debate about tryvon case?

[Lord Painz]

ok you cussing at me wasn't even called for I wasn't coming at white people I was also talking about blacks!! hint why I said ALL PEOPLE want to do is kill and distroy...you think I don't know that even today blacks is killing eachother off? all I said was I hate this world for the killing who wouldn't when they have the fear that the next day might be their last if and when they step one foot out of their door

also if you think about it this is how the world is today

black kill black: they are just stupid let them kill eachother off the world will be better without

black kill white: send him to jail for life

white kill black: there must have been a reason for it so let him go free

white kill white: what is our world coming to

I truly don't blame them what with the image we give ourself but it still don't make it right

btw still not coming at whites because if you look passed the color of our skin we all together are still people plus I have a white bf and a mixed group of friends

is this guy that kill him white?? looks mexican to me

 

[thai sage]

I think you're making the concealed weapon the main point of this. It isn't. Most of your questions merely ask whether or not Zimmerman approached the situation correctly, which is debatable.
By the way; He was not instructed, he was adviced not to follow Martin. Pressumably for his own safety, parhaps.
Carrying a gun doesn't make you invincible. If a young man gets behind your guard before you draw, it's over.
This case, to me, is very straighforward: Whoever screamed for help was not the one lying on top, therefore the other party must've been the mindless agressor. If Martin was the one screaming for help, then Zimmerman should be convicted. If the opposite is true, Zimmerman should go free.
Just FYI; no matter what happens to Zimmerman, the entire case has been blown enough out of proportion so that he'll never get a job again. Congrats, you've all just destroyed a man's life based on suspicion alone. Now that's a hate-crime.

Really? So your going to condemn everyone else not the guy who shot and killed a 17 year old boy...? Zimmerman has been giving contradictory information since the beginning, and it's been proven police tried to help cover things up, for what reason did zimmerman have to follow him in his car with a gun? All he had to do was call the cops and that's it.

 

[thai sage]

is this guy that kill him white?? looks mexican to me

According to zimmermans dad he thinks he's 1/4 Hispanic, how does the dad not even know what his own son is? But either way it doesn't matter what race Zimmerman is, just the fact that he killed a young black male because he's black, when a person of one race hates a person of another race for no reason other then race, that is racism, doesn't matter if it's Asian hating white or Hispanic hating black, or black hating white.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

According to zimmermans dad he thinks he's 1/4 Hispanic, how does the dad not even know what his own son is? But either way it doesn't matter what race Zimmerman is, just the fact that he killed a young black male because he's black, when a person of one race hates a person of another race for no reason other then race, that is racism, doesn't matter if it's Asian hating white or Hispanic hating black, or black hating white.

Are you some sort of retard? You need to be kicked off of NB immediately.

I hate how people say this is a gat damn hate crime. First people say "Oh he was singled out because he was wearing a hoodie and looked suspicious." and then they call it racism.

If he was wearing a hoodie and Zimmerman was following him how did he know Martin was black?

If he was going there just to kill him how did Martin get close enough to break his nose and slam his head into the ground?

I wish you could think, but unfortunately you are one of those hate-mongering people who likes to stir things up.

 

[Josh]

Zimmerman is a member of the neighborhood watch and sees an unknown person wandering around a GATED community, looking suspicious.

Zimmerman should have listened to the police warning, but by all reports Trayvon attacked him first.

Zimmerman is NOT a member of the community watch. He is self-appointed which means he made himself Block Captain but the neighborhood does not recognize him as such, therefore, he is not in the community watch program.

Don't make it sound like there is more than one report. No one witnessed what happened (or they haven't stepped up if they did) so there is only one report describing what transpired and that is Zimmerman's account and he killed the kid.

At this point you can't say either party was guilty because the only person who saw what happened did the shooting and he can say anything he wants. He may have been the aggressor or Trayvon may have been the aggressor, but I've already outlined previously what facts are certain. Based on Zimmerman's account and his actions, he needs to provide proof that he acted in lawful self-defense because as it stands, he shot and killed an unarmed person.

If law enforcement would have arrived first and gotten the same result as Zimmerman, there would have been a full investigation. It doesn't make sense that an untrained civilian can kill an unarmed man and go home without there being a full investigation. That's not how the law is supposed to work here in Florida.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

Zimmerman is NOT a member of the community watch. He is self-appointed which means he made himself Block Captain but the neighborhood does not recognize him as such, therefore, he is not in the community watch program.

Don't make it sound like there is more than one report. No one witnessed what happened (or they haven't stepped up if they did) so there is only one report describing what transpired and that is Zimmerman's account and he killed the kid.

At this point you can't say either party was guilty because the only person who saw what happened did the shooting and he can say anything he wants. He may have been the aggressor or Trayvon may have been the aggressor, but I've already outlined previously what facts are certain. Based on Zimmerman's account and his actions, he needs to provide proof that he acted in lawful self-defense because as it stands, he shot and killed an unarmed person.

If law enforcement would have arrived first and gotten the same result as Zimmerman, there would have been a full investigation. It doesn't make sense that an untrained civilian can kill an unarmed man and go home without there being a full investigation. That's not how the law is supposed to work here in Florida.

