General Football Debates!

[Michael92]

I'm sure, there were already high-profile clashes like this one in this season but I'm not good with dates I'm too lazy to go and compare weekly fixtures.

Let's just say that it's gonna be a rocking week.

Okay, you stubborn you You're just mad Man U isn't in one of the matches

 

[ReLax -]

Wait O_O

No internet and no football! What country is that? Tell me so that I can never visit it. U_U

I'll try to post updates for y'a as soon as possible. And there I thought what was happening to you and why there was no updates on this thread.

Pakistan lol electricity here goes every hour a pain. I was in Italy for a bit had connection there, but than had to come here for some wedding and a visit since I haven't been to my country for 18 yrs now lol

 

[ReLax -]

If Barca reach final, they will win, but again anything is possible in football also Chelsea lost Alex lol

At this time HT its 1-0 Bayern VS Madrid. Ribery scored.

 

[Grim]

I almost lost my voice after bayern Winner by Gomez on 90th min... not a fan but ...Barca supporter said enough

 

[Escorpiius]

Okay, you stubborn you You're just mad Man U isn't in one of the matches

Not really. I've already got that over. I'm fully with United in their EPL fight but still, I'm also keenly seeing CL fixtures.

Also, if we go by TV views, City and United's EPL matches will still get more views worldwide than the Europa Leagues matches. So why get mad? xd

Europa League's level has increased but its popularity and interest is still not in par with Big leagues matches.

I almost lost my voice after bayern Winner by Gomez on 90th min... not a fan but ...Barca supporter said enough

Lol. Was a great and intense match though.

I was right though. Madrid weren't outclassed since their strategy worked pretty well till the 90th minute and they did score the Away goal they wanted.

However, Bayern did a much better match than what I expected. They really seem to hold the Final dear to their heart and gave it their all. Apart from the Final being at Allianz Arena, they got further fueled by their defeat against Dortmund in Bundesliga.

The Away match will be damn interesting with the roles that are going to be inverse. Madrid will be the Attacking team and Bayern will counter.

It wouldn't surprise me if we see Extra-Time in the Return fixture.

Two things though concerning Madrid:

1. I remember pointing it out earlier in this thread - it's the constant bad habit of Madrid to concede the Opener. Sure, it was a 1st time in CL this year but it's a common flaw in Liga. Once more, they put their match in jeopardy b conceding that early goal. They should be careful. A repeat of that at Bernabeu and CL glory might fade for another year.

2. While they defended pretty well against the field play of Bayern, they were too often in difficulties in Spot-Kicks (Corners and Free-kicks). It's mostly their difficulty in clearing the ball. Which proved fatal with the 1st goal. The same issue was pretty recurrent throughout the match; though mattered less.

 

[Escorpiius]

Analysis: Barcelona v/s Chelsea

First of all, I'm damn proud that Chelsea pulled off their 1-0. They fought with all their heart in British-style. There are so many factors and style in football but I'll say it:

No victory is sweeter than the one you clinched with your heart, sweat and determination.

Barcelona obviously dominated the match. More chances (with 2 on the post and some exceptional saves) & more possession. But Chelsea scored on their sole shot on target. A 1-0 victory is pretty interesting for Chelsea. If it wasn't Barcelona against them, I would have placed them as favorites for the Return match.

One interesting occurrence in the match: The Blues' goal was scored after Messi lost a ball. Now that's something rare....

This match was very intense one but completely opposite to the Bayern/Madrid one. Bayern/Madrid match was an intense match with lots of offensive intents while this one was intense in terms of the mental concentration and physicality. Two awesome semis though - very dignified of Champions League.

 

[Michael92]

Analysis: Barcelona v/s Chelsea

First of all, I'm damn proud that Chelsea pulled off their 1-0. They fought with all their heart in British-style. There are so many factors and style in football but I'll say it:

No victory is sweeter than the one you clinched with your heart, sweat and determination.

Barcelona obviously dominated the match. More chances (with 2 on the post and some exceptional saves) & more possession. But Chelsea scored on their sole shot on target. A 1-0 victory is pretty interesting for Chelsea. If it wasn't Barcelona against them, I would have placed them as favorites for the Return match.

