[VS] Anotha one logia vs logia

[Love Cook]

No I didn't. Sand turning into glass when struck by lightning is something that naturally happens. There's no reason to assume it wouldn't happen if Enel's lightning strikes Crocodile's sand at this scale.

Giving Crocodile Haki, a completely fictional, circumstantial power, is nowhere near saying lightning would turn the sand into glass.


No we aren't. Shit like La Spada and Sables are being taken into account. It's just that these things can't produce any actual harmful effects on Enel. So it doesn't matter. Not only that, but no one gave Enel any feats or mentioned any abilities he couldn't execute through the use of his own body anytime, anywhere, naturally, until you started doing the opposite for Crocodile.

Using Enel's feats of El Thor is NOT the same as using Crocodile's feats in a desert. You wanna give Crocodile the desert, then we're giving Enel the Arc Maxim because those are actually equivalent.



"Lightning doesn't work on him."

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When Luffy hits Enel, he hits FLESH. Enel's body COULDN'T transform when hit by Luffy's fist. If it could, the result would have been Enel's body turning into lightning, and the lightning having no effect on Luffy.

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"Lightning power is completely useless."

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"Lightning won't work against me."

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The gold only hit Enel because Luffy's fist was in contact with his body. And no, Luffy's fist wasn't inside of the ball.

When the fist hits Enel, his lightning transformation shuts off, showing that Luffy's fruit neutralized his fruit.

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Are you stupid or just pretending that you are ?

I never said that Luffy isn't a good match-up against Enel because of the rubber vs lightning. I know that rubber doesn't conduct, posting 3 scans to repeat that and avoid the actual point I made is useless.

You said that Luffy's rubber negates the goro goro no mi. That is a big fat lie. That is some Blackbeard darkness fruit shit. You can even clearly see in the pic that you posted yourself where Luffy hits Enel with the golden ball that his teeth get knocked out by the ball.

It is stated nowhere that once Luffy is in contact with Enel he loses his power. If that was true Enel could've dodged the tiny fist and went into that giant ball to dodge the attack. So there is the speculation part, ugh what a fallacy.

Also the lightning turning sand into glass is a very rare phenomenon so saying that crocodile can be turned into glass while that hasn't been done once in OP is also speculation. Like I said just because Luffy doesn't conduct doesn't make him immune from the heat. He should've melted if Enel was that hot.

There is no way Enel wins this, he has nothing. Crocodile is after Luffy one of the best lighting rods when he is in contact with the earth. He has a golden weapon and is the better fighter.

 

[Punk Hazard]

There's always going to be moments no matter how skillful you are. Most logias can do what Enel could do if their natural weakness is not exploited. You cant compare some weakling to someone of Crocodile's caliber.

There won't be that moment. If Enel's body can transform while he's asleep, then it'll always transform so Crocodile will never be able hurt him with just sand

 

[Punk Hazard]

Are you stupid or just pretending that you are ?

I showed you a panel of Enel phasing through gold, and you're trying to continue the argument that gold cancel's Enel's ability to phase. You're not even in the position to be questioning the intelligence of special Olympians right now.

I

never said that Luffy isn't a good match-up against Enel because of the rubber vs lightning. I know that rubber doesn't conduct, posting 3 scans to repeat that and avoid the actual point I made is useless.

You said that Luffy's rubber negates the goro goro no mi. That is a big fat lie. That is some Blackbeard darkness fruit shit. You can even clearly see in the pic that you posted yourself where Luffy hits Enel with the golden ball that his teeth get knocked out by the ball.

It is stated nowhere that once Luffy is in contact with Enel he loses his power. If that was true Enel could've dodged the tiny fist and went into that giant ball to dodge the attack. So there is the speculation part, ugh what a fallacy.

AAAAND the bolded is exactly why you should have never typed the underlined. I post a panel where it says Enel's lightning is useless against Luffy because his body is lightning to prove that whatever effects the Goro Goro no Mi produces is useless when it comes to Luffy's body. That's why Luffy's fruit neutralizes Enel's.

