3rd raikage vs MS sasuke

[Bronze]

All MS users shit on Raikage.

 

[LuckyMan]

Obito was in a very close speed battle with Minato somone who is much faster than Ei... KM Naruto couldn't land a touch on Obito as well... All Kakashi did was kick Obito back that doesn't mean he faster gtfoh... and Praise Hiruzen...

What the hell man. What part of Kamui is not movement and fight speeds do you not understand?

He engaged in CQC with Kakashi and was defeated fair and square. He couldn't avoid the Raikiri to the chest. That is clear Kakashi has slight better movements and fight speeds than he does.

He couldn't even dodge Narutos Rasengan blitz to his face. His mind saw him but his body couldn't react fast enough without his Kamui, same situation with Kakashi.

We have two pieces of evidence of Obito getting knocked around without Kamui against the people you say he's faster than.

 

[Beans2]

Ay is not the 3rd Raikage, so I don't get how you cam to that conclusion. You are either giving him basic intel which means no knowledge of something till proven, or you are giving him fan-fic intel. Either way, he won't be capable of stopping Amateratsu when it hits his body or head. He can only cover one part of himself, his head or body. No reason for me to think he can fight normally when his body (or head) is on fire. Ay was simply a better match-up for Sasuke either way.

If both had manga intel (which would mean no intel) then sasuke charges in with a chidori like he did against Ay and gets lolstomped by nukite

 

[Xlad]

I'm going with Sandaime Raikage.

- V1 isn't going

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.
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, which is a far more potent (barring elemental disadvantage) than Enton.

Sasuke dodged Ei due to precognition as there was a panel

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, indicating its use.

 

[Apêx1]

If both had manga intel (which would mean no intel) then sasuke charges in with a chidori like he did against Ay and gets lolstomped by nukite

Or he starts the fight with Amateratsu as this isn't absolute IC, and nor is any other Versus match-up. Versus debates don't incorporate "CT is only used as last resort, thus Nagato loses said scenario." Not to mention, Nukite is not hitting Sasuke when Sasuke dodged Ay's punch, and v1 Bee's attack. Unless you are suggesting the 3rd is faster, which will need some proof seeing how Dodai easily stopped him, then Sasuke will dodge, realise the potency of the 3rd's jutsu given its massive chakra concentration and take cover. Once he has, he fires an Amateratsu and the match is pretty much finished. Either way, Nukite goes through any MS Susano, even v4, so if Sandaime has a way to stop Ama, he stomps.

 

[KidGamer65]

So your denying his arm was up before hand?

All I'm saying is that he did not raise his arm to block Amaterasu.

Because once he see Sasuke rushes him he strikes with his linear attack and Sasuke dodges then proceed to manipulate enton on his face...
Sasuke dodges, Nukite, tries to touch him, and then the Raikage uses his other hand one shots him.
.

I showed scans they hit him before they were blitzed... More reflexive? There about the same in speed plus SM Naruto hasn't shown no better striking speed that MS Sasuke... What makes you think 3finger nukit can pierce a Susanoo?

This is sad. Do you see the Raikage move in that scan. OBVIOUSLY NOT. Lol. End of discussion.

No, they aren't. SM Naruto's reactions>MS Sasuke's reactions. Not even referring to striking speed here.

The fact it's much stronger than Chidori, Raikiri, or Ay's attacks, which already breached Ribcage.

Also like Apex said how would the 3rd Raikage even know what Amaterasu is let alone know where to accurately block?

Read OP, and OP's later posts in the thread.

 

[Beans2]

Or he starts the fight with Amateratsu as this isn't absolute IC, and nor is any other Versus match-up. Versus debates don't incorporate "CT is only used as last resort, thus Nagato loses said scenario." Not to mention, Nukite is not hitting Sasuke when Sasuke dodged Ay's punch, and v1 Bee's attack. Unless you are suggesting the 3rd is faster, which will need some proof seeing how Dodai easily stopped him, then Sasuke will dodge, realise the potency of the 3rd's jutsu given its massive chakra concentration and take cover. Once he has, he fires an Amateratsu and the match is pretty much finished. Either way, Nukite goes through any MS Susano, even v4, so if Sandaime has a way to stop Ama, he stomps.

The scenario I am trying to give here is that the Third Raikage replaces Ay in a fight that happened in canon, with the same location, intel, distance, everything. Apparently I wasn't clear enough so I edited the post to make it more obvious.

 

[Draphsin]

Or he starts the fight with Amateratsu as this isn't absolute IC, and nor is any other Versus match-up. Versus debates don't incorporate "CT is only used as last resort, thus Nagato loses said scenario."

Actually, a lot of vs debates go like that. If a mindset isn't specified then what reason is there for us to believe that they would do anything other than what they showed us in canon? The only thing you would really factor out is PIS.

That's why you never see two of the same people with the same conditions put together, because it would end the same way that it did in canon unless the mindsets were changed.

 

[Apêx1]

Actually, a lot of vs debates go like that. If a mindset isn't specified then what reason is there for us to believe that they would do anything other than what they showed us in canon? The only thing you would really factor out is PIS.

That's why you never see two of the same people with the same conditions put together, because it would end the same way that it did in canon unless the mindsets were changed.

