[Deductions] Why Hiashi Hyuuga > Itachi Uchiha

[AGoodBoy]

Im sorry, but WHAT? Are you implyng that the character with the worst stamina in the manga will outlast a man who has a 4 in stamina in the DB?

You must have been joking.

No, I never implied that. What I implied was, Hiashi would be dead before stamina began to remotely matter. Same way orochimaru, Deidara, kakashi, asuma, kurenai, naruto, sasuke, the uchiha clan all could've been killed before his stamina disadvantage kicked in.

 

[Donald J Trump]

Totsuka gg
Amaterasu GG

 

[fastrthnwind]

No, I never implied that. What I implied was, Hiashi would be dead before stamina began to remotely matter. Same way orochimaru, Deidara, kakashi, asuma, kurenai, naruto, sasuke, the uchiha clan all could've been killed before his stamina disadvantage kicked in.

The main thing is that when itachi fought them, he tried to end things quickly, which failed in some cases like with kakashi and sasuke (who didnt underestimate his abilities) in which it did become a battle of stamina. If he starts using MS techniques, he is desparately trying to kill whoever it is quickly before his stamina will give out because the opponent has either matched or exceeded him in base abilities since MS abilities can take down most people, especially when they have no knowledge on it.

In this case, the battle is in hiashis favor because he can further expound upon itachis core strength, which is his chakra control by simply touching him. If he lands any good hits, which is inevitable considering he is a taijutsu master of the HIGHEST level,(SHARINGAN PRECOG DOES NOT EQUAL IMMUNITY TO TAIJUTSU) then his stamina and ability to ue jutsu will be thrown out of wack, putting him even closer to his death.

 

[Nous]

Naruto is about match ups, not who has more hype or higher stats. Naruto stats are shit, but he defeats almost every ninja correct?

Iruka's stats (26) are higher than Lee's (22) or Temari's (24,5); yet he would get wrecked by them.
Stats do not mean much to determine who would win a fight.

OT: Makes sense.

Do you want to know why people don't respect Hyūga Ichizoku fans as much as those of other fan-clubs? It's simply because you guys refuse to counter argumentation that prove ways Hiashi/Neji et cetera loses and simply target those illogical members that state things like Totsuka GG, Tsukuyomi GG. You blatantly disregard logical posts in favor of countering illogical ones to feel a sense of accomplishment. Idiotic counters to Strict have been made and none have countered mine yet you attack people whom state idiotic things.

Done with this "debate" as it is clear you guys show extreme bias toward the intelligence of the poster.

=)

​

Kakashi knew pretty much all there was to know about Itachi in part 1 bar the Mangekyou. Saying that Hiashi wouldn't know about the Uchiha affinity for Genjutsu and Itachi's fame with Genjutsu is ludicrous.

Well with that logic, Itachi possess Perfect Susano'o and Naruto can utilize Fūinjutsu. In a debate we utilize something called canonical information. Hiashi has shown absolutely no intelligence on Itachi, whatsoever in regards to shinobi prowess.

​

Closed Eyes completely negate this.

You didn't read or decipher anything I wrote did you. Utakata = Finger Genjutsu - Not Ocular. Closing his eyes shan't do anything.

​

Does Chiyo have the Byakugan? No she doesn't. Which means my counter is still valid. By your logic as well, Hashirama gets solo'd by Itachi.

No. How so? Itachi can play another under genjutsu in a variety of fashions. If Hashirama looked into Itachi's Mangekyō Sharingan, it is possible.

​

So your saying that Itachi can use Amaterasu longer than Hiashi can use Rotation? Laughable.

Excuse me, do you not understand how Amaterasu works? It doesn't disappear after usage is complete - it remains. Amaterasu can easily outlast Hiashi's ability to utilize Hyūga: Daikaiten.

How about you post some legit arguments before believing you've secured victory and insulting others? You're basically avoiding all of Strict's arguments.

