[Discussion] If transplanted, would Sasuke be able to tolerate one of Madara’s Rinnegan?

[Animegoin]

To be clear, this is if Sasuke removes his sharingan eye and transplanted one of Madara’s Rinnegan in its place.
​

Facts:
-Obito stated that he was only able to place one of Madara’s Rinnegan in his head and even then, he felt himself losing control.
-Sasuke was only able to manifest one Rinnegan so using that logic, he can only tolerate one of them due to his minuscule chakra reserves.

-Seeing as how Madara’s Rinnegan never ran out of chakra, (regardless of how much Nagato, Obito and Madara himself spammed them), it’s sufficient to say that just one of Madara’s Rinnegan drastically dwarfs the chakra contained within Sasuke’s.

-Sasuke’s had to recharge his Rinnegan multiple times throughout the series, to the point where he couldn’t even open that eye.

-Madara was able to keep his sharingan activated on his deathbed despite having all 9 bijuu, the Gedo Mazo, The Shinju, Hashirama’s senjutsu, and his own chakra ripped out of him. All of that while he was also completely crippled and blind.

-Sasuke couldn’t even maintain his sharingan while fighting Naruto in their final battle, He also couldn’t even open his left eye.

Conclusion:
Taking note of all of this, I say that Sasuke wouldn’t be able to handle the strain of even one of Madara’s Rinnegan.
What do you guys think?

>Additional question: Do you think Sasuke can tolerate Urashiki’s non-canon Rinnegan?​

 

[salamander uchiha]

Sasuke manifesting one Rinnegan is due to him having direct rokudo chakra and not Ashura chakra. Sasuke also lacks the yang nature necessary for it. You could call his Rinnegan a Pseudo Rinnegan. He did say that if he died give it to a Kakashi(average chakra reserves) or anybody else and they'll be able to use it.

On the point of requiring large chakra reserves to handle the Rinnegan then I disagree. If that was the case then Obito had massive chakra reserves they dwarf Nagato's. He had enough chakra to summon and maintain the Mezo, control the 6 paths, and the tailed beasts, while fighting two perfect Job, Guy Sensei and a Kamui user, that was before fighting the alliance and subjugating the Jyubi, while fighting Lord Madara's power. I don't even know how many days he was fighting for. I think it was the culmination of those factors + the lack of a powerful lifeforce which made it diddicult to resist the immeasurable power(Madara's).

After all Madara's eyes are the original eyes of the sage of 6 paths, Hogaromo does calls Madara's power his power.

Sasuke's Rinnegan seems to have a cool off period, I think you're right. I doubt he could handle Madara's Rinnegan he hasn't shown any ability to do so.

And Urushiki's rinnegan is like Sasuke's so possibly

 

[Naruto X Hunter]

Sasuke's Rinnegan (after Urashiki's) is the second closest variant to the Rinne-Sharingan. Which only existed as one eye.

Why would the far weaker Nagato be able to handle two Rinnegan, yet not Six Paths Sasuke, who received half of the Sage's power? Nagato even admitted that he paled in comparison to the Sage.

And Sasuke had cool down time due to his inexperience. Adult Sasuke hasn't displayed this weakness so far. Even after crossing dimensions with several people, he used Amenotejikara a few times without showing any signs of exhaustion.

 

[Animegoin]

Sasuke manifesting one Rinnegan is due to him having direct rokudo chakra and not Ashura chakra. Sasuke also lacks the yang nature necessary for it. You could call his Rinnegan a Pseudo Rinnegan. He did say that if he died give it to a Kakashi(average chakra reserves) or anybody else and they'll be able to use it.

On the point of requiring large chakra reserves to handle the Rinnegan then I disagree. If that was the case then Obito had massive chakra reserves they dwarf Nagato's. He had enough chakra to summon and maintain the Mezo, control the 6 paths, and the tailed beasts, while fighting two perfect Job, Guy Sensei and a Kamui user, that was before fighting the alliance and subjugating the Jyubi, while fighting Lord Madara's power. I don't even know how many days he was fighting for. I think it was the culmination of those factors + the lack of a powerful lifeforce which made it diddicult to resist the immeasurable power(Madara's).

After all Madara's eyes are the original eyes of the sage of 6 paths, Hogaromo does calls Madara's power his power.

Sasuke's Rinnegan seems to have a cool off period, I think you're right. I doubt he could handle Madara's Rinnegan though.

And Urushiki's rinnegan is like Sasuke's so possibly

I disagree to some degree, Sasuke received Six Paths chakra from Hagoromo himself, making the Ashura requirement completely null and void since we all know that Hagoromo has the undiluted chakra of both Ashura and Indra. Consequently Sasuke manifested one Rinnegan simply because his chakra reserves were minuscule and therefore, the chakra within his Rinnegan pales in comparison to the chakra within one of Madara’s. As for Sasuke instructing Naruto to transplant his eye into Kakashi, that could be interpreted in several ways; one of them being that Sasuke knew that Kakashi had Six Paths chakra at one point, and was capable of bearing a Rinnegan because of that. Or Sasuke knew that his Rinnegan wasn’t as taxing as Madara’s to where even Kakashi could bear it. Pretty sure it’s the latter.

Obito’s chakra reserves were massive, however claiming them to be superior to Nagato’s may not be true. The intensity of feats that Nagato performed in short succession dwarf anything Obito has done; from the assault on the Leaf village, to the Shinra tensi, to battling Naruto, to battling the Kyuubi, to creating a planetary construct, to reviving a huge number of dead individuals. All of that while being crippled. While Obito’s feats were partially credited to Kabuto who created those Edo Tensei Jinchuriki for him (Obito) to control. Obito subjugating the Juubi was credited to his Hashirama DNA and the Rinnegan he possessed, which should tell you what Nagato would’ve been capable of had he not been crippled and had Hashirama DNA. Moving on from that though, Obito’s battle fatigue had nothing to do with his inability to tolerate both Rinnegan, because he’d transplanted it before he even encountered anyone on the battlefield.
Anyway, as I see it Nagato had far larger chakra reserves than Obito and consequently was able to tolerate both of Madara’s Rinnegan.

