Thinking Kakashi can take itachi or sasuke (with logic, reason and evidence)

[Lt Fresh]

You make a good argument I like that. And I agree to some extent, depending on curtain circumstances ether ninja can win that battle.
-Kakashi has proven he would be able to fight Itachi on equal grounds, that should be common knowledge.

-The only thing that truly puts Kakashi at a disadvantage is Itachi's Sasuno'o because Kakashi knows how Tskuynomi works and probably work around it and Itachi's skill with the black fire is below avg so speed is Kakashi's plus.

 

[Mrmojo8484]

You make a good argument I like that. And I agree to some extent, depending on curtain circumstances ether ninja can win that battle.
-Kakashi has proven he would be able to fight Itachi on equal grounds, that should be common knowledge.

-The only thing that truly puts Kakashi at a disadvantage is Itachi's Sasuno'o because Kakashi knows how Tskuynomi works and probably work around it and Itachi's skill with the black fire is below avg so speed is Kakashi's plus.

thanks....also I agree.

 

[BlackBison]

Failed. 3 tomoe itachi can barely see 3 feet in front of him. Even kslashing figured out his was blind.

Kakashi stated that the ms destroyes the user sight and since Itachi been using this eye for a while kakashi said something along the lines of hom much have your vision deterioated. Also itachi is not blind just has really bad eyesight.

One more thing you people are forgetting.... Itachis power remained consistent from part 1 to part 2. Kakashis power, stamina and overall ability has greatly increased...even to the level of unlocking MS, a feat even few uchihas can do. Itachi doesn't even know this.

One thing I think you are forgetting is that Itachi has not once gone into battle trying to kill his opponent. In some ways Itachi is just like minato in the sense that he has had more screen time but we still haven't seen the two in all their essence yet and we never will. Itachi also happened to be the first real kage level villan(until we found out he was good) to be shown and he was shown practically anihilating his opponent without any trouble.

1. Don't make eye contact. This he knows now.

2. Watch his feet. He learned this from guy.

3. Create clones to confuse itachis already fading eyesight .

While a single one may not be enough, im sure using all 3 can nullify genjutsu.

1. This is something every shinobi knows and that hasn't stopped anyone. Also, itachi can cast genjustu only using his fingers so how will kakashi dodge that when he has to watch his fist to dodge his punches.

2. that is only something gai can do and if he tries to amaterastu to the face.

3. I think people forget that itachi can cast shadow clones to and might I add they explode.

 

[Destruction of Konoha]

Sorry but I think you are very wrong. Itachi has completely mastered the sharing an and all of its abilities that he has access to. Kakashi may be able to tie with a diseased itachi but definetley not prime itachi. Itachi has never really been pushed to his limits so we have never really seen his full power. As for sasuke, kakashi may have a better chance due to sasukes lack of experience or mastery of the sharingan but sasuke would still probably win. It has to be just the right time and day for ka ka sensei.

 

[DeViliShChild]

1. Don't make eye contact. This he knows now.

2. Watch his feet. He learned this from guy.

3. Create clones to confuse itachis already fading eyesight .


While a single one may not be enough, im sure using all 3 can nullify genjutsu.

1+2 = Hes not half as good as Guy with the feet technique, so this is still a MASSIVE disadvantage. How does he see anything above foot level like a fire jutsu?

3 = Fading eyesight? If you are talking about Itachi in the fight against Sasuke level of eyesight then yes i see your point


Anything short of that makes your point null because it isnt that big of a deal with ANY other Itachi.
Itachi vs Sasuke = Itachi at his absolute worse

 

[Mrmojo8484]

Kakashi stated that the ms destroyes the user sight and since Itachi been using this eye for a while kakashi said something along the lines of hom much have your vision deterioated. Also itachi is not blind just has really bad eyesight.I




One thing I think you are forgetting is that Itachi has not once gone into battle trying to kill his opponent. In some ways Itachi is just like minato in the sense that he has had more screen time but we still haven't seen the two in all their essence yet and we never will. Itachi also happened to be the first real kage level villan(until we found out he was good) to be shown and he was shown practically anihilating his opponent without any trouble.



1. This is something every shinobi knows and that hasn't stopped anyone. Also, itachi can cast genjustu only using his fingers so how will kakashi dodge that when he has to watch his fist to dodge his punches.

