Ending the Kisame vs Jiraiya debate
- Thread starter Blaze Release
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arguing with a character?
Tell me what part of that ,kisame says - Jiraya will beat me ..??
he says "you might be able to beat him , but I DONT KNOW ABOUT ME"
then kisame expresses that jiraya is one of the oh so great 3 ninjas of konoha legend....
Rep+ for the long post,but I don't see this ending anything due to some assumptions you made about the genjutsu... though i agree Kisame should win this only kishi can decide
lXxNaGaToxXl
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lol. this post doesn't show how j-man is over rated? i will agree that the OP made a great concise thread.
EliteKakashi
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He said Jiraiya was on a different level, I would take that as him calling himself below Jiraiya.
Regardless of that fact, I think it's senseless to argue this or Itachi and Jiraiya, given all we have to go off of is speculation and what characters said.
Funny, I got 90% of my info from the manga and
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, the only party not from the manga are the senerios I made and the info about the oil and water (that's basic cooking knowledge). oil+water is flamable and everything else is right, go do your own research.I think Jiraiya can use frog kata, he trained with them for years but Naruto had to focus on learning to absorb Natural chakra. Remember Naruto only managed to balance natural chakra with the oil but he had to learn how to draw on natural chakra without the oil so he had to learn to be still. Naruto managed to stay still and perfected SM, Jiraiya can draw on natural chakra and with Ma and Pa toad he can have them gather natural chakra and balance it so sag chakra would still be surrounding him.
Blaze Release
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First of all allow me to say is nearly 2 in the morning here therefore if i dont reply back im most likely sleeping U_U. First of all it depends on how much water kisame can create and how mud jiraiya can create. Kisame's chakra reserve is greater than jiraiya's its most likely that the water mixed with the mud would turn the water into a muddy water. Secondly i gave another alternative to deal with the swamp of the underworld in the Earth Release: Subterranean Voyage technique. Thirdly we saw that kisame didnt have any trouble with bee's ink therefore i dont see him having any trouble with oil
He was able to trap that pein after it got past his barrier ninjutsu. This technique wouldnt work in this environment. On that barrier jutsu, pein already saw though it because the rennigan like the sharingan can see chakra. Kisame fused with samahada can sense chakra therefore he'd know that there is a barrier
Kisame is faster than that. Secondly you really believe spikes could kill kisame after ive shown you his incredibly durable feat
Kisame in close comabt uses samahada has his offence but also to gain chakra or to injure his opponents;
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He also uses taijutsu along with his speed and strength. Jiraiya would have to somehow subdue him like what he did to raid fodder in order to use such a technique. Secondly kisame doesnt even need to get close to jiraiya because he has many mid to long range attacks such as this;
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First of ive countered this. The technique is a wall of MEAT. Now a 1000 FEEDING shark, you cannot tell me will not devour the technique. You claim the moment kisame start forming handseald he would lose samahada. First of all Kisame has shown to be able to create water clones;
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Which can hold his sword for him. Afterall it requires only the tiger seal;
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Secondly he can leave leave samahada for a second to form this tiger seal before he he yeilds samahada again.
First of all jiraiya doesnt use frog kata's the same way naruto does. His strength increases though. As i said kisame was able to tank 7 gates gai who's noon tige technique was said to be a 1 hit k.o;
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. If kisame was able to survive this without ny injuries in base, he is surviving this. Even with injuries with severe injuries he can recover himself as ive shown you with his rib cage wide open.The frog genjutsu wouldnt work. Ive already explained why and if you understand this youd know why i said it wouldnt work
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blazekev90
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Blaze Release
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blazekev90
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just read against Jman (base), so I'll comment on that first. What can be said, you did cover everything but you put it in Kisame's favor somewhat. The reason why I say this is because I see another possible scenario (correct me if I'm wrong)
Kisame starts off turning the setting into a water battlefield, ok. Now, both are under water but this doesnt make Jman helpless much and he has feats to assist him in this matter as well. I see you mentioned how much chakra summons consume, but Ima consider them in this situation because he'll need them, but the question is how many exactly. I personally think ONE big toad (same he used against Pein) and ONE smaller toad should be enough to at least help him escape from the water. This is how I see it happening;
Underwater, both set to go at (but as Jman knows he's at a his advantage) uses oil at the start and as this happens summons the two toads. The big one pops out ready to kick ass, while Jman enters the mouth of the smaller one. In this situation Kisame wouldnt (if I'm right) be about to sense Jman and only sees two toads, and sure he'll figure they have something to do with this, but would it be in time? The smaller toad cand easily attempt to escape, while the larger one defends against Kismae or his sharks. The oil should have an effect of the sharks ability to focus on the small toad (i mean that would be logical right??) and the huge toad could go HAM in the meantime.
