All the hype from madara saying that hashi is the only one who can rival myself when you think about it hiruzen sealed hashi and tobirama at the same time leading us to believe that all the hype surrounding sarutobi was true. But then he contradicted himself with the statement about hashi and madara. By letting hashi and tobirama get sealed this implies that madara would be sealed as well by hiruzen because if hiruzen can defeat hashirama by sealing him than he should be able to seal madara as well someone who hashi has been said to defeat. This is why I say Kishi contradicts his own writing.
All the hype from madara saying that hashi is the only one who can rival myself when you think about it hiruzen sealed hashi and tobirama at the same time leading us to believe that all the hype surrounding sarutobi was true. But then he contradicted himself with the statement about hashi and madara. By letting hashi and tobirama get sealed this implies that madara would be sealed as well by hiruzen because if hiruzen can defeat hashirama by sealing him than he should be able to seal madara as well someone who hashi has been said to defeat. This is why I say Kishi contradicts his own writing.
Well your argument falls short on the fact that just because A>B and B>C doesn't mean A>C. (A=hiruzen, B=hashirama, and C=Madara). It only means hiruzen has a chance it doesn't guarantee victory. Gai beat kisame when Bee lost to a 30% clone does that mean gai is stronger then bee? Not at all.
Tobirama
We Know: Greatest Water Style User, S/T Jutsu etc
We See: Only Uses a giagantic water pistol and a genjutsu
Hashirama
We Know: Mokuton user with Wood Dragon that can stop Kurama, Wood Shield etc
We See: Only grows some trees
................... If an old Saru was strong enough to beat Oro+Tobirama+Hashira then why was a Middle aged Saru not able to beat Kurama which Hashirama did while fighting Madara+Kurama......... i personally think Oro was over cocky and didnt knew the full extent of their potential to use his puppets properly. But then again A-B-C logic is not applicable in a battle.
Tobirama
We Know: Greatest Water Style User, S/T Jutsu etc
We See: Only Uses a giagantic water pistol and a genjutsu
Hashirama
We Know: Mokuton user with Wood Dragon that can stop Kurama, Wood Shield etc
We See: Only grows some trees
................... If an old Saru was strong enough to beat Oro+Tobirama+Hashira then why was a Middle aged Saru not able to beat Kurama which Hashirama did while fighting Madara+Kurama......... i personally think Oro was over cocky and didnt knew the full extent of their potential to use his puppets properly. But then again A-B-C logic is not applicable in a battle.
Once again someone clearly did not read the post. The revived user can use any of his original techniques, just because jutsus are absent does not mean they could not use them. Hiruzen doesn't have the ability to control a Tailed beast he simply pushed it out of the village.
We have seen Hashirama in combat before against the 3rd hokage and according to the manga, he could use all of his abilities.
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.
Now I know what some of you people may be thinking, "Well orochimaru couldn't use edo tensei very well or Orochimaru didn't understand Hashirama's techniques." Well you are sadly wrong according to the manga. The manga states in the spoiler I posted above, that the revived can use all of their original abilities, that seal doesn't prevent those abilities from being used, and that orochimaru had complete mastery over edo tensei.
Some of you will still deny the truth even though the manga specifically states orochimaru mastered it and the revived user with the tailsmens embedded inside them could use all their original abilities.
Also some of you may say something ignorant like "Hashirama and Tobirama didn't utilize all their techniques, hashirama didn't use his almighty flower power and tobirama didn't use his S/T jutsu's." You guys are seriously the worst out of every fanboy on this site including the minato and itachi ones. Read this spoiler.
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Notice anything about it? It says 1999 by Masashi Kishimoto. You seriously believe Kishimoto had thought about every technique that the previous hokages can use in 1999? We heard about their newer techniques in 2011-2012 meaning 12-13 years after they were introduced they were thought of and put in the manga to hype them up.
