[Discussion] Is Abortion An Innate Human Right?

[Sasuke tyeezy]

NO!!!!

If there wasn't a place were people could go to murder their child then I honestly believe they'd think differently before opening their legs..

Government has made it ok for folks to murder their babies just like they made it ok to go to war an have man killing man.. It's wrong!!

Are you dumb or ignorant?

War has been going on from as long as people have been on this earth,
& unwanted children used to be killed after their birth.

If you took away abortion the infant mortality rate would rise immensely.

 

[Sasuke tyeezy]

About as ridiculous and nonsensical as the idea of abortion and those who back it up. A soldier makes his own choice and is willing to die, it's not the same with abortion, i don't think a fetus can enlist into the army, you know... make their own decision. So not only do i think is morally wrong, weak, and disgusting, but also selfish.

But you know what, i'll give it the benefit of the doubt. I will make an exception to justify abortion if there is rape involved, and only that.

Right, they can't make their own choices. They don't even have a conscious, it's technically a parasite until it develops a conscious at which point it becomes a babt. So are you telling me it's wrong to get rid of a parasite if one chooses to?

 

[shelke]

If the government can improve health care, welfare and educational facilities (a proper set up for children to be turned into responsible members of the society) where abandoned children can be taken care of, then and only then, I would choose the second option.

However, since we don't live in a utopia, abortion should be legal in many situations. We need human population control as well. Not everyone should be allowed to breed. Take it whichever way you will.

 

[Marin]

If the government can improve health care, welfare and educational facilities (a proper set up for children to be turned into responsible members of the society) where abandoned children can be taken care of, then and onlythen, I would choose the second option.

However, since we don't live in a utopia, abortion should be leagal in many situations. We need human population control as well. Not everyone should be allowed to breed. Take it whichever way you will.

@bold: This would be a way bigger problem than not allowing abortions.

 

[BlacLord™]

Yes; you're not killing a baby, you're getting rid of a clump of lifeless cells that are insentient and incapable of feeling pain, at least during the time that abortion is legal. It's thoughtless to say abortion should be illegal, because it shows a lack of care as to why they take place.

So many pro-lifers yap on about caring about the "life" and giving it a chance, not seeming to get that many abortions take place because said foetuses would end up living in deprivation with no chance for anything better. Purposely born for the sake of living to struggle? That is careless. If not to enjoy life and be happy, there is no other point for living. The same thing applies for women who have abortions as a result of rape; if brought into this world by a mother who cannot handle it, then it would face rejection and coldness from one of, if not the key figure in its life. And that can throw up all sorts of mental issues.

And what about children with serious birth defects that will inevitably kill them anyway? Would you prefer them to live out a few painful days/weeks and die, or kill the insentient cells which results in no suffering?

 

[Bacillus]

for those spouting 'you should've used protection' or 'don't have ***' and all that, sure, fine. but most women and young teens do. people are going to ****, it is a biological fact. it is inevitable. and that is their choice in the matter just as it is your choice to to stand against abortion

should they be more educated and seriously weigh the consequences? some should, but that's generalizing and factoring out the fact that some are very well educated and are very aware of the consequences. it's ignoring the fact some do use extra prevention toward pregnancy such as shots, pills, and whatnot. lots of women do those. condoms are about 83% effective, pills are around 99%. and some use both. what do you say to these women? they want to ****, but they very clearly don't wish to get pregnant? tell them to not ****? tell them that they don't have the right to do as they please because they're murderers? guilt trip them until they learn their lesson? never **** their boyfriend again unless they actually want a baby? it's ludicrous

then, yes, you're correct: there are the irresponsible ones that makes you feel righteous. and some of these are horny teens, misguided women, college students that don't weigh the pros and cons. but: what if they can't raise the child properly? would you rather them give birth to something they can't even give shelter to and proper emotional support? would you rather give them an emotionally unstable life? and if they don't keep the baby: would you rather put them through the adoption process--force them to go through months of stress, disrupting their entire life, their entire future--only to give the kid to strangers (or close family) that will take care of the kid?
what does that do to the very young, irresponsible mother? would that not be emotionally traumatizing?

if you're for the kid's rights: what is actually honestly best for the kid? what if these mothers are unintentionally neglectful? because they have no clue how to educate themselves? because they don't know what a child really requires?
you've basically given the kid the gift of a shitty life? what then?

morally it's a tricky thing for both the mother and baby, scientifically it's not. there's far too much gray areas to determine what's best for the kid without hurting the mother and vice versa

 

[Sakura Michiko]

For who ever is saying "They should have used protection" please stop. My boyfriend and I use condoms all the time and I'm on birth control. We had two incidents where the condom popped. He told me instantly and we brought plan b and a pregnancy test because I was afraid my birth control was going to fail. If plan b was going to fail I was getting an abortion because I am not capable of raising a kid at the moment and I'm in school for nursing.Currently having a Kid would make it hard for me to do nursing school and work.I wouldn't even be financially capable to raise it. Protection can fail you know. Don't even tell me about adoption.My boyfriend told me before he was adopted by his loving family he was abused in a foster home and the system isn't the best.

