Hiruzen Sarutobi: "The GOD of shinobi" arguments

[MickNerks]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

Are you intentionally trying to sound ignore.Hiruzen made know every jutsu in the leaf, but he can do them, so it doesn't matter.Ninja Storm is a videogames, so there isn't anything in that game that factually relates to the manga.Like I have said in previous discussion on this topic, the manga is full of contradictions, and many things that were consider facts early on in the series has been discredited with new information.

No, u misunderstanding what i said.. i know the vidoe game isnt credible thats why we CANT use it to show the power of hashirama, and i already said that he knows all the jutsu but that doesnt mean he can use them..

I smell something, but what is it? Oh I know....a complete lack of logic in this post.

So Hiruzen's stronger because he's the god of shinobi right? Yes that's great logic at its finest :|

Manga scan please? Last time I checked Hiruzen knows about every existing jutsu of the leaf, not EVERY single jutsu in the history of the leaf. That's what the viz scans say.

You completely lost your credibility with me when you brought up the Ninja Storm Generations Video. That's NON CANON meaning it has zero relevance with the manga.



The manga states a lot of things that aren't true. People seem to want to believe that Kishi's a God and he doesn't make mistakes. The fact is he's contradicted himself several times in this manga.

By your logic Itachi's invincible, amaterasu can't be avoided, Minato strength is unparalleled, Minato himself is an unparalleled shinobi, amaterasu is as hot as the sun, Tobi is Madara, Tobi didn't summon the kyuubi to attack the leaf village, and etc. Since Kishi's word is law then none of these can be refuted by your logic.

It seems some people have never heard of contradictions or hyperbole.

WOOOOOWWWW... once again i was using the video game to show that we cant use that to show hash true strength because its not manga.

"By your logic Itachi's invincible, amaterasu can't be avoided, Minato strength is unparalleled, Minato himself is an unparalleled shinobi, amaterasu is as hot as the sun, Tobi is Madara, Tobi didn't summon the kyuubi to attack the leaf village, and etc. Since Kishi's word is law then none of these can be refuted by your logic."

^this is Bull S#!t, I never said any of this...

 

[-Vegeta-]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

No, u misunderstanding what i said.. i know the vidoe game isnt credible thats why we CANT use it to show the power of hashirama, and i already said that he knows all the jutsu but that doesnt mean he can use them..



WOOOOOWWWW... once again i was using the video game to show that we cant use that to show hash true strength because its not manga.

"By your logic Itachi's invincible, amaterasu can't be avoided, Minato strength is unparalleled, Minato himself is an unparalleled shinobi, amaterasu is as hot as the sun, Tobi is Madara, Tobi didn't summon the kyuubi to attack the leaf village, and etc. Since Kishi's word is law then none of these can be refuted by your logic."

^this is Bull S#!t, I never said any of this...

/facepalm

It wasn't directed towards you. I was quoting Ryuu.

 

[Ryuu..]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

sorry got my time frames mixed up. when hiruzen shows feats that put him on par with hashirama then hirzen could be>hashirama. orochimaru said if hiruzen was only 10 years younger he couldve beaten him. what was this god mode hiruzen doing during the nine tails attack, crying for minato.

53 years old is not his prime. He was still past it when the Kyuubi attacked. But now, you bring up the Orochimaru part. Orochimaru who perfected Edo Tensei. So here we have an Orochimaru who claims a 59 year old Hiruzen could defeat him and his Edo Tensei. Is it just me or is this improving Hiruzen's image? Thanks for bringing it up

/facepalm

It wasn't directed towards you. I was quoting Ryuu.

'Hiruzen was the strongest Hokage'. What is so absurd and unbelievable about that quote (in comparison to the things you brought up)?

 

[MickNerks]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

sorry got my time frames mixed up. when hiruzen shows feats that put him on par with hashirama then hirzen could be>hashirama. orochimaru said if hiruzen was only 10 years younger he couldve beaten him. what was this god mode hiruzen doing during the nine tails attack, crying for minato.

I think u miss the part when naruto's mom put the barrier up so that no one could help.. and before that he pushed the nine-tails out of the villiage with his rod..

/facepalm

It wasn't directed towards you. I was quoting Ryuu.

Mybad...:sy: sounded like it was directed toward me..

 

[0moi]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

....yea this thread has completelt changed....goodbye

 

[-Vegeta-]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

53 years old is not his prime. He was still past it when the Kyuubi attacked. But now, you bring up the Orochimaru part. Orochimaru who perfected Edo Tensei. So here we have an Orochimaru who claims a 59 year old Hiruzen could defeat him and his Edo Tensei. Is it just me or is this improving Hiruzen's image? Thanks for bringing it up



'Hiruzen was the strongest Hokage'. What is so absurd and unbelievable about that quote (in comparison to the things you brought up)?