2. that is only something gai can do and if he tries to amaterastu to the face.

3. I think people forget that itachi can cast shadow clones to and might I add they explode.

First of all, to say that he isn't going blind, he just has bad vision is BS. We all know from the day you unlock MS, your bound to go blind.

Secondly, I hate that excuse....that he isn't going into battle try to kill. Who's fault is that? I could say the same for kakashi. He could have just kamui'ed kakuzu instead of using rakiri. That's your logic. To me that's just an excuse someone used to try to justify their point.

As I said, itachis power remained consistent, kakashi has gotten alot stronger.

Third, if guy can do it, kakashi, who has the sharingan to make it easier can do it as well. He has also been shown to use the first gate and primary lotus something only 2 ninja can currently do.

As for his exploding clones.....kakashi saw thru them once....im sure he can do it again.

 

[Mrmojo8484]

Sorry but I think you are very wrong. Itachi has completely mastered the sharing an and all of its abilities that he has access to. Kakashi may be able to tie with a diseased itachi but definetley not prime itachi. Itachi has never really been pushed to his limits so we have never really seen his full power. As for sasuke, kakashi may have a better chance due to sasukes lack of experience or mastery of the sharingan but sasuke would still probably win. It has to be just the right time and day for ka ka sensei.

Again with the full power thing....not my fault. Im basing this off what I see...not what could be possibilites. Besides, I could say the same for kakashi.

 

[Ngylle]

hmm hard to call but i believe itachi still>kakashi.

Now about sasuke, if sasuke starts spaming susano arrow foward kakashi, how many arrow will kakashi be able to outstand before the overspamin arrows ****s him?

 

[Sasuke1025]

1. I beg to differ. In the fight with Tobi, he used it 4 times(kunai, rasengan,clone, gedo mazo). Prior to this he fought 2 days straight in the ninja war using chakra with no rest. Who to say 100% kakashi can't use it 6-7 times.

2. Ever heard the saying defense wins games? They could certainly create an opening for kakashi.

3. Agreed 100% but keep 2 things in mind: thanks to guy, kakashi now knows not to look him in the eyes. He didn't at first. Secondly , as we saw with kakashi sending out the clone to get caught in genjutsu, in sure he has more tricks to avoid getting trapped in genjutsu.

4. He had no info and was unprepared. I'll give you that one though it's irrelevant to them fighting again.

Kakashi did know not to look in his eyes. He told kutenai n asuna this n only used his sharingan eye thinking it wouldn't work against his sharingan
So what it's not like he was fighting alone. He had a team tht help him n Naruto chakra cloak might have refilled his chakra and he didn't kamui gedo mazo tobi didn't let him

 

[tristan]

kakashi doesn't even need to go near as he can kamui itachi's neck off to another dimension.

First of all, don't come in here spewing nonsense like one word answers. Please have logic/reason of proof to counter my points. On to the thread.

Vs Itachi

Im going to break these 2 down in 2 catagories: first being strengths, second being why I think kakashi can pretty much counter itachi.

1.Ninjutsu- Tie- Aside from the obvious Uchiha moves like susanoo and amateratsu and kakashis kamui, I think these 2 are even here. While itachi may possess superior hand seal speed, kakashi has a much wider range of jutsu at his disposal.

2.Genjutsu- Itachi-obviously. However, if they had fought again, there is a reason why I think kakashi can nullify tsyukuomi. I'll explain it in part 2.

3.Taijutsu- Tie- While itachi has proven that his Taijutsu is a force to be reckoned with, I feel kakashis Taijutsu is severely underrated. I mean seriously...he fought Hidan with a kunai WHILE avoiding kakuzus masks.

4. Intellect-Tie- Both have proved to be the 2 most intellectual ninjas we have seen. I don't think either is smarter than the other. The winner of this fight needs something more. (Data book 3 backs up my first 4 points, so no arguing those.)

