how a perfect jin can defeat tsukuyomi without needing their tail beast help.

Here it is again. They have access to at least 2 different chakra types. Naruto and Killer Bee can both access their tail beast chakra and their chakra at the same time. If they are placed in a genjutsu all they would have to do is access the tail beast chakra or whatever chakra is not being control and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled.

Infinite Tsukuyomi was broken. Sage explained that to defeat IT the rinnegan and all 9 tail chakra must be used together -

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[Mad Titan Thanos]

only Taijutsu and senjutsu works on JJ so KA wont work on them.

 

[Gerkak]

Izanagi can defeat it. If izanagi is activated before KA is used any command the KA user gives will be rewritten

 

[Scryed]

The jutsu is hard to detect, but not undetectable. Genjutsu are dangerous because they can be used in alot of different situations. It's not limited to just the battlefield. That's the advantage. Ninjas would be more prepared to face genjutsu on the battlefield than off the battlefield.

Jin and their tail beast experience time different in their world than the real world. Besides, I have already explained how a perfect jin can defeat tsukuyomi without needing their tail beast help.

Here it is again. They have access to at least 2 different chakra types. Naruto and Killer Bee can both access their tail beast chakra and their chakra at the same time. If they are placed in a genjutsu all they would have to do is access the tail beast chakra or whatever chakra is not being control and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled.

Infinite Tsukuyomi was broken. Sage explained that to defeat IT the rinnegan and all 9 tail chakra must be used together -

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Take into consideration that you need Uchiha blood to break Tsukyomi.

 

[shadowcb]

Take into consideration that you need Uchiha blood to break Tsukyomi.

There is not evidence to support that claim. The Uchiha's don't have the best track record when it comes to their claims. We were told amaterasu can't be evaded, which is false. We were told the only way to defeat an Uchiha is in 2vs1 battle. That is also false.

 

[unknownvillain1254]

Lol the Hyuga can break it

 

[LoZelda101]

The jutsu is hard to detect, but not undetectable. Genjutsu are dangerous because they can be used in alot of different situations. It's not limited to just the battlefield. That's the advantage. Ninjas would be more prepared to face genjutsu on the battlefield than off the battlefield.

Jin and their tail beast experience time different in their world than the real world. Besides, I have already explained how a perfect jin can defeat tsukuyomi without needing their tail beast help.

Here it is again. They have access to at least 2 different chakra types. Naruto and Killer Bee can both access their tail beast chakra and their chakra at the same time. If they are placed in a genjutsu all they would have to do is access the tail beast chakra or whatever chakra is not being control and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled.

Infinite Tsukuyomi was broken. Sage explained that to defeat IT the rinnegan and all 9 tail chakra must be used together -

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Sigh... My man, time manipulation isn't going by real time. It's manipulating time itself in the gen world when in actuality it's instantaneous, 1 sec the latest. Even if kurama broke naruto free from the gen he is 72hr mind raped

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[true enigma]

I have yet to find a legitimate counter to the strongest genjutsu in the Shinobi World - KA.​

Shisui was shown to be controlling multiple people at once. Yet not only just controlling, but creating false experiences through a person's mind, thus making people scream in panic and fear, which hints that Shisui could create any kind of thought/experience/emotional flow in person's mind: from happiness to fear and agony. Not only that, but he did it without any visual contact nor finger genjutsuing - all while being far away from the actual enemy. ( as shown in his

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) He could basically explode your brain. Now this is just straight out impossible for such an OP genjutsu to have no viable counters at all.

Can you name at least one?

The only two things that come to my mind are:

1) The person's will or chakra has to be extremely, and I mean really EXTREMELY strong/powerful in order to break the genjutsu. ( not lower than that of a transmigrant )

2) The person has to be a perfect Jinchuuriki.​

What do you think?​

P.S. Yes, you may say that in his fight vs Ao Shisui wasn't using KA. Well then, Shisui can't use Tsukuyomi. And it's impossible to perform such feats with normal 3T genjutsu.

Sasuke is immune, his rinnegan give him complete immunity to genjutsu.

 

[unknownvillain1254]

Technically it's possible ( only if beforehand ), but it's never going to happen. Genjutsu is instant, and this is Kamui's biggest and (probably) only weakness.

The only jutus that is instant s/t only

 

[unknownvillain1254]

Sasuke is immune, his rinnegan give him complete immunity to genjutsu.

And what is your information that came back this up

 

[Gerkak]

Sasuke is immune, his rinnegan give him complete immunity to genjutsu.

No one is immune to genjutsu. Sound genjutsu can still mess him up

 

[true enigma]

And what is your information that came back this up

Do u read the manga?

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That is the most powerful genjutsu in the manga he easily defended against. Shisui is no issue, he is immune.

 

[shadowcb]

Sigh... My man, time manipulation isn't going by real time. It's manipulating time itself in the gen world when in actuality it's instantaneous, 1 sec the latest. Even if kurama broke naruto free from the gen he is 72hr mind raped

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Theses scenes don't provide any evidence to support your claim.

1 - Naruto stated if you get it by amaterasu it's over. That's false. Obito, 4th Raikage, and Madara survived by hit by amaterasu.

2 - You are still using human partner method to explain why perfect jin can't tsukuyomi. That's flawed because they are not a jin. Kakashi and chiyo were talking about normal human not jin. Jin and tail beast are able to manipulate the time in their inner world. Tail beast experience time the exact same why their jin do so they would have time to defeat it.

3 - You still haven't said anything about Naruto's ability to manipulate all the chakras in his body at the same time. I'm not surprise. It's the best way to counter genjutsu. By using that method a perfect jin doesn't need their tail beast help. If they are placed in a genjutsu all they would have to do is access the tail beast chakra or whatever chakra is not being control and inject it into the chakra that's being controlled. They don't need the tail beast help to access tail beast chakra.