[Discussion] Can Whitebeard beat Mihawk?
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chopstickchakra
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chopstickchakra
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If the World's best Jiujitsu practitioner fought a 3rd degree Jiujitsu blackbelt who also happened to practice Muay Thai and was only a blue tassel(his 2nd skill is significantly below his primary-Jiujitsu) the WBJ would win in every aspect of the fight in regard to JJ but if the 3rd degree started using his Muay Thai then the chance appears for him to take the fight. That's all I've been saying, the introduction of a new fighting style would create a chance for victory that wouldn't exist while holding a sword. The chance exists whether you want to ignore/accept it or not
You're completely and utterly wrong in that case. You seem to think that "if a persons primary fighting style is 10 and his secondary is 5 then his overall strength will be 10+5 = 15". But that's wrong, he either fights him with 10 or 5 not with both as both can't be combined. Hence, you're wrong.
I just randomly called our imaginary swordsman with multiple skills by his name. If you have any problem with Fujitora, then lets call him swordsman X or whatever you like. And the whole having MF prevents you from being a swordsman thing is a fan made BS which doesn't exist in the manga. Fujitora's been referred to as a blind swordsman by Oda. Let's ignore this for the time being as it isn't really necessary now.
I know where you're getting at, But it just doesn't work in this manga. You just created a scenario where the superior fighter will encounter an unfamiliar fighting style, so he may or may not be able to fight back. Where as, in the manga, the fighters in the manga are bought in such a way that they can handle any kind of opponent. It's a world filled with ability users, so they can't just tell the kind of enemy they may encounter in the future.
Mihawk or any fighter for that matter can handle about any fighting method as long as it remains within the reach of their own capabilities. It's all about raw fighting skills ; If you have FTL reactions, you can handle about any kind of attack within the limit of your reaction speed. If your power is country level, you can handle any kind of power based attack within the limits of your power.
The thing is that the victory earned via those cases doesn't really effect Mihawk's status as the WSS nor does that count as a lose in conventional sense. There are times when you just can't win but still don't lose the fight, those special cases are the same. Sanji getting beaten by Kalifa was also one of those cases. Now, would you really say that she won the fight?
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You seem to have comprehension issues, so let's go with mathematical symbols if there is any hope for you to get it
A = World Strongest Swordsman
B = Random Swordsman
That random swordsman has multiple art of fightings under his belt where he is at
B1 = 2nd strongest swordsman
B2 = boxing at the level of his swordsmanship
B3 = kicking just below his swordsmanship and boxing
B4 = levels below his swordsmanship and boxing
B5 = Weakest at taikwendo
It would result in
A > B1 = B2 > B3 >>> B4 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> B5
In this case then, if he were to fight A, it doesn't matter which fighting style he'd chose. He'd still lose. What would matter is to which extent he'd lose. If he goes B1, he may lose shortly. If he choses B2, he may lose the same. If he choses B3, the gap will be more signficant. If he choses B4, he'd trash. If he choses B5, it would be a waste of time
Get it now?
Forbidden Technique
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I don't agree with most of this, but you seem pretty adamant on how you view Mihawk, so I see no point in refuting it. However, I hope you realize that everything you stated still falls short to what WB has going for him in each of those categories, and I don't believe I need to explain why.
@ Bold, I'm assuming you're referring to WB not being able avoid it due to his condition, as Marco alluded to? Keep in mind WB was still able to react and defend against
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despite being distracted, said condition, and injury. I don't see it being an excuse, the injury had to of contributed to his early collapse, which gave Aikanu that opening.
you need to read more carefully because it's ripped out of context, I was the one who started with it but now I see things about 'let me whip out me second grade jiu jitsu skill' that is not what it is about.
It started with something far more simpler. What if a swordsman has superior haki, a devil fruit like the rust guy who surprised Zoro, greater speed or a sword tech like Vista and kin'nemon.
Those people still would be swordsmen and not part time martial artists, but have a trump card to beat a stronger opponent.