@Large Font: He couldn't because Luffy's fist was moving too fast, and this is what the panels looks like:

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Luffy's fist hits Enel, and his transformation immediately shuts off. That is proof that Luffy's fruit neutralizes Enel's on contact. The transformation shuts off BEFORE the gold knocks his teeth out. The gold hurts him ONLY because Luffy's fist shuts his power off when he hits him.

Also the lightning turning sand into glass is a very rare phenomenon so saying that crocodile can be turned into glass while that hasn't been done once in OP is also speculation. Like I said just because Luffy doesn't conduct doesn't make him immune from the heat. He should've melted if Enel was that hot.

There is no way Enel wins this, he has nothing. Crocodile is after Luffy one of the best lighting rods when he is in contact with the earth. He has a golden weapon and is the better fighter.[/QUOTE]

 

[Love Cook]

I showed you a panel of Enel phasing through gold, and you're trying to continue the argument that gold cancel's Enel's ability to phase. You're not even in the position to be questioning the intelligence of special Olympians right now.

I

AAAAND the bolded is exactly why you should have never typed the underlined. I post a panel where it says Enel's lightning is useless against Luffy because his body is lightning to prove that whatever effects the Goro Goro no Mi produces is useless when it comes to Luffy's body. That's why Luffy's fruit neutralizes Enel's.

@Large Font: He couldn't because Luffy's fist was moving too fast, and this is what the panels looks like:


Luffy's fist hits Enel, and his transformation immediately shuts off. That is proof that Luffy's fruit neutralizes Enel's on contact. The transformation shuts off BEFORE the gold knocks his teeth out. The gold hurts him ONLY because Luffy's fist shuts his power off when he hits him.

Also the lightning turning sand into glass is a very rare phenomenon so saying that crocodile can be turned into glass while that hasn't been done once in OP is also speculation. Like I said just because Luffy doesn't conduct doesn't make him immune from the heat. He should've melted if Enel was that hot.

There is no way Enel wins this, he has nothing. Crocodile is after Luffy one of the best lighting rods when he is in contact with the earth. He has a golden weapon and is the better fighter.

[/QUOTE]

That's just not true, Luffy does not have the power to negate his fruit. You're making that up. Also isn't stated in the panels you're showing.

Luffy is immune to the lighting but he doesn't have the power to negate the goro goro no mi. So the underlined and bolded part still hold up.

So what you're saying that in theory if Luffy and Enel stand hand in hand, Enel is unable to use his lighting powers and body transformation ? Because that makes no sense at all. That is not how logia powers work. That's just like saying if Luffy touches Crocodile with wet hands the rest of his body can't transform anymore. It basically is a substitute for haki. Which allows Luffy to touch a logia user. When Tashigi was in Smokers body and Luffy grabbed her arms with haki she was still able to be in a smoke form. Just because Luffy is rubber doesn't negate Enel's powers with the exception of the part he is touched he still should have his lightning powers.

Also with special Olympians I think you're talking about Paralympians (unless you mean the gods on the mountain Olympus) are not mentally handicapped. So calling them stupid ironically makes you look like the dumb one. Just because someone is in a wheelchair means that they can't think straight. You're not in the position to say shit. Give Stephen Hawking a call maybe he can tell you a thing or two about proof > speculation.

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

There won't be that moment. If Enel's body can transform while he's asleep, then it'll always transform so Crocodile will never be able hurt him with just sand

Just on those basis alone, you implied that Enel is completely untouchable unless you are rubber.
Such back logic that Crocodile is able to attack/touch Akainu who is made of hot magma hotter than Enel's thunder but Crocodile can't touch Enel for reasons unknown?
And sand tornado stirs current, so of course he'll be able to touch regardless of what you think. Both sand and thunder are both elements so they would be able to harm which other with their elements.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Just on those basis alone, you implied that Enel is completely untouchable unless you are rubber.

Or using Haki. Or using Seastone. Things Crocodile has never shown to have.

Such back logic that Crocodile is able to attack/touch Akainu who is made of hot magma hotter than Enel's thunder

Magma isn't hotter than lightning or even fire.

but Crocodile can't touch Enel for reasons unknown?

No he can't *****. Crocodile has never shown Haki, he doesn't have Seastone, he has nothing in arsenal to affect him.

And sand tornado stirs current, so of course he'll be able to touch regardless of what you think. Both sand and thunder are both elements so they would be able to harm which other with their elements.