Here's why I think kakashi could win

When fighting most opponents, itachi likes to use first what he does best.....Genjutsu. While he incapacitated kakashi the first time with it, I don't think it would work on him again. The reason being: the same jutsu doesn't work twice on kakashi....he's too smart for that. He even told zabuza that and proved it to him. When kakashi fought the itachi clone in the anime, he distracted him and sent out a clone in his place which got caught in Genjutsu to no avail. I think this would work in a battle against the real itachi for 2 reasons: itachis fading eyesight and kakashis skill at making clones in combat. He even made a clone right in front of 2 paths of pain, a rinnegan user, and went completely undetected. Another notable comment to back my claim, chojis father even said kakashi always makes a clone toto test his opponents abilities first.

Kamui vs amateratsu/susanoo

I think kamui is an effective against both of these but I'll start with amateratsu. While the flames are deadly to anyone who comes in contact with it, I can gather one thing from this jutsus usage: it burns slowly. We've even seen 2 people use substitutions and one get his hand surgically removed before it caused any damage. Im pretty sure kakashi can kamui any fire that gets on him. We've seen his precise control over kamui in his fight against Tobi. The question is can he kamui amateratsu? If can kamui rasengans, lightning infused kunai and susanoos arrow , im sure he can kamui amateratsu.

We know that itachis susanoo boasts to weapons of legend: the yata mirror and the blade of totsuka. Since itachi incorporated them into his susanoo, I think it's safe to say they are the same composition...and you know what that means. If he kamui susanoo arrow, I sure he can use it on the objects or susanoo itself leaving itachi wide open for rakiri. Yata mirror isn't deflecting a t/s attack.

Final blow: kakashis rakiri. Itachi won't be able to dodge because of exhaustion and deteriorating eyesight. He can't counter this stronger faster version like he did sasukes. Not to mention kakashis has a good sharingan eye.

Thoughts?

 

[6pathofpain]

I agree with this thread, anyone who's saying itachi or sasuke will smash kakashi at this points just retarded and or being a fan boy. Itachi has the best chance of winning low difficulty, sasuke if he can win its gonna be high difficulty. Sasukes not that smart honestly

 

[tristan]

bottomline is, kakashi is doing major feats right now in this war and showing a vast improvement in his strength and chakra control...
he's a boss now...deal with it...

Kakashi did know not to look in his eyes. He told kutenai n asuna this n only used his sharingan eye thinking it wouldn't work against his sharingan
So what it's not like he was fighting alone. He had a team tht help him n Naruto chakra cloak might have refilled his chakra and he didn't kamui gedo mazo tobi didn't let him

 

[tristan]

did you forget what kakashi did the second time they met? he even bragged that any jutsu wouldn't work on him twice...and itachi applauded kakashi's skills...itachi fanboys should accept the fact that kakashi is doing something good at the moment...yes, he might not have naruto's almighty chakra reserve but....he got his intellects to make his battle short and cunning ability to beat each opponent...

Your reasoning about how Kakashi would avoid genjutsu is faulty and there fore has no credit. Thus still leaving the simple answer of Itachi wins by Tsyukuomi.

 

[Azrael160231a]

excellent post, i'm not sure the yata mirror and the blade of totsuka are necessarily the same composition as susanoo, also chakra may well play a key role for either side. he could probably defeat sasuke but you havent quite sold me on itachi yet. however this was well thought out and logically it makes sense. keep up the excellent work

 

[Tayhlor Uchiha]

just imagine how boss kakashi would be if he came from the senju or uchiha clan ?

 

[GracefulSerenity]

Sure he can. That's about as true as the so-called fact that one can be badass WITHOUT being an Uchiha, Senju, or Uzumaki or having a Sharingan, Rinnegan, or Bijuu. Note the sarcasm. -.-

 

[Microsword57]

Spoiler

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In Sasuke's case it was shown that Kakashi do not possess the speed feats to avoid the Susanoo Arrow. His "only option was to warp it with the Mangekyou." Sasuke could potentially use a consistent amount of Susanoo Arrows and in this case Kakashi being a Non-Uchiha has the disadvantage using Mangekyou attacks. While Sasuke using the EMS can use Mangekyou techs with less of a tole than a regular Uchiha with Mangekyou who would still have less of a tole on themselves performing such techs. Kakashi in this situation is locked in a Mangekyou battle until he dies.

Spoiler

I see that their are people with the notion that Kakashi could cause a diversion using his clones. The Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan gives the user the ability to see through clones. This conclusion can be made clearly based off Madara, a full developed Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan user's words here:

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He states that with his eye techniques he could see through Hashirama's Wood clones which are derived from shadow clones but are twice as complex requiring 2 Nature Transformations. It is a known fact that Madara obtained the Rinnegan after his battle with Hashirama and only possessed Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan.