​

 

[paratise]

Do you want to know why people don't respect Hyūga Ichizoku fans as much as those of other fan-clubs? It's simply because you guys refuse to counter argumentation that prove ways Hiashi/Neji et cetera loses and simply target those illogical members that state things like Totsuka GG, Tsukuyomi GG. You blatantly disregard logical posts in favor of countering illogical ones to feel a sense of accomplishment. Idiotic counters to Strict have been made and none have countered mine yet you attack people whom state idiotic things.

Done with this "debate" as it is clear you guys show extreme bias toward the intelligence of the poster.

=)

​

I haven't debated with anyone; i have just stated my opinion as "makes sense" regarding to topic.
About your post Centipede i only said the fact that databook stats do not determine who comes on top in a fight, who is stronger and who is better, i haven't involved in a debate regarding to overall topic with anyone and i haven't attacked anyone.

Good for being done with a debate that haven't even been started.:|
Have fun with online thesaurus and using Japanese terms.

 

[fastrthnwind]

Do you want to know why people don't respect Hyūga Ichizoku fans as much as those of other fan-clubs? It's simply because you guys refuse to counter argumentation that prove ways Hiashi/Neji et cetera loses and simply target those illogical members that state things like Totsuka GG, Tsukuyomi GG. You blatantly disregard logical posts in favor of countering illogical ones to feel a sense of accomplishment. Idiotic counters to Strict have been made and none have countered mine yet you attack people whom state idiotic things.

Done with this "debate" as it is clear you guys show extreme bias toward the intelligence of the poster.

=)

​

It isnt that at all. It is simply easier to reply to a more simple minded poster than an intelligent one since some of us dont have the time to get into a full debate with a more logical person which will require much more time to create a well thought out post complete with manga pages and DB stats explaining each detailed point to further educate to the higher minded people about the abilities and potential of the hyuugas.

We are educating the more simple minded people (the ones with half a brain to actually listen) so that in general when it is mentioned in other threads that they wil at least have a basic understanding of the hyuugas. Its a simpler approach to help let the entirety of the base know about the hyuugas in general. The other "trolls" are completely ignored since they contribute nothing to the base and instead are simply trying to gain attention to themselves by trying to be 'funny' or just plain stupid.

In this way it cateres to both the intelligent people and those with less understanding so that everyone in general wil get along better

 

[Nous]

I haven't debated with anyone; i have just stated my opinion as "makes sense" regarding to topic.
About your post Centipede i only said the fact that databook stats do not determine who comes on top in a fight, who is stronger and who is better, i haven't involved in a debate regarding to overall topic with anyone and i haven't attacked anyone.

Good for being done with a debate that haven't even been started.:|
Have fun with online thesaurus and using Japanese terms.

My sincere apology. Was mainly intended on the other.. Collectivized the two due to the same nature of the post. My apologies. It clearly has, as Strict is blockading all of Hiashi's arguments with Gakido and Draegod, possessing limited comprehension regarding his and mimicking whatever was stated in OP. I do not utilize any form of Thesaurus when employing posts upon Naruto-Base Forums.. I do not have time for such a pitiful act. It is the original name, so why shan't I? At the minimum, I understand what I am speaking about - unlike Gakido who in OT utilized Japanese Terms and doesn't understand a single somewhat complex word regarding identical topics when another posts an organized argumentation.

​

It isnt that at all. It is simply easier to reply to a more simple minded poster than an intelligent one since some of us dont have the time to get into a full debate with a more logical person which will require much more time to create a well thought out post complete with manga pages and DB stats explaining each detailed point to further educate to the higher minded people about the abilities and potential of the hyuugas.

We are educating the more simple minded people (the ones with half a brain to actually listen) so that in general when it is mentioned in other threads that they wil at least have a basic understanding of the hyuugas. Its a simpler approach to help let the entirety of the base know about the hyuugas in general. The other "trolls" are completely ignored since they contribute nothing to the base and instead are simply trying to gain attention to themselves by trying to be 'funny' or just plain stupid.