 

[Marin]

Purposely born for the sake of living to struggle? That is careless. If not to enjoy life and be happy, there is no other point for living.

The vast majority of humanity is struggling, just look at China, North Korea or Africa - life is a struggle. You don't need these examples, just look at any non-first world country. Even without financial well-being, happiness is a rare occasion rather than the norm so what you're saying here is a very strong statement.

Not to mention the specific ideology, personally, I would find a fully blissful life less enriching than one filled with struggles even on a purely atheistic approach. Being a theist though, I have a very different thing on my mind.

The same thing applies for women who have abortions as a result of rape; if brought into this world by a mother who cannot handle it, then it would face rejection and coldness from one of, if not the key figure in its life. And that can throw up all sorts of mental issues.

Could and can. Not would and will. Unless we're going to play fortune-tellers that remains a story to be told.

And what about children with serious birth defects that will inevitably kill them anyway? Would you prefer them to live out a few painful days/weeks and die, or kill the insentient cells which results in no suffering?

In cases in which a child and/or mother's lifes are at stake is where I'd agree to abort. Even some catholic hospitals will agree in such extreme cases.

morally it's a tricky thing for both the mother and baby, scientifically it's not. there's far too much gray areas to determine what's best for the kid without hurting the mother and vice versa

As soon as you ask "Should we" it becomes a matter of morals, not science.

 

[Omegga Shenron]

Your all dudes commenting on something you dont have to experience, abortion after 3-4 months is wrong imo, but women should make that choice for themselves, theirs all sorts of reason for abortion: getting raped, a horrible deformity in the baby, their too young and could possibly die from giving birth, etc. Plus theirs 7.8 billion humans and counting, im all for putting a dent in population increase.

 

[adeshina365]

Abortion is unfortunate.

 

[Legendary Saiyan]

I don't know about innate but abortion should only be allowed if the woman is raped or her life's in critical danger.

 

[shelke]

@bold: This would be a way bigger problem than not allowing abortions.

That is your personal perception, I'm afraid. Spartan society worked on certain principles where only specific individuals were allowed to procreate. They needed to be fit, healthy, young and it was incumbent upon men to be financially stable to support a child. Once you allow every individual a free reign, that is when situations like over-population arise which is the root cause of corruption, poverty and rise in social inequality.

 

[Marin]

That is your personal perception, I'm afraid. Spartan society worked on certain principles where only specific individuals were allowed to procreate. They needed to be fit, healthy, young and it was incumbent upon men to be financially stable to support a child. Once you allow every individual a free reign, that is when situations like over-population arise which is the root cause of corruption, povety and rise in social inequality.

You're suggesting an arian society. Ask Hitler how that turned out. Speaking of opinions suits you ill when you lay out nothing more than "should be" statements.

 

[shelke]

You're suggesting an arian society. Ask Hitler how that turned out. Speaking of opinions suits you ill when you lay out nothing more than "should be" statements.

It isn't about should bes, but could bes. People crave for stability and have laughable utopian ideals, yet the laws are not stringent enough nor are the conditions to realize even the half of the fairytales churned out by the idealists. One cannot have it all. That is not how reality works.

I won't comment on Hitler as he followed Aristotle's philosophies, mostly. But, who knows what could have happened had he succeeded.

 

[Marin]

It isn't about should bes, but could bes.

Not everyone should be allowed to breed

Goodbye.

 

[shelke]

Goodbye.

I am talking about a should be, which makes it a could be.

Use a bit of common sense. If you have any.

 

[Yubel]

I've come to realize that whether or not it's right. People will simply do what's convenient for them.

The real question we should ask is, how do we prevent unwanted pregnancies? That's where our focus should be.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Your all dudes commenting on something you dont have to experience

No, but we are human beings past the age of 14, so we have the intellectual capacity to understand the circumstances surrounding *** and abortion to form an educated opinion on the matter. Penis or vagina doesn't matter in this conversation, understanding does.