I do agree that Madara’s eyes are the eyes of the Sage and with that Urashiki possibility.

Sasuke's Rinnegan (after Urashiki's) is the second closest variant to the Rinne-Sharingan. Which only existed as one eye.

Why would the far weaker Nagato being able to handle two Rinnegan, yet not Six Paths Sasuke, who received half of the Sage's power? Nagato even admitted that he paled in comparison to the Sage.

And Sasuke had cool down time due to his inexperience. Adult Sasuke hasn't displayed this weakness so far. Even after crossing dimensions with several people, he used Amenotejikara a few times without showing any signs of exhaustion.

That logic is retarded, I’m sorry. Hagoromo himself had 2 Kekkei Mora Rinnegan and was the son of Kaguya but you think that Urashiki And Sasuke’s are closer to that eye? Not by a long shot.

Because Nagato was clearly genetically superior to Sasuke. One of Madara’s Rinnegan contains far more chakra than Sasuke’s does And Nagato was able to tolerate both of Madara’s. Even after receiving chakra from the source of the Rinnegan itself, Sasuke could only manifest one Rinnegan while Madara manifested two. Sasuke even received Six Paths Senjutsu with that and still couldn’t manifest a dual pair.

After Sakura was kidnapped, Adult Sasuke had to charge his eyes to where he couldn’t even manifest a Perfect Susano’o until his eyes had recharged. After which, Naruto even commented on his weakened eye power. Which also means that Sasuke couldn’t even activate his Mangekyou sharingan until his eyes fully charged.

Lmfao at that inexperience portion, Kid Nagato never had to charge his Rinnegan which just proves that Nagato was far more gifted than Sasuke.

Now which dimensional travel Ameno usage are you referring to?

 

[salamander uchiha]

I disagree to some degree, Sasuke received Six Paths chakra from Hagoromo himself, making the Ashura requirement completely null and void since we all know that Hagoromo has the undiluted chakra of both Ashura and Indra. Consequently Sasuke manifested one Rinnegan simply because his chakra reserves were minuscule and therefore, the chakra within his Rinnegan pales in comparison to the chakra within one of Madara’s. As for Sasuke instructing Naruto to transplant his eye into Kakashi, that could be interpreted in several ways; one of them being that Sasuke knew that Kakashi had Six Paths chakra at one point, and was capable of bearing a Rinnegan because of that. Or Sasuke knew that his Rinnegan wasn’t as taxing as Madara’s to where even Kakashi could bear it. Pretty sure it’s the latter.

While you're right this is ghost Hogaromo, he was too fodder to fight himself. The only reason I can see for that is because in his ghost state his chakra was weaker than Madara's, he couldn't even manifest in Madara's consciousness to talk to him(yes it's all bad writing). If he was strong or capable of anything he would've stopped Madara himself. I think what happened is Hogaromo's chakra mixed with Indra's chakra creating a new chakra, lesser than his own yet stronger than Indra's which resulted in a Pseudo Rinnegan in one eye. It would explain why Sasuke also has tomoe in his eyes. The other point is Kakashi lost the chakra at that point and Sasuke also said anybody(Sakura is also included). It shows why his lesser Rinnegan can be tolerated.

Obito’s chakra reserves were massive, however claiming them to be superior to Nagato’s may not be true. The intensity of feats that Nagato performed in short succession dwarf anything Obito has done; from the assault on the Leaf village, to the Shinra tensi, to battling Naruto, to battling the Kyuubi, to creating a planetary construct, to reviving a huge number of dead individuals. All of that while being crippled. While Obito’s feats were partially credited to Kabuto who created those Edo Tensei Jinchuriki for him (Obito) to control. Obito subjugating the Juubi was credited to his Hashirama DNA and the Rinnegan he possessed, which should tell you what Nagato would’ve been capable of had he not been crippled and had Hashirama DNA. Moving on from that though, Obito’s battle fatigue had nothing to do with his inability to tolerate both Rinnegan, because he’d transplanted it before he even encountered anyone on the battlefield.
Anyway, as I see it Nagato had far larger chakra reserves than Obito and consequently was able to tolerate both of Madara’s Rinnegan.

This is where I respectfully disagree, because Obito's feats are consistent and span over days with 0 rest in between. Nagato also used Preta path during his assault on Konoha so he was recovering chakra while he was battling. Also Konan said Nagato would shorten his lifespan if he used The Shinra Tensei. It leads me to think Nagato can pay lifeforce to use his jutsu or convert it to chakra otherwise why would he shorten his lifeforce after a jutsu? Also Nagato didn't really fight the 9 tails and he was bleeding I think when he used his Chibaku Tensei, perhaps he used more life force. As for the Rinne Tensei it seems to only require lifeforce for it's use, life for life so I don't see the chakra cost there. While Obito didn't have any of that for his feats, he was relying solely on his chakra. By subjugation, Obito was controlling it with his chakra via mokuton and when he became the Jyubi Jon, with his own will power. Obito also didn't really have Hashi cells, he had a white Zetsu body which Madara though was a Hashi body. Zetsu mentioned it in the flashbacks. Multi tasking divided power and attention, Kakashi mentioned there's a reason why Obito wasn't using the 6 paths powers via the 6 paths jutsu. So it would have a massive impact especially when you're multi tasking at an even higher level and fighting off the Jyubi's will as it's Jin. You're right that Obito made the statement regarding the Rinnegan before he engaged in the battles. Imo, he only said it to get Sakura to destroy the eye by pressurising her. If you think about it, he needed the Sharingan to also keep the tailed beasts under his control. The only factor I see is that a strong lifeforce is required to hold Madara Sama's Rinnegan or resist them to some degree. Nagato had that, but Obito clearly lacked that.

Btw the largest reserves in the Akatsuki according to Nagato belong to Kisame. It's mentioned when the Akatsuki are first introduced(too lazy to find the scan). Nagato would be second, but that's excluding Obito.

I do agree that Madara’s eyes are the eyes of the Sage and with that Urashiki possibility.

