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Sannin of the Scrolls 📜
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One of the most controversial characters in this manga is hokage that never was: Danzo Shimura. He is typically viewed as villain or an antagonist and few hold sympathy for him or his ideals, but to accurately judge a character as complex as him one needs to weigh his end goal against the methods which he used in attempt to execute it, and bear in mind the question of if the ends ever justify the means.
This thread and any discussion is to remain canon with the exclusion of filler events.
His past and his relationship with Hiruzen. from a young age Danzo and Hiruzen
Danzo also possibly aqcuired Tobirama's wariness of the Uchiha.
Parallels.The rivalry between Danzo and Hiruzen can be paralleled to Naruto and Sasuke's relationship in Part 1 during which Sasuke was becoming envious of Naruto due to Naruto rapidly becoming stronger to where Sasuke felt like he was not becoming stronger at all; which from Sasuke's perspective is a cause for alarm since his ultimate goal at the time was to kill Itachi, and he felt that if he couldn't improve as quickly as Naruto he would never become strong enough to face Itachi. Danzo's dream (or in broader terms, his goal) was to become the Hokage; and when Hiruzen attained that position instead of him and his goal was blocked, he underwent a change: his perspective shifted and corrupted his dream of what he truly wanted to be and replaced it with a pessimisstic outlook on the shinobi world and his obsessive, ambitious dream to become hokage. He came to believe that becoming Hokage would be the ultimate way to "trump" Hiruzen (or the policies/ideals which Hiruzen represented). This can be paralleled to Sasuke's encounter with Itachi and how it reignited Sasuke's single goal of revenge against Itachi and led to him betraying Konoha for Orochimaru in order to get strong enough to kill Itachi. Danzo undergoes a similar "betrayal" for Konoha when he splits from Hiruzen's government and forms his own factional division, Root, which he ensures remains loyal only to him.
Another parallel that occurs during Danzo's death scene is how his character foils Karin's when they both end up as sacrifices minutes apart from one another.
Themes.The themes of loyalty, sacrifice, and secrets run deep with characters and events related to Danzo: he maintains that it is the work of
Danzo's world and idea of preserving peace revolved around deception and secrets. He knew about the Uchiha Clan massacre and believed that the only way a civil war could be avoided is if genocide is carried out in secret, and in maintaining that secret peace could be preserved. This theme is represented by the seals which Danzo places on the tongues of his subordinates; his corrupted idea of forced peace is reinforced by the forced secrets which his subordinates must not tell. What's more, he assigned Sai a secret mission to kill Sasuke without being straightforward with his goals. He and Hanzo deceived the early Akatsuki when they ambushed Yahiko and Nagato. He tricked Nonou and used her to his advantage, then killed her through Kabuto.
Is Danzo a bad guy? Danzo always did what he thought was best for Konoha, and he deluded himself into associating his own selfish goal (becoming Hokage) as the ultimate way of doing what was best for Konoha. When did he put what he thought was best for Konoha before the greater good? In other words: when did he do the wrong things for the right reasons?
Has Danzo done anything unforgivable?
Yes.
1. He instructed his men to not help out during the Pain invasion on the premise that it would make Tsunade look bad and further his career, potentially placing him in the Hokage seat. This was a completely selfish action in which he put his own interests before those of Konoha's, for which he usually stood for.
2. He has his men fight their friends: Sai and Shin had to fight each other in Root's common practice which is similar to the "Bloody Mist's" Chunin Exams. Making Konoha ninjas fight other Konoha ninjas is not OK, especially on cruel and illogical reasons such as erasing the emotions of the victor and making them an emotionless killing machine.
Does Danzo's final sacrifice make up for his past mistakes?
In the end, Danzo acknowledged his failures and tried to redeem himself with one final act. Now, I would be able to look at him and forgive him because many of the things he did actually had a sound reason despite the means he used to execute his goals. But because of the two things I stated were unforgivable (remaining underground for the Pein invasion and making his subordinates kill each other), I don't think "sorry" cuts it. Danzo is, overall, a bad guy. Is he a victim? Yep, in some ways. Is he a simple character? Is he just a bad guy? Not at all.
This thread and any discussion is to remain canon with the exclusion of filler events.
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His past and his relationship with Hiruzen. from a young age Danzo and Hiruzen
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until it seemed a rift formed between them due to Danzo's jealousy of Hiruzen and feelings of rivalry which stemmed from Hiruzen's many accomplishments vs Danzo's lack thereof. By the time they were teenagers, Danzo's rivalry with Hiruzen was intense enough to where he
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and began an argument at a critical time when such rivalry would only endanger his comrades.