I was talking about reports from media outlets. Did I say anything contrary to the report? SO please get off your high horse. I seriously doubt that you have any greater claim than the thousands of us with internet access.

If he went there to kill him how did he get a broken nose and have his head slammed into the ground? There is no way that Trayvon could have done those things if Zimmerman went there to kill him.

Judging from the facts we know, I believe that Zimmerman approached Trayvon and was verbally aggressive, which resulted in Trayvon instigating a physical altercation, and Zimmerman overreacted and pulled his gun on him.

Seeing though as we only have Zimmerman's reports and neighbors reports of what happened afterwards, we can't definitively prove anything, but you are clearly trying to place blame only on Zimmerman. It isn't his fault that the police didn't do their job.

 

[Josh]

I was talking about reports from media outlets. Did I say anything contrary to the report? SO please get off your high horse. I seriously doubt that you have any greater claim than the thousands of us with internet access.

If he went there to kill him how did he get a broken nose and have his head slammed into the ground? There is no way that Trayvon could have done those things if Zimmerman went there to kill him.

Judging from the facts we know, I believe that Zimmerman approached Trayvon and was verbally aggressive, which resulted in Trayvon instigating a physical altercation, and Zimmerman overreacted and pulled his gun on him.

Seeing though as we only have Zimmerman's reports and neighbors reports of what happened afterwards, we can't definitively prove anything, but you are clearly trying to place blame only on Zimmerman. It isn't his fault that the police didn't do their job.

Actually, if you look a page or 2 back, you'll see that I DO actually have some credibility with my views on this matter and that I also pretty much said the exact same thing as you, however, the news reports contain some errors (Like Zimmerman being in the community watch) and news reports don't count when saying Trayvon started it. They are reading Zimmerman's statement, which, essentially means there is only ONE report of what happened.

I did you a favor and quoted my previous statements which I'm guessing you never read:

1. Zimmerman was a Self-Appointed Block Captain; meaning, his neighborhood did not officially recognize him as the Community Watch.

2. The duties of persons on Community Watch are to observe what's going on in the neighborhood and notify Law Enforcement of anything suspicious. They are not to get involved.

3. Though citizens can have the right to carry a firearm, Zimmerman was acting in an "official capacity" (Even though he is not official) and thus should not have been armed. The capacity he is claiming to have been acting under does not authorize a person to carry a firearm and utilize it.

4. A concealed weapon's permit is not a license to use a firearm, it's simply a permit to carry one.

5. The kid was unarmed. He had nothing that even resembled a weapon. There aren't any witnesses who saw what exactly transpired (unless they've recently stepped up), so the fact that an unarmed individual was killed should have warranted a full investigation. The kid's side of the story may never be known.

6. The Emergency Dispatcher instructed Zimmerman not to follow the kid, but he did anyway.

7. Someone, whether it was Zimmerman or the kid, was screaming for help on the Emergency call and after a solitary shot went off, the yelling stopped. If the kid was the one screaming for help, it sounds like he was executed. If it was Zimmerman, why was he not in control of his weapon and why did he shoot an unarmed kid? And why did he stop asking for help? Did he attempt to get help for the kid after he shot him, or did he do nothing?

These 7 things show that there should have been a more thorough investigation. Whether Zimmerman is guilty or not, he should not have been able to freely walk away. So far, Zimmerman seems like the aggressor. The kid wouldn't have tried to grab the gun if it wasn't out already.

I live in Florida. I have a concealed weapon's permit. I have a degree in Criminal Justice as well as Public Safety & Security. I work with police officers. I understand use of force policies and continuum's. I have received some training as a Federal Law Enforcement Officer (Though this is limited because I'm not full-time and haven't gone through a full academy yet). Does it make me an expert? No, but it does give me a little bit of credibility.

You need to get your head out of your a*s and get off your high horse before you make such accusations.

Also, you are making an assumption based off of the facts. It needs to be further investigated. I'm just pointing out the facts and not assuming anything.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

Actually, if you look a page or 2 back, you'll see that I DO actually have some credibility with my views on this matter and that I also pretty much said the exact same thing as you, however, the news reports contain some errors (Like Zimmerman being in the community watch) and news reports don't count when saying Trayvon started it. They are reading Zimmerman's statement, which, essentially means there is only ONE report of what happened.

I did you a favor and quoted my previous statements which I'm guessing you never read:





You need to get your head out of your a*s and get off your high horse before you make such accusations.

Also, you are making an assumption based off of the facts. It needs to be further investigated. I'm just pointing out the facts and not assuming anything.

What else are we supposed to do with facts other than make assumptions and try and piece them together to get the whole story?

Facts in and of themselves are meaningless, one needs the context to make sense of them.

 

[The Thinker]

The picture of the kid sticking up the middle finger isn't even trayvon martin. That's how biased the news system is. Trying to destroy his character and reputation.

You point out these facts that Martin had a height advantage, and youth advantage over Zimmerman. All these advantages, but Zimmerman had a gun. Guns>>>
He Followed Tayvon because he was suspicious for being black and wearing a hoodie (while it was raining).