Where did I ever say it's absurd to believe that? I made that point because it simply proves how fallible character statements can be, which is why people need to stop taking hype so seriously.

Kishi isn't a God like many of you believe. He's human just like the rest of us, which means he's prone to make mistakes just like we all are.

 

[MickNerks]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

Now I know you are serious being stupid.Let me explain this in a way even someone like you might understand.

Information on The Sage Of The Six Paths

He had the Rinnegan. See abilities of Rinnegan.
He defeat the combine power of all nine tail beast, the ten tails.
He created all ninjutsu
He created the Moon
He could used all nature elements
Creation of All Things jutsu
He was the source of Both the Uchiha and The Senju Clan

These things aren't rumors or legend, but facts.We know he exist from the memories of all the tail beast.We know he had creation of all things jutsu, a jutsu which allow him to create something out of nothing , from the tail beast.We know he had the rinnegan from Madara. Tobi, and Kabuto's research and knowledge.All the jutsus,abilities, and history of the sage of the six paths has been confirmed, which is how we can assess his power.Which is why anyone would say the sage is stronger than all shinobi.So I don't get why would you asked such a stupid question of what's the different between The Sage and Hiruzen, when it's so clear that there isn't anything we know about Hiruzen that makes him overpowering.The jutsu we have seen from Hiruzen aren't anything compare to what we have seen of Hashirama jutsus.

And Hiruzen beating a Edo Hashirama who didn't use any of his most powerful techniques isn't much of a accomplishment.

Your making your self look stupid, the same way you say the tailed beast remimber him and the existence is proof that he he creation of all things works with hiruzen as well. Iruka and orochimaru and part 1 kabuto says that hiruzen was the strongest hokage. EVEN THE ****ING DATA BOOK SAYS HE'S THE STRONGEST:flaw:.. how can you argue that. Its been confirmed in the manga, so how can you deny he's not as strong as hashirama.. The tailed beast never said he created the moon or that he could use all nature elements, you heard it from someone who wasnt there at the time, yet we still all believe it.. Sama works with Hiruzen..

 

[0moi]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

SO6P is the Shinobi GOD period

 

[TheSages456]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

53 years old is not his prime. He was still past it when the Kyuubi attacked. But now, you bring up the Orochimaru part. Orochimaru who perfected Edo Tensei. So here we have an Orochimaru who claims a 59 year old Hiruzen could defeat him and his Edo Tensei. Is it just me or is this improving Hiruzen's image? Thanks for bringing it up

yeah and hashirama and tobirama were definitely nerfed. hashirama didnt use the flower tree world in that fight or mokuton clones. tobirama didnt use spacetime ninjutsu. hashirama and tobirama were nerfed. if flower tree world was used hiruzen wouldve been dead as he has no counter to it.

 

[GodaimeRaikage]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

53 years old is not his prime. He was still past it when the Kyuubi attacked. But now, you bring up the Orochimaru part. Orochimaru who perfected Edo Tensei. So here we have an Orochimaru who claims a 59 year old Hiruzen could defeat him and his Edo Tensei. Is it just me or is this improving Hiruzen's image? Thanks for bringing it up



'Hiruzen was the strongest Hokage'. What is so absurd and unbelievable about that quote (in comparison to the things you brought up)?

Orochimaru didn't perfect Edo Tensei.You have to look no further to Kabuto's Edos compare to Orochimaru's Edos to know that Orochimaru's Edos were nowhere near perfect.And what Orochimaru said might improve his image in your mind, but 59 year old Hiruzen not being able to do much against the nine tails, a beast Hashirama could defeat alone, doesn't bold well in my book.

I think u miss the part when naruto's mom put the barrier up so that no one could help.. and before that he pushed the nine-tails out of the villiage with his rod..

Was that before or after the Kurama fire a tail beast bomb at the village that Minato had to teleport out of the village before it was destroyed?

 

[MickNerks]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

SO6P is the Shinobi GOD period

so6p is SHINOBI GOD
hiruzen is just GOD OF SHINOBI.lol:scorps:

 

[Ryuu..]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

Where did I ever say it's absurd to believe that? I made that point because it simply proves how fallible character statements can be, which is why people need to stop taking hype so seriously.

Ok you said some stuff about 'Amaterasu being as hot as the sun', although we all know certain physics laws are not followed in manga.