Now, this may seem like alittle much, but its def possible and the first thing I could think of lol (give me some time)
Kisame starts off turning the setting into a water battlefield, ok. Now, both are under water but this doesnt make Jman helpless much and he has feats to assist him in this matter as well. I see you mentioned how much chakra summons consume, but Ima consider them in this situation because he'll need them, but the question is how many exactly. I personally think ONE big toad (same he used against Pein) and ONE smaller toad should be enough to at least help him escape from the water. This is how I see it happening;
Underwater, both set to go at (but as Jman knows he's at a his advantage) uses oil at the start and as this happens summons the two toads. The big one pops out ready to kick ass, while Jman enters the mouth of the smaller one. In this situation Kisame wouldnt (if I'm right) be about to sense Jman and only sees two toads, and sure he'll figure they have something to do with this, but would it be in time? The smaller toad cand easily attempt to escape, while the larger one defends against Kismae or his sharks. The oil should have an effect of the sharks ability to focus on the small toad (i mean that would be logical right??) and the huge toad could go HAM in the meantime.
Now, this may seem like alittle much, but its def possible and the first thing I could think of lol (give me some time)
blazekev90
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basically J-man can absorb nature's chakra at any moment without the need of sage mode..... He just needs the perfect timing, when Kisame is attacking to absorb chakra.....
Naruto wasn't on Sage mode, but tried to enter while Petra path was absorbing his chakra causing him to turn into stone.
Sorry Blaze Realese, BUT NO, THIS FIGHT IS NOT "THAT EASY"
as you said before only Kishi knows the answer, but have in mind that Characters such as: Minato, Hiruzen, Zabuza, Haku, Oro, all of them and many more died too soon. While according to story Hiruzen is a prodigy, god of shinobis, but HIS SKILLS LACKED DEVELOPEMENT THROUGHT "TV ON AIR TIME", while characters such as: Gaara, A, Naruto, Sasuke, etc were always improving and seemed more stronger than those who died soon and couldn't show more of their skills "on air", making them look weaker.
In my opinion it is a pretty even fight, but Jiraiya takes it.
Naruto wasn't on Sage mode, but tried to enter while Petra path was absorbing his chakra causing him to turn into stone.
Sorry Blaze Realese, BUT NO, THIS FIGHT IS NOT "THAT EASY"
as you said before only Kishi knows the answer, but have in mind that Characters such as: Minato, Hiruzen, Zabuza, Haku, Oro, all of them and many more died too soon. While according to story Hiruzen is a prodigy, god of shinobis, but HIS SKILLS LACKED DEVELOPEMENT THROUGHT "TV ON AIR TIME", while characters such as: Gaara, A, Naruto, Sasuke, etc were always improving and seemed more stronger than those who died soon and couldn't show more of their skills "on air", making them look weaker.
In my opinion it is a pretty even fight, but Jiraiya takes it.
kyubbi sagemode
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Nice thread!!! And u should make a thread like this about kisame vs oro, cause or some reason they say oro will win.
MinatoFLASH
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WOW dude dont u think ur going too far with this!!!?? Its a ****en book that your talking about. Anyways the book says J-man wins
It's true if you take it by the manga then j-man wins... because kisame had no reason to lie but that was part 1 and Kishi prolly didn't know how powerful he was going to make either of them at the time so there is reason enough for a debate!Not FLAMING OR TROLLING OR FANBOYING!!!!!!!!!!!!
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