As a black man, if someone randomly approached me with a gun, threatening me, and asking what I"m doing in a neighborhood where my mom lives I'd feel uncomfortable as well. and Martin actually had the right to fight back. Anybody being threatened does.

There are no two sides to this story. Zimmerman approached the situation in a horrible way, even when the dispatcher told him not to. He approached and attacked Martin without reason. They have audio evidence.

Thank U "Dave"!This man always has good points when he tlks well types! :scorps:

ok you cussing at me wasn't even called for I wasn't coming at white people I was also talking about blacks!! hint why I said ALL PEOPLE want to do is kill and distroy...you think I don't know that even today blacks is killing eachother off? all I said was I hate this world for the killing who wouldn't when they have the fear that the next day might be their last if and when they step one foot out of their door

also if you think about it this is how the world is today

black kill black: they are just stupid let them kill eachother off the world will be better without

black kill white: send him to jail for life

white kill black: there must have been a reason for it so let him go free

white kill white: what is our world coming to

I truly don't blame them what with the image we give ourself but it still don't make it right

btw still not coming at whites because if you look passed the color of our skin we all together are still people plus I have a white bf and a mixed group of friends

I can't tell how u jst bashed on my race but itz all good doee i jst dont care for u plus I have nothing else to say to u! :scorps:

 

[Killahkels]

Guy had a gun followed the boy if some armed guy starts following you you have every right to fight back although you should try to run. But seriously defending this pr*** by saying the kid must been bad news he was suspended from school. Kids act up but does that mean they should be killed?

 

[Josh]

What else are we supposed to do with facts other than make assumptions and try and piece them together to get the whole story?

Facts in and of themselves are meaningless, one needs the context to make sense of them.

As long as you don't make assumptions appear as fact or misrepresent the facts, there's nothing wrong with it. I'm not accusing you of this necessarily, just speaking in general.

For this case, the biggest errors by the news are that they state Trayvon as being the aggressor and that Zimmerman is a part of the Community Watch. Trayvon being the aggressor cannot be proven without an independent witness (The fact that he injured Zimmerman could be from his own self-defense, but we'll probably never know for sure) and it's fairly well-known that Zimmerman was not officially in the Community Watch program because he did not have his neighbors' support. Those programs are actually set up in an official manner so that claim of his is false.

The funny thing is, if he really was in the program, he would be in more trouble because the responsibility of the Community Watch members is to observe suspicious incidents and report them to the police; they are not supposed to get involved.

But I agree, it can go either way and it needs to go to court. The local law enforcement messed up and failed to fully investigate the matter.

 

[Allan Hoshigaki]

why was he stalking him with a loaded gun in the first place?

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

why was he stalking him with a loaded gun in the first place?

Stalking is not the right word for that situation. Stalking implies that this was a pre-meditated thing, that Zimmerman had been following Trayvon for long before this.

As for the loaded gun, I believe he has a permit to carry it.

 

[Josh]

Stalking is not the right word for that situation. Stalking implies that this was a pre-meditated thing, that Zimmerman had been following Trayvon for long before this.

As for the loaded gun, I believe he has a permit to carry it.

That is correct. I apologize if I sounded harsh earlier. Being permitted to carry one though is not a license to use it.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

That is correct. I apologize if I sounded harsh earlier. Being permitted to carry one though is not a license to use it.

It is cool, I sounded like a jerk too. Peace?

 

[Josh]

It is cool, I sounded like a jerk too. Peace?

Of course!

 

[SAGA]

Poor dude this Trayvon kid,altho he does ''look like he is up to no good''.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

Poor dude this Trayvon kid,altho he does ''look like he is up to no good''.

Generalizing statements like this aren't very helpful.

 

[Allan Hoshigaki]

Stalking is not the right word for that situation. Stalking implies that this was a pre-meditated thing, that Zimmerman had been following Trayvon for long before this.

As for the loaded gun, I believe he has a permit to carry it.

true not to familiar with the case. also not sure how lawas work in america but if you have a permit for a handgun does the law say that your only allowed to use it on your property and cant be carried off. i dunno the laws. but if he killed the kid shouldnt he have been arrested for manslaughter regardless if it were self defence until proven in court otherwise and not been able to just walk home after the incident. and if roles where reversed im pretty sure trayvon would have been sentenced the next day to life behind bars.

 

[Killahkels]

Wtf is this all about. One black kid gets shot and everyone makes a huge fuss about it. If it were a white kid, hispanic, korean, russian, asian etc nobody would give a sh**. These days the only thing blacks have in cases is "racism man, racism." stuff liek this is retarded. You have people being raped and murdered and yet nobody cares, innocent lives in middle-east are being killed and nobody cares, all of a sudden a black kid gets shot and the whole world starts to give a flying f***.

This whole thing is stupid and is out of hand. Screw the media today. Complete sh**.

Condolenses to the family but seriously.

Maybe because in other cases with most other races they receive justice.
My condolenses to your family for producing a moron.