Madara's are definitely Hogaromo's eyes, but Urushiki's are fodderish. I think they're weaker than Sasuke's eyes, he couldn't even use any of the paths and got handled by two Kage, he was forced to dimension shift to avoid getting solo'd.

 

[Animegoin]

While you're right this is ghost Hogaromo, he was too fodder to fight himself. The only reason I can see for that is because in his ghost state his chakra was weaker than Madara's, he couldn't even manifest in Madara's consciousness to talk to him(yes it's all bad writing). If he was strong or capable of anything he would've stopped Madara himself. I think what happened is Hogaromo's chakra mixed with Indra's chakra creating a new chakra, lesser than his own yet stronger than Indra's which resulted in a Pseudo Rinnegan in one eye. It would explain why Sasuke also has tomoe in his eyes. The other point is Kakashi lost the chakra at that point and Sasuke also said anybody(Sakura is also included). It shows why his lesser Rinnegan can be tolerated.

Ghost Hagoromo wasn’t fodder by any means though, consider what could’ve happened if he’d given all of his Six Paths power to either Naruto or Sasuke instead of splitting it between the two; That’s not saying that Madara wasn’t nerfed though. Also Hagoromo wasn’t capable of manifesting before Madara because Madara wasn’t ever near death + he was in complete control of himself and the Juubi. Initially Hagoromo was only able to meet with those that were in limbo. Afterwards he was only capable of manifesting in the real world only after Madara no longer existed on earth...where Hagoromo was then capable of manipulating the chakra within Madara’s lower portion to manifest in the real world.

I do agree with anyone being able to tolerate Sasuke’s Rinnegan.

This is where I respectfully disagree, because Obito's feats are consistent and span over days with 0 rest in between. Nagato also used Preta path during his assault on Konoha so he was recovering chakra while he was battling. Also Konan said Nagato would shorten his lifespan if he used The Shinra Tensei. It leads me to think Nagato can pay lifeforce to use his jutsu or convert it to chakra otherwise why would he shorten his lifeforce after a jutsu? Also Nagato didn't really fight the 9 tails and he was bleeding I think when he used his Chibaku Tensei, perhaps he used more life force. As for the Rinne Tensei it seems to only require lifeforce for it's use, life for life so I don't see the chakra cost there. While Obito didn't have any of that for his feats, he was relying solely on his chakra. By subjugation, Obito was controlling it with his chakra via mokuton and when he became the Jyubi Jon, with his own will power. Obito also didn't really have Hashi cells, he had a white Zetsu body which Madara though was a Hashi body. Zetsu mentioned it in the flashbacks. Multi tasking divided power and attention, Kakashi mentioned there's a reason why Obito wasn't using the 6 paths powers via the 6 paths jutsu. So it would have a massive impact especially when you're multi tasking at an even higher level and fighting off the Jyubi's will as it's Jin. You're right that Obito made the statement regarding the Rinnegan before he engaged in the battles. Imo, he only said it to get Sakura to destroy the eye by pressurising her. If you think about it, he needed the Sharingan to also keep the tailed beasts under his control. The only factor I see is that a strong lifeforce is required to hold Madara Sama's Rinnegan or resist them to some degree. Nagato had that, but Obito clearly lacked that.

Btw the largest reserves in the Akatsuki according to Nagato belong to Kisame. It's mentioned when the Akatsuki are first introduced(too lazy to find the scan). Nagato would be second, but that's excluding Obito.

Nagato’s Preta Path of Pain used a sealing jutsu. None of the chakra that was absorbed by that Path of Pain returned to Nagato, otherwise Nagato himself would’ve turned into a Toad along with his Path Of Pain. And Nagato’s lifespan would lessen because he was so feeble from decades of physical inactivity that the chakra toll was physically destroying what remained of his body. Plus the techniques of the Rinnegan draws chakra from the brain, which is why Nagato was bleeding from the nose after using Chibaku Tensei. He’d already wasted HUGE amounts of chakra by using the huge shinra Tensei, if he hadn’t used that then he wouldn’t have been in bad shape at all. And yes, Nagato did battle the nine tails, It was in chapter 438.
Also the Rinne-Tensei is dependent on how much chakra one has remaining, Konan stated that she feared for Nagato’s life only because he’d used so much chakra already. Also, Obito did have Hashirama cells, which is why elder Madara stated the “even if you never awaken the Rinnegan...,” portion. I could go far more in-depth into that but there’s no need to. Also Obito validated Kakashi’s theory that the reason as to why he wasn’t using the 6 Paths techniques was because his chakra wasn’t capable of doing all of that, and if the Kabuto hadn’t made the Edo Tensei then Obito would’ve really been shit out of luck. Nagato never had that problem. Furthermore, while Obito was had trouble controlling the Juubi’s will initially, he was capable of overcoming it thanks to the combination of his own will power and his physical composition powers. And Obito definitely didn’t just say that to have Sakura destroy the eye, he meant it.

While I’m not saying that Kisame doesn’t have huge reserves, Nagato clearly couldnt have been counting himself in that. If he was then it was a wank.

Madara's are definitely Hogaromo's eyes, but Urushiki's are fodderish. I think they're weaker than Sasuke's eyes, he couldn't even use any of the paths and got handled by two Kage, he was forced to dimension shift to avoid getting solo'd.

I agree

 

[Draw]

What do you mean Obito, Madara, and Nagato spammed the rinnegan without the rinnegan losing chakra?

Sasuke has a cool down for Ameno..just like Shinra Tensei would give Nagato.

Sasuke does not have these low chakra reserves you say. A character with low reserves is Kakashi or Itachi. Itachi could not sustain V3 Susano while Sasuke can use Perfect. He also is recharging his eye because hopping dimensions takes a lot of chakra. Kaguya hopped through dimensions in an instant because shed draw chakra from the IT. So for Sasuke to do anything close to this would in fact imply he has a lot of chakra.

Madara was not blind or crippled at any point idk what you are saying

And lastly, you fail to see that Kishimoto served us very small moments and gestures that showed Sasuke cared for Naruto. Sasuke could sustain his sharingan the whole battle. At the very end when Sasuke was going for the finishing blow: Sasuke deactivated his sharingan out of hesitation: similarly to how he changed his strike at VOTE pt1 from a piercing blow to Naruto's chest, to a straight punch to the gut. How do I know this? Because Sasuke then went on to use the MS after Naruto sent him flying before the final clash. This would not suggest Sasuke could not sustain his sharingan.