Producing electricity will let him harm the man made of and immune to electricity? Is that what you're saying?

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

Or using Haki. Or using Seastone. Things Crocodile has never shown to have.

No, because you said that Enels body transform in his sleep. Caesar dodge one of Luffy's attacks when he transform; so you're basically saying that Enel is untouchable.

Magma isn't hotter than lightning or even fire.

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Depending on the voltage and Onepiece logic, yes it is.

No he can't *****. Crocodile has never shown Haki, he doesn't have Seastone, he has nothing in arsenal to affect him.

Whos said you need ****ing seastones and haki to touch logias? Different elements can touch each other.

Producing electricity will let him harm the man made of and immune to electricity? Is that what you're saying?

Wind. Air pressure can still harm Enel. And Crocodile's sand spear can still harm him as well.

 

[Punk Hazard]

No, because you said that Enels body transform in his sleep. Caesar dodge one of Luffy's attacks when he transform; so you're basically saying that Enel is untouchable.

Enel's body can transform all it wants, it'll still get hurt when its hit by Haki or Seastone. Reflexively transforming means nothing against those.

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Depending on the voltage and Onepiece logic, yes it is.

Akainu said his fruit was superior. He never said it was hotter.

Whos said you need ****ing seastones and haki to touch logias? Different elements can touch each other.

Sand not being an element that can touch lightning.

Wind. Air pressure can still harm Enel.

And the basis of this being?

And Crocodile's sand spear can still harm him as well.

How?

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

Enel's body can transform all it wants, it'll still get hurt when its hit by Haki or Seastone. Reflexively transforming means nothing against those.

You can reflexively transform to dodge haki attacks. Haki does not negate devil fruit powers completely it just allows you fend off them or touch them when they materialize. As for logia users they can transform specific part of their body to evade incoming haki attacks like Aokiji did to Whitebeard.

Akainu said his fruit was superior. He never said it was hotter.

He said his devil fruit can burn even fire which is what makes it superior. You need to be extremely hot to burn something or someone. He's literally burning fire.

Sand not being an element that can touch lightning.

Sand is an element like all the other logias that can touch Enel regardless. Logias can actually touch each other as seen in the series.

And the basis of this being?

On the basis of air being an insulator of positive and negative charge to produce lighting in the clouds. There is no lighting without air.

How?

He's a logia. Logia's can still attack other logias.
And his gold alloy hook would greatly damage Enel too considering that the golden bell is what was responsible for knocking him out in the first place.

 

[Punk Hazard]

You can reflexively transform to dodge haki attacks. Haki does not negate devil fruit powers completely it just allows you fend off them or touch them when they materialize. As for logia users they can transform specific part of their body to evade incoming haki attacks like Aokiji did to Whitebeard.

What Aokiji did was transform into ice and create a hole in his body for the spear to fall through. Whitebeard's spear didn't actually pierce through any of his ice. Enel could try something like that too, but if the person is too fast and strike him, whether he's lightning or materialized, it'll hurt his body.

Haki doesn't turn off a Devil Fruit. Hitting someone with Haki doesn't deactivate the DF, but it causes the DF eater to feel pain.

He said his devil fruit can burn even fire which is what makes it superior. You need to be extremely hot to burn something or someone. He's literally burning fire.

Yes. Burn it because it's superior. He never said he can burn him because it's hotter. Akainu's fruit cancels out Ace's, causing his flesh to be damaged.

Sand is an element like all the other logias that can touch Enel regardless. Logias can actually touch each other as seen in the series.

Yes, sand can physically interact with lightning, but that wouldn't cause any damage or pain to Enel. When Luffy punched Aokiji with no Haki, he touched Aokiji, but he was able to reform and he didn't feel any pain. Like I said to Love Cook, the sand can split the lightning apart, but it wouldn't cause any pain or injury unless it's infused with Haki.

On the basis of air being an insulator of positive and negative charge to produce lighting in the clouds. There is no lighting without air.

Except Crocodile doesn't have an air fruit. He has the Sand fruit, meaning he can generate sandstorms. Given that lightning can exist inside sandstorms, Enel would be able to continue existing inside any sandstorms Crocodile makes.

