Hiruzen> minato and here is why (READ first)

[maiavarepz]

every jutsu derived from one source, and so, what i think is that when the jutsu lets say evolved (even though i do not believe in evolution) it is just going back to the previous one it descended from.....meaning, that if the third was tobiramas student, then tobirama, at some point would have written, or told hiruzen what the jutsu was compiled from..... my guess is that tobirama could teleport anywhere, without seals, but not very far.....(theory) hiruzen judged minato worthy of using the technique which allowed minato to make adjustments and so minato thought of using seals....this helped alot with his title as the yellow flash

 

[abeluchiha]

NO WAY!!!! all jutsu is not enough.....you need speed and awesoness....no way he cud defeate tobi!!!

 

[iknowwhotobiis]

ALL jutsus include bloodline limits and hidden you dumba$$....do you not know what ALL means???

excuse me?! It has been stated by iruka that he knows all existing jutsus hence the title of the professor. (This title has also been stated in the databook as well, which reinforces iruka´s point). However, we can assume that Iruka is obvisouly not including jutsus that require bloodline limit or are hiden. How can I make it more clear for you to understand?

 

[GodaimeRaikage]

ALL jutsus include bloodline limits and hidden you dumba$$....do you not know what ALL means???

Of course he knows what all means...

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It's this, right?

 

[iknowwhotobiis]

you idiot all existing jutsus in konoha means the jutsus in the scroll which mizuki stole and from where naruto learnt kage bunshin, and all existing jutsu in that scroll was mastered by him and written by hashirama.....

souce?

 

[choft]

OK OP, I want you to answer this question.

First, read the bottom left panel of the scan:

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Please read the part that says "weilds space time techniques that exceeds both the second's and my own."

FTG is a space time technique. If Hiruzen had it, why didn't Minato say "second, third, and mine?"

Please answer this since you're the one banging on about manga facts.

 

[iknowwhotobiis]

every jutsu derived from one source, and so, what i think is that when the jutsu lets say evolved (even though i do not believe in evolution) it is just going back to the previous one it descended from.....meaning, that if the third was tobiramas student, then tobirama, at some point would have written, or told hiruzen what the jutsu was compiled from..... my guess is that tobirama could teleport anywhere, without seals, but not very far.....(theory) hiruzen judged minato worthy of using the technique which allowed minato to make adjustments and so minato thought of using seals....this helped alot with his title as the yellow flash

Ok so since tobirama was hiruzen sensei, he might indeed know FTG or a weaker version?!

 

[Zohka Uchiha]

I think that what is said about the Hiruzen is when he was at his prime, he new about all the jutsus, it is not stated in the manga that he could preform them! I do not belive him a ftg user. the only reason Minato could learn it was because of Kusina i thing! She was the one who learned Minato seals like the ftg and the deamon seals (dont remember) so can we then call those two village techs?

 

[-Vegeta-]

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Now

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I am just using manga facts here, hiruzen was called the professor who knew all existing jutsus. FTG IS an existing jutsu. SO yeah hiruzen knows it...

Have you ever heard of hyperbole? Him knowing all the jutsu in Konoha would mean he knows Susanoo, amaterasu, tsukuyomi, chidori, rasengan, shadow possession jutsu, and etc. That's impossible because some of them are kkg.

Your logic is terrible.

 

[toczik14]

dude the term "he knows and could use every jutsu" was used metaphorically meaning he knows how every jutsu in konoha works and he could use almost every basic jutsu excluding bloodline limits and hidden techniques...am sure hiruzen was very sharp in his prime and could easily learn a jutsu which isnt bloodline limit or hidden technique

 

[~Naruto&Itachi~]

excuse me?! It has been stated by iruka that he knows all existing jutsus hence the title of the professor. (This title has also been stated in the databook as well, which reinforces iruka´s point). However, we can assume that Iruka is obvisouly not including jutsus that require bloodline limit or are hiden. How can I make it more clear for you to understand?

I am not gonna argue why you shouldnt assume dumb things.....but than why didn't 3rd just use rasengan?

 

[iknowwhotobiis]

OK OP, I want you to answer this question.

First, read the bottom left panel of the scan:

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Please read the part that says "weilds space time techniques that exceeds both the second's and my own."

FTG is a space time technique. If Hiruzen had it, why didn't Minato say "second, third, and mine?"

Please answer this since you're the one banging on about manga facts.

finally a serious response, I did forget about that panel. That might prove that hiruzen might not know FTG. Thank you for not trolling.

I know it will sound ridiculous for saying this but perhaps he didnt mention hiruzen because he was not the greatest at S/T. My support is that he didnt mention his special guards as well because they were obviously less skilled than minato (Same as hiruzen).

However, that is highly unlikely. So i guess you might be right.

I think that what is said about the Hiruzen is when he was at his prime, he new about all the jutsus, it is not stated in the manga that he could preform them! I do not belive him a ftg user. the only reason Minato could learn it was because of Kusina i thing! She was the one who learned Minato seals like the ftg and the deamon seals (dont remember) so can we then call those two village techs?

good point. thank you!

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Now

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Read the previous posts before posting. I would appreciate.

 

[choft]

finally a serious response, I did forget about that panel. That might prove that hiruzen might not know FTG. Thank you for not trolling.

I know it will sound ridiculous for saying this but perhaps he didnt mention hiruzen because he was not the greatest at S/T. My support is that he didnt mention his special guards as well because they were obviously less skilled than minato (Same as hiruzen).

However, that is highly unlikely. So i guess you might be right.

Finally, you are changing your mind. And all my other responses are serious too. So whilst this has got you thinking, also think about my other question too:

"Why didn't he use it against Orochimaru?", and please don't use the argument "no preparation time". Do you really think Hiruzen is that careless?

 

[naruttebayo]

It has been stated in the manga that hiruzen knew all existing jutsus in konoha. If I am not mistaken, that also includes the FTG and here is why.

Most of you will say no because Minato was dead at that time. That is not sufficient because minato special guards knew FTG as well and they are ALIVE during the thid time, which means that FTG is an EXISTING jutsu in konoha.

So since hiruzen knows FTG, he is stronger than minato. THoughts?!

knowing ftg is not enough you must also have lightning fast reflexes to counter something
like A's fastest punch

 

[iknowwhotobiis]

Finally, you are changing your mind. And all my other responses are serious too. So whilst this has got you thinking, also think about my other question too:

"Why didn't he use it against Orochimaru?", and please don't use the argument "no preparation time". Do you really think Hiruzen is that careless?

Well, it is not about being careless.

May be he knows FTG but he might not be able to perform it as fast as minato so it is not reliable in a real fight scenario?!

knowing ftg is not enough you must also have lightning fast reflexes to counter something
like A's fastest punch

You sir are correct. I think my mistake in this thread was to say hiruzen > minato ( i just threw that out to troll a bit). Yes that might be the reason why he cannot use in a real fight.

 

[Caliburn]

Spoiler

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As you said, it's always the best to use common sense and manga facts, so why don't you follow your own advice? This panel clearly states that they learned the FTG from Minato. Thus in the end it all comes down to only Minato knowing the FTG (as he was their teacher), thus it can not be qualified as a 'Konoha jutsu' and thus your statement is wrong, or in the least it's nothing more than speculation with no basis, as that's the only argument you had for your theory that Hiruzen knew FTG.

~closed as it's full of spam and flame, with reason, and there is nothing to discuss anymore.