It's too easy just to conclude that Mihawk beats everyone without exception
I agree with you for a large part but I don't think Shanks would hide in shame and care about a title he seems too laid back to worry about that. I think he could have became pirate king a long time ago if he really tried.
Also he stopped Kaido from coming to Marineford, did that succesfully and stopped the war with his presence. That should put him up there with WB and Kaidou based on hype.
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Punk Hazard
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Then Mihawk will have some surprise quality as well that makes this not enough to beat him.
It's too easy to assume that just because a swordsman busts out a DF or a martial art, it's better than Mihawk.
Like Avi said, it's ridiculous you people assume that a swordsman's primary method of fighting wouldn't be enough to beat Mihawk, so he'll bust out someone secondary and somehow that'll let him beat Mihawk? If what a swordsman is best at isn't enough for Mihawk, something inferior won't help him just because it's an extra thing.
Forbidden Tale
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Fair enough, but I have never actually disagreed with Shanks being on the level of Kaido or Old Whitebeard, I have disagreed with Mihawk being below their level.
Some scans say "In a one on one fight Kaido will win" and another scan says "In a one on one fight always bet on Kaido"
Either way Oda is basically saying Kaido can beat anybody one on one...
Forbidden Tale
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Which comes from his 'immortality', that he just can't die.
He was still beaten 7 times.
Punk Hazard
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And how serious do you think I was?
Like for real?...
Riker and I go way back, and are cool with eachother.. not sure what you think you needed to accomplish with your post.. but thanks "guy".. lol
To anyone still trying to debate, it's not about "secondary" powers.. like yo, yall never heard of equal?
What do you guys say about Law and Fujitora and how they use their swords and DF's? Pretty much equal..
We've never even seen Shanks go all out.. so his sword is probably his weakest and simplest way of fighting.
When Luffy fights an opponent, does he go G4 right away? Off bat? Or does he use G2 or G3 first or even a base attack to test the opponent's strength?
It's simple logic..
So far, we've seen Shanks use his sword to clash with WB's Bisento.. now was Whitebeard's bisento his primary way of fighting? Was it his strongest form of attack? Whats better for WB to use, his Bisento alone? Or his DF?
We also see Shanks block Akainu's attack on Coby with his sword, but tell me logically, why would a 1 armed man stop a lava/magma attack with his one and only arm, when he has a weapon just as capable on his waist?
Think about these things people.. think..
What do you guys say about Law and Fujitora and how they use their swords and DF's? Pretty much equal..
We've never even seen Shanks go all out.. so his sword is probably his weakest and simplest way of fighting.
When Luffy fights an opponent, does he go G4 right away? Off bat? Or does he use G2 or G3 first or even a base attack to test the opponent's strength?
It's simple logic..
So far, we've seen Shanks use his sword to clash with WB's Bisento.. now was Whitebeard's bisento his primary way of fighting? Was it his strongest form of attack? Whats better for WB to use, his Bisento alone? Or his DF?
We also see Shanks block Akainu's attack on Coby with his sword, but tell me logically, why would a 1 armed man stop a lava/magma attack with his one and only arm, when he has a weapon just as capable on his waist?
Think about these things people.. think..
Punk Hazard
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If your other ability is equal to your swordsmanship, and your swordsmanship is inferior to Mihawk, then that shit will also be inferior to Mihawk, so either way, you're gonna lose still so?
So does superior haki count as a second ability or a poison or other tricky devil fruit or are you then just going to say no he is a haki master which is his first ability and him wielding a sword is his second, because that sounds like something you would do.
Punk Hazard
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Superior Haki to Mihawk's Haki doesn't mean you'll win if Mihawk's Swordsmanship is superior to your Haki.
chopstickchakra
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I never said it would effect his status as WSS if he lost to someone in these scenarios, just that he could lose. Yes Kalifa won the fight against Sanji thanks to his principles. You can try to spin why he lost however you'd like fact is he lost. Doesn't make him weaker just means he couldn't win that fight despite being superior to his opponent in multiple areas, there was one key area where he lacked compared to his opponent and that resulted in his defeat.