He's a logia. Logia's can still attack other logias.

Uhm, no they can't. This has never been stated or shown.

And his gold alloy hook would greatly damage Enel too considering that the golden bell is what was responsible for knocking him out in the first place.

Don't bring back this retarded argument. Enel was able to phase into the golden part of the Ark Maxim. If Crocodile swings that hook, Enel will just phase through it. The reason the bell knocked Enel out was because Luffy's fist was touching his body, which cancels Enel's "intangibility."

 

[Jugram Haschwalth]

Crocodile wins.

Enel is an overconfident fighter with a good ability. I think Crocodile is smart enough to find a way around his defense.

The glass argument is bullshit, if lightning strikes sand it can indeed create a small shard of glass. But Crocodile is just as intangible with his logia body as Enel. So even if his body is solid for lightning strikes (Because why would lightning be able to hit a sand logia but not the other way around ?) It would create a chunk of glass in his body and he can just drop it and recover, because he can create more of his element.

So many holes here i honestly don't know where to begin. Crocodile has a solid logia if you understand what i mean? Kuzan is ice thus his Logia can hold a real solid form while Enel is composed of lighting which holds no physical form at all. Sand is nothing but small rocks. He can hit Croc entire body at once thus turning him into glass all at once.

Crocodile also isn't harmed by a cannonball explosion which blow chunks out of body, he just closes those up and is good as new. So the whole glass argument is based on nothing.

But what happens when 2 people who can't touch each other fight ? I think that the better fighter wins, that is crocodile. He has New World experience.

A cannon ball flies right through Croc lighting would affect him in a completely different type of way. Glass argument is based off facts heated sand becomes a solid material. We have no idea how strong current Enel is so just to give Croc the advantage in that area is bias.

I feel that every vice-admiral level guy pre-skip (because they have haki) could beat Enel. And I don't think that is the case for Crocodile.

Completely wrong here. Smoker was not as impressive as Enel.

Luffy was fast enough in base form to keep up with Enel in his lightning form (so the speed argument goes over board). Enel was not competent enough to beat luffy in any other way to get around the rubber weakness. If he was that good he should've done more with his staff or a sword or when he had a massive golden ball on his arm.

So if you compare the fights the two put up against Luffy, Crocodile did a better job of holding him off. Beat him twice and hit him with his poison hook.

Luffy also kept up with Croc so your point is moot. Enel did compensate actually rather quickly since he opted to burn Luffy instead of shock him. Luffy body wasn't completely DF proof for Croc so of course he did better that's pretty obvious.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Crocodile wins.


So many holes here i honestly don't know where to begin. Crocodile has a solid logia if you understand what i mean? Kuzan is ice thus his Logia can hold a real solid form while Enel is composed of lighting which holds no physical form at all. Sand is nothing but small rocks. He can hit Croc entire body at once thus turning him into glass all at once.


A cannon ball flies right through Croc lighting would affect him in a completely different type of way. Glass argument is based off facts heated sand becomes a solid material. We have no idea how strong current Enel is so just to give Croc the advantage in that area is bias.

Completely wrong here. Smoker was not as impressive as Enel.


Luffy also kept up with Croc so your point is moot. Enel did compensate actually rather quickly since he opted to burn Luffy instead of shock him. Luffy body wasn't completely DF proof for Croc so of course he did better that's pretty obvious.

Smart man, not bothering with Variah.

 

[Rikudou Tobi]

What Aokiji did was transform into ice and create a hole in his body for the spear to fall through. Whitebeard's spear didn't actually pierce through any of his ice. Enel could try something like that too, but if the person is too fast and strike him, whether he's lightning or materialized, it'll hurt his body.

That's how every Logia evades incoming attacks (essentially). They materialize then disperse whenever incoming attacks try to land. Skilled logia users can do that unconsciously like Crocodile or you can be like Enel and have mantra (haki) to do that for him. Especially when he has a contraction that enhances his observation to sky island level.
Now that you know, you're still saying that Enel is invincible and that no attacks can land on him because he can disperse into materialization in his sleep to avoid all incoming attacks. That's what you are implying right now. You do realize that?

