Deidara vs Tsunade

ItachiStyle

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I don't think Tsunade can beat most of the Akatsuki. I think she can stomp Hidan (one of the worst members) and Kakuzu (an extremely overrated guy with a gimmick easily worked around), at the same time if she likes. There are lots of people in Akatsuki who will crush Tsunade. Obito, Itachi, Nagato, Konan probably beats her, Kisame could be a very tough fight for sure, at a suitably large distance and mounted Deidara would be a serious problem for her (though it then depends on factors like knowledge, etc), Oro would crush her. However she is a pretty impressive Kage level ninja, and many of the Akatsuki are just no match for her.
 

Zexion~

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how could you possibly think konan beats kakuzu :O you my friend have no idea what your talking about
 

ItachiStyle

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Actually I was saying Konan beats Tsunade. Hence the word "her" when I typed "beats her". Learn to read more carefully.
 

Zexion~

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..... yes but i was assuming you also were implying that she beats kakuzu and hidan as well.. Learn to not be a **** more carefully
 

ItachiStyle

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Maybe you should stop assuming, and actually read what people write. This might improve the quality of your posts quite alot. Sorry your Akatsuki boy lost this fight. Get over it.
 

Zexion~

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lmao not according to everyone else in the thread just you so im good :p
 

Edo Odin

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Maybe you should stop assuming, and actually read what people write. This might improve the quality of your posts quite alot. Sorry your Akatsuki boy lost this fight. Get over it.
Your only argument was that Tsunade could run at him in one second and beat him up...

lmao not according to everyone else in the thread just you so im good :p

Ignore him. It's obviously pointless.
 

Zexion~

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^ haha ik it gets frustrating thoug
 

ItachiStyle

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There has been no counter argument to that claim whatever. As such the result is still Tsunade punching Deidara's head off in the opening seconds of the fight. Maybe next time give Deidara several hundred feet of distance, and have him mounted. Then he might win.
 

Edo Odin

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There has been no counter argument to that claim whatever. As such the result is still Tsunade punching Deidara's head off in the opening seconds of the fight. Maybe next time give Deidara several hundred feet of distance, and have him mounted. Then he might win.
One last time, I'll direct you to the scan where Deidara avoided a head-on attack from Sasuke, a ninja that has often been noted for his speed, from a shorter distance then thirty meters [ - ] Not to mention the fact that he was using the Shunshin Jutsu while at it [ ]

Then I'll remind you of the fact that the time Deidara needs to make a clay animal is not long at all, meaning that it will not take him much time at all to make one and get to the air.

If this does not convince you, how would you like having an official debate about this ? Me vs You, with three judges who will decide the outcome.
 

ItachiStyle

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1) No indication Sasuke was serious in that attack, he even tells us he's going to get info out of him,
2) There is no indication Sasuke is as fast as Tsunade. What Sasuke has is awesome predictive powers, where his sharigan allows him to effectively be as fast as guys like A in fights, by predicting their movements and reacting to them... he is not actually as fast. He has never demonstrated speed anything like what Tsunade demonstrated.
3) You probably shouldn't take the Tobi persona joking around as a serious analysis of the tech being used. As far as we can see, Sasuke casually advances in, kills Tobi, and announces he's going to make Deidara spill... he then casually stands around and deflects various attacks Deidara uses, while doing nothing. Hardly Sasuke going all out at this point.

It takes him more than a second to make a clay get away animal, which is all that matters since it'll take a second or less for Tsunade to fist punch his head off.

As for your proposal, I care about logic, not what 2 random and arbitrary posters think. We have good evidence in this thread for several of you being extremely ignorant, I'm supposed to care what 2/3 randoms like you think?
 

Edo Odin

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ill judge that
Seems that that won't be necessary :rolleyes:
1) No indication Sasuke was serious in that attack, he even tells us he's going to get info out of him,
2) There is no indication Sasuke is as fast as Tsunade. What Sasuke has is awesome predictive powers, where his sharigan allows him to effectively be as fast as guys like A in fights, by predicting their movements and reacting to them... he is not actually as fast. He has never demonstrated speed anything like what Tsunade demonstrated.
3) You probably shouldn't take the Tobi persona joking around as a serious analysis of the tech being used. As far as we can see, Sasuke casually advances in, kills Tobi, and announces he's going to make Deidara spill... he then casually stands around and deflects various attacks Deidara uses, while doing nothing. Hardly Sasuke going all out at this point.

It takes him more than a second to make a clay get away animal, which is all that matters since it'll take a second or less for Tsunade to fist punch his head off.

As for your proposal, I care about logic, not what 2 random and arbitrary posters think. We have good evidence in this thread for several of you being extremely ignorant, I'm supposed to care what 2/3 randoms like you think?
Alright then, think what you will...The fact that you are the only one with this opinion, when even experts on Tsunade, like Chatte and Slug Princess Tsunade agree with me, along with the fact that you refuse to let other people judge the outcome of the match is enough for me :rolleyes:

Sure, Tsunade totally wins by simply running up to him and punching his head off.
 