You also said, for example, 'Tobi is Madara, Madara is Tobi etc'. Now, I will, I promise, accept Hashirama to be stronger if the manga states that at any moment. The story has changed interms of Tobi's identity. There is no evidence that the story has changed interms of who the strongest Hokage is. I'm not saying Kishi hasn't changed his mind interms of the story, i'm saying no-one can give me evidence for this, so it's irrelevant to me. No evidence whatsoever. My point is, it hasn't said that Hashirama was the strongest Hokage, and people are using some nonsense pages as evidence. It was so clear when it was said about Hiruzen. People interpret things about characters differently (i.e. Minato is unsurpassable). How else can you interpret what was said about Hiruzen?

Until that day that it clearly says Hashirama was the strongest, I'm not accepting any other view. If people can find me a manga page which proves this then i'll accept it, but they can't because thus far it doesn't exist. Last post for now, going off.

 

[TheSages456]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

I think u miss the part when naruto's mom put the barrier up so that no one could help.. and before that he pushed the nine-tails out of the villiage with his rod..



Mybad...:sy: sounded like it was directed toward me..

so pushing the kyuubi out of the village=beating the kyuubi:sy:
anyhow the fact is that hiruzen couldnt handle the kyuubi by himself and was hoping for minatos appearance.

 

[Ryuu..]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

Orochimaru didn't perfect Edo Tensei.You have to look no further to Kabuto's Edos compare to Orochimaru's Edos to know that Orochimaru's Edos were nowhere near perfect.And what Orochimaru said might improve his image in your mind, but 59 year old Hiruzen not being able to do much against the nine tails, a beast Hashirama could defeat alone, doesn't bold well in my book.



Was that before or after the Kurama fire a tail beast bomb at the village that Minato had to teleport out of the village before it was destroyed?

He perfected it. It was part 1 power levels which made them seem nerfed.

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About the Kyuubi, that's just a perfect example of abilties suiting different things. Hashirama's Moktuon happened to supress it, giving him an almighty advantage. Has nothing to do with Hashirama > Hiruzen.

 

[MickNerks]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

Orochimaru didn't perfect Edo Tensei.You have to look no further to Kabuto's Edos compare to Orochimaru's Edos to know that Orochimaru's Edos were nowhere near perfect.And what Orochimaru said might improve his image in your mind, but 59 year old Hiruzen not being able to do much against the nine tails, a beast Hashirama could defeat alone, doesn't bold well in my book.

You dont know what hiruzen could do to 9tails cause we never seen him in prime.

Was that before or after the Kurama fire a tail beast bomb at the village that Minato had to teleport out of the village before it was destroyed?

hahaha b4..

 

[-Vegeta-]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

Ok you said some stuff about 'Amaterasu being as hot as the sun', although we all know certain physics laws are not followed in manga.

You also said, for example, 'Tobi is Madara, Madara is Tobi etc'. Now, I will, I promise, accept Hashirama to be stronger if the manga states that at any moment. The story has changed interms of Tobi's identity. There is no evidence that the story has changed interms of who the strongest Hokage is. I'm not saying Kishi hasn't changed his mind interms of the story, i'm saying no-one can give me evidence for this, so it's irrelevant to me. No evidence whatsoever. My point is, it hasn't said that, and people are using some nonsense pages as evidence. It was so clear when it was said about Hiruzen. People interpret things about characters differently (i.e. Minato is unsurpassable). How else can you interpret what was said about Hiruzen.

Until that day that it clearly says Hashirama was the strongest, I'm not accepting any other view. If people can find me a manga page which proves this then i'll accept it, but they can't because thus far it doesn't exist. Last post for now, going off.

I use common sense over character statements that are rather fallible. I've already shown you several examples of that. Based on the jutsu and feats Hashirama has Hiruzen can't compare to him, which is why Hiruzen fans like yourself resort to hype because you know that. By hype Minato's stronger than edo Madara, but do you and others believe that? Hell no. Neither do I lol.

The databook also says kamui can't be avoided, so is that true? I'd guarantee you'd say no.

You're free to believe what you want, but Hashirama>Hiruzen IMO. That's not changing unless we eventually see prime Hiruzen and he shows me something to change my mind.

 

[MickNerks]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

so pushing the kyuubi out of the village=beating the kyuubi:sy:
anyhow the fact is that hiruzen couldnt handle the kyuubi by himself and was hoping for minatos appearance.

It helped alittle, but he was still old man.. but you are still right at that time hiruzen couldnt handle 9tails by himself..:shrug:

 

[Akatsuki wise guy]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

hiruzen is just hype many characters would stomp on him currently.

 

[BasedBijuu]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

1st hokage was able to tame the nine tails while the 3rd hokage was able to watch the nine tails destroy his village. Is this really a debate?

 

[TouchMyMangos]

Re: Hiruzen Sarutobi: The GOD shinobi Vote!!!!

Hiruzen was the strongest.