Sasuke also battled for a full two days and the only time he is seen w his eye shut from exhaustion is Vs. Naruto.

GG, yes he can handle at least one if Obito could. Sasuke IS the reincarnation of Indra. Surely he can use 1 rinnegan if an average uchiha with senju dna can.

Post automatically merged: Feb 19, 2019

Consequently Sasuke manifested one Rinnegan simply because his chakra reserves were minuscule

Wait so you are telling me that if Sasuke had more chakra his other sharingan would've transformed into a rinnegan??? Hagoromo must've been all like "Well Kid, I'd let you get a second rinnegan but you dont have enough chakra so i cannot hand it over" seems like legit head canon. I would like to believe Kishi wanted to keep Sasuke grounded to his uchiha roots and appearance and left him with one sharingan.

 

[salamander uchiha]

Ghost Hagoromo wasn’t fodder by any means though, consider what could’ve happened if he’d given all of his Six Paths power to either Naruto or Sasuke instead of splitting it between the two; That’s not saying that Madara wasn’t nerfed though. Also Hagoromo wasn’t capable of manifesting before Madara because Madara wasn’t ever near death + he was in complete control of himself and the Juubi. Initially Hagoromo was only able to meet with those that were in limbo. Afterwards he was only capable of manifesting in the real world only after Madara no longer existed on earth...where Hagoromo was then capable of manipulating the chakra within Madara’s lower portion to manifest in the real world.

Near death was never stated to be a reason for Fodderomo's manisfestaion. I mean BZ was used to justify this ass pull and all he said it's possible for transmigrants to meet him if they're strong enough or something like that. Even with his lesser chakra Hogaromo being given to Naruto he would've been but raped as he lacked the Rinnegan. He had plenty of opportunity to meet Madara even while he was alive(near death originally) and to guide him but chose not to. He probably knew he'd end up getting solo'd. As for the real world manifestation even that was half assed nonsense.

I do agree with anyone being able to tolerate Sasuke’s Rinnegan.

Good we agree on something.

Nagato’s Preta Path of Pain used a sealing jutsu. None of the chakra that was absorbed by that Path of Pain returned to Nagato, otherwise Nagato himself would’ve turned into a Toad along with his Path Of Pain. And Nagato’s lifespan would lessen because he was so feeble from decades of physical inactivity that the chakra toll was physically destroying what remained of his body. Plus the techniques of the Rinnegan draws chakra from the brain, which is why Nagato was bleeding from the nose after using Chibaku Tensei. He’d already wasted HUGE amounts of chakra by using the huge shinra Tensei, if he hadn’t used that then he wouldn’t have been in bad shape at all. And yes, Nagato did battle the nine tails, It was in chapter 438.

The Preta Path itself, turned the pain to stone because Naruto started to absorb massive amounts of natural energy(not sage chakra). The body itself doesn't have chakra flowing through it except what transmitted to it, it was inevitable it would turn to stone. Nagato was cut off when it turned to stone. Nagato still had chakra compared to it. The pains share sight via chakra transmition with one another so it moves back and forth. Nagato has to receive chakra to know what's going on a th then relay chakra to them. Normally I'd agree with you but the only Rinnegan techniques that are shown to draw chakra from the brain are those that work on the same principles as the Sharingan. The bleeding from the brain indicates stress on the body as a whole. Jonin only said it would shorten his lifeforce. It is possible that the Uzumaki can covert lifeforce to chakra to fuel their jutsu. I wouldn't really call that a battle ,lol.

Also the Rinne-Tensei is dependent on how much chakra one has remaining, Konan stated that she feared for Nagato’s life only because he’d used so much chakra already. Also, Obito did have Hashirama cells, which is why elder Madara stated the “even if you never awaken the Rinnegan...,” portion. I could go far more in-depth into that but there’s no need to. Also Obito validated Kakashi’s theory that the reason as to why he wasn’t using the 6 Paths techniques was because his chakra wasn’t capable of doing all of that, and if the Kabuto hadn’t made the Edo Tensei then Obito would’ve really been shit out of luck. Nagato never had that problem. Furthermore, while Obito was had trouble controlling the Juubi’s will initially, he was capable of overcoming it thanks to the combination of his own will power and his physical composition powers. And Obito definitely didn’t just say that to have Sakura destroy the eye, he meant it.

Konan also though Nagato would live through it, she clearly didn't know how the Rinne rebirth works. It's likely Nagato lied to her so she doesn't interfere with the original plan(Tobi's plan). Kabuto made the Edo Tensei, yes. But, it was Obito who was controlling them via the 6 paths techniques and they still required transmition of chakra, simultaneously controlling the tailed beasts and the Mezo. Kakashi concluded he wasn't using the paths for this reason because controlling tailed beasts requires far more power. 6 at the same time I think. I only saw his will power play a part in it, I don't remember his composition playing any part in it or being hinted at. The two Rinnegan together bring at full power would only be true for an Uchiha, imo. Because, their brain also produces the special chakra. I think it was to get Sakura to destroy the eyes asap.

While I’m not saying that Kisame doesn’t have huge reserves, Nagato clearly couldnt have been counting himself in that. If he was then it was a wank.

I agree

Nah, Nagato was the leader at that time, he was definitely including himself. It was legitimate truthful wank.

See we've agreed on two things so far.

 

[Animegoin]

What do you mean Obito, Madara, and Nagato spammed the rinnegan without the rinnegan losing chakra?

Sasuke has a cool down for Ameno..just like Shinra Tensei would give Nagato.

Sasuke does not have these low chakra reserves you say. A character with low reserves is Kakashi or Itachi. Itachi could not sustain V3 Susano while Sasuke can use Perfect. He also is recharging his eye because hopping dimensions takes a lot of chakra. Kaguya hopped through dimensions in an instant because shed draw chakra from the IT. So for Sasuke to do anything close to this would in fact imply he has a lot of chakra.

