How does Hashirama counter Tsukuyomi?

[ComplexCity]

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Only someone with kekkei genkei (blood line - the Uchiha blood line), and Sharingan can break Tsukuyomi.

Sasuke fits the criteria.

I asked how Sasuke broke it. I didn't ask you what was the criteria

 

[Genyūmaru1]

1. LOL did you read your own post u posed ways to defeat genjutsu in general
2. You wrote ways to counter and defeat fodder genjutsu and assumed hashi knows this "Once has you there is no contesting this genjutsu it doesnt matter if you can break it or not".
3. Orochimaru has a 5 in genjutsu in databook and was considered a genius who knows the mechanics and how it works yet was powerless to stop even Kasegui. Chakra control has nothing to do with fighting tsukuyomi. Hashi is not an uchiha period
4. Since you don't seem to grasp simple facts MS > 3 tome
5. no need to ignore the manga because it rustles u ^^

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These hashirama fapboys got me like

 

[BLAZE]

But a statement from Itachi, a character who has never faced Hashirama/Tobirama/Madara and characters of that level... or characters like Tsunade who are said to have the best chakra control, is credible enough for you to claim it can't be broken without the Uchiha blood??? How so??

This guy and his shit logic.Nothing can change that

I asked how Sasuke broke it. I didn't ask you what was the criteria

can u read :|

 

[SoundBar]

Quit trolling. Link manga scans that signify Hashirama can counter Tsukuyomi.

Naw, I'm not wasting my time doing that, fuks wrong with you kid? lmao we ALL remember when King Hashirama broke Edo Tense I through sheer will power, Tobirama lifted a finger and the room shook, what makes you think Tsukiyomi is going to hold either of them? It's laughable to even think such a thing.

But like I said before, Hashirama can just tank it, still no proof against it.

 

[Berkenstiel]

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These hashirama fapboys got me like

Tbh why are we arguing with KH he thinks tsunde can beat Itachi

 

[Genyūmaru1]

I asked how Sasuke broke it. I didn't ask you what was the criteria

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[Genyūmaru1]

Tbh why are we arguing with KH he thinks tsunde can beat Itachi

He what?

 

[Claymantan]

But a statement from Itachi, a character who has never faced Hashirama/Tobirama/Madara and characters of that level... or characters like Tsunade who are said to have the best chakra control, is credible enough for you to claim it can't be broken without the Uchiha blood??? How so??

What proof is there, that other methods that don't work, besides a statement from a character who has limited knowledge??

Speculation: the forming of a theory or conjecture without firm evidence.

To claim that other methods don't work, despite the genjutsu being given 2 methods of countering it, without any proof.. is speculation.

Your evidence is that Hashirama has high chakra, therefore he can break Tsukuyomi. While a high release of chakra is a requirement to break Tsukuyomi, there's not a single manga scan that states that high chakra averts the other requirements that Itachi states. Therefore, it's speculation, because even though your theory is based on evidence (that a high chakra release is required to break Tsukuyomi), that is not firm evidence that Hashirama can break Tsukuyomi, because it ignores the other two requirements that Itachi states. No character ever indicates that the other two requirements can be made irrelevant. Hashirama has high chakra reserves, no doubt, but I could even argue that he's still a human shinobi and shouldn't be treated as exempt from those requirements just because of that.

It's not 2 other methods. There's nothing saying that you can just avert those methods by just having high chakra. For all we know, the Sharingan brain pathway and Uchiha bloodline are necessary for a user to even try to counter using chakra pathways.

So, speculative argument.

That Hagoromo can break Tsukuyomi is more believable, because he's the father of the progenitor of Uchiha blood. So that comparison someone made before is a false equivalency.

 

[Simbv]

KingHashirama, complexCity, most of the logical members left late 2014, Early 2015. With them came the swarm of Sasuke/Uchiha Stans. Just leave it alone and stop arguing.

 

[KingHashirama]

Tsukuyomi only has 1 given method of breaking it dude. Having the Uchiha Bloodline, and the Sharingan. What don't you understand???

Tsukuyomi has never been given a method. But a statement from a character, who claimed the tool known as the sharingan, can break his tsukuyomi. The sharingan breaks tsukuyomi via 1 of those 2 methods, given by Jiraiya. That is why I said read up on genjutsu, so you can actually know how genjutsu works.


Tsukuyomi falls under the category of Genjutsu, it is no exception from the 2 methods. If you believe it is an exception, I need you provide a scan where it says that.

Databook 2 and Itachi's statement from part 1 = Invalid. << (the reasoning behind countering genjutsu was not explained in part 1, but in part 2.)


You also need to provide a scan, where Itachi has tried his technique against those with Perfect chakra control. And those on the level of Hashirama and Tobirama.

You continously do not provide any scans, that are asked from you, but provide scans that are irrelevant to the discussion.

