Creation Question...

[Yusuke Urameshi]

-----DISCLAIMER-----
I am a Christian and believe in creation. If you know nothing about the God or anything related to the Genesis account or creation, please don't post an idiotic or ignorant reply.
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Here's my question:

If God made the world perfect, why is the universe slowly expanding outwards? If it were perfect, or still perfect, why wouldn't the orbits/gravitational pulls of planets/stars/celestial bodies, be perfect and neutral, without any expansion?

Please don't post anything if you have nothing intelligent to say or don't know what you're talking about. I'm actually curious about this. And please don't post something stating your worldview/beliefs as fact. That is all.

 

[Filo]

-----DISCLAIMER-----
I am a Christian and believe in creation. If you know nothing about the God or anything related to the Genesis account or creation, please don't post an idiotic or ignorant reply.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here's my question:

If God made the world perfect, why is the universe slowly expanding outwards? If it were perfect, or still perfect, why wouldn't the orbits/gravitational pulls of planets/stars/celestial bodies, be perfect and neutral, without any expansion?

Please don't post anything if you have nothing intelligent to say or don't know what you're talking about. I'm actually curious about this. And please don't post something stating your worldview/beliefs as fact. That is all.

I am catholic but I think the one part your missing is that God could not create the world to be perfect. Only God is perfect. In order for life to exist there needs to be two sides. Love and Hate. If the world were perfect it could not exist. If only love (perfection) existed you would not know it was love because you would have nothing to compare it to

 

[The Necromancer]

I just believe that God created the universe in the "big bang" and is now letting it run its course, evolution and science in all.

 

[kral]

He made everything and set the laws up but with those laws come things like universal expansion.

 

[FitzChivalry Farseer]

Well it was perfect until Eve came across a very well known tree.

 

[Yusuke Urameshi]

I am catholic but I think the one part your missing is that God could not create the world to be perfect. Only God is perfect. In order for life to exist there needs to be two sides. Love and Hate. If the world were perfect it could not exist. If only love (perfection) existed you would not know it was love because you would have nothing to compare it to

I just read a little mini Bible lesson about this topic. It seems that God didn't create a perfect world, not exactly because of what you said, but because God simply never said the world was perfect. He said it was 'good.' Good is not perfect. That's kind of the conclusion I've come to.

 

[Yusuke Urameshi]

Well it was perfect until Eve came across a very well known tree.

I could ask another question off of that statement. If God created the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, did God create evil? I've already come to what I think is a solid answer to this question, but I still think it's a good challenger.

 

[FitzChivalry Farseer]

I could ask another question off of that statement. If God created the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, did God create evil? I've already come to what I think is a solid answer to this question, but I still think it's a good challenger.

Yes he did but we were never supposed to even be aware of it. I do not think he wouldve allowed harm to befall us.

Edit: What was your answer?

 

[FreakensteinAG]

If God made the world perfect, why is the universe slowly expanding outwards? If it were perfect, or still perfect, why wouldn't the orbits/gravitational pulls of planets/stars/celestial bodies, be perfect and neutral, without any expansion?

As it turns out, the universe has a lifespan too -- a few trillion years. When the universe expands far enough, not even gravity will be powerful enough to hold it in place and it just collapses upon itself. There's this and the "Big Crunch" theory, which surmises that once the collapse takes place, the universe contracts once more.

I just believe that God created the universe in the "big bang" and is now letting it run its course, evolution and science in all.

You are a Deist, then? Pretty cool--not too many are upfront with this, actually

I could ask another question off of that statement. If God created the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, did God create evil? I've already come to what I think is a solid answer to this question, but I still think it's a good challenger.

Yes, and ruddy well placed the tree in a right good spot too! There's something odd about instructing two people to not interact with this, but not giving the two enough wisdom to go through with the plan...

Well it was perfect until Eve came across a very well known tree.

We all know who should have seen that one coming, and it wasn't The Snake or Adam. :| But he let it transpire anyway.

 

[Yusuke Urameshi]

As it turns out, the universe has a lifespan too -- a few trillion years. When the universe expands far enough, not even gravity will be powerful enough to hold it in place and it just collapses upon itself. There's this and the "Big Crunch" theory, which surmises that once the collapse takes place, the universe contracts once more.



You are a Deist, then? Pretty cool--not too many are upfront with this, actually



Yes, and ruddy well placed the tree in a right good spot too! There's something odd about instructing two people to not interact with this, but not giving the two enough wisdom to go through with the plan...



We all know who should have seen that one coming, and it wasn't The Snake or Adam. :| But he let it transpire anyway.

Is it the Big Crunch that says the universe will come back together, then another Big Bang will happen, so on and so forth? Or is that a different theory that's a combination of the two?

 

[FreakensteinAG]

Is it the Big Crunch that says the universe will come back together, then another Big Bang will happen, so on and so forth? Or is that a different theory that's a combination of the two?

Pretty much, it's like the universe will be infinitely expanding and contracting with every successive legacy. It's kinda spooky if you think about what's taking place and how long it takes.

 

[Yusuke Urameshi]

Pretty much, it's like the universe will be infinitely expanding and contracting with every successive legacy. It's kinda spooky if you think about what's taking place and how long it takes.

To think that this universe could be the 4029358th universe...

 

[FitzChivalry Farseer]

As it turns out, the universe has a lifespan too -- a few trillion years. When the universe expands far enough, not even gravity will be powerful enough to hold it in place and it just collapses upon itself. There's this and the "Big Crunch" theory, which surmises that once the collapse takes place, the universe contracts once more.



You are a Deist, then? Pretty cool--not too many are upfront with this, actually



Yes, and ruddy well placed the tree in a right good spot too! There's something odd about instructing two people to not interact with this, but not giving the two enough wisdom to go through with the plan...



