Its about time this discussion gets put to rest. Its almost as if people cannot read, refuse to read and instead just look at the manga pics or are just plain ignorant. Either way ill enlighten you'll; the facts about the Uchiha and the Senju.
Wow! Isn't that a bit too much?
Now i keep hearing people saying that the uchiha were evil and the senju were good. Allow me annihilate that myth.
From what we know the senju offered the uchiha a peace treaty and the uchiha accpeted because they also wanted peace;
From what we know the uchiha accepted hashirama the senju leader as the first hokage instead of their own leader madara;
The uchiha turned their back on madara *(their leader) because they wanted peace;
They started despise him due to his power hungry and war ways. Madara translanted this as them betraying him;
So from what we know so far the uchiha also wanted peace and accepted the senju leader hashirama as the leader of the village over their own leader and later despised their leader as a power hungry war lover.
Uchiha wanted peace because they got tired of the constant war and Senjus were winning. Don't you remember Tobi telling us that it was around the same time Madara was going blind and had to take Izuna's eyes to recover? After all, apparantly that was the reason of Tobi's anger at the peace treaty to start with- he was angry that Izuna gave up his eyes to continue and yet rest of the Uchihas went ahead and compromised.
You imply that they agreed because they were peace loving while to me it appears that treaty was partly because Uchihas thought that they were reaching their limits.
We will have to wait to find out Tobi's ID to get a slightly better idea. In any case it seems that Uchihas were devided over the issue to at least some extent.
The second hokage trying to play nice and giving the uchiha a 'special' role;
But this was the truth behind the so called special role;
That's Tobi talking. So I will take his statements with a grain of salt. Tobirama gave them monoploy over a job which in turn requires and enables Uchihas to keep an eye on everyone as well.
The uchiha were blamed/suspected of the fox's attack. This shows that whilst the uchiha had complete faith in the senju and accepted their leader as the hokage, the senju on the otherhand didnt trust the uchiha;
this argument is flawed- in a major way. Your own pic posted in original post claims that Uchihas were already "thinking of staging a rebellian".
Nobody knows where Uchihas were that fateful night when Kyuubi attacked. A sharingan user summons it and attacks Konoha while the head of the police force is absent along with his wife. They are not present in any panel during the attack- they fail to fight along with others, the Hokage dies and the police force is unable to find the culprit even.
Anyone would have suuspected them. But they do not try to explain their position, do not try to talk an go ahead and start to act on the plan of rebellion.
Ever heard of the fifth column? It's not evil to be on alert on part of rest of Konoha.
If Uchihas had complete faith in Senjus and rest of the village they shold have come out and Talked- tried to clear the atmosphere and everything. but they didn't. In fact they refuse to talk to the third Hojage depite his efforts. Faith - my foot.
They were further pushed into isolation;
During that time Hyugas were making great sacrifices in interest of the rest of the village- like Hiyashi willing to die for it and losing his brother for the cause ( they could refuse to let their head die as demanded by Raikage- Hiyashi had done nothing wrong but defended his daughter from the kidnaper and a spy).
On the other hand, Uchihas were busy trying to implant Shisui and Itachi in ANBU as Spies.
Exactly at what point of time Uchihas
as a clan did something for the village which was not in their own self interest at the same time? I am not talking about individuals like Itachi, Obito or Shisui etc. Itachi proved the only exception in his clan who actually walked the whole nine yards and chose Konoha over Sasuke ( he tried to put them eqaul but that was just human so, I let it pass).
o from what we know the uchiha accepted the senju peace treaty because they always wanted peace.
We have no evidence that they
always wanted peace. It's a wishful thiking on your part.
The stood behind the senju leader and cast away their own leader because they believe he was a power hungry war lover.
More likely that they didn't believe Madara being able to pull it off against Senjus and it was confirmed when Madara challanged Hashirama and lost. Making Tobi whoever he is, mad.
It seems like whilst the uchiha fully trusted the senju, the senju didnt as tobirama has showed us with his so called special role and as the elders has shown us. They have been further isolated. From what we know which clan seem like the victims?.
Already replied above. You are repeating yourself. From what we know they seem pretty self centered. No wonder Itachi was exhasperated by them.
The A coup D'etat was bound to happen sooner or later. Just imagine this in real life or relate it to history where a group of people have been discriminated for so long. They are eventually bound to respond. The fact that the uchiha have waited so long to finally respond says shows that they of all people have patience
What patience? Nobody in the clan had the same potential as Madara, since Madara and Izuna.