In this way it cateres to both the intelligent people and those with less understanding so that everyone in general wil get along better

Fair. Was expecting a moronic answer.. Will probably receive from Draegod though. In regards to the topic, simply observe many of your fellow fans.. It is constant repetition "countering" the identical posts. Do not take time to argument with those - it makes both look idiotic.

Advice; That is all.

​

 

[AGoodBoy]

The main thing is that when itachi fought them, he tried to end things quickly, which failed in some cases like with kakashi and sasuke (who didnt underestimate his abilities) in which it did become a battle of stamina. If he starts using MS techniques, he is desparately trying to kill whoever it is quickly before his stamina will give out because the opponent has either matched or exceeded him in base abilities since MS abilities can take down most people, especially when they have no knowledge on it.

In this case, the battle is in hiashis favor because he can further expound upon itachis core strength, which is his chakra control by simply touching him. If he lands any good hits, which is inevitable considering he is a taijutsu master of the HIGHEST level,(SHARINGAN PRECOG DOES NOT EQUAL IMMUNITY TO TAIJUTSU) then his stamina and ability to ue jutsu will be thrown out of wack, putting him even closer to his death.

Itachi never failed, where you got that I don't know.

First encounter with Kakashi he succeeded in hospitalizing kakashi unless you can prove otherwise. Itachi ended the fight in minutes, like planed.
The second encounter with Team 7 + chiyo, Itachi never wanted to win. When they killed his clone, he smiled. losers aren't happy to die. Where you get your facts regarding Kakashi is beyond me.

As for sasuke, their first encounter, sasuke was sucessfully mentally tramatized at about 5years old and unlocked 1 tomoe. The 'fight' ended.
the second encounter when Itachi and Kisame wanted to capture naruto, Sasuke was successfully hospitalized.
The third encounter before their bought at uchiha hideout, Itachi successfully relayed his battle invitation to sasuke with a clone. The never begun fight ended.
Their final battle, where Itachi went in with intentions to die, was dragged on because itachi had to exhaust sasuke's chakra to rid him of orochimaru. Like itachi stated, orochimaru 'finally came out'. In other words, the fight dragged on not because itachi underestimated Sasuke (whom he could have let win), but because the fight needed to drag on for his plans to be achieved. Do you think Itachi needed to use his susano'o? No. If sasuke was rid of orochimaru before the battle, itachi would have just taken that Kirin and let sasuke bask in his victory.
As for your blatant assumption that itachi must start with MS, once again, this is completely false. Itachi only opened MS on opponents who he needed to end quickly, but who he knew would be troublesome to beat without it. In other words, he could have a dragged out Sharingan battle, or a quick MS 1 shot.

- Kakashi? Why waste time fighting him along with asuma and kurenai, when Tsukuyomi GG was a valid response? Kakashi is no push over, he was a jounin at a very young age, and a fellow ANBU operative. It would have been far riskier to battle kakashi without MS than to simply lose some vision and go on his merry way. Like Itachi stated, do you think They would just battle kakashi, kurenai and asuma and be done with it? No, reenforcements would arrive and now itachi would have to fight to kill, just to escape, instead of simply immobilizing. The fact that Guy was able to arrive before they even finished is a testament to how strained their time was.
- You'll probably try to bring up itachi SECOND ever real use of his MS which was when he burnt through jiraiya's toad stomach with Amaterasu. Jiraiya was manipulating the stomach, blocking their path and could sense where they were. Itachi and kisame needed to escape quickly and not waste time fighting/injuring jiraiya. Do you have a better solution than Amaterasu? no, no you don't. Itachi simply used his quickest method to avoid confrontation. But, then again, I'm sure you'll try to state that base jiraiya can take on both Itachi and Kisame...
-Itachi's last use of MS in battle was when he was planning on dying from the get go. That as evidence is completely irrelevant as his vision no longer mattered. Dead people need not see. Why did Itachi not use MS on orochimaru? Or Deidara? They're FARRRR more deadly than Kakashi and Jiraiya (in a 2 V 1). Then, why did he opt for simple sharingan against such powerful foes? Simple, the situation didn't require a quick defeat, as in getting away before starting a war. This point that you, and every itachi debater likes to bring up that 'itachi needs MS' is not only rubbish, but it's not supported by the manga. What itachi does need is his 3T sharingan. Beyond that, MS is only situational, and most likely isn't even needed for this battle. Worst case scenario is that he requires it ONLY because Hiashi has a powerful dojutsu. Other than that, hiashi canonically can't compete.