Also some of you fanboys may say "Well their emotions were sealed so that made them weaker." Again you are wrong. Here naruto states
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in chapter 551 page 3 that Nagato was being completely controlled no emotions. Here
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in Naruto chapter 551 page 10 that even though he was under direct control and has no emotions like Hashirama and Tobirama, he was admittedly far superior to his original self and even killerbee states he was ridiculously strong. Some of you may argue "Well he absorbed gyuki chakra so that made him stronger. Again you are wrong, even though he had the chakra, that gave him the ability to walk not improve his ninja abilities. Here
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Kurama gives kakashi chakra. Here
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we see kakashi hasn't gotten a boost in strength or any ninja abilities. Therefore the chakra did not do anything to nagato but give him the power to walk again. The only time one gets an enhancement in abilities from bijuu chakra is when it takes a shroud over the user or acts as it did in naruto's kyuubi initial phase in part one.
With all that being said, Hashirama and Tobirama were at their prime(since they died young) and could utilize all their techniques during their only fight scene with Hiruzen. There is no way they were "incomplete" as the manga specifically states the revived even with the tailsmen inside them can use all their original techniques.
I thought that Nagato had just used Shinra Tensei to destroy Konoha prior to fighting Naruto, not only draining his chakra reserves, but shortening his life span?
I thought that Nagato had just used Shinra Tensei to destroy Konoha prior to fighting Naruto, not only draining his chakra reserves, but shortening his life span?
I'm surprised you know how to read since chapter 551 which I posted is in the 4th shinobi world war and did not take place in konoha. Oh well people can dream.
Where is the proof they toyed with him the whole fight. It was stated they were toying with him in the genjutsu not the entire fight. No proof to backup your claims so your just another fanboy. The hokages are puppets but can use all their original jutsus and were perfect according to kabuto.
Where is the proof they toyed with him the whole fight. It was stated they were toying with him in the genjutsu not the entire fight. No proof to backup your claims so your just another fanboy. The hokages are puppets but can use all their original jutsus and were perfect according to kabuto.
So I'm assuming Madara toying with the Kages has to be stated to? ~sigh~ this is sad man. Also.. puppets only do what their master tells them to do..... Kabuto controlled Muu at certain points.. and same with Nagato.
I can't take people serious who consider the Edos as living people.. especially when they don't have full control of themselves.
So I'm assuming Madara toying with the Kages has to be stated to? ~sigh~ this is sad man. Also.. puppets only do what their master tells them to do..... Kabuto controlled Muu at certain points.. and same with Nagato.
I can't take people serious who consider the Edos as living people.. especially when they don't have full control of themselves.
You said "I can't take people serious who consider the Edos as living people.. especially when they don't have full control of themselves." Edo's have never had full control of themselves that is what makes them edo's....
Anyways what you said doesn't refute anything here but only attributes my side of the debate. Taking things out of context is not intelligent whatsoever so I'm not surprised you can't take me serious since you don't even understand how to properly analyze a situation.
You said "I can't take people serious who consider the Edos as living people.. especially when they don't have full control of themselves." Edo's have never had full control of themselves that is what makes them edo's....
Anyways what you said doesn't refute anything here but only attributes my side of the debate. Taking things out of context is not intelligent whatsoever so I'm not surprised you can't take me serious since you don't even understand how to properly analyze a situation.
That is being taken out of context. The hokage's were toying with him in the genjutsu not the entire fight otherwise it would of been stated earlier.
I'm surprised you know how to read since chapter 551 which I posted is in the 4th shinobi world war and did not take place in konoha. Oh well people can dream.
"everything in text" Analyzing a situation means looking at the surroundings, the area itself, what is going on, what caused the situation, and what is being said. So to say they toyed with him the entire fight is taking that line out of context without proper analyzing because they were toying with him only in the genjutsu not the entire fight.
Definition of toying: flirt: playful behavior intended to arouse sexual interest.
I don't believe any playful behavior was going on do you?
"everything in text" Analyzing a situation means looking at the surroundings, the area itself, what is going on, what caused the situation, and what is being said. So to say they toyed with him the entire fight is taking that line out of context without proper analyzing because they were toying with him only in the genjutsu not the entire fight.
Definition of toying: flirt: playful behavior intended to arouse sexual interest.
I don't believe any playful behavior was going on do you?
and from site did you use for the legal definition? I'm gonna make an assumption you live in America so that mean you are going by the attorney generals definition.
... The point was.. Oro toyed with Hiruzen.... and made him commit suicide.