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Sasuke puts up a better battle for Kakashi than Itachi. I have no clue why people are claiming Kakashi can beat Sasuke but "Might" beat Itachi. In my opinion he can not beat either yet.

Spoiler

While it is capable to Kamui the flames of Amaterasu I do not see it happening.
The flames of Amaterasu ignite on where the User is focusing his eyes.
Therefore I do not see Kakashi having the speed to catch the Flames as soon as they Ignite. If the flames are already on Kakashi I see no way for him to Kamui the flames without causing enormous self injury since his Kamui is different than Obito in terms of use.

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[Champ]

Nope Kakashi would get owned by either brother

 

[shadowcage]

First of all, don't come in here spewing nonsense like one word answers. Please have logic/reason of proof to counter my points. On to the thread.

Vs Itachi

Im going to break these 2 down in 2 catagories: first being strengths, second being why I think kakashi can pretty much counter itachi.

1.Ninjutsu- Tie- Aside from the obvious Uchiha moves like susanoo and amateratsu and kakashis kamui, I think these 2 are even here. While itachi may possess superior hand seal speed, kakashi has a much wider range of jutsu at his disposal.

2.Genjutsu- Itachi-obviously. However, if they had fought again, there is a reason why I think kakashi can nullify tsyukuomi. I'll explain it in part 2.

3.Taijutsu- Tie- While itachi has proven that his Taijutsu is a force to be reckoned with, I feel kakashis Taijutsu is severely underrated. I mean seriously...he fought Hidan with a kunai WHILE avoiding kakuzus masks.

4. Intellect-Tie- Both have proved to be the 2 most intellectual ninjas we have seen. I don't think either is smarter than the other. The winner of this fight needs something more. (Data book 3 backs up my first 4 points, so no arguing those.)

Here's why I think kakashi could win

When fighting most opponents, itachi likes to use first what he does best.....Genjutsu. While he incapacitated kakashi the first time with it, I don't think it would work on him again. The reason being: the same jutsu doesn't work twice on kakashi....he's too smart for that. He even told zabuza that and proved it to him. When kakashi fought the itachi clone in the anime, he distracted him and sent out a clone in his place which got caught in Genjutsu to no avail. I think this would work in a battle against the real itachi for 2 reasons: itachis fading eyesight and kakashis skill at making clones in combat. He even made a clone right in front of 2 paths of pain, a rinnegan user, and went completely undetected. Another notable comment to back my claim, chojis father even said kakashi always makes a clone toto test his opponents abilities first.

Kamui vs amateratsu/susanoo

I think kamui is an effective against both of these but I'll start with amateratsu. While the flames are deadly to anyone who comes in contact with it, I can gather one thing from this jutsus usage: it burns slowly. We've even seen 2 people use substitutions and one get his hand surgically removed before it caused any damage. Im pretty sure kakashi can kamui any fire that gets on him. We've seen his precise control over kamui in his fight against Tobi. The question is can he kamui amateratsu? If can kamui rasengans, lightning infused kunai and susanoos arrow , im sure he can kamui amateratsu.

We know that itachis susanoo boasts to weapons of legend: the yata mirror and the blade of totsuka. Since itachi incorporated them into his susanoo, I think it's safe to say they are the same composition...and you know what that means. If he kamui susanoo arrow, I sure he can use it on the objects or susanoo itself leaving itachi wide open for rakiri. Yata mirror isn't deflecting a t/s attack.

Final blow: kakashis rakiri. Itachi won't be able to dodge because of exhaustion and deteriorating eyesight. He can't counter this stronger faster version like he did sasukes. Not to mention kakashis has a good sharingan eye.

Thoughts?

I agree that the kakshi now can beat itachi but dont see him beating sasuke

 

[Lunir]

Well if you make the argument that kakashi can pretty much Kamui any attack, and then kamui off limbs/heads and how he can spam it as rapidly as he did against a Sasuke's Susano'o arrow, and finally as often as he has in the current Tobi encounter. Then Kakashi Can pretty much beat anyone, Kamui is heavily limited by plot but is stupidly broken and OP'd.