Lmao, Hiashi stands no chance. The battle is not even close to being in his favor. The OP literally hinges on rotation. That's not going to help hiashi. Want to know what will happen? Hiashi will

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, maybe with a 64 palm, or a chakra blocker, then

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will happen, and hiashi will be completely decked before having time to react. Having 360 vision isn't helping when you don't have the speed to react to a surprise attack, and guess what? Itachi's DB faster than Hiashi. Hiashi will never land a good hit or any hit on Itachi. Don't even repeat that Taijutsu nonsense, as itachi is known for his exceptional Crow bushin feints. Any lucky hits hiashi gets is being done on a bushin. Worst case, it's done on an exploding crow bushin, a bushin

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i.

Hiashi dies without the use of MS. Tsukuyomi when his eyes are opened, or a sustained Amaterasu till his rotation stops/ sustained amaterasu which would light him up

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, or totsuka blade bursting through rotation ends Hiashi's life. Good try, but no.

 

[Mellanoma]

People like you amuse me to no end. You act like hiashi is just gonna SIT there and get hit with everything itachi has, like he isnt the most powerful hyuuga of one of the strongest clans.(I DONT CARE if hes not uchiha or senju)

Yata - ok so susanoo has yata mirror. Wut is ur point? Did we say it would destroy it? No we didnt. We said he could hold him back from attacking.

Totska blade - dodge it. Its not that fast. But then again ppl like u would just say totska gg so im not bothering with it.

Genjutsu - close the eyelids nullifies ALL eye contact. They can see through their eyelids. Eye contact with the ovular organ is required for all of itachis genjutsu so he wont get caught in any genjutsu INCLUDING tskuyomi.

Clone explosion - Rotation or vacuum palm does the trick.

Im starting to doubt ur intelligence now. NARUTO GAVE CHAKRA TO EVERYONE AFTER NEJI DIED.

Again it need direct eye contact with the actual organ, not just seeing it with byakugan vision.

Again just dodging it is fine. Hiashi is fast by himself and totska is not.

You can't simply dodge Totsuka without some sort of S/T.

Reason? It's size and radius can grow to whatever is needing as noted when it was small to stab Nagato and massive to fight the hydra. It is not a matter of how fast something is.

An ant no matter how fast will be crushed by a boot right?

 

[NewKageism]

Countering Itachi's Genjutsu:

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Just going to go after this right now. FYI your post is nice, but closing his eyes really? Really?

Doesn't that make you color blind?

So let see how this pans out.

Itachi: Ready Hiashi
Hiashi: Hyuuga the strongest

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Itachi: Before or after my brother Sasuke left the village
*Hiashi closes his eye lids

Itachi: Hiashi do not go full retard on me. Please open your eyelids
Hiashi: Come Itachi!

Hiashi: get into his attack mode

Itachi: amaterasu

Hiashi: Your simple fire attack won't work I will block it with my hand rotation

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Here it comes!

GAME OVER
X-rays show black and white (color blinded) if he closed his eyeballs he would not be able to tell a regular fire from black flames. That is the death of of Hiashi.

 

[Gakido]

Im sorry, but WHAT? Are you implyng that the character with the worst stamina in the manga will outlast a man who has a 4 in stamina in the DB?