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for picking Hiruzen as the Hokage was partly based on this and the knowledge that Hiruzen represented Konoha's values best and understood the importance of passing on the Will of Fire the younger generation, as well as recognizing him as the stronger of the two and the one who could better protect the village. When Tobirama selected Hiruzen as the next Hokage, it cemented the bitter rift between Danzo and Hiruzen and stood as an example of what would become of Naruto and Sasuke should they never reach an understanding. Danzo also possibly aqcuired Tobirama's wariness of the Uchiha.
Parallels.The rivalry between Danzo and Hiruzen can be paralleled to Naruto and Sasuke's relationship in Part 1 during which Sasuke was becoming envious of Naruto due to Naruto rapidly becoming stronger to where Sasuke felt like he was not becoming stronger at all; which from Sasuke's perspective is a cause for alarm since his ultimate goal at the time was to kill Itachi, and he felt that if he couldn't improve as quickly as Naruto he would never become strong enough to face Itachi. Danzo's dream (or in broader terms, his goal) was to become the Hokage; and when Hiruzen attained that position instead of him and his goal was blocked, he underwent a change: his perspective shifted and corrupted his dream of what he truly wanted to be and replaced it with a pessimisstic outlook on the shinobi world and his obsessive, ambitious dream to become hokage. He came to believe that becoming Hokage would be the ultimate way to "trump" Hiruzen (or the policies/ideals which Hiruzen represented). This can be paralleled to Sasuke's encounter with Itachi and how it reignited Sasuke's single goal of revenge against Itachi and led to him betraying Konoha for Orochimaru in order to get strong enough to kill Itachi. Danzo undergoes a similar "betrayal" for Konoha when he splits from Hiruzen's government and forms his own factional division, Root, which he ensures remains loyal only to him.
Another parallel that occurs during Danzo's death scene is how his character foils Karin's when they both end up as sacrifices minutes apart from one another.
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after she is used by him as a sacrifice. Shortly after when Danzo sacrifices himself, in his final moments
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Themes.The themes of loyalty, sacrifice, and secrets run deep with characters and events related to Danzo: he maintains that it is the work of
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who are responsible for the peace preserved in the ninja world and, believing that Itachi revealed the truth behind the Uchiha massacre to Sasuke, accused Itachi of betraying the Leaf and changing loyalties; and a shift in loyalties will upset the balance, or peace preserved by countless loyal shinobi who have sacrificed their lives for the sake of peace. His bodyguards Torune and Fu were so loyal that they engaged in combat with "Madara" almost certainly knowing they would die just in order to buy Danzo time to undo the brace on his arm. Though many are loyal to Danzo, he is not loyal to others: he betrayed Orochimaru (who gave him his izanagi power) when he sent Sai on a mission to assassinate Sasuke, Orochimaru's vessel. He betrayed Kabuto and attempted to kill him despite Kabuto being an excellent and loyal spy. The ultimate testament to Danzo's loyalty to Konoha was when he sacrificed his life to destroy Shisui's eye to prevent it from falling into enemy hands. Danzo's sacrifice also resonates with
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(which is also the same as
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) and how the manner/circumstances of one's death determine the value of one's character. Danzo's sacrifice stands as a testament to his loyalty and contradicts the selfish life he lived where he put Konoha's needs before the greater needs of the ninja world and favored the group before the individual (which he put into effect in his organization in which individuality was supressed to the maximum.)
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, Danzo attempts to compensate for past mistakes with a single, final act to make up for his failures, and mimicks his sensei (Tobirama), his subordinate (Itachi), and his longtime rival and friend (Hiruzen); by choosing to sacrifice himself for the
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, just like they did. The final predominant theme associated with Danzo's character is secrets.
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Danzo's world and idea of preserving peace revolved around deception and secrets. He knew about the Uchiha Clan massacre and believed that the only way a civil war could be avoided is if genocide is carried out in secret, and in maintaining that secret peace could be preserved. This theme is represented by the seals which Danzo places on the tongues of his subordinates; his corrupted idea of forced peace is reinforced by the forced secrets which his subordinates must not tell. What's more, he assigned Sai a secret mission to kill Sasuke without being straightforward with his goals. He and Hanzo deceived the early Akatsuki when they ambushed Yahiko and Nagato. He tricked Nonou and used her to his advantage, then killed her through Kabuto.