Not anymore. At this point, if someone wants an absolute IC debate, he needs to specify it or it is simply a slightly IC debate. Either way, NB is not Narutoforums, so I don't see why you are trying to incorporate that way of thinking, or an early 2013 NB way of thinking. Times have changed, IC is specified or people don't consider what was shown, but rather anything at all. Hence CT starts the fight, TBB starts the fight, COFRS starts the fight, etc.

And no, it often happens that people put Madara vs Hashirama rematch. People don't debate it because canon wise, one of them already won, even if the other has potential to win when only considering feats and feats alone.

The scenario I am trying to give here is that the Third Raikage replaces Ay in a fight that happened in canon, with the same location, intel, distance, everything. Apparently I wasn't clear enough so I edited the post to make it more obvious.

I see, I thought you were trying to say same location and same Sasuke, not a scenario replication. Obviously, Sandaime shits. I don't see the point of the thread if Sasuke will fail his Chidori and die, since this is exactly what must happen in this scenario replication

 

[Draphsin]

Not anymore. At this point, if someone wants an absolute IC debate, he needs to specify it or it is simply a slightly IC debate.

If a mindset isn't specified then they would act how it was shown in the manga, because that's how they fight. If you want to change their way of thinking from an IC mindset then you'd need to specify. There's no such thing as an "absolute" IC debate. Unless their mindset is different from when they fought the battle in canon then the battle will end the same way.

Either way, NB is not Narutoforums, so I don't see why you are trying to incorporate that way of thinking, or an early 2013 NB way of thinking. Times have changed, IC is specified or people don't consider what was shown, but rather anything at all. Hence CT starts the fight, TBB starts the fight, COFRS starts the fight, etc.

I don't visit narutoforums & it's not an "early '13 way of thinking" either, it's simply common sense. If naruto starts off a battle spamming tbbs instead of rasengans without a reason for it then it would be out of character for him. Since naruto wouldn't normally fight like that then he isn't fighting like how the manga showed us he would.

And no, it often happens that people put Madara vs Hashirama rematch. People don't debate it because canon wise, one of them already won, even if the other has potential to win when only considering feats and feats alone.

My point is in the bold, based on the canon way these two fought hashi came out on top, they both have the feats to take eachother out but the manga gave us a winner based on how they fight.

Madara could've obliterated SS, why did he bother to charge the thing when he has multiple tbbs to rip it apart from a distance & PS slashes that could create their own shockwaves?

Madara's IC character failed against hashi, OOC madara would've fared better. Remember that we're coming up with the strategies & not the characters we're debating for, meaning they might not even think of the same things that we do & the manga shows us what they would do without our opinions.

 

[TRE MERCER]

What the hell man. What part of Kamui is not movement and fight speeds do you not understand?

He engaged in CQC with Kakashi and was defeated fair and square. He couldn't avoid the Raikiri to the chest. That is clear Kakashi has slight better movements and fight speeds than he does.

He couldn't even dodge Narutos Rasengan blitz to his face. His mind saw him but his body couldn't react fast enough without his Kamui, same situation with Kakashi.

We have two pieces of evidence of Obito getting knocked around without Kamui against the people you say he's faster than.

So why is Minato ftg counted as his speed? Actually if you read the Manga you would know Obito let himself get hit just to get rid of Madara seal you clown.(

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). Kakashi doesn't have better cqc skills seeing as Obito managed to catch someone on BM Naruto level in cqc... BM Naruto was already in the Kamui dimension therefore he caught Obito by surprise and that's not helping your case because on the 3rd Raikage seeing as SM Naruto was fast enough to dodge his attacks... Theres very few who could dodge a BM Naruto surprise blitz... Obito let Kakashi stab him and he didn't get knocked around all Kakashi did was kick him one time and that means he's better? Stop the the tom-foolery...

All I'm saying is that he did not raise his arm to block Amaterasu.

Yes he did i even showed you a scan of him lifting his elbow...

This is sad. Do you see the Raikage move in that scan. OBVIOUSLY NOT. Lol. End of discussion.

No, they aren't. SM Naruto's reactions>MS Sasuke's reactions. Not even referring to striking speed here.

The fact it's much stronger than Chidori, Raikiri, or Ay's attacks, which already breached Ribcage.



Read OP, and OP's later posts in the thread.

Maybe this scan will help you out.(

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). How? They both shown speeds to dodge v1 Raikages and im pretty sure Ei is much faster...

 

[KidGamer65]

Yes he did i even showed you a scan of him lifting his elbow...

You showed no such scan. He is depicted as perfectly still. How in the world would he even know to block Amaterasu when he didn't know it was being used until that panel with the exclamation above his head. Lol, combine that with the fact he has no reason to dodge, it's pretty obvious that he wasn't trying to block it. Give. It. Up.

Maybe this scan will help you out.(

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). How? They both shown speeds to dodge v1 Raikages and im pretty sure Ei is much faster...

Lol. Yes, Fodder managed to charge at him, after he was slowed down by several Doton Walls.

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And he still blitzed the shit out of them.

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"He took out Dozens of people in an instant"

V1 Ay is not any faster than the Third Raikage. Naruto's feat is superior. Sasuke dodged Ay's elbow, Naruto waited for the last possible moment, dodged Nukite (greater reach) and spun around the Raikage's attack and hit him in the arm. Sasuke only ducked.