Madara was not blind or crippled at any point idk what you are saying

And lastly, you fail to see that Kishimoto served us very small moments and gestures that showed Sasuke cared for Naruto. Sasuke could sustain his sharingan the whole battle. At the very end when Sasuke was going for the finishing blow: Sasuke deactivated his sharingan out of hesitation: similarly to how he changed his strike at VOTE pt1 from a piercing blow to Naruto's chest, to a straight punch to the gut. How do I know this? Because Sasuke then went on to use the MS after Naruto sent him flying before the final clash. This would not suggest Sasuke could not sustain his sharingan.

Sasuke also battled for a full two days and the only time he is seen w his eye shut from exhaustion is Vs. Naruto.

GG, yes he can handle at least one if Obito could. Sasuke IS the reincarnation of Indra. Surely he can use 1 rinnegan if an average uchiha with senju dna can.

My reply is in the spoiler just to keep this looking organized

Spoiler

I mean that no matter how many Rinnegan techniques they spammed consecutively, they never had to close their eyes for Madara’s Rinnegan to charge.

I’m not talking about the cool down period, I’m talking about Sasuke actually having to close his left eye in order for the Rinnegan to recharge.

Incorrect on nearly all basis. First, Sasuke’s chakra reserves are canonically lower than Madara’s, Itachi and Kakashi are irrelevant unless we consider how “weak Kakashi” was able to use Perfect Susano’o. Secondly, Sasuke had recharged his eyes on numerous occasions in the War arc which was before he even learned to dimension hop. And lastly, save the fanfic, Sasuke’s dimensional hop isn’t comparable to Kaguya’s. Kaguya teleports in mass, Sasuke creates a portal. When Kaguya creates a portal, she isn’t remotely drained like Sasuke is.

Madara was blind and completely crippled on his deathbed, tf are you talking about? Learn to read, I clearly said after the battle with Kaguya. ?

Lmfao no, so you’re saying that Sasuke intentionally deactivated his sharingan? Like I said, save the headcanon; a pain spasm caused Sasuke to deactivate his sharingan. That was explicitly shown.

Oh and Sasuke didn’t battle for two full days without running out of chakra. ? Stop with the fanfic, for most of the their battle against Obito, Sasuke had Kurama’s chakra cloak around him. After that, Sasuke received chakra from Hashirama before he went to ambush Madara, then after that he received chakra from Kabuto and Hagoromo. >Then after Juubi Madara went into Obito’s dimension, the first thing Sasuke did was close his eye to recharge it.

GG you played yourself and I proved that obviously Sasuke can’t.

Wait so you are telling me that if Sasuke had more chakra his other sharingan would've transformed into a rinnegan??? Hagoromo must've been all like "Well Kid, I'd let you get a second rinnegan but you dont have enough chakra so i cannot hand it over" seems like legit head canon. I would like to believe Kishi wanted to keep Sasuke grounded to his uchiha roots and appearance and left him with one sharingan.

Yes yes, that’s exactly what I’m saying. Regardless of what your interpretation of it -which is ironically headcanon ?, you played yourself.

Near death was never stated to be a reason for Fodderomo's manisfestaion. I mean BZ was used to justify this ass pull and all he said it's possible for transmigrants to meet him if they're strong enough or something like that. Even with his lesser chakra Hogaromo being given to Naruto he would've been but raped as he lacked the Rinnegan. He had plenty of opportunity to meet Madara even while he was alive(near death originally) and to guide him but chose not to. He probably knew he'd end up getting solo'd. As for the real world manifestation even that was half assed nonsense.

In both Naruto and Sasuke’s cases, they were on the verge of death. That’s a given at this point.

@bold: I agree, I even said something along those lines before.

The Preta Path itself, turned the pain to stone because Naruto started to absorb massive amounts of natural energy(not sage chakra). The body itself doesn't have chakra flowing through it except what transmitted to it, it was inevitable it would turn to stone. Nagato was cut off when it turned to stone. Nagato still had chakra compared to it. The pains share sight via chakra transmition with one another so it moves back and forth. Nagato has to receive chakra to know what's going on a th then relay chakra to them. Normally I'd agree with you but the only Rinnegan techniques that are shown to draw chakra from the brain are those that work on the same principles as the Sharingan. The bleeding from the brain indicates stress on the body as a whole. Jonin only said it would shorten his lifeforce. It is possible that the Uzumaki can covert lifeforce to chakra to fuel their jutsu. I wouldn't really call that a battle ,lol.

Naruto’s body automatically converted the Nature energy into Senjutsu, which is what the Preta Path had absorbed. Naruto can only generate Toad senjutsu, which is why the Preta Path turned into a Toad. Again none of the chakra that Preta Path of Pain has ever absorbed flowed back to Nagato and Pains’ line of Sight aren’t based on the chakra rods. They’re based off of the Rinnegan itself, which is why when the animal Path was inside the Toad, despite Nagato still being able to still control it, he couldn’t pinpoint its location. If what you were saying was true, Nagato would always know their location since the Paths of Pain were still receiving signals; much like a radar. So ultimately Nagato can actually see out of the eyes of his puppets via their shared Rinnegan. Also I disagree, it was a fight in a sense that it made Nagato expend chakra.

Konan also though Nagato would live through it, she clearly didn't know how the Rinne rebirth works. It's likely Nagato lied to her so she doesn't interfere with the original plan(Tobi's plan). Kabuto made the Edo Tensei, yes. But, it was Obito who was controlling them via the 6 paths techniques and they still required transmition of chakra, simultaneously controlling the tailed beasts and the Mezo. Kakashi concluded he wasn't using the paths for this reason because controlling tailed beasts requires far more power. 6 at the same time I think. I only saw his will power play a part in it, I don't remember his composition playing any part in it or being hinted at. The two Rinnegan together bring at full power would only be true for an Uchiha, imo. Because, their brain also produces the special chakra. I think it was to get Sakura to destroy the eyes asap.