One interesting occurrence in the match: The Blues' goal was scored after Messi lost a ball. Now that's something rare....

This match was very intense one but completely opposite to the Bayern/Madrid one. Bayern/Madrid match was an intense match with lots of offensive intents while this one was intense in terms of the mental concentration and physicality. Two awesome semis though - very dignified of Champions League.

I don't think many on forehand would have thought that both Real and Barca would lose the first leg. I would say that Real had a better result than Barca, but Barca at Camp Nou and judging from this match, it would be hard to see Barca not going through unless they miss the goal as much as they did today. Chelsea practically had one shot on target like Escorp said.
One thing to be noted is that Barca has been eliminated in the semi-finals 4 out of 5 times when they have lost the first leg. So the statistic isn't favoring them.

And another thing, can't remember seeing both Real and Barca coming from a defeat before a EL Clasico... It will be insane as both teams will need their players for the 2nd leg as well. None of them can afford to take the 2nd leg too easy either, so all pressure on Barca now as Real can afford to lose, but Barca can't.

Edit:

Two facts;

* Messi hasn't scored in the last 7 encounters against Chelsea.

* In the last 6 matches between Chelsea and Barca, Chelsea has two victories, 4 draws and 0 defeats!! Real Madrid and Mourinho should definitely learn something from them, lol.

 

[Escorpiius]

I don't think many on forehand would have thought that both Real and Barca would lose the first leg. I would say that Real had a better result than Barca, but Barca at Camp Nou and judging from this match, it would be hard to see Barca not going through unless they miss the goal as much as they did today. Chelsea practically had one shot on target like Escorp said.
One thing to be noted is that Barca has been eliminated in the semi-finals 4 out of 5 times when they have lost the first leg. So the statistic isn't favoring them.

And another thing, can't remember seeing both Real and Barca coming from a defeat before a EL Clasico... It will be insane as both teams will need their players for the 2nd leg as well. None of them can afford to take the 2nd leg too easy either, so all pressure on Barca now as Real can afford to lose, but Barca can't.

Wait...

Each time, Barcelona lost the First Leg match in a European Competition Semi-Final, they were always eliminated at the end.

That's what I've heard. :|

I agree that many didn't expect them to lose both before Classico. Zidane nicely said that they can win all in a week or lose all...I guess, it applies not only for Madrid but also for Barcelona. Madrid's score is indeed more favorable; thanks to the so-crucial Away goal.

If Chelsea doesn't get rigged by referees, I do believe that they might do it. Don't forget that most of the times when Barcelona overturn a deficit, referee decisions were to somewhere in the mix.

Be it Chelsea in 2009, the red card to RVP due to loud crowds, the soft penalty recently against Milan and ect...

So, I'm sure that referee will play key roles in the Return match at Camp Nou. Will Barcelona relive the Inter souvenirs It adds suspense. Btw, kudos to the German referee of today who was really good in my eyes.

 

[Michael92]

Wait...

Each time, Barcelona lost the First Leg match in a European Competition Semi-Final, they were always eliminated at the end.

That's what I've heard. :|

I agree that many didn't expect them to lose both before Classico. Zidane nicely said that they can win all in a week or lose all...I guess, it applies not only for Madrid but also for Barcelona. Madrid's score is indeed more favorable; thanks to the so-crucial Away goal.

If Chelsea doesn't get rigged by referees, I do believe that they might do it. Don't forget that most of the times when Barcelona overturn a deficit, referee decisions were to somewhere in the mix.

Be it Chelsea in 2009, the red card to RVP due to loud crowds, the soft penalty recently against Milan and ect...

So, I'm sure that referee will play key roles in the Return match at Camp Nou. Will Barcelona relive the Inter souvenirs It adds suspense. Btw, kudos to the German referee of today who was really good in my eyes.

The experts said so in the sports studio that streams the match back here...

Oh and check out the two facts I added in as well in my last post.

 

[Escorpiius]

* Messi hasn't scored in the last 7 encounters against Chelsea.

* In the last 6 matches between Chelsea and Barca, Chelsea has two victories, 4 draws and 0 defeats!! Real Madrid and Mourinho should definitely learn something from them, lol.