We all know who should have seen that one coming, and it wasn't The Snake or Adam. :| But he let it transpire anyway.

Just answering your reply to mine

Well we were created in his image and we have much in common except the all powerful part. I believe that God and us humans share compassion, love, benevolence, kindness, and sorrow. On the downside we also share naivety, hate, anger, wrath, jealousy, and most of all doubt. If anyone has read the bible throughly you can clearly see that he shows this quality. See how he shows us how hes worried when he instructs adam and eve not to eat from the tree, thats even concern. So who knows maybe he was naive in letting adam and eve alone with the tree of knowledge.

 

[Yusuke Urameshi]

Just answering your reply to mine

Well we were created in his image and we have much in common except the all powerful part. I believe that God and us humans share compassion, love, benevolence, kindness, and sorrow. On the downside we also share naivety, hate, anger, wrath, jealousy, and most of all doubt. If anyone has read the bible throughly you can clearly see that he shows this quality. See how he shows us how hes worried when he instructs adam and eve not to eat from the tree, thats even concern. So who knows maybe he was naive in letting adam and eve alone with the tree of knowledge.

I disagree. There are two types of attributes: communicable and incommunicable. Communicable= like you said, love, anger, et cetera. Incommunicable = omnipotence, omniscience, omnipresence, perfection, et cetera. I don't know if you believe God is perfect or not, but if he is, he can't be naive. Also, when has God ever been doubtful?

 

[FreakensteinAG]

Just answering your reply to mine

Well we were created in his image and we have much in common except the all powerful part. I believe that God and us humans share compassion, love, benevolence, kindness, and sorrow. On the downside we also share naivety, hate, anger, wrath, jealousy, and most of all doubt. If anyone has read the bible throughly you can clearly see that he shows this quality. See how he shows us how hes worried when he instructs adam and eve not to eat from the tree, thats even concern. So who knows maybe he was naive in letting adam and eve alone with the tree of knowledge.

This is quite the interesting perspective! Throughout reading and listening to other peoples' testimonies, never once have I seen someone who confided that maybe, perhaps that Jehovah had a flawed psyche. Of course, the proof is in the pudding, but I have to say, it commands a lot of wisdom to say this and be content with it. Much respect, sir!

God is perfect or not, but if he is, he can't be naive

Deities can show naivety in his interaction with his domain, but doing so grants an air of malevolence about him, something demonstrable with the retelling of The Destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah where Lot's wife was turned into a pillar of salt for looking back at her home.

 

[FitzChivalry Farseer]

I disagree. There are two types of attributes: communicable and incommunicable. Communicable= like you said, love, anger, et cetera. Incommunicable = omnipotence, omniscience, omnipresence, perfection, et cetera. I don't know if you believe God is perfect or not, but if he is, he can't be naive. Also, when has God ever been doubtful?

Right before he destroys Sodom and Gomorrah. Im sure your familiar with the story. Before he decides to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah Abraham pleads with him not to destroy those cities. God was intent on destroying them because they were filled with sinners. However Abraham got him to think about his decision by asking if there were at least 100 innocent people that he shouldnt destroy them. God agreed. However Abraham kept bringing down the number successively down to five.

 

[FitzChivalry Farseer]

This is quite the interesting perspective! Throughout reading and listening to other peoples' testimonies, never once have I seen someone who confided that maybe, perhaps that Jehovah had a flawed psyche. Of course, the proof is in the pudding, but I have to say, it commands a lot of wisdom to say this and be content with it. Much respect, sir!



Deities can show naivety in his interaction with his domain, but doing so grants an air of malevolence about him, something demonstrable with the retelling of The Destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah where Lot's wife was turned into a pillar of salt for looking back at her home.

Still we were never supposed to even be exposed to such feelings of anger, pain, or hate. This is what the tree of knowledge brought seven fold. We were never supposed to feel Gods wrath because he completely confided in us and thats what true love really was. What good do we gain from knowledge? Self accomplishment? Bah we wouldnt even have to feed our low self esteem if it wasnt for knowledge.

 

[EnDash]

I disagree. There are two types of attributes: communicable and incommunicable. Communicable= like you said, love, anger, et cetera. Incommunicable = omnipotence, omniscience, omnipresence, perfection, et cetera. I don't know if you believe God is perfect or not, but if he is, he can't be naive. Also, when has God ever been doubtful?

god was doubtfull many times, like FitzChivalry Farseer said and there are other examples. but maybe thats what makes him perfect, that he is not only good and smart and knowledgeable, maybe to be perfect you need to have anger and doubt as well.

about the universe, there is a theory that says because the universe is expanding, it is going to get very cold before it will die, it's called the big freeze. all the stars will be extremely far away from each other and all sources of light or warmth will die. and that will be when humans wont be able to inhabit the universe anymore (unless we can warm ourselves artifically good enough). i don't think god knew ahed what will happen in the end, from the bible he says that he didn't like the "chaos" that was before the creation of the universe. i think he wanted unpredictability, he wanted something that can prove god wrong sometimes. he wanted a world where adam and eve, his creation in his image, might eat from the tree of knowledge.

the one theory i really like about the universe though is the free launch theory, it's completly hypothetical but it says that the universe sum total energy is positive energy in the form of matter, and negative energy in the form of gravity. because they are both equal but one is negative and the other positive they cancel each other out, and the sum total energy in the universe is 0. so to create a universe you need 0 energy, the universe is a free launch, fascinating is it not?

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[KillerbYo]

Maybe it is perfect, or for a purpose we dont know. Just because we deem something as imperfect dousnt make it so. Myabe God knows something we dont.

 

[YowYan]

Perfection is subjective, so that's already a meaningless debate.