Konan could’ve been right though, if he hadn’t exhausted so much chakra he probably could’ve lived. Even after he exhausted well over 90% of his chakra and resurrected the villagers, he was still alive and talking to Naruto while Obito would’ve died immediately. Like I said earlier, the chakra that Nagato exhausted costed him his life. Similar to how BZ said that death after having a bijuu removed was an absolute rule which turned out to be BS. Moving on though, yes that was my point. Obito can’t control the beasts and use the rinnegan’s 6 Paths techniques. Also Obito’s composition came into play by him having Hashirama’s cells, even if it was a tiny bit. Madara himself stated that Hashirama cells were what was helping enforce their dominance over the Juubi, but without Hashirama cells it wouldn’t have been possible at all.

Nah, Nagato was the leader at that time, he was definitely including himself. It was legitimate truthful wank.

See we've agreed on two things so far.

If Nagato did put himself in that equation, which I doubt he did, then it was a wank.

Indeed.

 

[Naruto X Hunter]

I disagree to some degree, Sasuke received Six Paths chakra from Hagoromo himself, making the Ashura requirement completely null and void since we all know that Hagoromo has the undiluted chakra of both Ashura and Indra. Consequently Sasuke manifested one Rinnegan simply because his chakra reserves were minuscule and therefore, the chakra within his Rinnegan pales in comparison to the chakra within one of Madara’s. As for Sasuke instructing Naruto to transplant his eye into Kakashi, that could be interpreted in several ways; one of them being that Sasuke knew that Kakashi had Six Paths chakra at one point, and was capable of bearing a Rinnegan because of that. Or Sasuke knew that his Rinnegan wasn’t as taxing as Madara’s to where even Kakashi could bear it. Pretty sure it’s the latter.

Obito’s chakra reserves were massive, however claiming them to be superior to Nagato’s may not be true. The intensity of feats that Nagato performed in short succession dwarf anything Obito has done; from the assault on the Leaf village, to the Shinra tensi, to battling Naruto, to battling the Kyuubi, to creating a planetary construct, to reviving a huge number of dead individuals. All of that while being crippled. While Obito’s feats were partially credited to Kabuto who created those Edo Tensei Jinchuriki for him (Obito) to control. Obito subjugating the Juubi was credited to his Hashirama DNA and the Rinnegan he possessed, which should tell you what Nagato would’ve been capable of had he not been crippled and had Hashirama DNA. Moving on from that though, Obito’s battle fatigue had nothing to do with his inability to tolerate both Rinnegan, because he’d transplanted it before he even encountered anyone on the battlefield.
Anyway, as I see it Nagato had far larger chakra reserves than Obito and consequently was able to tolerate both of Madara’s Rinnegan.

I do agree that Madara’s eyes are the eyes of the Sage and with that Urashiki possibility.



That logic is retarded, I’m sorry. Hagoromo himself had 2 Kekkei Mora Rinnegan and was the son of Kaguya but you think that Urashiki And Sasuke’s are closer to that eye? Not by a long shot.

Because Nagato was clearly genetically superior to Sasuke. One of Madara’s Rinnegan contains far more chakra than Sasuke’s does And Nagato was able to tolerate both of Madara’s. Even after receiving chakra from the source of the Rinnegan itself, Sasuke could only manifest one Rinnegan while Madara manifested two. Sasuke even received Six Paths Senjutsu with that and still couldn’t manifest a dual pair.

After Sakura was kidnapped, Adult Sasuke had to charge his eyes to where he couldn’t even manifest a Perfect Susano’o until his eyes had recharged. After which, Naruto even commented on his weakened eye power. Which also means that Sasuke couldn’t even activate his Mangekyou sharingan until his eyes fully charged.

Lmfao at that inexperience portion, Kid Nagato never had to charge his Rinnegan which just proves that Nagato was far more gifted than Sasuke.

Now which dimensional travel Ameno usage are you referring to?

- Nagato struggled to capture the non-fully transformed Yang Kyuubi. Whereas Sasuke easily subdued all 9 Biju with Genjutsu, captured them with Chibaku Tensei, then had an extended battle with a Naruto and Kyuubi who were far stronger than the one Nagato lost to. To think Nagato has more chakra than Sasuke is ridiculous. As for genes, he's a member of a clan that branched off from the Senju. His genes are more diluted than Sasuke's.

The Sage is way stronger but Sasuke's Rinnegan itself is superior to his. Think about why he awakened this particular Rinnegan in the first place. It was after he received the Sage's power. He already had Indra's power, so adding the Sage's power (Rinnegan) ontop of Indra's (Sharingan), formed the Tomoe Rinnegan which is a combination of both Dojutsu. Having use of both their abilities unlike the base Rinnegan.

If Madara's base Rinnegan is superior to Sasuke's Tomoe Rinnegan, then why would he need to switch back to EMS to cast Genjutsu on A while Sasuke doesn't need to? The only way Madara's use of the Rinnegan may look better than Sasuke's is because he was/is more powerful/skilled. Not because the eye by itself is inherently better.

- We barely know about kid Nagato. He was only said by Jiraiya to have mastered the basic nature elements. If you're referring to kid Nagato, he got permanently screwed on his first use (?) of the Gedo Statue.

- I was referring to Amenotejikara. As an Adult he hasn't shown to need any cool time for it.

- Do you think Madara>Kaguya because she awakened one Rinne-sharingan? Matter fact, Madara only awakened one aswell. What's your explanation on that?

 

[Ansatsuken]

Your logic is valid only if Sasuke awakened one Regular Rinnegan eye without any Tomoes but the reality is Sasuke awakened 6 Tomoes Rinnegan. Clearly it no longer in the category of normal Rinnegan. Other talking about chakra reserves, Obito and Nagata are not necessary at all here bcus you're not comparing Apple with Apple but Apple with Orange. I thought this matter already reached the consensus long time ago.

 

[Animegoin]

- Nagato struggled to capture the non-fully transformed Yang Kyuubi. Whereas Sasuke easily subdued all 9 Biju with Genjutsu, captured them with Chibaku Tensei, then had an extended battle with a Naruto and Kyuubi who were far stronger than the one Nagato lost to. To think Nagato has more chakra than Sasuke is ridiculous. As for genes, he's a member of a clan that branched off from the Senju. His genes are more diluted than Sasuke's.