I'll add something more to your stats - Messi played against 60+ teams in his career and Chelsea is one among those lucky 6 teams against whom Messi never scored. And like you said, he did play Chelsea 7 times nonetheless.

I like my fact also - Messi losing a ball, that lead to an Opponent goal at the end. It's so rare that he loses a dangerous ball and when that ball is actually fatal, I wonder if it happened before.

Mourinho has nothing to learn from Chelsea since he made Chelsea. The Spinal-bone (Cech-Terry-Lampard-Drogba) of Mourinho's Chelsea was key for today's victory.

Also, I think only English and Italian team can play that defensively. Madrid will get criticize, like shown before, if they try play too-defensive with harsh plays. I guess, this type of play - which I do appreciate - is not of the taste of Spanish culture and its play.

 

[Michael92]

Champions!!! Escorp, care to comment? Lolxd

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Calmate, Camp Nou. Calmate...

 

[Escorpiius]

If Chelsea doesn't get rigged by referees, I do believe that they might do it. Don't forget that most of the times when Barcelona overturn a deficit, referee decisions were to somewhere in the mix.

I'm quoting myself cause I was right. That Red card to John Terry is a travesty! Alexis just did amongst his best acting performance of his lifetime.

 

[Ryuu..]

I'm quoting myself cause I was right. That Red card to John Terry is a travesty! Alexis just did amongst his best acting performance of his lifetime.

Nahh, JT is a madman, a clear and very unnecessary red card U_U

 

[ReLax -]

I'm quoting myself cause I was right. That Red card to John Terry is a travesty! Alexis just did amongst his best acting performance of his lifetime.

No...

It's not like Alexis throw himself into Terry's knee. Terry himself kneed Alexis light or hard he still made an assault. As far as speaking ref wise this should end all Barcelona buying refs if that was the case they'd be in the finals, (the offside goal near the end was questionable nevertheless the ref could have allowed it for Barca) so its either refs make the right decisions or a stupid one not because they are being bought.

Nevertheless Chelsea will most likely lose the final unless they hold off for PK or play on a different level.

 

[Escorpiius]

No...

It's not like Alexis throw himself into Terry's knee. Terry himself kneed Alexis light or hard he still made an assault. As far as speaking ref wise this should end all Barcelona buying refs if that was the case they'd be in the finals, (the offside goal near the end was questionable nevertheless the ref could have allowed it for Barca) so its either refs make the right decisions or a stupid one not because they are being bought.

Nevertheless Chelsea will most likely lose the final unless they hold off for PK or play on a different level.

I'm skeptical because Terry seems to look at the ball and Alexis was completely unconcerned from the action. Terry did say that Alexis shoved into him in post-match interview. Is it true? Doubt it but possible in my eyes. But even if it's intentional

1. It's a weak contact.
2. It does not annihilate any action play.

If the Red Card was given for the reckless tackle of Lampard, I would have agreed more but whether Terry purposely did a douche job or not, it doesn't deserve a Red Card. A yellow at most if intentional or nothing otherwise. That's my view and it was a scandal at that point of the match in my eyes.

And I'm sorry but you can't say referee disadvantaged Barcelona.

You get 1 penalty. There are like 15 fouls only of Chelsea; yet there's a red card before half-time. It's pretty poor judging from referees.

 

[Blaze Release]

Whoever they face i hope they get obliterated. Im a neutral and i watched the first game which barca dominated and chelsea played their negative football. Now im a lover of the BEAUTIFUL game and its due to this reason why i sided with barca. Again chelsea employed their negative tactics and basically all 11 players stayed in their own half, until terry's stupidity which brought them to 10 men.

Still with 10 men they just stayed back for the whole game. Must admit, Remeries goal was beast and i was happy when torres scored. Who ever chelsea play, i hope chelsea get annihilated. Itd due to this that i want Real to go through because if Bayern go through chelsea should beat them

 

[Escorpiius]

Whoever they face i hope they get obliterated. Im a neutral and i watched the first game which barca dominated and chelsea played their negative football. Now im a lover of the BEAUTIFUL game and its due to this reason why i sided with barca. Again chelsea employed their negative tactics and basically all 11 players stayed in their own half, until terry's stupidity which brought them to 10 men.