 

[Trúth]

^ Probably a highschool drop out with that reading comprehension

-Not directly related to Itachi (of the same blood)
-Not even an Uchiha
-Won't even bother to avoid eye contact

Conclusion: He doesn't. 7 pages of butthurt over this simple fact tho.

 

[BLAZE]

But like I said before, Hashirama can just tank it, still no proof against it.

:lol i mean wow

Hashirama cannot break Tsukuyomi its as simple as that :lol But Itachi cannot catch him with with as his speed and jutsu's are tiers above Itachi


He ain't tanking Tsukuyomi.No one without uchiha blood and shringan is :lol

 

[Berkenstiel]

KingHashirama, complexCity, most of the logical members left late 2014, Early 2015. With them came the swarm of Sasuke/Uchiha Stans. Just leave it alone and stop arguing.

Sig worthy

 

[Genyūmaru1]

Tsukuyomi has never been given a method. But a statement from a character, who claimed the tool known as the sharingan, can break his tsukuyomi. The sharingan breaks tsukuyomi via 1 of those 2 methods, given by Jiraiya. That is why I said read up on genjutsu, so you can actually know how genjutsu works.


Tsukuyomi falls under the category of Genjutsu, it is no exception from the 2 methods. If you believe it is an exception, I need you provide a scan where it says that.

Databook 2 and Itachi's statement from part 1 = Invalid. << (the reasoning behind countering genjutsu was not explained in part 1, but in part 2.)


You also need to provide a scan, where Itachi has tried his technique against those with Perfect chakra control. And those on the level of Hashirama and Tobirama.

You continously do not provide any scans, that are asked from you, but provide scans that are irrelevant to the discussion.

I'm done.

^ Probably a highschool drop out with that reading comprehension

-Not directly related to Itachi (of the same blood)
-Not even an Uchiha
-Won't even bother to avoid eye contact

Conclusion: He doesn't. 7 pages of butthurt over this simple fact tho.

My brain is dying arguing with these Hashirama fapboys.

 

[LoZelda101]

yeah considering they have madara sorrounded and his brother fatally wounded.dunno what does that scan proves

considering the powerlvl of this war, being vulnerable for a sec is a death sentence, izuna confirms that. if hashi was seriously worried about genjutsu in the first scan above, he would not had looked at madara's EMS. hashi knows madara likes to dance, thirst in combat more than use gen, itachi is the literal polar opposite of what hashi has dealt with his entire life. i honestly can't see hashi without intel stomping itachi unless he went all out asap, which i also highly doubt he will.

 

[BLAZE]

KingHashirama, complexCity, most of the logical members left late 2014, Early 2015. With them came the swarm of Sasuke/Uchiha Stans. Just leave it alone and stop arguing.

please i have seen his logics :lol

Tsunade... just like Jiraiya will beat Itachi.

If hes use totsuka and etc.. then Tsunade uses katsuyu.. genjutsu is completely irrelevant then.

Tobirama. I'm sure a kunai can pierce the Raikage...

 

[Genyūmaru1]

please i have seen his logics :lol

LOL. Kunai can piece the Raikage. I'm done.

 

[SenseiSama]

This is the only argument in this whole thread for Hashi breaking Tsukuyomi that has potential, but without a scan supporting that Edo Tensei and Tsukuyomi operate in the same way, I can't really get behind it.

Someone else pointed out that Hashi might be able to just tank Tsukuyomi - I hope they were joking. Itachi's not going to stand there and wait and see how Hashi handles it.

"Strong chakra" is a spec argument. Blame Kishi for being vague and lazy.

He can with Kai release I'll explain why.

Hashirama was immune to the effects of mind control which is what genjutsu basically is, controlling the neurons in someone's brain. Other techniques that influence a person's will have the same weaknesses as genjutsu.

i.e : Kurama protected Naruto from being controlled by Pain's rod same way he protects him from genjutsu, Sasuke broke Danzo's seal by releasing chakra same way he broke Tsukuyomi

Manga has shown that any technique that influences a person's ability to control themselves like genjutsu, ET, Pain's rods, and Danzo's seal, can be broken with the chakra release method, logically the same applies to Tsukuyomi. In the end it's still a genjutsu and therefore has the same weaknesses.

Tsukuyomi can be broken but requires a very high level of chakra to do so, as we know Hashirama's chakra is miles above hebi Sasuke so logically the genjutsu will not work on him. Itachi was limited by his perspective, he never faced anyone near Hashi's level so to him Tsukuyomi seemed unbreakable as much as Nagato seemed unbeatable.

 

[Dannie]

Even if Hashirama does decide to close his eyes, won't that just slow him down and give Itachi the advantage?

 

[Simbv]

Sig worthy

Sig worthy because I called him by his username?