Kages

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Lol I got 3 people to quote me and I got 'em mad :drive:
 

ItachiStyle

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Seems that that won't be necessary :rolleyes:

Alright then, think what you will...The fact that you are the only one with this opinion, when even experts on Tsunade, like Chatte and Slug Princess Tsunade agree with me, along with the fact that you refuse to let other people judge the outcome of the match is enough for me :rolleyes:

Sure, Tsunade totally wins by simply running up to him and punching his head off.

I would be embarassed to ever cite those people as experts on anything... they're just Tsunade fanboys, much like Kages is/was a Hiruzen fanboy. It says nothing about the strength of their arguments.
 

Kages

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I would be embarassed to ever cite those people as experts on anything... they're just Tsunade fanboys, much like Kages is/was a Hiruzen fanboy. It says nothing about the strength of their arguments.

You mean like you are an Itachi or 2nd Mizukage fanboy?
 

ItachiStyle

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I let my reasoning talk for me, I don't argue like you by just repeating "she's one of the SANNIN, so is legendary, and has will of fire, even such and such fodder nin in the manga said she was SO good!"
 

Waltz

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I have literally no idea what those scans are supposed to prove, so clearly they don't "speak for themselves", res ipsa loquitur fail. Did you even read my posts? Deidara doesn't start on a mount far away, he is 30 feet away in the ground. He can't summon anything in 1 second, which is how long it'll take Tsunade to be on him... what's he going to do? Pull a face at Tsunade as she gets the jump on him and punches his head off?

Looking at the Gaara scans, I'll be generous and make the following observations for you:
1) You haven't established a baseline speed for Gaara's sand which suggests it is comparable to the speed established for Tsunade's high end speed. One difficulty you'll run into is Gaara's sand doesn't seem to have a consistent speed, and there is no point of reference to measure it next to (for instance, the time it takes someone very fast to shut their jaw).
2) The distance is unclear from the perseptive of the the scans, we don't know how far away Gaara's sand was
3) Deidara can dodge because he already has a flying creature right next to him to jump on. Once mounted, Deidara has excellent speed... except he does not start the fight with a mount right next to him and ready to go. You haven't proven Deidara can summon a mount in the 1 second it'll take Tsunade to be on top of him.

Tsunade has proven that in a few seconds she can: a) sense the threat, b) cover hundreds and hundreds of feet against the force of gravity, while c) carrying an object weighing hundreds of tonnes, then d) aim that object, e) throw that object at someone who is moving very fast, and f) land. That's multitasking. Even if Deidara is reactive enough to a) sense danger, and b) start moving, Tsunade has shown above that she can react to those things. Manda was moving, and she has no trouble adjusting her aim perfectly. The distance she is travelling is vastly greater than the distance Deidara can cover in 1-2 seconds, even if Deidara starts to move, she'll still have heaps of time to catch him, and can react as he's doing it (not that Deidara has shown he can move very fast, certainly nothing compared to Tsunade). Plus during all this you want Deidara to form seals and summon a creature (which he has to expand first), then jump on it and escape... in 1-2 seconds? Absurd, and no feats are suggestive of him being able to do this at all. Tsunade moved through the air 100 feet and batted away Katon's faster than Mei could form a single seal jutsu... no way Deidara is fast enough to do all these things.

Heck, Tsunade doesn't need to move at all... she can throw a pebble at Deidara at this distance, and he has no time to do anything... even if he is fast enough to begin to dodge, which hasn't been shown, Tsunade can adjust her aim (just like she did for a moving Manda) and hit him right in the skull. End of Deidara. If she can anticipate and hit a moving Manda in mid-strike (Manda who was moving so quickly, neither Jiraiya or Bunta could counter), it'll be childs play to hit Deidara with a vastly lighter object (which will be travelling at even greater velocity towards Deidara's skull).

At this point its up to you to believe what you want (not saying your point don't make sense) but we cannot judge Gaara's sand speed in totality by the manga because all the scans are stationary. That doen't mean we can't analyze based on feats and also we what also cannot do is argue with facts in the manga.The Manga clearly showed Gaara's blocking Enton kagatsuchi and a drop kick at point blank range which is an astronomical feat especially because of the speed A is capable of. Deidara was able to evade this very same sand where as is he was that slow, based on the speed the sand blocked the drop kick and kagatsuchi he should've still been caught. The Manga also showed that Tsunade's power thrust of 100 ft was too slow and madara countered with a katon (look at tsunade's Distance):

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What i think your neglecting in this case is Air resistance in tsunade's jumps and the fact that Tsunade isn't A so as all the force she initially moved with is converted to energy, she slows down (basic physics) In the case of A however, A's Raiton no Yoroi will greatly increase his speed, power and reaction time giving him the ability to counter air resistance being that his speed only increases the longer he travel's.

