A detailed thread on why Nagato > Hashirama

[TobisPawn]

No the wood is actual matter and a physical thing it is not chakra that can be absorbed.

What does Nagato do against poison pollen, hmm? If you say absorb it I will :flaw:

Fly in the air and Shinra Tensei it (poison pollen)?


And no, the wood is chakra molded and its characteristics changed.

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"It entails the moulding and defining of one's chakra into an innate type of chakra nature, altering its properties and characteristics."

Just like Jiraiya's fireballs could be completely absorbed by Pain, Hashirama's wood can be absorbed by Nagato. There's no difference. Unless you're saying that the chakra should have been absorbed, but the fire should have stayed?

 

[Q of the Sharingan]

The wood is simply chakra in the form of wood. That's Nature Transformation. U_U All of the wood be absorbed, like Pain absorbing Jiraiya's fireballs completely.

And no, he absorbed Rasengan before it actually made contact with him.

No he combines wood and water natures to create life. He created the forest that the Hidden Leaf is in. If the wood was just chakra, it would disappear after he stops pumping chakra into it.

And he absorbed Jiraiya's rasengan after touching it here

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He is able to absorb chakra and things made of chakra, like fire, the oil made by Ma and Pa, lightning, and wind attacks. The wood uses chakra to grow but it is wood, chakra enhanced wood, but still wood.

 

[TobisPawn]

No he combines wood and water natures to create life. He created the forest that the Hidden Leaf is in. If the wood was just chakra, it would disappear after he stops pumping chakra into it.

And he absorbed Jiraiya's rasengan after touching it here

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He is able to absorb chakra and things made of chakra, like fire, the oil made by Ma and Pa, lightning, and wind attacks. The wood uses chakra to grow but it is wood, chakra enhanced wood, but still wood.

I see you don't know what Nature Transformation means...the wood is chakra.

 

[Nidaime Pupil]

I see you don't know what Nature Transformation means...the wood is chakra.

You cite the Wikia and he cites the manga. Shall I just go and edit the Wikia to agree with what im saying or should you just never cite the Wikia again?

 

[Q of the Sharingan]

I see you don't know what Nature Transformation means...the wood is chakra.

Why yes I do know what Nature Transformations are. My point is that the chakra is just a life source for the wood. Think of it is a large amount of energy that allows the wood to grow quickly. That is why mokuton is so special. It isn't simply combining earth and water natures, it creates LIFE. So yes, Nagato would be able to stop the growth of the wood by absorbing the chakra in it, but the wood would still be there.

 

[Nidaime Pupil]

Why yes I do know what Nature Transformations are. My point is that the chakra is just a life source for the wood. Think of it is a large amount of energy that allows the wood to grow quickly. That is why mokuton is so special. It isn't simply combining earth and water natures, it creates LIFE. So yes, Nagato would be able to stop the growth of the wood by absorbing the chakra in it, but the wood would still be there.

Agreed.

 

[Volcanikage]

Harishima wood is different is has Life in it because of his senju abilityn not only that his wood can fight like if it was a summon and fight with out him controling it

not only that you talk like nagato can spam his move A HUGE SHINRA TENSEU to stop the pollew forest jutsu it will work but ones his down he need time to get his shinra tensei ready

An his wood was strong enough to survive a 9 tails TBB an am sure TBB is almost equal or strongest than a shinra tensei

 

[Kira was Righteous]

Preta path>Mokuton

Closing his eyes and being a great sensor>bringer of darkness

 

[Dantee]

I agree Nagato is greater than Hashirama however you missed alot of points.

 

[Midday]

I made this post in the other Hashirama Nagato thread. It may be slightly out of context but I think the points are reasonable.

Spoiler

Nagato should be able to use his paths to back him up, I don't see why not since he can just summon them with animal path.

Petra path absorbs any ninjutsu backed up by the databooks. Mokuton is ninjutsu therefore it can be absorbed.

His mokuton would have a hard time restraining 9 boss summons. 1 he can't see and another splits everytime it's hit. Hashirama is also going to have a hard time restricting gedo maze which choji butterfly mode and his dad got easily overpowered, it also block the commanders earth sandwich technique with little difficulty.

Nagato can also heal from any attack with Nakara path.

Making a forest to escape chibaki tensei wouldn't work. The forest would just be absorbed into it, he would need to destroy the core since it's a gravity technique.

Chibaki tensei is this big

Spoiler

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Whilst the biggest mokuton forest we've seen looks smaller to me.

Spoiler

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Harishima wood is different is has Life in it because of his senju abilityn not only that his wood can fight like if it was a summon and fight with out him controling it

not only that you talk like nagato can spam his move A HUGE SHINRA TENSEU to stop the pollew forest jutsu it will work but ones his down he need time to get his shinra tensei ready

An his wood was strong enough to survive a 9 tails TBB an am sure TBB is almost equal or strongest than a shinra tensei

Shinra tensei only has a 5 second inteval for deva path and he doesn't even know that there's an interval.