You must have been joking.

Actually, Part 1 Ino, Part 1 Sakura, and Haku all had worse stamina stats.

Haku had a 2
P1 Ino had a 2 (Even in Part 2 she only had a 2.5)
and P1 Sakura had a 1 (Sakura in Part 2 also had a 2.5)

 

[Uchihareborn207]

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Conditions:

This is the same Itachi that fought Sasuke

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Countering Itachi's Non-Mangekyou Ninjutsu:

Itachi's main arsenal of Ninjutsu comprises of Katon and Exploding Clones. Which frankly, as I explain multiple times later in the thread, Rotation blocks these attacks.

Exploding Clones themselfs won't amount to much as a doujutsu was already able to see through them.

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Even if they manage to close in on Hiashi, Kaiten saves him.

Now, It may be hard for Hiashi to keep up with Itachi's hand seals so that he can counter his Katon's, but the Byakugan is also capable of tracking high speed movement and seeing Itachi knead chakra, making the speed at which he can release the Katon useless.

(

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)(

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)



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Countering Itachi's Taijutsu/Weapons:

First of all, the Hyuuga are know for being the strongest Taijutsu users in the Leaf. The Databook also gives Hiashi a 5 in Taijutsu while Itachi only has a 4.5

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Itachi in terms of skill, will be sorely outmatched here. Whenever Itachi may have though he would have landed a blow,

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and

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. Leaving Itachi

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and open for the follow up (

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)(

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).

Any weapons are hard countered by Rotation and can even

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. Even Itachi's skill in attacking in multiple directions and angles are rendered useless by the Bykaugan

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Countering Itachi's Genjutsu:

Countering Ocular Genjutsu is actually very simple for Hyuuga's.

They Byakugan gives them

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. To completely nullify the chances of Genjutsu, all a Hyuuga must do is close there eyes! The Byakugan will give them sight through their eyelids while negating the chances of eye-contact!



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Countering Mangekyou Jutsu's:

Since Itachi's base arsenal won't cut it against a Hyuuga of Hiashi's level, eventually he will be forced to use the Kaleidoscope Copy Wheel Eye.

Due to his failing healthy and low stamina, Itachi perfers to fight without the use of these techs. We can even deduce how many times he can use the Mangekyou before his body fails him.

Tsukiyomi; 1 Use (

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)
Amaterasu; 2 Uses (

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)(

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)
Susano'O; A short time of use (

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)

From the above, we now know that Itachi can consistantly use the Mangekyou or many times in the same fight. It doesn't help that Tsukiyomi is already countered by a ability that costs no chakra or stamina to implement, but Hiashi still has counters for Amaterasu and Susano'O.

Amaterasu:

The Bykaugan has the ability to see chakra, the instance that proves this also shows that it can see when chakra is being directed to the eye and a Jutsu is being used!

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with this knowledge, Hiashi can deduce when Itachi is going to use Amaterasu (Or Sharingan Genjutsu/Tsukiyomi for that matter)!

From there when the Jutsu is released, Hiashi can use the mechanics of Rotation to block the attack! When Hiashi sees Itachi pouring massive amounts of chakra into his eye and preps amaterasu, Hiashi can pour out of his Chakra points to stop the flame.

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Then finish the Jutsu to deflect it!

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Susano'O:

While Hiashi has no direct ways to break Susano'O, he has ways to wait it out and the intel feeding Byakugan to know to do it.

Given that Byakugan allows the user to see the targets chakra as proven previous, Hiashi will know that Itachi doesn't have large reserves of chakra. While countering Amaterasu and once Ssuano'O comes out, he will see the huge chunks of chakra coming out of Itachi's low stamina and will know that its best to allow Itachi to seal his own fate!

The only thing Hiashi needs do when Susano'O comes out is to Air Wall Palm to keep it at bay until Itachi runs out of chakra, I even found one in a calc that shows the direct comparison between the two!