Given the 30 meters lets convert it to feet. 30 meters = 98.425 feet (roughly 100ft). Are you really trying to tell me that deidara wouldn't notice un-maneuverable tsunade coming at high speeds from exactly 98 feet away? even given the fact that she's slower than raikage?

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We've already seen that a Straight forward attacts don't work being that Naruto dodged A because of . Why would you even think Deidara wouldn't be able to dodge tsunade? He was even given a 4.5 for speed in the 3rd Databook:

Deidara

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Tsunade

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Even the Databook Disagrees with you being that we're referring to her base speed.

shows the intense speed Deidara can travel at while on his bird and this very same speed was as deidara noticed that likewise Gaara is able to use his sand at very high speeds.

Tsunade cannot blitz deidara from 98 feet away via the method your trying to impose here. Once again, you are over-exaggerating Tsunade's capability of speed, neglecting the impact of of air resistance on the the conversion of Potential -> kinectic energy at a distance of 98 feet.
 
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ItachiStyle

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At this point its up to you to believe what you want (not saying your point don't make sense) but we cannot judge Gaara's sand speed by the manga because all the scans are stationary.
I've highlighted the important part. No, we can't judge, which means there is no real evidence for your claim. Mine has evidence, and that's the problem for you here.

Look, I agree, Gaara is fast, I've said so elsewhere. I think he'd solo the 3 non-Onoki Kage quite handily. That said, it's a long, long way from being able to argue Deidara is close to fast enough to react to Tsunade. Even Gaara's big sand speed feats of blocking A's foot, and catching the 3rd Raikage, aren't great arguments, because neither was necessarily going at anything like full speed when that happened. Likewise, let's assume Gaara is faster than the Raikage (he isn't at full speed, though with all the sand defences he has by the time Raikage powers up it won't matter). So what? We don't know any of the important info that would allow that to translate to help Deidara:
- was Gaara's sand moving at full speed or close to it?
- how far away was the sand when it went for Deidara?
- Deidara already had an escape vehicle waiting for him to jump on to get away
Right after Deidara "gets away" he gets his hand crushed by Gaara (while mounted, which helps his speed greatly)... so much for his great reaction speed. And he even tells us, he got caught because Gaara was using his "faster" sand (from his gourd), so before Gaara assumedly was using slower normal sand. None of this helps Deidara's cause.
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Yes, Tsunade is slower than A... full speed A... but again, that doesn't lead to the conclusion that Deidara is fast, because of the above problems.

What i think your neglecting in this case is Air resistance in tsunade's jumps and the fact that Tsunade isn't A so as all the force she initially moved with is converted to energy, she slows down (basic physics) In the caso of A however, A's Raiton no Yoroi will greatly increase his speed, power and reaction time giving him the ability to counter air resistance being that his speed only increases the longer he travel's.

Given the 30 meters lets convert it to feet. 30 meters = 98.425 feet. Are you trying to tell me that deidara wouldn't notice un-maneuverable tsunade coming at high speeds from 98 feet away? even given the fact that she's slower than raikage?
Huh? Firstly, the fight specified 30 feet between them, not 30 m's. Secondly, I don't see how your physics above helps. Tsunade is slowed down in her jump... she won't be when she jumps horizontally (not vertically) right at Deidara's pointy blonde head (unrestrained by hundreds and hundreds of tonnes of weight). I don't understand your argument. If Tsunade wanted to jump 100 feet forward, how long do you think it would take her to reach her target?

We've already seen that a Stright forward attact by A was dodged by Naruto because of A's complete linear movement.
No, Naruto dodged it because he was in Sage mode, and that let him sense his attack coming early and respond to it (Jedi style). Deidara doesn't have that, so he can't do it.

As for the Databook, you won't have to look at my post history for long to get an idea of what I think about it. It's trash, and should never be the basis of a serious argument. It's also full of horrible inconsistencies, my favourite being Itachi and Oro both getting the same rating for Genjutsu. Seriously, don't care what the databook says (and even if I did, for all we know his "speed" is factoring in his speed while mounted, which is definitely good, unlike his normal speed, which is definitely crap).
 
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Edo Odin

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Huh? Firstly, the fight specified 30 feet between them, not 30 m's.
.....:sy:
Location: Gaara&Lee vs Kimimaro
Knowledge: Manga
Distance: 30 meters
Restrictions: None

I say Deidara wins, anyone wanna debate ?

Making four of these, as I saw a lot of people state that Tsunade beats Sasori, Deidara, Kisame and Kakuzu, and am really in the mood for a debate :p
Are you telling me that you've been coming up with all these stupid-ass arguments for all this time because you read the goddamn OP wrong....?
 
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