Still with 10 men they just stayed back for the whole game. Must admit, Remeries goal was beast and i was happy when torres scored. Who ever chelsea play, i hope chelsea get annihilated. Itd due to this that i want Real to go through because if Bayern go through chelsea should beat them

I said it after the 1st Leg and I'll say it again:

No victory is sweeter than the one you clinched with your heart, sweat and determination.

Comprehend it in any way you want and bring any thesis of positive/negative or beautiful/ugly football, fact is that football is a game where you need to strive for victory. I don't believe in artistic play or football done to please people. You fight for your club's pride and its victory.

I like football where tactics is the key word and determination is the key play. This is what I liked in football. Football is to overcome odds and leave victorious. It doesn't prove superiority otherwise. Chelsea is the team was superior tonight.

Criticize Chelsea's style if you want but it's something hard to accomplish what they did. You require enormous mental strength to pull the match they did.

If I were to analyze the match, I'd say that Barcelona were dominating in the first 20 minutes. Chelsea gained solidity as match progressed and still did despite Cahill's injury and 1st goal. The Red card was really bad refereeing in my view and disrupt the match; and hence the 2nd goal.

Ramires's goal was a game-changer though. yet another goal in Additional first-half period and Chelsea had the motivation they needed. They did a brilliant 2nd half. Very few fouls (unlike Inter in 2010), conceded a penalty but had luck with them and then defended extremely well. As I said, you may easily snap at any second since it's hard to play football when you don't have the ball but they had the spirit. That's Mou's spirit in my point.

As for Barcelona, well, despite the great defending of Chelsea, they lost because of their style for once. It's ironic but true.

They wanted possession so much that they barely shoot from 20-30 yards; in fear of returning the ball to Chelsea. They made so much passes that after some time, they became pressured to score. You made so many few crosses despite being on the wings that you lacked percussion.

Barcelona couldn't adapt to Chelsea's 2nd half defensive approach and that's the main reason of the downfall of today in my eyes.

They could have had like 40 shots given the amount of time they were near Chelsea's block. They could have given 30+ crosses if they had a pure striker. They could have played on another player if they had a pure striker. They could have not depend their play on Messi. Messi was subdued by the 3-man marking on him but they couldn't find alternatives in this match.

Beautiful football or whatever you want to name it, today this tactic was their downfall. Sometimes, you mustn't persist with your beautiful tactic but adapt and vary to situations. They didn't. They controlled. They lost.

EDIT: A

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on the tactics of this match.

 

[ReLax -]

I'm skeptical because Terry seems to look at the ball and Alexis was completely unconcerned from the action. Terry did say that Alexis shoved into him in post-match interview. Is it true? Doubt it but possible in my eyes. But even if it's intentional

1. It's a weak contact.
2. It does not annihilate any action play.

If the Red Card was given for the reckless tackle of Lampard, I would have agreed more but whether Terry purposely did a douche job or not, it doesn't deserve a Red Card. A yellow at most if intentional or nothing otherwise. That's my view and it was a scandal at that point of the match in my eyes.

And I'm sorry but you can't say referee disadvantaged Barcelona.

You get 1 penalty. There are like 15 fouls only of Chelsea; yet there's a red card before half-time. It's pretty poor judging from referees.

Well as far as I saw in the replay they showed Terry was behind Alexis and lifted his knee towards his back I don't think I remember Alexis looking back.

1. Lifting his leg/knee is an action
2. Weak or not still an assault

As I've said that if the ref looked at it my way than it should have been punished, yellow or red I cannot really judge without looking at it, but if it was done purposely of course its a deserved red lets not forget of Terry pass and his court still going on which I believe had a factor in the refs decision.

I never said they "disadvantaged" Barcelona, I simply meant to say just because an advantage goes towards you doesn't mean you bought the ref. This game there could have been various ways Barcelona could have won if ref favored them (offside goal by Sanchez, which seemed a close one or another red for Lampard).

The PK was a deserved one, Chelsea was playing defensively you expect them to make a fouls. 45-55% refs judge poorly.

 

[Ryuu..]

I said it after the 1st Leg and I'll say it again:

No victory is sweeter than the one you clinched with your heart, sweat and determination.