>Lmfao at that False logic, Nagato didn’t have access to genjutsu which is what Sasuke used to tame those bijuu. Nagato also didnt received Six Paths chakra and Six Paths Senjutsu from Hagoromo, Senjutsu from Hashirama nor Hashirama cells from Kabuto. In essence, Sasuke was a walking asspull handout and your logic failed the very moment you decided to type them. About the, “his genes are more diluted than Sasuke’s,” portion I say that while they are diluted, they’re still akin to Senju and clearly provided a superior host for the Rinnegan than they did Sasuke.

-The Sage is way stronger but Sasuke's Rinnegan itself is superior to his. Think about why he awakened this particular Rinnegan in the first place. It was after he received the Sage's power. He already had Indra's power, so adding the Sage's power (Rinnegan) ontop of Indra's (Sharingan), formed the Tomoe Rinnegan which is a combination of both Dojutsu. Having use of both their abilities unlike the base Rinnegan.

>That’s literally retarded and the definition of headcanon. Hagoromo literally created the OP Izanagi technique using his Rinnegan, which the lower scaled version of that is a sharingan genjutsu technique. Not to mention that neither Madara nor Hagoromo had any Mangekyou sharingan techniques anyhow, while Sasuke does. Madara literally only has Susano’o.

-If Madara's base Rinnegan is superior to Sasuke's Tomoe Rinnegan, then why would he need to switch back to EMS to cast Genjutsu on A while Sasuke doesn't need to? The only way Madara's use of the Rinnegan may look better than Sasuke's is because he was/is more powerful/skilled. Not because the eye by itself is inherently better.

>Using that logic, why did Edo Madara activate his mangekyou sharingan to use Susano’o when was clearly capable of using Susano’o without even having his eyes in head at all? He didn’t even need to activate his sharingan at all, right? Same principle. But yes, Madara is superior than Sasuke, and proof of that resulted in not only dual Rinnegan, but both of which are individually of superior quality.

- We barely know about kid Nagato. He was only said by Jiraiya to have mastered the basic nature elements. If you're referring to kid Nagato, he got permanently screwed on his first use (?) of the Gedo Statue.

>Lmfao piss poor fanfic, we know that kid Nagato had been using the Rinnegan subconsciously and had killed many people before he even turned 12. We also know that later on his life, despite not having received any teachings from Obito, Nagato was able to save Karin, use the deva path and summon the Gedo Statue. He could’ve even had the Gedo Mazo rampage if he wanted. We also know that a 17-18 year old Sasuke couldn’t even keep his eye open after literally only using the Rinnegan to teleport. ? Madara spammed Limbo with only one Rinnegan and never had to close his eye in order for it to recharge. Played yourself. Kid Nagato > Sasuke.

- I was referring to Amenotejikara. As an Adult he hasn't shown to need any cool time for it.

>He literally did, which is why he wasn’t able to use Perfect Susano’o until after they left Orochimaru’s hideout. And that was after one use of it. Other than that though, Sasuke hasn’t been shown to have used Ameno consecutively.

- Do you think Madara>Kaguya because she awakened one Rinne-sharingan Sharingan? Matter fact, Madara only awakened one aswell. What's your explanation on that?

>I think Madara > Kaguya in general, not only because he manifested Hagoromo’s dual Rinnegan but also because he’s smarter (strategically, combat-wise and Six Paths techniques) than Kaguya. Also Madara only manifested the Juubi’s sharingan because he had all of the bijuu and the husk inside of him when he absorbed the Shinju tree. Hagoromo is also stronger than Kaguya because too is intellectually superior to Kaguya and because of his Rinnegan. None of which can be said for Sasuke.

Post automatically merged: Feb 20, 2019

Your logic is valid only if Sasuke awakened one Regular Rinnegan eye without any Tomoes but the reality is Sasuke awakened 6 Tomoes Rinnegan. Clearly it no longer in the category of normal Rinnegan. Other talking about chakra reserves, Obito and Nagata are not necessary at all here bcus you're not comparing Apple with Apple but Apple with Orange. I thought this matter already reached the consensus long time ago.

Unfortunately that isn’t entirely correct, regardless of whether the tomoe are present on the Rinnegan or not, it’s still just a Rinnegan. In fact, the only difference in Sasuke’s Rinnegan compared to the others that are shown is that Sasuke’s has a recharge time. The tomoe exist on Sasuke’s Rinnegan even when he doesn’t have his sharingan activated, but they were missing when Sasuke had full chakra. But regardless of the inconsistent appearances of the tomoe, everyone (Hagoromo, Kurama, Black Zetsu, Madara, Sakura and even Sasuke) attested that its a normal Rinnegan. Again, the only real difference being that it has a recharge time. It really is a comparison between apples and apples.

 

[Ansatsuken]

>Lmfao at that False logic, Nagato didn’t have access to genjutsu which is what Sasuke used to tame those bijuu. Nagato also didnt received Six Paths chakra and Six Paths Senjutsu from Hagoromo, Senjutsu from Hashirama nor Hashirama cells from Kabuto. In essence, Sasuke was a walking asspull handout and your logic failed the very moment you decided to type them. About the, “his genes are more diluted than Sasuke’s,” portion I say that while they are diluted, they’re still akin to Senju and clearly provided a superior host for the Rinnegan than they did Sasuke.



>That’s literally retarded and the definition of headcanon. Hagoromo literally created the OP Izanagi technique using his Rinnegan, which the lower scaled version of that is a sharingan genjutsu technique. Not to mention that neither Madara nor Hagoromo had any Mangekyou sharingan techniques anyhow, while Sasuke does. Madara literally only has Susano’o.



>Using that logic, why did Edo Madara activate his mangekyou sharingan to use Susano’o when was clearly capable of using Susano’o without even having his eyes in head at all? He didn’t even need to activate his sharingan at all, right? Same principle. But yes, Madara is superior than Sasuke, and proof of that resulted in not only dual Rinnegan, but both of which are individually of superior quality.