Haki doesn't turn off a Devil Fruit. Hitting someone with Haki doesn't deactivate the DF, but it causes the DF eater to feel pain.

I never said that it does. Read my post carefully.

Yes. Burn it because it's superior. He never said he can burn him because it's hotter. Akainu's fruit cancels out Ace's, causing his flesh to be damaged.

It burns Ace because he is hotter. That's why it's superior to Ace. There's no other reason why he would say why his fruit is superior to Ace in the first place. Stop bullshit posting, you lost this argument too.

Yes, sand can physically interact with lightning, but that wouldn't cause any damage or pain to Enel. When Luffy punched Aokiji with no Haki, he touched Aokiji, but he was able to reform and he didn't feel any pain. Like I said to Love Cook, the sand can split the lightning apart, but it wouldn't cause any pain or injury unless it's infused with Haki.

That example doesn't make sense whatsoever. Luffy is a paramecia and Aokiji is a logia. Of corse he's gonna feel pain when he splits his ass with a grande spear sand like he did Akainu. You can't fuse haki into elemental fruit abilities either.
When luffy punched aokiji in the stomach he did not materialize at all. He simply tanked it that base punch. Nothing special.

Except Crocodile doesn't have an air fruit. He has the Sand fruit, meaning he can generate sandstorms. Given that lightning can exist inside sandstorms, Enel would be able to continue existing inside any sandstorms Crocodile makes.

Sand storms generates wind. You cannot have a sand storm without wind it's impossible. He rotates sand in the palm of his hand generating spiraling wind itself. He used sandy wind to one-shot an awaken guard in impel down and send jinbei flying to safety in the war.

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Uhm, no they can't. This has never been stated or shown.

Yes yes they can, it's always been shown. Don't be an idiot here.
Ace vs Smoker
Crocodile vs Akainu
are all good examples.

Don't bring back this retarded argument. Enel was able to phase into the golden part of the Ark Maxim. If Crocodile swings that hook, Enel will just phase through it. The reason the bell knocked Enel out was because Luffy's fist was touching his body, which cancels Enel's "intangibility."

Well no he won't phase through it because he's a logia. Logias can fight other logias thanks to their fruit powers.

Edit: Still a retard calling me Variaboss? I'm done with you here you stupid troll.

 

[chopstickchakra]

How will Enel ? Croc is also a Logia.



And One Piece is not. In reality the sand wouldn't dodge



That all means nothing in the world of One Piece. Why does Enel get the El Thor size upgrade and doesn't Crocodile get the he is able to be a desert upgrade ? He can literally just sink in the ground and pop out somewhere else. Also when in the ground the surface area is so much bigger and the lightning would just flow away into the ground, look on your roof that is how a lightning rod works. Enel wasn't known for leaving glass shards all around when fighting everybody and striking the ground. So the whole glass thing is just speculation.



Doesn't really matter when crocodile is intangible, he is lacking a physical substance. He can produce his own element. So even if lightning strikes and splits him. He would just regenerate.



He can just wait it out in the ground. Also it isn't even that hot apparently seeing as Luffy is fine. If rubber doesn't melt, sand definitely isn't turning into glass.



And that is where you are wrong and Crocodile's intelligence comes in. Luffy defeated Enel by smacking Enel with a giant golden ball into a bell. Enel in lightning form was not able to phase through it. Luckily for Crocodile he had a little accident with his hand and got it replaced with a golden hook. So Crocodile has a way of touching Enel where Enel has none. So seeing as you recognized him as the more skilled fighter I think we can agree now that Croc would win this.

You could even go a step further and speculate that a schichibukai with New World experience must have CoA. Because 1) in the navy vice-admirals and above have haki (okay he isn't technically navy) and 2) from all strong people we've seen in the New World most of them have haki.

So to conclude because I'm afraid I will be quoted a lot, and I don't feel like posting in this thread anymore.

* Base Luffy could keep up with lightning Enel = not lightning fast
* Lightning doesn't melt rubber, so it's not hot enough to create glass (Glass argument is speculation)
* Sand logia is just as intangible as lightning logia, he can always create more/restore himself even if he gets hit by lightning
* Crocodile is a more skilled fighter than Enel and not over confident and cocky
* Enel has a way of touching Enel with his golden hook, Enel has none.