We see and hear of only Shisui and Itachi (years later since Madara left) and they didn't had MS at the same time. Shisui had to die for Itachi to gain it.
Uchihas would have been toast fighting the whole village just with simple sharingan. They would have left the village and founded another independent one if they were that capable. Orochimaru got himself a village (sound) even when he was on the run most of thhe time.
They took advantage of 12 year old due to his trauma;
They abused his love for the village;
And ordered him to wipe out his clan. His clan that had the right to finally stand up for themselves;
You got your manga mixed up. We do not know his exact age but Itachi was made an ANBU captain at the age of 13. Massacre took place sometime after this. And Itachi took the decision and mission to wipe his clan - because he was inspired by
Shisui's sacrifice and words.
Sarutobi didn't order it and it was apparant that Itachi didn't trust Danzou since he threatenned him and asked Sarutobi to take care of Sasuke.
Now that the Uchiha has had enough and have decided to stand up for themselves, now sarutobi wants to sort things out (not his fault though, be he is still the hokage he shouldve done something before all this);
Nah.. already explained that it was how Tobi tries to justfies himself, but seeing his plans we should be just glad that uchihas were never in power as Hokage. They would keep all the tailed beast instead of sharing it like hashirama and would have already fulfilled their Moon eye plan probably.
He was given the orders to kill everyone uchiha (who had the right to demand justice), but he couldnt kill sasuke;
The only conciliation sarutobi could do was to protect sasuke from the elders, especially danzou;
As Danzou said it was the only mission Itachi failed. Unless Naruto is able to ractify the problem created and left by Itachi, there will be no peace only more deaths.
So tell me which clan seem victims. From what ive read it seems like the senju tricked the uhciha, this is debeatable though. From what ive seen its seems like they used the peace treaty as a strategy to form an alliance wit the uchiha to later slowly kill them off. When an uchiha (madara) saw what was happening the uchiha already trusted this peace treaty. When madara attacked and the 2nd hokage saw that they might be similar people following madara's footsteps he used a wise stragety with the special role nonsense.
Hugas?
How can Kushina say she was chosen to become a jinchurcki. How come she doesnt have a choice;
Because she couldn't be selfish. Somebody needed to be to keep the ballance. Her own village was destroyed and she understood the importance of a jinchuriki for the ally village.
Once naruto heard the truth, even he got worked up. Basically because they used his mother, similarly to the way itachi was used and abused (A hero was instead put into the bingo book to kill when encountered);
So now they have taken advantage of the uchiha and uzumaki.
Naruto got over it within minutes. He doesn't se it as abuse- " Being a jinchuriki is not all bad" and a smile on Naruto's face is the proof of it. Every tailed beast seems to find him honest about it.
This is where you learn exactly what i mean. We all know about edo tensei.
In order to use it you have to use LIVE human beings as sacrifices. Now the second hokage Tobirama created such a technique. He mustve used live human beings either from the village, war prisoners. Either in order to create such a technique you have to have experimented;
And many shinobies sacrifice themselves for the sake of village. the tech was created by Tobirama and declared forbidden by
him. He didn't recommend it but forbid it. Orochimaru stole most of the forbidden techs.
Even madara who has been considered evil frowned up such a technique;[
Seems like even a power hungry madara knew the limits, yet tobirama didnt and created such a kinjutsu (forbidden technique). I challenge you to name me a kinjutsu that is on par with edo tensei in terms of how evil and atrocious it is. What poeple dont understand is that the only true 'evil' uchiha's we know are madara and sasuke and in either case their arent evil.
Only because he was expecting to be brought back by rinnegan not as an edo. Next moment he was smiling and using it to his advantage with rinnegan.
Its this same technique that brought the downfall of sarutobi. This same technique that is currently being used by the opposition. Its this same technique that has brought fought an upgraded madara
And your point is lost in there somewhere, since none of the good guys used it. Tobirama if intending to use it carry a bit of his brother's DNA and could have just sacrificed Kagami and raised Hashirama to fight Kumo ambush and lived.
Madara you might question him idea of peace, but in either case he seems to want peace. In sasuke's case, its due to a chain of events which caused him to become like this. His hate is stemmed from what the senju did. If the senju from the beginning had treated the uchiha fairly they wouldnt have tried to take over the village, therefore itachi's mission would also non-existent
lmao.
I will use it on captured enemies who I will be killing anyways. Once again ninja must kill bad guy