>Lmfao piss poor fanfic, we know that kid Nagato had been using the Rinnegan subconsciously and had killed many people before he even turned 12. We also know that later on his life, despite not having received any teachings from Obito, Nagato was able to save Karin, use the deva path and summon the Gedo Statue. He could’ve even had the Gedo Mazo rampage if he wanted. We also know that a 17-18 year old Sasuke couldn’t even keep his eye open after literally only using the Rinnegan to teleport. ? Madara spammed Limbo with only one Rinnegan and never had to close his eye in order for it to recharge. Played yourself. Kid Nagato > Sasuke.



>He literally did, which is why he wasn’t able to use Perfect Susano’o until after they left Orochimaru’s hideout. And that was after one use of it. Other than that though, Sasuke hasn’t been shown to have used Ameno consecutively.



>I think Madara > Kaguya in general, not only because he manifested Hagoromo’s dual Rinnegan but also because he’s smarter (strategically, combat-wise and Six Paths techniques) than Kaguya. Also Madara only manifested the Juubi’s sharingan because he had all of the bijuu and the husk inside of him when he absorbed the Shinju tree. Hagoromo is also stronger than Kaguya because too is intellectually superior to Kaguya and because of his Rinnegan. None of which can be said for Sasuke.

Post automatically merged: Feb 20, 2019

Unfortunately that isn’t entirely correct, regardless of whether the tomoe are present on the Rinnegan or not, it’s still just a Rinnegan. In fact, the only difference in Sasuke’s Rinnegan compared to the others that are shown is that Sasuke’s has a recharge time. The tomoe exist on Sasuke’s Rinnegan even when he doesn’t have his sharingan activated, but they were missing when Sasuke had full chakra. But regardless of the inconsistent appearances of the tomoe, everyone (Hagoromo, Kurama, Black Zetsu, Madara, Sakura and even Sasuke) attested that its a normal Rinnegan. Again, the only real difference being that it has a recharge time. It really is a comparison between apples and apples.

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Sorry buddy you maybe can fooled a kid or very old person but not me

The Tomoes on Sasuke's Rinnegan disappeared when he's not in full chakra but after his chakra is back to full the tomoes on his Rinnegan appeared. That means his full Rinnegan power is coming back.

And those people including Sasuke never called it normal Rinnegan but just Rinnegan. But we all know its a different kind of Rinnegan.

 

[Robot]

Yes

 

[Animegoin]

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Sorry buddy you maybe can fooled a kid or very old person but not me

The Tomoes on Sasuke's Rinnegan disappeared when he's not in full chakra but after his chakra is back to full the tomoes on his Rinnegan appeared. That means his full Rinnegan power is coming back.

And those people including Sasuke never called it normal Rinnegan but just Rinnegan. But we all know its a different kind of Rinnegan.

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Yeah, nice try but I wasn’t kidding, Sasuke’s tomoe are blatantly missing despite him having full chakra, but they appear again on the same page, bottom right panel. The after Obito And Sakura rescued Sasuke from the desert planet, Sasuke states that his eyes haven’t recharged yet but yet, he still had the tomoe there. Which is, like I said, an inconsistency.

Again, nice try though but better luck next time. And like I said, a Rinnegan is a Rinnegan. Period.

 

[Robot]

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Yeah, nice try but I wasn’t kidding, Sasuke’s tomoe are blatantly missing despite him having full chakra, but they appear again on the same page, bottom right panel. The after Obito And Sakura rescued Sasuke from the desert planet, Sasuke states that his eyes haven’t recharged yet but yet, he still had the tomoe there. Which is, like I said, an inconsistency.

Again, nice try though but better luck next time. And like I said, a Rinnegan is a Rinnegan. Period.

Sorry just wondering why would you ask a question if you have the answer picked out in your brain already.

 

[Animegoin]

Sorry just wondering why would you ask a question if you have the answer picked out in your brain already.

I wasn’t debating against anyone’s answer, I was debating their flawed logic that led them to making those conclusions.

 

[Robot]

I wasn’t debating against anyone’s answer, I was debating their flawed logic that led them to making those conclusions.

So you were debating their answer... Calling someone out for how they got their answer is the same calling someone out for the answer they got.

 

[Ansatsuken]

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Yeah, nice try but I wasn’t kidding, Sasuke’s tomoe are blatantly missing despite him having full chakra, but they appear again on the same page, bottom right panel. The after Obito And Sakura rescued Sasuke from the desert planet, Sasuke states that his eyes haven’t recharged yet but yet, he still had the tomoe there. Which is, like I said, an inconsistency.

Again, nice try though but better luck next time. And like I said, a Rinnegan is a Rinnegan. Period.

That cant be used in an argument. It just a small mistake from Kishi and he does something like that occasionally in his manga.

You previously said those people called it "Normal Rinnegan". But it never had any classification. Like you said "Rinnegan is a Rinnegan". And yes I can agree with that. But for Sasuke his single Rinnegan can perform/do more than Madara's single Rinnegan. There is where the differentiation happened.

 

[Animegoin]

So you were debating their answer... Calling someone out for how they got their answer is the same calling someone out for the answer they got.

No it isn’t and if you actually read the conversations in this thread, you’d see that you’re wrong. I highly doubt you’d ever admit though.

Also, don’t spam my thread with idiotic statements like those you just made. Either contribute to the discussion or piss off.

Post automatically merged: Feb 20, 2019

That cant be used in an argument. It just a small mistake from Kishi and he does something like that occasionally in his manga.

You previously said those people called it "Normal Rinnegan". But it never had any classification. Like you said "Rinnegan is a Rinnegan". And yes I can agree with that. But for Sasuke his single Rinnegan can perform/do more than Madara's single Rinnegan. There is where the differentiation happened.

Nah, that’s not a valid excuse, bud. And anyway, what about the second portion that I brought up? Ya know, when Sasuke was rescued from the desert dimension (planet) and stated that his eye hadn’t recharged yet but he still had the tomoe there?

“A Rinnegan is a Rinnegan, period.” Sasuke’s Rinnegan cannot do more than one of Madara’s or Hagoromo’s, Plus Sasuke’s has to recharge, while Madara’s doesn’t, which proves that he won’t be able to tolerate one of Madara’s Rinnegan.