Bye, I'm out.

Edit:
I saw that salty tre was leaving dislikes on a well structured post with arguments and replied with a picture. So just for you I made this little edit.



Is Enel going to turn Crocdile into a 10 cm big glass statue or what are you trying to say with that pic ? Read this post up here. Even in the very very unlikely scenario that is total speculation where Enel turns Crocodile into glass (because apparently he has no resistance as a strong character in One Piece) He can still separate the glass parts and regenerate. That is what Logia's do.

But like I said, Enel hasn't shown the feats that his lighting is hot enough. Crocodile can hide in the ground, and he is a logia. So no one will be turned into glass in this fight.

You keep avoiding the real question here by saying Croc can dodge Croc can hide. Ok Croc can hide, but let's say he wasn't able and got hit that's the point, if he got hit by an attack large enough to hit his whole body then he'd be turned to glass. The question isn't can he hit him(we know he can't) the question is who would have the greater effect if they could and Enel would have the greater effect with lightning over sand.

 

[Love Cook]

You keep avoiding the real question here by saying Croc can dodge Croc can hide. Ok Croc can hide, but let's say he wasn't able and got hit that's the point, if he got hit by an attack large enough to hit his whole body then he'd be turned to glass. The question isn't can he hit him(we know he can't) the question is who would have the greater effect if they could and Enel would have the greater effect with lightning over sand.

It's not so much as me avoiding the question. It's you doing a bad job of reading.

Things I said:

1) Enel's lightning wasn't able to melt rubber. Even though his rubber body didn't conduct he should still feel the heat. If his lightning can't even do that, why are you giving him a feat that needs far more heat to pull off to create glass. = speculation from your side.

2) If lightning leaves behind glass (which is very very rare, so I don't understand why it's considered so natural here) it takes an enormous amound of energy and leaves behind just a tiny little piece of glass. So it doesn't work like that at all when you have a huge ass lightning bolt cover crocodile and presto he turns to glass. That just happens in your fantasy. He is no aokiji who freezes Doflamingo.

3) Crocodile with two feet on the ground is world's best lightning conductor because it would travel through his sand body into the ground. So there is an enormous loss of energy.

Now read up before you quote me again. This is just wasting my time at this point.

Crocodile wins.


So many holes here i honestly don't know where to begin. Crocodile has a solid logia if you understand what i mean? Kuzan is ice thus his Logia can hold a real solid form while Enel is composed of lighting which holds no physical form at all. Sand is nothing but small rocks. He can hit Croc entire body at once thus turning him into glass all at once.


A cannon ball flies right through Croc lighting would affect him in a completely different type of way. Glass argument is based off facts heated sand becomes a solid material. We have no idea how strong current Enel is so just to give Croc the advantage in that area is bias.

Completely wrong here. Smoker was not as impressive as Enel.


Luffy also kept up with Croc so your point is moot. Enel did compensate actually rather quickly since he opted to burn Luffy instead of shock him. Luffy body wasn't completely DF proof for Croc so of course he did better that's pretty obvious.

Logia is not solid, It's a fluid mass of that element. If he gets hit and split he can recover.

For your whole glass speculation, because it's not a fact as you stated, read the reply on chopstick.

I said all the vice-admirals pre skip. Smoker wasn't a vice admiral pre skip. Good job reading there.

The point I made about Luffy keeping up with Enel is to prove he is not 'lightning fast'. If there was any doubt about Crocodile's speed I would indeed have said the same. But nobody here goes oh but Crocodile is the speed guy, but somehow they do about Enel. While he got hit by base Luffy and a giant golden ball. So If Luffy can keep up in base form with Enel. Crocodile is not that much slower than him as shown by both fights.

Don't talk about my post containing holes when you're post is like a blackhole that sucks all the logic out of it.

 

[Punk Hazard]

That's how every Logia evades incoming attacks (essentially). They materialize then disperse whenever incoming attacks try to land. Skilled logia users can do that unconsciously like Crocodile or you can be like Enel and have mantra (haki) to do that for him. Especially when he has a contraction that enhances his observation to sky island level.
Now that you know, you're still saying that Enel is invincible and that no attacks can land on him because he can disperse into materialization in his sleep to avoid all incoming attacks. That's what you are implying right now. You do realize that?