Is Danzo a bad guy? Danzo always did what he thought was best for Konoha, and he deluded himself into associating his own selfish goal (becoming Hokage) as the ultimate way of doing what was best for Konoha. When did he put what he thought was best for Konoha before the greater good? In other words: when did he do the wrong things for the right reasons?
-Ambushing the Akatsuki and attempting to eliminate them simply because he viewed them as a potential threat. This judgment was almost completely unfounded since the Akatsuki at the time never posed any threat to Konoha, and Danzo ironically destroyed peace (represented by the Akatsuki) in an attempt to preserve Konoha's stability. Nevertheless, Danzo put Konoha before all else and was not willing to take even the slightest risk.
-Killing the messenger frog which would alert Naruto to Pain's invasion: Danzo was not willing at any rate to risk Konoha losing the power of the Kyubi's jinchuuriki to the Akatsuki and was even willing to allow Konoha to continue to be attacked to preserve this millitary power.
-Planning to have Kabuto and Nonou kill each other in a mutual strike: Danzo came to realize that these two had learned too much, and to preserve Konoha's power he could not allow risking them to fall into enemy hands and put Konoha's overall well-being before the individual needs of his followers.
-Supporting the massacre of the Uchiha clan: he did it to prevent the outbreak of civil war and certainly did preserve peace within Konoha through this, but genocide is never OK in my opinion. Still, it was for what Danzo thought was the right reason and it very well may have been.
-Using KA on Mifune: Danzo believed it was absolutely necessary for the good of Konoha that he be chosen the supreme leader of the SA and there was no acceptable alternative.
-Attempting to kill Sasuke: Danzo sent Sai on a mission to assasinate Sasuke who was at the time a rogue ninja: while this goes contrary to Naruto's beliefs, Danzo actually had very well-placed reasons for assigning Sai this mission and attempting to carry it out, since it was certainly in the best interests of Konoha to have Sasuke dead.
-Killing the messenger frog which would alert Naruto to Pain's invasion: Danzo was not willing at any rate to risk Konoha losing the power of the Kyubi's jinchuuriki to the Akatsuki and was even willing to allow Konoha to continue to be attacked to preserve this millitary power.
-Planning to have Kabuto and Nonou kill each other in a mutual strike: Danzo came to realize that these two had learned too much, and to preserve Konoha's power he could not allow risking them to fall into enemy hands and put Konoha's overall well-being before the individual needs of his followers.
-Supporting the massacre of the Uchiha clan: he did it to prevent the outbreak of civil war and certainly did preserve peace within Konoha through this, but genocide is never OK in my opinion. Still, it was for what Danzo thought was the right reason and it very well may have been.
-Using KA on Mifune: Danzo believed it was absolutely necessary for the good of Konoha that he be chosen the supreme leader of the SA and there was no acceptable alternative.
-Attempting to kill Sasuke: Danzo sent Sai on a mission to assasinate Sasuke who was at the time a rogue ninja: while this goes contrary to Naruto's beliefs, Danzo actually had very well-placed reasons for assigning Sai this mission and attempting to carry it out, since it was certainly in the best interests of Konoha to have Sasuke dead.
Has Danzo done anything unforgivable?
Yes.
1. He instructed his men to not help out during the Pain invasion on the premise that it would make Tsunade look bad and further his career, potentially placing him in the Hokage seat. This was a completely selfish action in which he put his own interests before those of Konoha's, for which he usually stood for.
2. He has his men fight their friends: Sai and Shin had to fight each other in Root's common practice which is similar to the "Bloody Mist's" Chunin Exams. Making Konoha ninjas fight other Konoha ninjas is not OK, especially on cruel and illogical reasons such as erasing the emotions of the victor and making them an emotionless killing machine.
Does Danzo's final sacrifice make up for his past mistakes?
In the end, Danzo acknowledged his failures and tried to redeem himself with one final act. Now, I would be able to look at him and forgive him because many of the things he did actually had a sound reason despite the means he used to execute his goals. But because of the two things I stated were unforgivable (remaining underground for the Pein invasion and making his subordinates kill each other), I don't think "sorry" cuts it. Danzo is, overall, a bad guy. Is he a victim? Yep, in some ways. Is he a simple character? Is he just a bad guy? Not at all.
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he's there to do the dirty work so the hokage couldnkeep their hands clean.