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​

hahahahahaahaha XDXD
tsukuyomi (end of story)
izanami (complete stomp)
Amateratsu GG
Susanoo GG (juken wont work)

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Yata (Air Wall Palm) GG
Totsuka GG

 

[Draegod]

My sincere apology. Was mainly intended on the other.. Collectivized the two due to the same nature of the post. My apologies. It clearly has, as Strict is blockading all of Hiashi's arguments with Gakido and Draegod, possessing limited comprehension regarding his and mimicking whatever was stated in OP. I do not utilize any form of Thesaurus when employing posts upon Naruto-Base Forums.. I do not have time for such a pitiful act. It is the original name, so why shan't I? At the minimum, I understand what I am speaking about - unlike Gakido who in OT utilized Japanese Terms and doesn't understand a single somewhat complex word regarding identical topics when another posts an organized argumentation.

​

Fair. Was expecting a moronic answer.. Will probably receive from Draegod though. In regards to the topic, simply observe many of your fellow fans.. It is constant repetition "countering" the identical posts. Do not take time to argument with those - it makes both look idiotic.

Advice; That is all.

​

Who are you again? First of, I been stopped participating in this thread and only post2-3 simple post I think. Second, every so called hypha supporter on this site got all there hypha info from me or from another who got it from me. Again who are you again? I'll happily go over the thread I haven't looked at in about 2-3 days and shit on you soon enough. Trying to be like Varrah makes you look pathetic btw.

 

[aimop95]

The Sharingan and its variants are not the most powerful dojutsu's in existence (otherwise Itachi should have been able to solo Pain and his cohorts and the Senju should have died a long time ago)

All genjutsu is escapable, or otherwise has such specific restrictions that make it impractical to be used in the everyday battle field unless the user has some sort of modification.

 

[TheEvilOne]

No offence, but a Hyuuga fodder isn't beating Itachi. Nice thread tho.

 

[solo king]

Op is retarded. Hiashi has no feats at all..

 

[Edo Odin]

Why are people reviving this thread?

The end result of this match is obvious. Hiashi, a character who has barely shown any canonical feats, won't come close to defeating someone like Itachi. Everything that needed to be said in this thread has already been said, just let it die FFS.​

​

 

[Mellanoma]

Your first point is completely wrong comparing sharingan and Byakagan when it is a manga fact Byakagan can't tell the difference between clones... I.E Faint clone explosion solos

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Secondly you talk about Amaterasu being detected and avoided when hiashi has shown 0 feats to show that he can out manuvuer Amaterasu which spawns on site. Itachi vs Sasuke examples are terrible considering Itachi was not trying to kill sasuke.

anyways here is another quote "Your Eyes can see but your body can't react:

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People have been really wanking the focused chakra in Eye thing since Obito did it. There is no way Hiashi can start a rotation BEFORE amaterasu spawns ON him.

Anyways after reading Yata mirror (Air Palm GG) i know your trolling haha

 

[Draegod]

Your first point is completely wrong comparing sharingan and Byakagan when it is a manga fact Byakagan can't tell the difference between clones... I.E Faint clone explosion solos

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Secondly you talk about Amaterasu being detected and avoided when hiashi has shown 0 feats to show that he can out manuvuer Amaterasu which spawns on site. Itachi vs Sasuke examples are terrible considering Itachi was not trying to kill sasuke.

anyways here is another quote "Your Eyes can see but your body can't react:

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People have been really wanking the focused chakra in Eye thing since Obito did it. There is no way Hiashi can start a rotation BEFORE amaterasu spawns ON him.

Anyways after reading Yata mirror (Air Palm GG) i know your trolling haha

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Exploding clay clone. Next we have the ability to see anything chakra related in the body before a ninja uses any tech chakra related:

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Ama will never in a thousand years be a factor for ninja's who can put a layer between them and the would be fire that couldnt even burn Samurai armor.