That's not what happens. Logias evade attacks by transforming themselves into their elements, and then the attacks hit them, forcing their body to fall apart. They then reform their body back together, and if there's no Haki or Seastone or weakness to their DF in the attack, then they don't feel any pain or take any damage.

When Luffy kicked the three Admirals, the ice chunks were FORCIBLY breaking their bodies apart. When Luffy punched Crocodile, when the guards shot Crocodile, the fists and bullets FORCIBLY pushed the sand apart. Logias don't make holes in their bodies and let stuff pass through those holes unless it involves Haki or something else that cancels a Logia's defenses.

It burns Ace because he is hotter. That's why it's superior to Ace. There's no other reason why he would say why his fruit is superior to Ace in the first place. Stop bullshit posting, you lost this argument too.

The bold is nothing more than your claim. That's not an argument, that's not proof.

There are plenty of reasons Magma would be superior to Fire aside from being hot. For one, Magma is molten earth. As seen when Whitebeard caught one of the meteors on his bisento and blew out the fire, there was a rock underneath the flames. The earthen part of Magma can smother fire, especially when it's in a molten form.

Magma can also assimilate fire. As mentioned before, magma boils down to earth being on fire. You put fire against magma, you just get more magma. That's why it overwhelms Ace's fire.

That example doesn't make sense whatsoever. Luffy is a paramecia and Aokiji is a logia. Of corse he's gonna feel pain when he splits his ass with a grande spear sand like he did Akainu. You can't fuse haki into elemental fruit abilities either.
When luffy punched aokiji in the stomach he did not materialize at all. He simply tanked it that base punch. Nothing special.

That spear wouldn't cause Enel any pain. His body will split, but it wouldn't cause injury, he'd just reform. That's how all Logias work unless they have natural superiority.

Haki can be infused into elements. Zoro was able to infuse Haki into his flying slash, which shows that Haki can be infused into non-physical ranged attacks. That includes Logia powers.

Sand storms generates wind. You cannot have a sand storm without wind it's impossible. He rotates sand in the palm of his hand generating spiraling wind itself. He used sandy wind to one-shot an awaken guard in impel down and send jinbei flying to safety in the war.

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Sandstorms can also generate lightning.

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If lightning can be generated inside sandstorms, then nothing about Crocodile's sandstorms would cancel Enel's powers.

Yes yes they can, it's always been shown. Don't be an idiot here.
Ace vs Smoker
Crocodile vs Akainu
are all good examples.

None of these are examples of Logias injuring each other without Haki. The things the shoot at each other can collide, yes, but without Haki or seastone, none of this stuff hitting their bodies will actually cause pain. Crocodile didn't hurt Akaini when he split him. Ace and Smoker weren't hurting each other.

Well no he won't phase through it because he's a logia. Logias can fight other logias thanks to their fruit powers.

Zero evidence of a Logia being able to hurt another Logia unless there's Haki or natural superiority.

 

[Jugram Haschwalth]

]Logia is not solid, It's a fluid mass of that element. If he gets hit and split he can recover.

For your whole glass speculation, because it's not a fact as you stated, read the reply on chopstick.

A logia can be solid as Ice is always solid therefor the logia is solid your making no sense here. Google and see what heated up sand looks like im not going to go back in forth with you over something that is common sense.

I said all the vice-admirals pre skip. Smoker wasn't a vice admiral pre skip. Good job reading there.

What impressive feat did any vice Admiral have pre timeskip? None.

The point I made about Luffy keeping up with Enel is to prove he is not 'lightning fast'. If there was any doubt about Crocodile's speed I would indeed have said the same. But nobody here goes oh but Crocodile is the speed guy, but somehow they do about Enel. While he got hit by base Luffy and a giant golden ball. So If Luffy can keep up in base form with Enel. Crocodile is not that much slower than him as shown by both fights.

Enel doesn't need to be lighting fast when Crocodile can't hit him.

Don't talk about my post containing holes when you're post is like a blackhole that sucks all the logic out of it.

Sure it is.

 

[king madara]

Enel Melts crocodile. Enel wins.