Comprehend it in any way you want and bring any thesis of positive/negative or beautiful/ugly football, fact is that football is a game where you need to strive for victory. I don't believe in artistic play or football done to please people. You fight for your club's pride and its victory.

I like football where tactics is the key word and determination is the key play. This is what I liked in football. Football is to overcome odds and leave victorious. It doesn't prove superiority otherwise. Chelsea is the team was superior tonight.

Criticize Chelsea's style if you want but it's something hard to accomplish what they did. You require enormous mental strength to pull the match they did.

If I were to analyze the match, I'd say that Barcelona were dominating in the first 20 minutes. Chelsea gained solidity as match progressed and still did despite Cahill's injury and 1st goal. The Red card was really bad refereeing in my view and disrupt the match; and hence the 2nd goal.

Ramires's goal was a game-changer though. yet another goal in Additional first-half period and Chelsea had the motivation they needed. They did a brilliant 2nd half. Very few fouls (unlike Inter in 2010), conceded a penalty but had luck with them and then defended extremely well. As I said, you may easily snap at any second since it's hard to play football when you don't have the ball but they had the spirit. That's Mou's spirit in my point.

As for Barcelona, well, despite the great defending of Chelsea, they lost because of their style for once. It's ironic but true.

They wanted possession so much that they barely shoot from 20-30 yards; in fear of returning the ball to Chelsea. They made so much passes that after some time, they became pressured to score. You made so many few crosses despite being on the wings that you lacked percussion.

Barcelona couldn't adapt to Chelsea's 2nd half defensive approach and that's the main reason of the downfall of today in my eyes.

They could have had like 40 shots given the amount of time they were near Chelsea's block. They could have given 30+ crosses if they had a pure striker. They could have played on another player if they had a pure striker. They could have not depend their play on Messi. Messi was subdued by the 3-man marking on him but they couldn't find alternatives in this match.

Beautiful football or whatever you want to name it, today this tactic was their downfall. Sometimes, you mustn't persist with your beautiful tactic but adapt and vary to situations. They didn't. They controlled. They lost.

+rep, bolded part is what football is about.

 

[Escorpiius]

It wouldn't surprise me if we see Extra-Time in the Return fixture.

It pains to guess it right

I must say it was a very intense match; with lots of chances and lots of offensive intent from both teams. Madrid started full-steam in the first 20 minutes - with 2 goals from CR7 but still Bayern often created chances. Unsurprisingly, they got their goal on a penalty.

Thereafter, it was a match with lots of chances and shots for both teams. Madrid felt the Classico fatigue after the 60 min mark and Bayern could have ended it if Gomez didn't mess on his control.

Madrid seemed to have let the storm pass and gain the upper hand in extra-time as Bayern hold on. The fresh legs of Kaka, Higuain and Granero helped but Madrid messed up some chances they had in that ET while Bayern resisted.

There came the most nerve-wracking test in football -the Penalty shootout. And a number of things fascinated me:

1. Neuer got a great style in penalties. With his height and body posture, he used his skills and attributes to the optimum and obviously, it helped. This fascinated me quite a bit; given I play GK mostly (though I play much rarely now)

2. The 2 Ballon D'Or - Kaka and CR7 - missing their penalties in the same way. CR7 is brilliant penalty shooter but must say that in crucial shootouts, he fails often. Did so in United 2008 Final, did so in a shootout in Cup final during his United days and did so again.

3. I could have bet all that Ramos was going to shoot it upwards. I wonder why he chose to shoot cause' clearly his posture, his speed, his run were all wrong. Even the way he positioned his ball gave me an unauspicious feeling.

All-in-all, Bayern fought with all their heart and deserve to clinch this victory. You could clearly see a will in Bayern in that match; that was missing in almost all their Bundesliga matches this season. Their pride, their ego, their honor were boosted by the perspective to play the Final at their Arena and this pro-pulsed them into Final.

Unlike Barcelona though, Madrid have few things to regret. It was a very balanced clash and a narrow defeat - a defeat that could have end on a victory on any other day.

Congrats to Bayern to qualify for the Final. I'll be rooting for Chelsea though obviously.