Hashirama blocking tbb was from filler, or should we add Nagato's using shadow clones from a filler.

 

[TobisPawn]

No he combines wood and water natures to create life. He created the forest that the Hidden Leaf is in. If the wood was just chakra, it would disappear after he stops pumping chakra into it.

And he absorbed Jiraiya's rasengan after touching it here

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He is able to absorb chakra and things made of chakra, like fire, the oil made by Ma and Pa, lightning, and wind attacks. The wood uses chakra to grow but it is wood, chakra enhanced wood, but still wood.

Ok, you got me. xd

But Nagato can still stop its growth, rendering it useless.

 

[Stark]

Hashirama for the win

 

[TobisPawn]

READ THIS POST, EVERYONE

So apparently the general consensus is that Preta Path can at best only stop the wood's growth. So there still isn't much of an issue here. Nagato can stop any wood coming in at him, and/or Deva Path and Asura Path it. Or he can use Katon on it, after stopping its growth. Hell, if you believe that Preta Path can't do anything to Mokuton, Nagato can use Deva + Asura Path combinations to eradicate it. And/or he can fly in the air to avoid Mokuton, and spam attacks from there.

So again, not much of an issue here.

 

[tazze019]

+ rep.....

 

[TobisPawn]

+ rep.....

Thanks.

 

[TheSages456]

READ THIS POST, EVERYONE

So apparently the general consensus is that Preta Path can at best only stop the wood's growth. So there still isn't much of an issue here. Nagato can stop any wood coming in at him, and/or Deva Path and Asura Path it. Or he can use Katon on it, after stopping its growth. Hell, if you believe that Preta Path can't do anything to Mokuton, Nagato can use Deva + Asura Path combinations to eradicate it. And/or he can fly in the air to avoid Mokuton, and spam attacks from there.

So again, not much of an issue here.

hashirama would just pump more chakra into the wood. the wood would be coming at nagato very fast so he would have no time to place his hands on it. if nagato just stands there waiting for the wood to come at him to absorb it then he will die because it will crush him plus he wouldnt have time to absorb the chakra in it.

 

[TobisPawn]

hashirama would just pump more chakra into the wood. the wood would be coming at nagato very fast so he would have no time to place his hands on it. if nagato just stands there waiting for the wood to come at him to absorb it then he will die because it will crush him plus he wouldnt have time to absorb the chakra in it.

He doesn't have to necessarily use Preta Path on it. He can use a massive Shinra Tensei (

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) to send it all flying away from him, giving him time to fly up in the air. From there, he can use Katon attacks, Deva Path attacks, and Asura Path attacks to pit Hashirama onto a defense which he can't keep up forever (ST blowing wood away, missiles blowing it up, fire burning it). Or he can use Chibaku Tensei to make Hashirama lose his footing and be sent flying to its center, and/or barrage Hashirama with summons, while staying safe from any Mokuton by levitating high up in the air.

Or when in the air, Nagato can use Bansho Ten'in on Hashirama and impale him. And Gedo Mazo can be a last resort, though I'm not sure if the Bijuus should be included inside it for the sake of the debate.

 

[Enchanted Champion]

Nagato would Solo Hashirama high difficulty. Rinnegan is on a much high level then wood. He has no answer for Planetary devastation.

+Rep

 

[TheSages456]

He doesn't have to necessarily use Preta Path on it. He can use a massive Shinra Tensei (

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) to send it all flying away from him, giving him time to fly up in the air. From there, he can use Katon attacks, Deva Path attacks, and Asura Path attacks to pit Hashirama onto a defense which he can't keep up forever (ST blowing wood away, missiles blowing it up, fire burning it). Or he can use Chibaku Tensei to make Hashirama lose his footing and be sent flying to its center, and/or barrage Hashirama with summons, while staying safe from any Mokuton by levitating high up in the air.

Or when in the air, Nagato can use Bansho Ten'in on Hashirama and impale him. And Gedo Mazo can be a last resort, though I'm not sure if the Bijuus should be included inside it for the sake of the debate.

true this could work. i have never seen nagato use any katons though. i dont agree with the part about chibaku tensei, bansho tenin and gedo mazo.

 

[TobisPawn]

true this could work. i have never seen nagato use any katons though. i dont agree with the part about chibaku tensei, bansho tenin and gedo mazo.

It was stated that he mastered all elemental transformations, so I'd assume he's pretty good with Katon.

And what do you disagree with on Chibaku Tensei, Bansho Ten'in, and Gedo Mazo? Given that Gedo Mazo without Bijuus would impale Nagato. I dunno whether the Bijuus should be included in it for the debate.

For Chibaku Tensei, I don't see Hashirama getting a counter for it. He can grow Mokuton through it and crush it, but Nagato can stop him from forming the handsigns using Bansho Ten'in, Shinra Tensei, or any other attack. Or Nagato can attack him in the confusion of Chibaku Tensei being destroyed (shared vision through summons).